Unidentified Navy Senior- "I Didn't Join the Navy To Fight For Al-Qaeda in a Syrian Civil War!"

reply to post by TrueAmerican


I could not have said that any better. I feel like I am an American in a foreign nation anymore. I am flabbergasted as to how many people think Obama can do no wrong and don't have a clue about who he is supporting.

Some are in my family all be it in Cali the land of the dumbocrats. I told them the other day it does not matter witch party you are from, your still an American and this so called president is supporting the same people we were just fighting against in Iraq and still in A-stan among other places. I flat told them either Obama is openly supporting all things radical Islam or I must have died in my sleep and woke up in the future where a Hitler type man from the middle east has taken over America.

How can these people can be so blind to how bad he is dragging this country into the ground while trying to pick a fight he cant win is beyond comprehension? To top it off he passes the decision to Congress just as soon as the UK said nope our people said hell no to starting WW3. I love his audacity. He just stuck his neck out, now Congress needs to chop it off before Russia has to respond to our missiles by sinking some of our Men and Women in the Med. I don't think Russia can win a naval battle with us but we will loose ships and most importantly American men and women on them.

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by St Udio

that 17 yo nephew has maybe 40% of their career options nullified by your 'good intentions' (limited knowledge)
excuse me if you are offended

Oh no, I am not offended. Because at least I have a nephew that is ALIVE- not lying on some Iraqi or Afghan sand and dying from an AK47 bullet or IED explosion. On the other hand, if this country was invaded, I would go and get that same nephew and haul his ass off to the battlefront. With me. There is a right time to die. For the RIGHT reasons.

You do realize that a large portion of military positions are non-combat in nature right? Joining the military does not automatically put a gun in your hands and send you into harms way. I had to shoot an M-16 in basic and after that I had to get certified with a 9mm pistol and shotgun twice during my enlistment on the off chance that I might have to stand a security watch (Never happened in 6 years). I was a nuclear power electrician and never entered a combat zone during my enlistment. There is some good technical training to be had in the military, and many employers are partial to hiring former military because they know you are disciplined and can show up to work on time... My first job after the military was 2x my military pay, and I have since more than doubled that as well. And I wouldn't have been able to do it without the technical training I received in the military.

My son wanted to join the Army, and I told him don't just join to be a grunt carrying a gun, get some good training out of it that will benefit you when you get out. That would be better advice than just a blanket anti-military stance. I give the same advice to other family and friends that consider joining the military.

My aunt qualified for a JROTC scholarship, but her mother (my grandmother) was anti-military and wouldn't let her take it. She enlisted in the Navy anyway once she was of age, but had to work her way up through the enlisted ranks. She did well and eventually become an officer and is ready to retire now. She also never entered a war zone in 25 years (Meteorologist), She could have become a senior officer by this time rather than spending almost 20 years enlisted before becoming a junior officer if she had taken the scholarship and her mother wasn't so against the military...

Originally posted by Aazadan

Originally posted by neformore
Did I miss some stuff - (possibly, I dunno) - Where were these kind of people when all the Iraq stuff was going down?

Probably fooled like the rest of the country. 10 years, trillions of dollars, proven falsified info for going, and a lack of results has made people a bit more wise.

Yeah, I was fooled in 2003 big time. This was long before joining here.

It galls me that I believed the line I was fed and shames me what I thought of the people that could see through it at the time.

You live and learn.

I applaud these brave men. I hope more of them feel the same way.

But they will still have to answer to their superiors, who are puppets of Obama, who is the head puppet of the elites who want this war to happen.

Will these same people refuse orders?

Originally posted by supremecommander
I applaud these brave men. I hope more of them feel the same way.

But they will still have to answer to their superiors, who are puppets of Obama, who is the head puppet of the elites who want this war to happen.

Will these same people refuse orders?

I doubt they will refuse orders and do not hope nor expect them to. If they did it would blemish both their integrity and honor. They are voicing their opinion and taking substantial risk in doing so in the way they are doing it which is far more than most if not all the people calling for them to refuse orders are doing about this situation.

Civilians have more freedoms than these soldiers do when it comes to influencing policy's and so far I don't see anyone doing much more than armchair quarter backing on this. They will follow orders as long as they do not go against the UCMJ even though it looks like the broke one of the rules by posting these pictures.

As a veteran who served our Country for 13 years I feel compelled to say this -

You civilians are not doing your damn job.

That's right.

These pictures of soldiers and sailors protesting is FUBAR. Soldiers and Sailors follow orders - not protest political decisions. There is such a thing as good order and discipline - and these soldiers / sailors are NOT following it.
Why are they doing this?

Because you civilians are not doing your job. YOU, as the majority have a CIVIC DUTY to learn about, choose and hold responsible your elected representatives. The very fact that these veterans are doing this tells me that civilians are failing to uphold their civic duty, and now our soldiers and sailors must violate their oaths to get the message across.

And don't try to make excuses. How many people around here actually got up and voted? You can lie to me, but you know the truth. How many people here know who their congressman are? Who their senators are? Probably just a small minority....and that is just sad.

