Debunking Original Sin

Originally posted by DeadSeraph
reply to post by Lone12

 

Even within the context of a growth towards civilization, Adam and Eve certainly could have been real people. It's possible that what the Bible records is more so an important family, rather than the only family. As someone already pointed out previously, the Bible itself indicates there were people living in Nod during the time of Cain and Able (indicating that they were not members of Adam's family). That would seem to support the notion that Adam and Eve were not the only two people on earth at the time, but rather the two most important people within the context of the Bible.

It's also possible that what is being chronicled is not only the lives of these individuals, but their lives and legacies. So we could view some of the lore surrounding Adam and Eve as metaphors for a sort of "civilization building family", that descended from two real people. Either way, viewed through this interpretation, "original sin" is far from being debunked, and still fits within the framework of the bible.

thanks DS you are far more eloquent then i am

..i m obsessed with the concept of ' adam and eve'
a gorgious couple... placed downhere to Undo all the animalistic humanoid Templates

it sure provides a Goal to look onto
- not a future of becoming a chakra slave of that same awareness
but a genuine New stunning Being
as God always wanted since day 1

- bless

reply to post by windword


There is no original sin! It is a falsely attributed teaching!

"The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin."
Deuteronomy 24:16

"But every one shall die for his own iniquity: every man that eateth the sour grape, his teeth shall be set on edge."
Jeremiah 31:30

"The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him."
Ezekiel 18:20

"Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall receive his own reward according to his own labour."
1 Corinthians 3:8

"Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap. For he that soweth to his flesh shall of the flesh reap corruption; but he that soweth to the Spirit shall of the Spirit reap life everlasting. And let us not be weary in well doing: for in due season we shall reap, if we faint not."
Galatians 6:7-9

Children are not saturated in Original Sin, because Jesus said;

"But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven."
Matthew 19:14

reply to post by micmerci

I am one of those. Maybe science considers me a fool for my belief but personally I believe God is a higher intelligence and authority than any scientist.

This is why aliens never stop for coffee.

reply to post by windword

I guess the neext question then would be "Did sin exist in the world outside of Eden before Adam and Eve were cast out of garden, or did they introduce sin the world for the first time?" If so, original sin isn't so original after all.

Original sin was ambition. Lucifer was jealous of the humans, made from earth, because "God" exalted them over his fiery essence. So he decided he would ascend beyond even his creator. I still don't understand why "God" didn't just make another universe, install Lucifer as its god, and seal it off forever. If he's omnipotent, it should have been a piece of cake. Kill two birds with one stone without harming a single soul. Lucifer would be the sole god of his own universe, and there would be no serpent to tempt Adam and Eve - which "God" had to have known would happen if he kept Lucifer around.

But no, he had to unleash the beast upon the most susceptible of his creations: the humans. He was either very cruel or very stupid.

reply to post by Joneselius

We've never seen an animal evolve at all, not ever.

Modern humans have existed for about 500,000 years. Evolution takes a little longer than that.

Originally posted by Joneselius
THEORY being the key word of course. THEORY.

"You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means."


Gravity is also a theory. There is a joke that goes something along the lines of, "Did you hear about the creationist who jumped out of the plane without a parachute?"


OT: Original sin as it was explained to me is one of the most idiotic things i have ever heard of. Given that the church now accepts evolution as a fact, it boggles my mind that "Your version of your god" could make a newborn child with sin.

reply to post by Lone12

concluding hereby,

that your OP title is most pretentious

if not blatantly Untrue.

kind regards ,

Let's not put the cart before the horse, sir. Before anything else you might have to say, you need to go back and rearrange this post into something much more coherent. I'm surprised it got two stars...no sources or anything. Just a jumble.

In the book of Thomas (yes I know its not in the Bible), the disciples asked Jesus what to look for as a signal of his return. One of the signs he revealed was that man and woman would become one, basically an asexual being. If it ends that way, then who's to say it didn't start that way as well?

I could see other people existing outside of the garden if Adam was an asexual being before being separated into male and female. Maybe he laid eggs or something, which would've been clones of Adam. If Cain impregnated one of those clones, then perhaps the mark of Cain is homosexuality?

Just thinking out of the box here.

reply to post by Bone75


LOL

I can see it now! Cain fears for his life from the people outside of Eden, so GOD turns Cain into a flaming gay guy so they won't beat him up and kill him.

I am still pretty convinced no one has a clue what the heck is going on.

There is simply too much that we are unaware of currently.

What is it that we do not know that we do not know?
I know not it's dimension or scope but I know it lay out there waiting to be discovered.

Too many unanswered questions, none of the proposed theories add up yet.
This is probably going to remain an unresolved controversy for a long time.

Evolution in and of itself kinda destroys the idea of original sin (and Christianity)

If evolution is true then there is no Adam

If there is no Adam then there is no original sin

and

If there is no original sin, then there is no Jesus

reply to post by Prezbo369

If there is no original sin, then there is no Jesus

Extrapolating much? Come on, you can set a better example than that. Let's have some evidence with that conjecture.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Prezbo369

 

If there is no original sin, then there is no Jesus

Extrapolating much? Come on, you can set a better example than that. Let's have some evidence with that conjecture.

Maybe i'm mistaken, but wasn't the big Jeezy sent down to earth for 'our' sins?

This may depend on which of the 33,000 denominations you speak to, but generally this seems to be the case no?

Why don't you just debunk the bible and be done with it? Maybe because you enjoy the bible a little too much?

reply to post by Prezbo369

Maybe i'm mistaken, but wasn't the big Jeezy sent down to earth for 'our' sins?

This may depend on which of the 33,000 denominations you speak to, but generally this seems to be the case no?

Our sins...not just original sin...

reply to post by Prezbo369


Yep. Supposedly, Jesus had to be sent to pay for the sins of Adam and Eve that were passed to all of humanity (original sin), and his coming is said to be foreshadowed in Genesis 3

14 And the Lord God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this, thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:

15 And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.

Although, I never really saw this verse that way. It seems to me God instilled a hatred of snakes and made people want to stomp on their heads while they bite the heal of their attackers.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Prezbo369

 

Maybe i'm mistaken, but wasn't the big Jeezy sent down to earth for 'our' sins?

This may depend on which of the 33,000 denominations you speak to, but generally this seems to be the case no?

Our sins...not just original sin...

Well as I said, it depends on which denomination(s) you speak to, and which Christian you speak to.

That being said, (normal, average everyday) sin was also brought into the world by Adam and his requested and hastily assembled partner along with original sin according to many.

Romans 5:12 and all that..............jazz.

reply to post by Prezbo369


Right........Good ole Saul of Tarsus, ie St Paul.......

Romans 5:12
Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Of course this is untrue, as innocent children also die, as do puppies and saplings that take root in the shadow of the "mother tree" and can't get enough sunlight to survive.

We live in a symbiotic system that requires a continuous cycle of perpetual death and rebirth.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Just to point out we have seen evolution happen..many times.

reply to post by Prezbo369


You're saying that if original sin didn't exist, then there's nowhere for the rest of sin to come from. I'm saying that the rest of sin was always there, it just wasn't classified as sin because it was natural behavior. Cro Magnon, Neanderthals, cave men, etc. They stole, they adulterated, they murdered, they coveted...because it was all a part of survival. The only difference is now that we think we're better. We're arrogant.