Third Party Lucid Dreaming Interference

reply to post by teachtaire


Hi,

interesting thread, so S & F

I have had a lot of lucid dreams (also obes) over the years and have experienced a lot of this 'interference'.
It's almost as if by changing status within the dream from normal user to more of an admin status, it triggers a protective program within the dream system. So we have, for example, a fast manifestation of dream characters (just when you thought you were in a nice quiet location to get along with your business) that can forcefully restrict you sometimes. I've had it where I'm trying to fly and they're trying to catch my legs. Also where they start doing this really irritating tickling around my ribs. I hate being restricted by them! So many of my experiences ended up revolving around escaping from their pursuits.

I think the only way around it is to be like a hacker. Try out ways where you are more able to blend into the goings on of the dream. This will usually require an initial change of attitude to how we view the dream situation. For example, one of the main constants of this scenario is feeling irritated by them and wanting to escape or destroy them somehow. Instead, you could try playing around with the idea of purposefully intending not to care about them anymore. Plan in your waking hours to not bother addressing their presence anymore (e.g. trying to devise ways of getting rid of them/escaping from them). It's almost as if the worrying and puzzling over them is taking our energy. So making the decision not to care somehow frees you up a bit, makes you feel lighter. Since taking this perspective I've noticed their influence is not so pervasive.

Aelf

Originally posted by RedCairo

I've had dreams with entities before. e.g. the Abramelin entity on invisibility was very kind. I told him the whole story of the Flatlanders and why my people thought we couldn't see his, and he educated me about why we really don't see entities like him and how to do it

Would you mind sharing what he said regarding why we don't see entities like him and the method he showed you on how to? Thanks

Aelf

reply to post by Aelfrede

OK. Didn't do me much good, but then, I am the metaphysically obtuse most of the time, maybe it will be more helpful to you.

One night I flipped through a book called The Sacred Magic of Abramelin the Mage, one of the books the Order folks had mentioned. I ignored all the various warnings – frankly, I just had a hard time taking magick at all seriously – and drew one of the talisman-like squares from it, related to "invisibility." (Seemed harmless enough, compared to the other stuff, anyway.) Getting bored, I tossed the book aside and watched TV with my grandmother until bedtime.

January, 1995

"...but really," I found myself explaining to [him], "We do understand about things being more dimensional than ourselves." I told him the story of the Flatlanders, and how many people have used this as an example, guessing that "entities" such as him were extra dimensional or some such thing; that perhaps we just weren't capable of seeing them.

He listened patiently, I thought, but then said (in words? I'm not sure, but it translates to that), "You misunderstand. Extra dimensionality has nothing to do with why you don't usually see me. Here..." and he carefully "held me by the edges" and focused me directly upon him.

"Come on," I said, laughing, understanding that he was "teaching me about invisibility" but not feeling I'd be up to performing it. "I bet I could balance a whole stack of Abramelin squares on my head and STILL not be invisible!" He seemed humored.

"Look," he said, suddenly serious, "Look at me." And suddenly he was nowhere in sight. I looked around – where did he go?! But I could feel him there, somewhere, as if he were right in front of me. Again I felt him "holding me by the edges and focusing me," and my vision got smaller and smaller until it was just a molecular dot, a searing focus of dagger point, and then it extended vertically, as if I were seeing through this tiny crack in a barely opened door.

And finally I could see completely through it, and was "there" with him, with a feeling of new focus that reminded me of those 3D pictures so popular of late. It wasn't as if I had to focus to get there... it was more like I had to unfocus, and allow my Will to work out refocusing my eyes where I wanted to see. It was as if any attempt to control my focus, to be in control, to insist on my own way of seeing it, doomed me to failure. Then when my brain sorted it out and the focus began coming into view, then I could take control again.

The key to seeing the invisible was not great effort, which in fact distracted me and made me attempt to focus on what I already knew. And it wasn't focusing larger than my world; it was actually focusing smaller, specifically, like looking through a keyhole, and then when you finally got the vision through the keyhole you got closer to it until the vision filled your whole sight.

