Nehelannia...The Return of a Forgotten Goddess.

Trying to stay on track with the original post but my nose keeps getting pulled by puzzles

Were the leaders of the Franks Sarmatians?

The Frankish Cugerni, later called Sicambri, lived in the 1st quarter of the 5th century
Colonia Ulpia Traiana, now Xanten, on the Rhine upstream of Nijmegen, east of Venlo.
This Germanic people had a treaty with the Romans. They served as a buffer for
the even wilder eastern living barbarians.
In this region were also stationed Sarmatians. They came from the Danube Plain.
They and the Franks as well were by treaties associated with the Romans as foederati.
In the middle of the 5th century, they were retired to the south and had a great camp to
Fanum Martis, now Famars.
Childerik, ± 440-480, the first Frankish king, was in the same time by the Romans assigned
to a large area in Tournai. His tomb was discovered in 1652 in the church of Saint Brice and
therein were except Germanic also clear Sarmatian marks.
Childeric was a son or at least a descendant of the semi-legendary king Merovech.
From Merovech recounts a legend that he is the son of a princess and a sea monster.
This shows similarities with the Sarmatian Nart saga. The ancestor of the main gender
the Urismagsprung from the commitment of progenitor Achsartag with a sea nymph,
daughter of the sea godDonbettir.
Clodovech, called by the French Clovis, son of Childeric was leader of probably 500 Franks.
Him was given the command of Roman units of allies Sarmatians and Alemanni and he married
Clotilde Burgundian princess who had the catholic religion.
Clodovech and his entire court took the over the Christian faith, in that way he got the mighty
bishops on his hand. He lost however as a result the half his Frankish followers.
The conquest of the important city Soissons showed his growing power.
The military settlers of other origin assimilated unnoticed with the Franks.
An example of the assimilation of the Alans, mainly that in Armorica the later Brittany
is demonstrated by the disappearance of the tribal name Alan together with
the appearance of the first name Alain. That name is even very popular until now
also in the English territories. Even the name Goar remained. This suggests that the Alans
were a rather small group.
After the Christianization of the Alans, which took place about the same time as that of the Franks,
we see in the sixth century a bishop and a Saint Alanus and also a St. Goar.
A variant name is Eochar. This sometimes occurs alternately in the same person.
In the Ossetian, the language of the eastern Alans, the name Goar Changed to Iæukhar.
Another Goar was in 627 in Aquitaine Count of Albi and succeeded in 630 St. Arnulphus,
the oldest known ancestor of the Carolingians, as bishop of Metz.
This indicates at least a close relationship between the Alanian and French nobility.
The German historian Schmoeckel see much evidence that the Merovingians as well as
the Carolingiansare descendants of the Sarmatians.

There is a linkage to your previous thread- the Sarmatians had distorted skulls- crasy but i follow my instincts

The poet Ausononius sees on a journey in the year 368 in the Moselle valley a recent built village of peaceful Sarmatian farmers.
King Sambida accepted in 440 a settlement in the valley of the Rhone at Valence.
In Valence (Fr.) in the Rhône valley are graves found from the 4th century with skulls as seen in the Ukraine in steppe peoples such as Sarmatians and also Goths with a characteristic skull deformation, caused by tight bandage of the growing skull of new born babies. (3)
In Brittany king Eochar got in 447 his own country.
In an area around Lake Geneva are many places with names of Alanian origin. These must have been Alanian settlements. Here are also graves from the 5th century of people that have the same typical Sarmatian skull deformation.



Some people feel the various different shapes of heads were remnants of the citizens of the lost continent of Atlantis. These people either had this shape naturally or had some specific reason to shape the head from infancy to enhance some person power, may it be political power, mental capacity or psychic ability. In this theory the surviving Atlanteans became seeds for other cultures, providing knowledge of science and psychic arts wherever they dispersed to. They founded cultures in Mexico, Peru, Egypt and beyond. Other people started copying them, creating the elongated heads as a custom representing a certain class of people. A similar theory says that these people were the survivors of another lost Pacific continent, the continent of Mu, which disseminated coneheads to South America and Mexico.

I know Sarmatian history because this area was a veterans settlement of such, and thus there is much local descent from them, in fact the country church were my Grandfathers family lived on the Fylde coast had a Roman altar from the fort as a baptismal font, so very much local history for me.

Bremetenacum

I don't know if you've read the book from Scythia to Camelot but it makes the case for the Arthurian Legends deriving from the Sarmatians in Britain.