Furthermore, I hear all the time that the system is "rigged". And...It might be - and yet - you lemmings either don't vote at all, or continue to tow the "party line". It's pretty much common knowledge that a new major third party would be a good thing in American politics, am I right? All the Libertarian party needed was 5% of the electorate.
We all knew Gary Johnson wasn't going to win - that wasn't the point - the point was to get another third party officially recognized and YOU FAILED. I doubt many of you have even one iota of what I'm talking about. Sad.

The worst part is - you continue to fail.
And you will continue to fail until the majority of you lemmings pull your collective heads out of the sand and start paying attention.

I am glad the UK are not getting involved, I don't know why we don't just leave them to their own devices, what is the threat to us anyway, can anyone tell me. Why don't we save our money on missiles and build solar, wind and wave power and other alternative ways of getting energy.

reply to post by TrueAmerican


Consider it confirmed (AC1 (AW) Ret.).

Originally posted by zeeon
As a veteran who served our Country for 13 years I feel compelled to say this -

You civilians are not doing your damn job.

That's right.

These pictures of soldiers and sailors protesting is FUBAR. Soldiers and Sailors follow orders - not protest political decisions. There is such a thing as good order and discipline - and these soldiers / sailors are NOT following it.
Why are they doing this?

Because you civilians are not doing your job. YOU, as the majority have a CIVIC DUTY to learn about, choose and hold responsible your elected representatives. The very fact that these veterans are doing this tells me that civilians are failing to uphold their civic duty, and now our soldiers and sailors must violate their oaths to get the message across.

And don't try to make excuses. How many people around here actually got up and voted? You can lie to me, but you know the truth. How many people here know who their congressman are? Who their senators are? Probably just a small minority....and that is just sad.

Furthermore, I hear all the time that the system is "rigged". And...It might be - and yet - you lemmings either don't vote at all, or continue to tow the "party line". It's pretty much common knowledge that a new major third party would be a good thing in American politics, am I right? All the Libertarian party needed was 5% of the electorate.
We all knew Gary Johnson wasn't going to win - that wasn't the point - the point was to get another third party officially recognized and YOU FAILED. I doubt many of you have even one iota of what I'm talking about. Sad.

The worst part is - you continue to fail.
And you will continue to fail until the majority of you lemmings pull your collective heads out of the sand and start paying attention.

You sir, are absolutely correct! The civilians need to protest (active duty CANNOT).

Organize! Lets the politicians know how u feel!

Originally posted by zeeon
And don't try to make excuses. How many people around here actually got up and voted?

Ok. Then let's make a deal. You and your military buddies go and seize every single last electronic voting machine there is, and put back paper ballots- and I will help rally the civilian troops to get out there and start voting again. Because as it stands, voting is useless.

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by St Udio

that 17 yo nephew has maybe 40% of their career options nullified by your 'good intentions' (limited knowledge)
excuse me if you are offended

Oh no, I am not offended. Because at least I have a nephew that is ALIVE- not lying on some Iraqi or Afghan sand and dying from an AK47 bullet or IED explosion. On the other hand, if this country was invaded, I would go and get that same nephew and haul his ass off to the battlefront. With me. There is a right time to die. For the RIGHT reasons.

wtf? whats the difference dying over there or over here if both wars are manufactured by lies?
or if the US was invaded because of previous invasions?
maybe there is just no 'right time to die' for any reason other than , youre old

Did anyone catch this? I think it's the same image used in the hack screenshot.

((According to this article, the US Marine Corps website was hacked by the Syrian army with a screenshot containing the same image.))

www.thedailysheeple.com...

Originally posted by TrueAmerican

Originally posted by zeeon
And don't try to make excuses. How many people around here actually got up and voted?

Ok. Then let's make a deal. You and your military buddies go and seize every single last electronic voting machine there is, and put back paper ballots- and I will help rally the civilian troops to get out there and start voting again. Because as it stands, voting is useless.

It's exactly this kind of passive "Nothing matters, so I'm not going to do anything" attitude that is YOUR PROBLEM. You can claim until your blue in the face that voting is rigged, votes don't matter - blah - blah - blaaaaah.

What you fail to understand is that if you quit trying, "they" HAVE ALREADY WON.
If the TPTB are rigging and manipulating votes, MAKE THEM WORK FOR IT.
Why make it easier on them? Why do you, and people who think like you defer your only voice? So what if it ultimately doesn't matter? Continue to exercise it! Exercise it until you are 100% totally unable to do so anymore.

It just baffles my mind to hear that excuse. So what if it's rigged? It's not a valid reason to stop trying.

Originally posted by links234

Originally posted by fenson76
What that Chief did could cause him his career if found out. He did a brave thing.

No. It's not 'brave.' It's brave if you don't involve yourself in the conflict. If you're to be deployed then you become a conscientious objector. Or you don't join the military in the first place.

It violates the UCMJ by taking a stance on a political issue while in uniform. I would expect a navy chief to know better.

