70%+ Liberals oppose Syrian intervention; message to world - if Obama acts it is without the support

Originally posted by namehere
reply to post by grandmakdw

 

don't go making excuses for liberals or anyone else to absolve any sense of guilt you might feel or to place blame on others. whether you oppose it or not when a country declares war on another the people are responsible for it as much as the government, especially when they do nothing to stop it.

this whole "we're innocent" bs is merely an excuse to make cowards feel justified about their inaction, it's easy to blame others but it's hard to look and see your guilt and realize that you have wronged even if indirectly. that is our responsibility as people of a powerful nation to accept guilt for lives taken, to weigh our actions and accept the consequences of those actions, to not run away and place blame on this or that group for whatever reason.

that is why we have never completely won any modern war, why we can't have peace, because our people cannot realize this and they run from it, they fight amongst themselves and blame each other and we end up creating messes that lead to more conflict which is never resolved, and if we don't quit behaving this way our country will be destroyed by our foolishness.

I spent over 50 years total in an active duty military family.

We have lost wars in modern times, because many times we were sticking our noses where it didn't belong, trying to "save" other people from themselves. Quite a number of our wars, post WWII were police actions where we thought we knew better what other people wanted and needed than they did for themselves. Also, we got involved in most of them because of what a lot of people at ATS call "false flags". If we had only responded when attacked, there would have been only one action, chasing down the terrorists involved in 9/11, which could have been done more effectively by the CIA, navy seals, Army rangers and did not have to involve a large number of troops on the ground.

(had an extra few minutes)

reply to post by grandmakdw

WWII were police actions where we thought we knew better what the people wanted and needed then they did for themselves

WWII was a total different war as we see today..WWII was a madman who wanted to incorporate and exterminate races in the whole world , this is a civil war

reply to post by grandmakdw


He didn't say he didn't draw a line. He said the world drew that line. He isn't trying to back out ( I wish) he was bolstering his position. It wad speech flair. Its common sense but to be clear I dislike Obama more than I disliked Bush (didn't think it was possible).

Sadly, this happens all too much. The people are often blamed for the actions of their government, not matter what their true beliefs are...

When will people realize governments are institutions with their own goals?

With that in mind, the people can always do significant things to stop government intervention. Take what happened in Brazil for example. There was a significant amount of protests which stopped congress from passing a new amendment to the current constitution.

Instead of voting on polls, take it to the streets

Originally posted by GogoVicMorrow
reply to post by grandmakdw

 

He didn't say he didn't draw a line. He said the world drew that line. He isn't trying to back out ( I wish) he was bolstering his position. It wad speech flair. Its common sense but to be clear I dislike Obama more than I disliked Bush (didn't think it was possible).

The fact is, he did say that he didn't set a red line, when he clearly did and he is now trying to avoid responsibility for his own words and actions by seeking shelter in the words of the Geneva Convention.

His every move since this debacle started has been calculated and purposeful. His appeal to Congress came only after the U.K. Parliament shot Cameron down, thus leaving Obama out on the ledge by his lonesome, so what does he do? Push the choice into the lap of Congress which will now free him of culpability when he gets his authorization (which he and the Secretary of State John Kerry have made clear that he doesn't need). Congress gets the blame when it all goes bad, Obama gets away with it. Now, with the International community, he's again shirking responsibility by blaming the Geneva Convention for the 'red line'.

This guy is the king of 'shuck and jive' politics.

With all of the Obama failures and boondoggles, it would make sense that 'Liberals' should be turning on Obama Inc.

And many, despite the obvious disarray, seem to be.

But don't let that fool you.

They, the Liberals, didn't seem to shout so loud about Libya.
[ that worked real well didn't it ? ]

Nor did they seem to be yelling at the top of their lungs and throwing tantrums about Obama Inc. supporting the Muslim Brotherhood Morsi in Egypt.
[ that worked real well didn't it ? ]

Don't let that fool you !!

They still supported Obama Inc. for re-election in 2012 even AFTER Libya and AFTER the Morsi installation in Egypt, along with all the other Obama failures and let downs.

Obama has their FULL support !!

He is doing exactly what the Liberal Base wants.

Don't be fooled by the double talk and excuses for failure.

It's all an act.