Scythia to Camelot

Historical sources tell us about their presence under this name in the time of Marcus Aurelius. 5500 Sarmatians were settled in Britain who seemed to have disappeared, except for one “ala” (cavalry regiment) of 500 men in Ribchester.

The Hungarian connection

One will find correspondence between say the cult of Nerthus and the Lady of the Lake tradition, but i don't think it can directly relate to the cult of Nehalennia, the dates are too early and there is different emphasis and aspects.

But a couple more links;


Lucius Artorius Castus

The Battles in Britain

Thanks for the links in the previous post which is exactly where i was being led to. This passage i read made me laugh as it was a good example of history repeating itself.

Prof. Gyula Mészáros, Turkologist, published a short article in 1937, concerning the discord between the Romans and the Iazig[21]: “We can read about the Jazyg battle of Emperor Constantine in the year 359, in the history books of Ammianus Marcellinus. The Emperor came from his winter camp at Sirmium and organized his troops at Aquincum near the Danube against the limigates who were liberated from serfdom. The Jazygs, faced with the Romans, feigned defeat and promised to be faithful subjects and asked to be permitted to go to the other side of the Danube. The Emperor had a platform built to give a speech to his subjects to be. He almost began to speak, when an irate Jazyg warrior took off his boot and threw it toward the Emperor, calling out: “Marha-marha” words which Ammianus believed to be their battle cry.[22] This Jazyg “battlecry” means “(You) Ox, (you) Ox” in Magyar. Even in the distant past, this word for bovines had already attained its secondary meaning: “You idiot!”.

I realise I am getting off on a tangent but I am following hunches and hoping to tie it all together so it has some semblance of at theory. I ask for the op’s patience and hope that they can offer their educated opinion when they feel I am barking up the wrong tree with tenuous associations
My ultimate intention is to try and link the Merovingians with the Royal Scythians and the Sumerians and Enki I am not a scholar of these things but even a cursory reading of these subjects shows in my opinion linkages between the legends of Arthur, the Merovingians, the Sarmatians, Sumerians and Enki either through the idea of a bloodline or cultural leakage. Not sure how this might eventually tie in with the goddess but there are possibilities with Avalon.

en.wikipedia.org...
The Merovingian dynasty owes its name to the semi-legendary Merovech (Latinised as Meroveus or Merovius and in French as Merovée), leader of the Salian Franks, and emerges into wider history with the victories of his son Childeric I (reigned c. 457–481) against the Visigoths, Saxons, and Alemanni. Childeric's son Clovis I (481–511) went on to unite most of Gaul north of the Loire under his control around 486, when he defeated Syagrius, the Roman ruler in those parts. He won the Battle of Tolbiac against the Alemanni in 496, at which time, according to Gregory of Tours, Clovis adopted his wife Clotilda's Catholic (i.e. Nicene) Christian faith. He subsequently went on to decisively defeat the Visigothic kingdom of Toulouse in the Battle of Vouillé in 507.
The Merovingian ruling family were sometimes referred to as the "long-haired kings" (Latin reges criniti) by contemporaries, as their long hair distinguished them among the Franks, who commonly cut their hair short. The term "Merovingian" comes from medieval Latin Merovingi or Merohingi ("sons of Merovech"), an alteration of an unattested Old Dutch form, akin to their dynasty's Old English name Merewīowing,
The Merovingians derived their royal power from their long hair, which was thought to confer upon them martial prowess. Childeric III, the last Merovingian king, was notable for his thick golden-red hair, which was said to reach to his lower back.
The Chronicle of Fredegar interpolated on this reference by Gregory by adding Merovech was the son of the queen, Chlodio's wife; but his father was a sea-god, bistea Neptuni.[4] Some researchers have noted that Merovech, the Frankish chieftain, may have been the namesake of a certain god or demigod honored by the Franks prior to their conversion to Christianity.
It has been suggested Merovech refers to, or is reminiscent of, the Dutch river Merwede,[5] Although this river was historically a main subsidiary of the Rhine, in modern times it is a tribute of the Rhine-Meus-Scheldt delta; the area where, according to Roman historians, the Salian Franks once dwelled.
Another theory[6] considers this legend to be the creation of a mythological past needed to back up the fast-rising Frankish rule in Western Europe.
A certain ancient legend holds that Merovech was conceived under parnormal or divine circumstances. It is said that Pharamond's wife, while swimming, encountered a Quinotauror sea monster, which presumably could change shapes. Though never stated, it is implied that she was impregnated by it. This legend was related by Fredegar in the seventh century and may have been known earlier. The legend is probably a back-formation or folk etymology used to explain the Salian Franks' origin as a coastal culture, and was thus based on the name itself.
The "Mero-" or "Mer-" element in the name suggests a sea or ocean (see Old English "mere," Latin "mare," or even the Modern English word "mermaid"
Now the Sarmatians seem to be associated with the Royal Scythians. When they made the treaty with the Romans they offered to supply auxiliaries namely cavalry. Now I assume that the royal clan was known for its bravery and would have supplied aristocrats so as to be seen to lead by example.
These cavalry had mail armour that was designed like fishes scales they did not cut their hair and tied it in a Gordian knot. They painted their bodies in spirals which I believe where representative of curled snakes. They also had a priestly caste that wore hats shaped exactly like a magicians such as Merlin.
Now what got me thinking about this was something I found while researching the op’s original post so I am sorry if I am moving off topic but I will post it next as I believe it shows a linkage with Enki even if tenuous.