As for being invisible, he indicated that it had to do with changing your own perception, as if somehow your own perception affected "where you were" and affected other people's perception of you as a result. I wasn't completely clear on this. I was confused about how, for instance, you could pay attention to "here" and yet "not" at the same time, so that you could operate in the same place you were being invisible in.

He took me through it, demonstrating how there were many levels of consciousness quite available to me even in normal waking life, and showing me how I already had it worked out; the "level of thinking" I've always called "my anchor" proved I'd been doing the multiple thinking all my life anyway, "anchoring" one level of thought while using the "surface layers" for activity.

It seemed clear when I was there, but when I awoke a short time later I didn't think I'd be able to do either – view, or hide – on my own.

-- from Bewilderness, chapter 16

Thanks for that. Very interesting. Your description of the type of focus you had being familiar to looking at 3D drawings is something I can relate to. When you said:

'And it wasn't focusing larger than my world; it was actually focusing smaller, specifically, like looking through a keyhole, and then when you finally got the vision through the keyhole you got closer to it until the vision filled your whole sight.'

Could you explain this focusing smaller in a bit more detail (if you're able to)? Also, was this done when awake eyes open/when lucid dreaming/behind closed eyes?

Btw I sent you a U2U

Cheers,

Aelf

Originally posted by RedCairo
reply to post by Aelfrede

OK. Didn't do me much good, but then, I am the metaphysically obtuse most of the time, maybe it will be more helpful to you.

One night I flipped through a book called The Sacred Magic of Abramelin the Mage, one of the books the Order folks had mentioned. I ignored all the various warnings – frankly, I just had a hard time taking magick at all seriously – and drew one of the talisman-like squares from it, related to "invisibility." (Seemed harmless enough, compared to the other stuff, anyway.) Getting bored, I tossed the book aside and watched TV with my grandmother until bedtime.

January, 1995

"...but really," I found myself explaining to [him], "We do understand about things being more dimensional than ourselves." I told him the story of the Flatlanders, and how many people have used this as an example, guessing that "entities" such as him were extra dimensional or some such thing; that perhaps we just weren't capable of seeing them.

He listened patiently, I thought, but then said (in words? I'm not sure, but it translates to that), "You misunderstand. Extra dimensionality has nothing to do with why you don't usually see me. Here..." and he carefully "held me by the edges" and focused me directly upon him.

"Come on," I said, laughing, understanding that he was "teaching me about invisibility" but not feeling I'd be up to performing it. "I bet I could balance a whole stack of Abramelin squares on my head and STILL not be invisible!" He seemed humored.

"Look," he said, suddenly serious, "Look at me." And suddenly he was nowhere in sight. I looked around – where did he go?! But I could feel him there, somewhere, as if he were right in front of me. Again I felt him "holding me by the edges and focusing me," and my vision got smaller and smaller until it was just a molecular dot, a searing focus of dagger point, and then it extended vertically, as if I were seeing through this tiny crack in a barely opened door.

And finally I could see completely through it, and was "there" with him, with a feeling of new focus that reminded me of those 3D pictures so popular of late. It wasn't as if I had to focus to get there... it was more like I had to unfocus, and allow my Will to work out refocusing my eyes where I wanted to see. It was as if any attempt to control my focus, to be in control, to insist on my own way of seeing it, doomed me to failure. Then when my brain sorted it out and the focus began coming into view, then I could take control again.

The key to seeing the invisible was not great effort, which in fact distracted me and made me attempt to focus on what I already knew. And it wasn't focusing larger than my world; it was actually focusing smaller, specifically, like looking through a keyhole, and then when you finally got the vision through the keyhole you got closer to it until the vision filled your whole sight.

As for being invisible, he indicated that it had to do with changing your own perception, as if somehow your own perception affected "where you were" and affected other people's perception of you as a result. I wasn't completely clear on this. I was confused about how, for instance, you could pay attention to "here" and yet "not" at the same time, so that you could operate in the same place you were being invisible in.