The Government answers to foreign born financial interests, not we the people. If you are foolish enough to believe that this country is not operating under a coup, you are delusional.

Originally posted by xuenchen
With all of the Obama failures and boondoggles, it would make sense that 'Liberals' should be turning on Obama Inc.

And many, despite the obvious disarray, seem to be.

But don't let that fool you.

They, the Liberals, didn't seem to shout so loud about Libya.
[ that worked real well didn't it ? ]

Nor did they seem to be yelling at the top of their lungs and throwing tantrums about Obama Inc. supporting the Muslim Brotherhood Morsi in Egypt.
[ that worked real well didn't it ? ]

Don't let that fool you !!

They still supported Obama Inc. for re-election in 2012 even AFTER Libya and AFTER the Morsi installation in Egypt, along with all the other Obama failures and let downs.

Obama has their FULL support !!

He is doing exactly what the Liberal Base wants.

Don't be fooled by the double talk and excuses for failure.

It's all an act.

Your partisan rhetoric is not only ignorant, but by choosing to buy into it you also feed the beast that controls our Government and both political parties.

People with your mindset are willingly aiding these criminals with this left right foolishness!!!!

reply to post by supremecommander

Your partisan rhetoric is not only ignorant, but by choosing to buy into it you also feed the beast that controls our Government and both political parties.

People with your mindset are willingly aiding these criminals with this left right foolishness!!!!

Well many of us ARE well aware of the global financial base that 'governs' the governments that have subscribed.

But this thread is not at that level.

Find some of my posts that address just what you are talking about. I've made many.

This topic is about Liberals and Obama, not about the B.I.S. or I.M.F. or the worldwide central banking system.

...Just keeping the table level.

The Liberals are 100% in support of Obama.

AND, they are the ones that usually scream the loudest about Dems = Repubs !!!!

TinfoilTP
reply to post by grandmakdw

 

Who the "F" made you Ambassador to the world?

Obama won with 51% of the vote to become president.

If you take your useless out of the air thin numbers of 70% liberals, that is only 35% of the pie chart that includes everybody. Not all of Obama's 51% were "liberal" less than half I'd say by pulling a number out of thin air using your standards. So lets revise that 35%, say 50% of 51% were actually "liberal", that's 25% liberal who voted for Obama, now apply your "70% of liberals" to the 25% and you get about 17% of the total population you are declaring to speak for are against the war in Syria.

Some declaration, who ever hired you to be world's ambassador should summarily fire you.

Voter_turnout_in_the_United_States_presidential_elections
en.wikipedia.org...

Election 2008

Voting Age Population (VAP) 229,945

Turnout 131,407

% Turnout of VAP 57.1%

and here's a picture, just in case you need it

in other words obama can only claim 67,017 worshipers [tops], out of an over 313.9 million population
claiming their "messiah" as the infallible, uber-righteous war pig/world ambassador/policeman
with power of life and death over the 7+billion people on the planet

this is why barry and his fellow travelers are going on about mob-rul*COUGH* democracy
in a constitutional republic

so much for "democracy" [rolls eyes]

I'd Ask you to take your head out, but according to your posting history,
it's way too late for that:shk:

Liberals are the great enablers.

There were an abundance of liberals in power in the world when Neville Chamberlain waived that paper with fresh ink from Hitler declaring peace in our time, while the exterminations were being planned out.

History repeats itself.

Obama is trying to save you from yourselves, because he knows history will not be kind to the enablers.

reply to post by grandmakdw


It could be 100% and it won't matter one bit. we will go to war if the president and his buddies say we should.

Originally posted by 0bserver1
reply to post by grandmakdw

 

WWII were police actions where we thought we knew better what the people wanted and needed then they did for themselves

WWII was a total different war as we see today..WWII was a madman who wanted to incorporate and exterminate races in the whole world , this is a civil war

I said post WWII which means after WWII

Yes, this is a civil war which we have no business interfering in

Originally posted by altairpeaceandsecurity
Sadly, this happens all too much. The people are often blamed for the actions of their government, not matter what their true beliefs are...

When will people realize governments are institutions with their own goals?

That is the point I am trying to make. I hope the world realizes that and doesn't blame the American people for the actions of Obama. However, if history tells us anything, it is that they will blame us and retaliate.