The earliest written record of cranial deformation dates to 400 BC in Hippocrates' description of the Macrocephali or Long-heads, who were named for their practice of cranial modification. He said of it:

"14. I will pass over the smaller differences among the nations, but will now treat of such as are great either from nature, or custom; and, first, concerning the Macrocephali [tribe or `nation' said to be living beyond the Bosphorus / Black Sea or maybe even further i.e Scythians - RD] There is no other race of men which have heads in the least resembling theirs".

"...At first, usage was the principal cause of the length of their head, but now nature cooperates with usage. They think those the most noble who have the longest heads...".

"It is thus with regard to the usage: immediately after the child is born, and while its head is still tender, they fashion it with their hands, and constrain it to assume a lengthened shape by applying bandages and other suitable contrivances whereby the spherical form of the head is destroyed, and it is made to increase in length".

With regards to the actual subject i believe an alternate meaning of Nehalennnia may mean place, hall, or small alcove of sublime light if it split into ne halen nia.

The apples bring to mind the hesperides and Hercules.

Ordinarily the Hesperides number three, like the other Greek triads (the Three Graces and the Moirai). "Since the Hesperides themselves are mere symbols of the gifts the apples embody, they cannot be actors in a human drama. Their abstract, interchangeable names are a symptom of their impersonality," Evelyn Harrison has observed.[5]


This circular Pyxis or box depicts two scenes. The one shown presents the Olympian gods feasting around a tripod table holding the golden Apple of the Hesperides.[6] The Walters Art Museum.
Nevertheless, among the names given to them, though never all at once, are Aegle ("dazzling light"), Arethusa, Erytheia (or Erytheis) and Hesperia (alternatively Hespereia, Hespere, Hespera, Hesperusa or Hesperethoosa). Lipara, Asterope and Chrysothemis are named in a Hesperide scene of the apotheosis of Heracles (romanised to Hercules) on a late fifth-century hydria by the Meidias Painter in London[7] They are sometimes called the Western Maidens, the Daughters of Evening or Erythrai, and the "Sunset Goddesses", designations all apparently tied to their imagined location in the distant west. Hesperis is appropriately the personification of the evening (as Eos is of the dawn) and the Evening Star is Hesperus. In addition to their tending of the garden, they were said to have taken great pleasure in singing.

I realise it is meant to be Cadiz but Avalon and this Godess are associated with Apples, Cadiz?

. Thus say the Scythians about themselves and about the region above them; but the Hellenes who dwell about the Pontus say as follows: -- Heracles driving the cattle of Geryones came to this land, then desert, which the Scythians now inhabit; and Geryones, says the tale, dwelt away from the region of the Pontus, living in the island called by the Hellenes Erytheia, near Gadeira which is outside the Pillars of Heracles by the Ocean.

The Scythian hat would fit a conehead, Why are wizards hats like Sythian Hats and no other? Merlin wears a Scythian hat. Mer water lake. Lay of the lake. Avalon. The armour of the Sarmatians is fish scales also associated with Dragons, Worms and snakes with legs. Wizards again. The scythians wore a gold cup or chalice and a gold fish that was a sturgeon, Time to investigate the numerous tribes that lived in that area around the Nehalennia area and try and find connections

en.wikipedia.org...