He took me through it, demonstrating how there were many levels of consciousness quite available to me even in normal waking life, and showing me how I already had it worked out; the "level of thinking" I've always called "my anchor" proved I'd been doing the multiple thinking all my life anyway, "anchoring" one level of thought while using the "surface layers" for activity.

It seemed clear when I was there, but when I awoke a short time later I didn't think I'd be able to do either – view, or hide – on my own.

-- from Bewilderness, chapter 16

edit on 2-9-2013 by RedCairo because: (no reason given)

Originally posted by Aelfrede
Also, was this done when awake eyes open/when lucid dreaming/behind closed eyes?

That was a kind of lucid dream I had rather consistently for a few years -- I was aware that I was not in my normal waking world, and lucid even to the point of intellectual thought, and at times could even intentionally 'wake my body up' when I wanted. I very rarely have those anymore.

When you said:

'And it wasn't focusing larger than my world; it was actually focusing smaller, specifically, like looking through a keyhole, and then when you finally got the vision through the keyhole you got closer to it until the vision filled your whole sight.'

Could you explain this focusing smaller in a bit more detail (if you're able to)?

I have encountered this a lot since then. I think I could explain it more, but maybe before I do, I should share another experience from my case study, because it actually forms the basis of why I came up with the "mental model" for it I did.

Experiences and dreams I have even now -- rarely but sometimes -- use this model, and I'm not sure if that is because it is valid for me, or simply because having that model filters my perceptions to match. Hang on I have to go find it to quote it...

Alright. This is an experience which is perhaps best thought of as, er, shamanic perhaps. I was wide awake when it began, but I assume in an considerably altered state that I was able to perceive it at all.

[July 1993

He can hold you by that fear, I heard someone say. I existed on more than one "plane," that seemed clear at that moment: I spanned many layers of consciousness, which were frequencies like radio waves, and each "bandwidth" was a world, a reality... divisible for infinity, but for me there were specific groupings. In the level where "he" lived, my fear, which is an intangible emotion to me, was instead real to him, was tangible, was a solid thing he could grasp.

I had just arrived home after work, and the moment I sat down in my recliner he had arrived—perhaps not quite fully in the physical but almost tangible. He said he was going to test me for fear, and a weakness to....? I wasn't sure what. I was too scared to physically move, and I just reclined there, feeling my breathing, hoping I was dreaming or imagining it all. I was confused and unnerved. I silently complied. Why me? I was scared—How did he get in my house? Or was I dreaming? Hallucinating?

He put the fingers of his hand against my forehead and I trembled, unable to guess his intentions. Then I could see his hand as it became huge and rather etheric, and passed into me. He moved it slowly into and through me, searching, beginning with the very top of my head. He was intangible to me; I couldn't feel him physically, but I could "sense" him clearly. And I understood that while my body was intangible to him, he was looking for my fear, and somehow—based on a "mutually matching frequency" or something like that—it would not be.

I felt my fear starting up, growing and growling inside me, and now that I was tuned to the 'reality' of his plane, lower in my torso I felt it manifest, first as a wispy, cloud-like substance, then growing firmer as my fear became more pronounced, growing hard as it mounted into terror. I knew I had to let go of it; I had to get rid of it before his hand reached that part of me. I could almost imagine his fingers closing around it, and him having a part of me "in his control."

Unsure what to do or how to help myself, I remembered that my friend who was close to "Mother Mary" had once said that Archangel Michael was a good guy for protection. With a brief flash of black humor, recalling the saying about there being no Atheists in trenches, I yelled for him in my mind, hoping he was as real as Mary had been, and would help me for no better reason than because I asked. I wasn't religious, and I specifically wasn't Catholic, but faced with something this strange and scary, I found a sudden use for the imagery.

Secure in my belief that either he would protect me, or more likely that my belief in such would protect me regardless, with a humorous touch of not believing what I was experiencing was possible anyway, I relaxed, and I forced myself to clarity, to no emotion, to let everything go in the absolute faith that I would be ok. The solid result of my fear dissipated... into the wispy clouds... then into nothingness. I relaxed further. I was clear; I was clean; I was safe. His hand continued through me, traveling downward through my torso, and I had the feeling he was frustrated that I had nothing for him; I remained as intangible to him as he was to me.