It's simple the administration will simply turn it around by saying those who don't support The Figurehead are not "true liberals" and are closet racists and isolationists that's how they will stamp out dissent within and from without the Democratic party.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by namehere
reply to post by grandmakdw

 

don't go making excuses for liberals or anyone else to absolve any sense of guilt you might feel or to place blame on others. whether you oppose it or not when a country declares war on another the people are responsible for it as much as the government, especially when they do nothing to stop it.

this whole "we're innocent" bs is merely an excuse to make cowards feel justified about their inaction, it's easy to blame others but it's hard to look and see your guilt and realize that you have wronged even if indirectly. that is our responsibility as people of a powerful nation to accept guilt for lives taken, to weigh our actions and accept the consequences of those actions, to not run away and place blame on this or that group for whatever reason.

that is why we have never completely won any modern war, why we can't have peace, because our people cannot realize this and they run from it, they fight amongst themselves and blame each other and we end up creating messes that lead to more conflict which is never resolved, and if we don't quit behaving this way our country will be destroyed by our foolishness.

Bullshirt.

I served in Gulf War 1 and Deux.

They were fought for (what I thought) valid reasons but were executed poorly.

Now we have a potus that is just itching to prove his manhood by blowing shirt up!

Again, executed badly.

I don't see a valid reason for this. Maybe because I'm out, maybe because I'm older, but I could give a shirt if it doesn't affect Americans or the western world.

Harsh?

Maybe.

*meh*

I'm an Afghan and Iraq vet and I completely 2nd you on this. Syria is just plain and simply not our place in my humble opinion.

Originally posted by TinfoilTP
Liberals are the great enablers.

There were an abundance of liberals in power in the world when Neville Chamberlain waived that paper with fresh ink from Hitler declaring peace in our time, while the exterminations were being planned out.

History repeats itself.

Obama is trying to save you from yourselves, because he knows history will not be kind to the enablers.

I don't care how history sees us, It is rarely accurate and frequently distorted to fit the needs of those in power.

Obama is not our "savior" and we don't need him to save us from ourselves,
and we shouldn't try to be the savior of
Syria. They should be allowed to run their own country and bring their own to justice.

Originally posted by mike dangerously
It's simple the administration will simply turn it around by saying those who don't support The Figurehead is not a "true liberal" and is a closet racist and isolationist that's out they will stamp out dissent within and from without the Democratic party.

You have a good point.

But for how long will the Democrats who are being called racist and isolationist (as if that is a bad thing) finally turn, the administration has finally worn out the racist card with conservatives.

The NSA scandal has the libs really shaken up and turning around and calling them what they call conservatives as insults won't go over well.

Looks like the Libs may be waking up with their 70% opposition to interfering in Syria and if the administration turn on them, well, I don't think it will be pretty, donations and support will quickly dry up.

A little addition:

Arizona congressman Matt Salmon’s constituents have called his office 500 times about Syria, he tells National Review Online in an interview, but only two callers have expressed support for intervening there. “This is not hyperbole!” he says emphatically.

And Salmon himself is firmly against authorizing a strike. “I don’t see any national-security imperative for our country at all. Both sides in this equation are bad actors.” He also notes that Obama has been unable to form an international coalition and hasn’t laid out an overall objective for a missile strike. “Other than saving face for the president, I don’t understand what we would be doing,” he says.

Further, Salmon doubts the intervention will be brief. “Nobody believes this is going to be a couple surgical strikes,” he says.

www.nationalreview.com...

mike dangerously
It's simple the administration will simply turn it around by saying those who don't support The Figurehead are not "true liberals" and are closet racists and isolationists that's how they will stamp out dissent within and from without the Democratic party.

edit on 083030p://5126 by mike dangerously because: (no reason given)

edit on 083030p://5226 by mike dangerously because: (no reason given)

Kerry is already starting ...

Secretary of State John F. Kerry said Tuesday that members of Congress who refused to authorize retaliatory strikes against Syria would be responsible when the regime of Syrian President Bashar Assad gasses its citizens or when North Korea or Iran attempts to use nuclear weapons

Kerry holds objectors responsible for any future atrocities in Syria

Next we'll hear it from Obama and the others.

They want 100% Loyalty and no excuses either !!