These things are obvious the story just needs to be followed up. They just need to be tied up with enki the coneheads, esau, cain, oannes, sirius, mermaids and a bloodline

Henry Creswicke Rawlinson, in his 1853 address to the Royal Asiatic Society
""The Scythian warlords of the Sidhe (a transcendent intellect called the Web of the Wise) originated in the Carpathians and Russian steppe-lands to become a migratory race who took their culture far and wide - as far as Ireland to the West and Mongolia to the East. Indeed, the very name of Ur (the capital of Sumer) came from the Scythian word Ur, meaning 'Lord', while the settlement of Anu was not in Sumer where one might expect to find it, but hundreds of miles to the north on the Caspian Sea.""

scythians/sakas/ serpents
NAGA/NAICK
Another version claimed Heracles and a half serpent (mermaid like) being as the ancestors of the Scythians. Both have ties with similar stories among other Ural-Altaic legends. Starting with the serpent like mother of the Scythians, who in India was called Naga, by the local Scythian incomers. The NAK suffix and root word also has a very rich set of meanings in the Ugrian languages, including
( 4, feminine, joint-vertabra, genetive - source, navel, rule of
important person.)
To a lesser extent the root word is part of most U.A. and Sumerian languages. Several of the local Scythian tribes use this word for chief/ruler "Naick". Similarly the Ugrians Nay=queen, Nayer=king. Hungarian Nyek tribe. (Scythian NAICK-erde tribe next to the Aral Sea.)
A Greek legend of the origin of the Anatolian Megari claims that Zeus maries a Scythian nymph and their childred are the source of this nation. In another variation the sons of Zeus and Nemesis, are known as the Gemini twins. According to Greek tradition even Zeus originates from the east. The pre-Vedic Gathas also call the constellation Capricorn by the name Makar, while Gemini is Mit-huna. Much like the Hunor and Magor twins of Hungarians dealing with the mythical stagg. Similarly the Sumerian god ENKI is also known as Daramah the "great stagg", whose other symbol is the fish, the combination of the two is Capricorn.
Many of the Hun and Turkic tribes had the wolf and various dog breeds as the totem animals and in Turkic languages bo"ru" refers to wolf. Herodotus also mentions the Scythian NEURI, who "turn into wolves once per year.. as a ceremony no doubt. This tribal name is much like the Hurrian NAIRI tribal name. The royal tribes of the Huns had the dragon (LIU-ente dynasty) as their totem like the Medes and royal Scythians. It would only be natural for the royal Scythians to have the half serpent half woman being to be their ancestress with the type of legend Herodotus related about the mating of Zeus with such a mythical "mermaid", which Herodotus calles the daughter of Bor-isten(es).

In the great epic Mahabharata, the depiction of nagas tends toward the positive. An epic calls them "persecutors of all creatures", and tells us "the snakes were of virulent poison, great prowess and excess of strength, and ever bent on biting other creatures" (Book I: Adi Parva, Section 20). At some points within the story, nagas are important players in many of the events narrated in the epic, frequently no more evil nor deceitful than the other protagonists, and sometimes on the side of good.
Stories involving the nāgas are still very much a part of contemporary cultural traditions in predominantly Hindu regions of Asia (India, Nepal, and the island of Bali). In India, nāgas are considered nature spirits and the protectors of springs, wells and rivers. They bring rain, and thus fertility, but are also thought to bring disasters such as floods and drought.
Nagas are snakes that may take human form. They tend to be very curious. According to traditions nāgas are only malevolent to humans when they have been mistreated. They are susceptible to mankind's disrespectful actions in relation to the environment. They are also associated with waters—rivers, lakes, seas, and wells—and are generally regarded as guardians of treasure.
Traditions about nāgas are also very common in all the Buddhist countries of Asia. In many countries, the nāga concept has been merged with local traditions of great and wise serpents or dragons. In Tibet, the nāga was equated with the klu, wits that dwell in lakes or underground streams and guard treasure. In China, the nāga was equated with the lóng or Chinese dragon.
Nāgas are believed to both live on Mount Sumeru, among the other minor deities, and in various parts of the human-inhabited earth. Some of them are water-dwellers, living in streams or the mer; others are earth-dwellers, living in underground caverns

There is no where an ego can't go.

Originally posted by ScoobyDont
There is no where an ego can't go.

I wonder what that means, and whose ego it is directed to........
who gives a flying flip what line it is.....

reply to post by spannera



I think you're right in the relationship to the Hesperides, when one considers the triple form of Nehalennia;

See Triple aspect Nehalennia


This then finds comparison with the triple Matronae/Aufaniae and Matres.