His hand reached the bottom of me, just below my feet, and I found myself seized with an almost cruel realization. I opened my eyes, looked at him and laughed. He was very short, stocky (in some unusual manner I can't quite describe), he had no hair, he was very odd looking, and his eyes were far too bright to be "normal," they shined in a way that gave me the shivers.

But I was safe, and knew he wouldn't come near me again if he was smart. I had realized that my perception abilities included a wide spectrum of frequency-groups that included his group, his "reality." But he was a smaller, less complex sort than I—he was limited to his own world, his own "layer," and I was bigger than he was, I spanned lots of layers. Without my fear, that vibration that somehow existed as solid to him where he was, he had nothing, none of the power he sought to gain from a small part of me. He couldn't hurt me. I wasn't sure how we'd met—if he had "come" to me or if I had suddenly "attuned to" him—but he backed away from me and vanished.

I shook my head and said to myself, Wow! What just happened here? Was that a dream?! What...? and almost began to cry with a scared sort of confusion.]

I don't recall ever really thinking of such a thing in quite this way, where each layer was a world, and where it was specifically considered "frequency." It's simply that this was "obvious" to me as a given during the experience.

edit on 3-9-2013 by RedCairo because: Seem to have messed up ex tag

Alright. So since then, whether in conscious experiences, meditation (conscious but intentional and altered state) experiences, lucid dreams, or non-lucid dreams, it seems to follow this pattern:

That I as an entity span a certain spectrum of frequencies. A big spectrum (tiny compared to some other entities, but big compared to some).

Each of these frequencies is a world of its own. Each combined is another world. You can connect these in different combinations to create all kinds of worlds.

Enochian magick is an example of this. Looks like star-charts (sigils) in that model. The Cabala is an example of this. I think the 'paths' represented by Tarot as well as the sephira and different gradients of them may be that model (no expert on either of those mind you). The color scale, using color blending, is an example of this.

I called it The Rainbow of Soul in my '95 case study, but later discovered all kinds of other people have used the same term. However I think my use of it is better, heh.

All the frequencies that "are within my range" I think I may have the ability to "tune into."

Sometimes it just seems like every world, or bandwidth, has its own reality.

Sometimes it seems like certain bandwidths (let us say, the bandwidth of a certain frequency of cells in your body) is a "doorway" to a reality. (I had an experience like that which blew my mind, and was frankly harder for me to accept than even far more out-there experiences.)

Whether that means a reality can be compressed into what we would consider a small space (which is actually ludicrous in a physics sense, there is no such thing, the scale of size is off the charts of our ability to measure and comprehend in both directions), or whether there is another way of think of it (I have one but it's more words than I want to bother with right now), I'm not sure.

I had one lucid dream where this guy showed up, like a friend, distraught because his world had such issues. He was in 'my reality' in the dream, and at one point, he wadded up this paper in his fist, and then a 'layer' opened below us (in my floor) to his world, which was "a layer underneath mine" and I went with him, leaping into it. We shrank (! real Alice experience) and the paper fell with us. We reached the ground in his world, in a city center area, and the ball of paper was still falling, and it was like 3+ stories high compared to us at that point and we were scrambling to get out of the way before it came down.

I won't bore you with the (somewhat disturbing) dream, though I'm glad this made me think of it because I think I need to address this in a meditation, but the bottom line is that it was an entity who was a part of me but existing in his own reality which was a super-thin "layer." I was a lot "bigger" than him by nature, I think.

I was once told in a meditation that by default, I will perceive everything as human and similar to my own world (mental models), unless there is some energy that just can't be translated that way, in which case I perceive it symbolically, and that may mean symbology on the human (e.g. it may be a horse or a fairy), or symbolically of a different species (e.g. it may be a creature).