Furthermore, it's not about helping Al'Qaeda or supporting terrorists. It's about telling a government that chemical weapons on civilians, in particular, is wrong. Standing by while atrocities are committed is complicit in those atrocities!

The United States has turned a blind eye to human rights violations for way, way too long. I hope congress endorses a limited strike on military targets within Syria.

edit on 1-9-2013 by links234 because: Emphasis.

Hmmm. lets see how wrong you are.
"Any commissioned officer who uses contemptuous words against the President, the Vice President, Congress, the Secretary of Defense, the Secretary of a military department, the Secretary of Transportation, or the Governor or legislature of any State, Territory, Commonwealth, or possession in which he is on duty or present shall be punished as a court-martial may direct."

A chief is NOT an Officer. The rules are different. You have no idea what you are talking about. I know, I was enlisted and knew even then years ago there was a difference. At least get your facts straight. The only rules about this that apply to enlisted are:
(1) violates or fails to obey any lawful general order or regulation;

(2) having knowledge of any other lawful order issued by any member of the armed forces, which it is his duty to obey, fails to obey the order; or

(3) is derelict in the performance of his duties

Where does it say they can't have an opinion? People join the military to protect their country not others or bankers profits. Your argument about not getting involved as a person in the military is so out of touch it's scary. You have no idea. The fact that you can't take the time to google the right information before trying to put someone in their place makes anything you say about as trustworthy as CNN/FOX.

reply to post by fenson76

Where does it say they can't have an opinion? People join the military to protect their country not others or bankers profits. Your argument about not getting involved as a person in the military is so out of touch it's scary. You have no idea. The fact that you can't take the time to google the right information before trying to put someone in their place makes anything you say about as trustworthy as CNN/FOX.

Unfortunately you just aren't 100% correct either. I don't have the time to search through the 1000+ pages of Military and Navy regulation, but I do know for sure that you CANNOT voice a political opinion in uniform - there is no distinction between enlisted and officer. The key point is IN UNIFORM. In uniform you are an official representative of the service you belong to. Anything you say while in uniform can and often is misconstrued by the public as official when it is not. That is why only PAO's (Public Affairs Officers) are authorized to give statements to the press in uniform (as well upper echelon brass such as the CNO etc etc).

I spent 13 years in the Navy. I was an E-6 LPO before I got out. I'm very familiar with the regs.

reply to post by zeeon


Exactly, now someone is going to post the next go to rationalization for not voting third party, "you are just throwing your vote away." These conversations always circle lunacy and tend to proceed as follows:

Me: "Vote third party for real change. The two parties aren't fixing anything and voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil."
Voter: "I would but I don't want to throw my vote away."
Me: "You are just using a self-fulfilling prophecy here. If you actually voted third party and got others to do so then we could start changing things."
Voter: "No if I vote third party it is just a vote for the

This is simple, he has to follow orders, It does not matter where he is ask to fight, he just has to do it.

Do what your ordered. Keep your opinions out of it.

Originally posted by Skorpy
This is simple, he has to follow orders, It does not matter where he is ask to fight, he just has to do it.

Do what your ordered. Keep your opinions out of it.

Sigh...no he doesn't. I have refused an illegal order before and their was nothing anyone could do to me. I refused to sign off on an inspection which grounded two aircraft in an emergency situation. I was threatened with everything under the sun but stuck to my guns and got ZERO reprisals. If you believe something is illegal, don't do it. Not that hard a decision. Also the whole "conscientious objector" thing doesn't cover the majority of the military which is in a support role. I suppose infantry can try but unless you want to be the "paper bit.h" for the rest of your command, I would think twice. I don;t know where you are getting that in uniform you can't say something political. Show me. I have and NOTHING happened to me so, I am not saying that you are wrong but my experiences are different. It's more likely up to each CO to enforce rules upon the enlisted.

reply to post by fenson76


I hope you're not in the military because I don't want you to get in trouble for anything in particular, however:

Members of the Armed Forces are prohibited from participating in off-post demonstrations when they are in uniform in violation of DoD Directive 1334.1 (reference (d)).

Also

The commander of a military installation or other military controlled facility under the jurisdiction of the United States shall prohibit any demonstration or activity on the installation or facility that could result in interference with or prevention of orderly accomplishment of the mission of the installation or facility.

Don't protest in uniform. End of story.

I've been having some rather heated discussions about Syria and I'm having some reservations about my initial stance on the subject. I can't give a concrete opinion on it at the time and I can't take back what I originally posted. I stand by the belief that what these servicemembers are doing is wrong if not on the verge of being against regulations and I oppose that.

reply to post by curme


Just because you swore that oath doesn't mean, in any shape, fashion, or form that you obey every damned order that comes your way. If it's illegal, you are actually obligated to disobey it, and report it to those above the issuer.

Taking that oath doesn't, or shouldn't anyway; turn you into some sort of mindless drone. One can be a soldier, and still be an upstanding person. Illegal orders are to be disobeyed, that's implicit in that oath, but you'd better be ready for the repercussions if you're wrong...