Matres and Matrones appear depicted on both stones with inscriptions and without, both as altars and votives. All depictions are frontal, they appear almost exclusively in threes with at least one figure holding a basket of fruit in her lap, and the women are either standing or sitting. In some depictions, the middle figure is depicted with loose hair and wearing a headband, and the other two wear head dresses

the loose hair may point to maidenhood, whereas the head dresses may refer to married women, the snakes may refer to an association with the souls of the dead or the underworld, and the children and nappies seem to indicate that the Matres and Matrones held a protective function over the family, as well as a particular function as midwives.

Matre and Matrones

The Garden of the Hesperides is Hera's orchard in the west, where either a single tree or a grove of immortality-giving golden apples grew. The apples were planted from the fruited branches that Gaia gave to her as a wedding gift when Hera accepted Zeus. The Hesperides were given the task of tending to the grove


They are sometimes called the Western Maidens, the Daughters of Evening or Erythrai, and the "Sunset Goddesses", designations all apparently tied to their imagined location in the distant west. Hesperis is appropriately the personification of the evening

Hesperides




Hesperides relates to Venus as the Evening star, or Vesper, i would also though expect one of the three to relate to Venus as Morning star, in terms of the overall cycle of death and rebirth, with the Golden Maiden ruling by day, ie connected to the Sun.

The most celebrated aspect of Venus was though as the Evening star in the West, and the other two aspects could be considered subordinate, in that it is the sensual fertility Goddess of Evening delights that is the key to progression through the cycle.




Nehalennia could be represented also in the manner of Venus.

reply to post by tetra50


This line . Sorry for over reaching but nobody found a treasure by hiding under a bushel. Lol, Just think that the Merovingians story is interesting and a puzzle worth solving. Dragons like to hide there gold.

Hidden Mysteries

In 1656 Nicolas Fouquet, France's finance minister under King Louis XIV- sent his younger brother the Abbey Louis to Rome where he met with the painter Nicolas Poussin. In a letter to his brother Fouquet wrote that he and Poussin had:

discussed certain things of which 1 shall be able to inform you fully in a short while which will give you, through M. Poussin benefits, which kings would have great trouble extracting from him, and which after him perhaps no one in the world will rediscover in the centuries to come; and moreover this will be without great expense and could even be turned to profit and that these things are so hard to discover that nothing on earth can have greater value nor be their equal.

Originally posted by 3n19m470

I'm sure your lady is admirable in many respects. She has hobbies, and aspirations, and personality quirks that render her unique and loveable.

But I'm certain she wouldn't appreciate the virtues of her vag being introduced into a forum discussion, particularly when her bits are being used as a cheap rhetorical gambit.

Right?

reply to post by spannera


Interesting what you said about the Nordwestblock.

This from a Masonic site, regarding the cornerstone laying ceremony:

"The cornerstone is normally placed on the face of the building, or front Northwest side of the building. It can be placed in a flag pole structure (or other structure similar) close to the building."

I wonder if there is a connection.

Originally posted by 3n19m470
reply to post by spannera

 

Interesting what you said about the Nordwestblock.

This from a Masonic site, regarding the cornerstone laying ceremony:

"The cornerstone is normally placed on the face of the building, or front Northwest side of the building. It can be placed in a flag pole structure (or other structure similar) close to the building."

I wonder if there is a connection.

Well, gosh, I guess you'd have to plant a flagpole to find out.

I'm guessing the land will rest unimpressed.

reply to post by Eidolon23


I thought you could tell by most of my post, including the parts you quoted, that I was in a humorous mood today... She usually gives me a break when I'm trying to be "cute", but you're right I should probably change that a little... Sorry I realize I'm not in some "man-cave" knocking back cold ones with the fellas here, thanks for the polite reminder.

reply to post by 3n19m470


No problem.

Beer is the Grand Dispensation. She's cool, you're cool, we're all cool, and everyone's giggling.

My best to you and your Lady.

And your brothers.

reply to post by 3n19m470



42-45. (Inana speaks) "Maybe it will muddy the waters, and will leave gigantic cowpats -- but let my father give me the Bull of Heaven, so I can kill the lord, so I can kill the lord, so I can kill the lord, Lord Gilgameš!"

46-49. Great An replied to holy Inana: "My child, the Bull of Heaven would not have any pasture, as its pasture is on the horizon. Maiden Inana, the Bull of Heaven can only graze where the sun rises. So I cannot give the Bull of Heaven to you!"

50-51. Holy Inana replied to him: "I shall shout, and make my voice reach heaven and earth!"

52-54. He was frightened, he was frightened. Great An replied to holy Inana: "I shall give her the Bull of Heaven."