In my "Rainbow of Soul" theory, I said that "perception is the moving point," that there is a vast range of frequencies as well as sine-wave beat-patterns (these likely fall more into what you might call alternate realities, as experience, e.g. incredibly similar to here but not-quite).

I suspect the 30 Aethyrs in Enochian magick, which by the way mysteriously match "30 levels" in a couple other philosophical systems I'm too tired to think of right now, are probably within the bandwidth of us as a species.

I think the Abramelin entity, as well as most everything else we run into, occupies some combination of frequency/bandwidth which is within our range -- much 'smaller' than we are in that regard, although equal at their own level.

I think this has some mind boggling implications for the potential 'realities' of everything down to our liver cells. I know most people would rather think of entities and sentience as being 'outside' them and something metaphysical or spiritual or alien or whatever, but I suspect most of what we interact with is quite literally part of us, by which I mean, the 'us' which happens to exist at that particular frequency.

So that is why he seemed small. He was in a specific bandwidth much smaller than mine, like the guy in the weird shamanic experience I described.

Originally posted by RedCairo
Alright. So since then, whether in conscious experiences, meditation (conscious but intentional and altered state) experiences, lucid dreams, or non-lucid dreams, it seems to follow this pattern:

That I as an entity span a certain spectrum of frequencies. A big spectrum (tiny compared to some other entities, but big compared to some).

Each of these frequencies is a world of its own. Each combined is another world. You can connect these in different combinations to create all kinds of worlds.

Thanks for sharing your experience. Your talk of frequencies and bandwidths makes me think of the 'Eagle's emanations' that don Juan discussed in Castaneda's books. The most in-depth explanations about that, if I remember rightly, is in 'The Fire From Within' (by Carlos Castaneda).

Here's a few quotes that refer to it:

'Seers who see the Indescribable Force 's emanations often call them commands. That's what they really are, commands.

Everything is made out of the Indescribable Force 's emanations. Only a small portion of those emanations is within reach of human awareness, and that small portion is still further reduced, to a minute fraction, by the constraints of our daily lives. That minute fraction of the Indescribable Force 's emanations is the known; the small portion within possible reach of human awareness is the unknown, and the incalculable rest is the unknowable.

The new seers, being pragmatically oriented, became immediately cognizant of the compelling power of the emanations. They realized that all living creatures are forced to employ the Indescribable Force 's emanations without ever knowing what they are. They also realized that organisms are constructed to grasp a certain range of those emanations and that every species has a definite range. The emanations exert great pressure on organisms, and through that pressure organisms construct their perceivable world.

In our case, as human beings, we employ those emanations and interpret them as reality. But what man senses is such a small portion of the Indescribable Force 's emanations that it's ridiculous to put much stock in our perceptions, and yet it isn't possible for us to disregard our perceptions...'


' The Indescribable Force 's emanations cannot be rendered at all in a language of comparisons. Individual seers may feel the urge to make comments about certain emanations, but that will remain personal.

The new seers were terribly practical men. They weren't involved in concocting rational theories.

The new seers, imbued with practicality, were able to see a flux of emanations and to see how man and other living beings utilize them to construct their perceivable world.

The way those emanations are utilized by man is so simple it sounds idiotic. For a seer, men are luminous beings. Our luminosity is made up of that portion of the Indescribable Force 's emanations which is encased in our egglike cocoon. That particular portion, that handful of emanations that is encased, is what makes us men. To perceive is to match the emanations contained inside our cocoon with those that are outside.

Seers can see, for instance, the emanations inside any living creature and can tell which of the outside emanations would match them.

The emanations are something indescribable. My personal comment would be to say that they are like filaments of light. What's incomprehensible to normal awareness is that the filaments are aware. I can't tell you what that means, because I don't know what I am saying. All I can tell you with my personal comments is that the filaments are aware of themselves, alive and vibrating, that there are so many of them that numbers have no meaning and that each of them is an eternity in itself...'


'Perception is a condition of alignment; the emanations inside the cocoon become aligned with those outside that fit them. Alignment is what allows awareness to be cultivated by every living creature. Seers make these statements because they see living creatures as they really are: luminous beings that look like bubbles of whitish light.

The emanations inside and the emanations outside are the same filaments of light. Sentient beings are minute bubbles made out of those filaments, microscopic points of light, attached to the infinite emanations.'

taken from: www.prismagems.com...
(quotes taken from 'The Fire From Within' by Carlos Castaneda)

Right, so nothing on 1-30 Hz interference from devices? Any such interference directly violates FC C rules

reply to post by Goldcurrent

the AMAZING thing was just a few nights ago, I had what many of you may consider a 'lucid' dream. It was honestly something I have failed to remember that even existed. 'The dream world'!!

Well that is odd because last Saturday night i also had a lucid dream of flying that only lasted 2 minutes.

The previous lucid dream was decades ago.

Maybe something big is starting to open up in the spiritual world. Dare i mention, Stargates.

I too have had entities in my dream. In one of my lucid dreams, I tried talking to my subconcious, and one of the ways I tried was by making the little cell phone sign with my thumb and pinky finger, and putting it to my ear. I said "Is anybody there?" and a voice replied to me saying "I watch you, I watch you all the time". Now, as you may know, it is not uncommon to hear characters in your dreams speaking, but there is a sort of familarity with those voices, However, this voice, the one from the phone, was completely foreign to me. I don't know if it was an extra-dimensional being, a demon, or my subconscious, but whatever it was, it was creepy.

reply to post by Koolcdj69


In my Shamanic substances days I met an adept that told me that dreams "could" be a portal to other realms and these portals are usually closed to mortals and guarded by entities that can take on any form. The tricksters and they aren't confined to dreams.
Cheap Trick made a song about it...



www.youtube.com...

teachtaire
Right, so nothing on 1-30 Hz interference from devices? Any such interference directly violates FC C rules

Apologies for being lazy, but could you sum up what the above means?

(3am here and i'm too tired for heavy reading lol)

s+f!

(quoting Casteneda) "Seers make these statements because they see living creatures as they really are: luminous beings that look like bubbles of whitish light."

I knew I should have read more of his stuff. I just never got into the whole light/dark power-trip that was my impression from a couple of his books I read in high school. Had I not read 'The Art of Dreaming' in late 1995 -- and had it not followed on two years of experience I considered really unique and that he described amazingly well -- I wouldn't have thought much of his work I admit.

Interesting the above quote. If that was in TAoD I don't recall it now, but that was eons ago. I don't consider myself a seer at all, and yet I sometimes see what one of my inner-selves called "the solar body" (turns out that is a term that exists for eons, but I had never heard it before I got it from the inside). They look quite literally like white-plasma-glowing light-beings. A very "soft" white sense though. They wear humans like suits which is kind of funny. As if we are like bumper cars, like whether we are miserable or happy it's all novelty-fun for them. I think I blogged one experience, one day when I was working on being perceptive in public which I almost never do (my mind has a very hard lock between 'metaphysics' and 'practical reality' which is probably for the best). Hang on... here it is (edited to be shorter):

(My best friend dreamed he met 'the angel of my soul' and was very moved by it. This led to my thinking about the topic while shopping not long later.)

...I looked to my right, where a woman stood looking at the bagged baking chopped nuts. She was about 140# overweight and looked very uncomfortable, in pantyhose and business style skirt. I closed my eyes while facing her direction and told my mind, ‘show me her angel-of-soul.’

The surprising thing was how EASY it was for this to totally pop right into my visual field.

I usually have to provide a little bit more “help” to the visualization of something brand new — not ‘making’ it you understand, but almost like a helping foot-up in imaginative-energy. (Actually that’s impossible to describe, so either the reader does this stuff, and gets it, or never will.) But BAM this was right there.

It was slightly diff for me; more soft-opaque light-being than I think they probably are, at least as my symbol or perception goes.

I was startled because it instantly turned and looked right at me! Gahh!

The woman bends over to get something from a bottom shelf and I was surprised because I thought what I was seeing would bend too, but it didn’t. I guess I was thinking of it like some kind of X-ray of the soul like a skeleton or something that would move in every way she did. I thought that was funny then, I’m so ridiculous, as if the angel is going to be doing jumping jacks with you in the morning? The whole idea almost made me giggle out loud.

It was more like it just sort of glided/existed ‘in the center of her gravity’ or something. I had the feeling that it could move ‘with’ her if it chose, lay down with her, but it was a sort of generality, it was usually standing, sitting or lying, and other motion was trivial-peripheral on her part… definitely the feel that orientation in space and gravity doesn’t mean jack.

It was still looking at me. I felt such… “sweetness” in me all the sudden. (This is a recognizable characteristic of angelics at any level, the ‘sweet’.)

What can I do for her? I ask it, having the sudden desire to do something genuinely good for her.

Just be kind, it says.

I needed some macademia nuts anyway. So I asked her to help me find them, and I made a point to really look at her and smile sincerely and ‘see the holiness in her’ as I did. She really smiled in response, like really warmly and real, and I had the oddly sad impression that it had been too long since someone had made that kind of connection with her.

*

... we were walking down the side of the store with all the meat. It’s a big area, divided down the middle by 3' high structures that hold turkeys and sales. It was busy, so there were quite a few people the length of the store.

I thought to myself, as I pondered whether a sirloin petite at the side looked ok, I wonder if everyone’s angel looks different, or if people have different sorts, or maybe some are brighter or darker, bigger or smaller? I was actually only ‘generally wondering to myself’ is all.

But when I picked up the meat and turned toward my basket, every person from me to the far wall had that humanish lightish white form in them! — which somehow I could see clearly even though I also saw their bodies clearly. (It's a chakra effect; sound and visuals both have dimension that one cannot have with ordinary senses.)

Immediately every one of them turned and LOOKED at me! All at the same time, like orchestrated motion! In my head I sort of did a mental intake-of-breath in surprise. It was like every one of them ‘knew I was looking at them’ the instant I was.

I had the feeling inside me of such FUN then. Like light-joy-delight. Like they were… they were wearing their people… like it was all this fabulously fun experiment… the way that we would treat theme park racing track-cars or bumper cars or something we “sat in and operated within pre-designed major limits.” As if you could bump into someone hard and that would be as neat an experience as speeding along or going over a waterfall in a log-boat or spinning in a teacup or anything else. It was all this hilariously delightful really “sweet” feeling grand adventure.

On the bright side it did answer my question. Yes, they all looked the same. No, they are not dimmer or brighter. But, they actually did all “fit the body” they were in — their height was around the same or up to a foot or so higher in some cases than the person they were inside, so there was that variance — at least as I grokked prior to looking down after just a couple moments, and then looked back up and I had lost the vision, probably because I was already going, You know you must be imagining this, right.

*

I once woke up in the morning, back when I lived in my RV-van-conversion with sailboard, guitars and Jimi posters :-) — and happened to look at my black kitten, Polo. I was awake, but sleepy.

And when I looked at her, my god! — what I actually saw, “inhabiting the same space as her” now that I think about it, like the light-beings in people in the store — was this other cat, a few times her size, with HUGE eyes, that were totally sentient, in a way foreign to me. The eyes were much larger and more slanted than cat’s eyes actually are, on this creature. Oh yeah, and the eyes and most of it was actually really *gold* even though polo was black.

The cat-soul of Polo looked at me, way-smart and way-foreign, and I imagine my eyes and mouth were open wide in astonishment. I closed my eyes tight, thinking I was imagining it, and opened them again, and it was just Polo, looking at me like most cats do… like they simply cannot care less unless you’re going to feed or wait on them. :-)

Hang on I'm trying to tie this to lucid dreams. Well, my friend was lucid during dream of what he felt was 'the angel of me,' that's something I suppose...

reply to post by RedCairo


Well I wish the 'angel in/of me' or whatever would help me out against these dream interferers/agents that stop me from dreaming