How the Soviet KGB created Conspiracy Theories

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by Skyfloating

 

OP, if you're saying that the first and only source for the JFK assassination conspiracy theory,
is the Soviet Union ? I must hotly contest that.

edit on 4-8-2013 by randyvs because: (no reason given)

Same goes for the AIDS conspiracy... and all the rest.... yes, the Soviet's spy
machine had a job to do, but that doesn't mean they invented these ideas themselves
"out of whole cloth" (as they say). The Soviet spy machine was tasked with finding
those stories that had "good memes" that they would exploit, and the best lies are
those which contain a measure of truth... while ex-spies come forward and claim
they made up this stuff, what does this really tell us? It only tell me they are still
doing what they are good at doing, telling half-truths that benefit themselves.

By the way, we do the same thing... we find "conspiracy theories" that can be
used to sow decent against China in Africa (just one example). It doesn't matter
if it is true or not, only that it is effective... that is what propaganda is all about.

Pacepa is one of the biggest traitors, biggest liars, biggest everything you want.

90% of the things he says is total BS.

I watched the documentary made based on his book. How the hell can you say you were poor in Romania, you were opressed or anything like that when you were in the highest rankings of the government.

Pacepa and the first Romanian President, Iliescu were some of the biggest criminals of our countrie's history but ofcourse the population here is so dumb they can't see that and accept criminals to be pardoned.

I'm not saying that Russia and the KGB are saints, its just that this is the biggest liars you will ever hear about.


Oh and its funny that the book is called Disinformation and is disinforming and is obviously a counter propaganda tool. From what i've seen in the documentary, everything is the KGB-s fault, even 9/11.... yeah right ...

i'm still shocked that the soviets managed to do so many things without a word of it reaching the ears of the rest of the world, like imprisoning a 17 year old for being 10 minutes late to work. (under stalin). or some of the other atrocities committed against their own people. the figure of 20 million dead under stalin is incorrect, it's over 70 million.

hmm, more from this guy

Originally posted by UnifiedSerenity

Originally posted by jaffo
reply to post by UnifiedSerenity

 

At no point in time has ANY reputable biologist said anything even CLOSE to what you propose as to the origins of HIV.

During the 1950s, millions of people were injected with polio vaccines contaminated with "SV-40", a cancer-causing green monkey virus. Such vaccine contamination problems are largely kept hidden from the public. Yet in spite of the known danger, drug companies and physicians always pooh-pooh any suggestion that AIDS could have arisen from animal virus-contaminated vaccines.

On May 11, 1987, The London Times, one of the world’s most respected newspapers, published a front-page story entitled "Smallpox vaccine triggered AIDS virus." The story suggests that African AIDS is a direct outgrowth of the WHO smallpox eradication program. The smallpox vaccine allegedly awakened a "dormant" AIDS virus infection in the black population. Robert Gallo, the co-discoverer of HIV, was quoted as saying, "The link between the WHO program and the epidemic is an interesting and important hypothesis. I cannot say that it actually happened, but I have been saying for some years that the use of live vaccines such as that used for smallpox can activate a dormant infection such as HIV (the AIDS virus)." The Times story is one of the most important stories ever printed on the AIDS epidemic; yet the story was killed and never appeared in any major U.S. newspaper or magazine. source

If the WHO didn’t realise the potential side-effects of using impure vaccines by the time they started immunising hundreds of millions of people in the developing world, they certainly should have. The only way AIDS could have simultaneously erupted so explosively and so exclusively in African Blacks and American gays was to seed HIV into these two distinct populations through vaccine programs laced with HIV.

The incidence of AIDS infections in Africa coincides exactly with the locations of the W.H.O. smallpox vaccination program in the mid-1970's (London Times, May 11, 1987). Some 14,000 Haitians then on UN secondment to Central Africa were also vaccinated in this campaign. Personnel actually conducting the vaccinations may have been completely unaware that the vaccine was anything other than what they were told.

A striking feature of AIDS is that it's ethno-selective. The rate of infection is twice as high among Blacks, Latinos and Native Americans as among whites, with death coming two to three times as swiftly. And over 80% of the children with AIDS and 90% of infants born with it are among these minorities. "Ethnic weapons" that would strike certain racial groups more heavily than others have been a long-standing U.S. Army BW objective. (Harris and Paxman, p 265)

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Are we to believe there is a disproportionate number of homosexuals in Haiti? Is that reasonable to believe? Or does the fact that this is the poorest nation in the world suggest it was a target of an Eugenics program? Which seems more reasonable to you?

My conclusion: AIDS is not an accident of nature.

Let's stop blaming God, soviet counter-propaganda, and green monkeys. It is time we faced the truth about the origin of this selective killer. AIDS was designed to "neutralize the undesirable element" within the United States and make a person's immoral lifestyle seem acceptable as cause of death. . .the perfect plague. The lives of millions of uninformed people depend on the recognition that we have deliberately and covertly unleashed a biologic Holocaust of unprecedented proportions.

Originally posted by AnyoneSeenJustice

Skyfloat do you honestly believe that anyone other than the most dim will accept your OP

Even by getting say 10-15% of the dim ones to believe this, it is not a real victory

I suggest you don't underestimate ATS folks, as well as those who read silently without posting, but chuckle at your attempt here.

Why are you so angry to attack me and readers personally instead of addressing the facts?

Is it because of Cognitive Dissonance?

Originally posted by starwarsisreal

Yo OP what about the John Titor conspiracy theory if you do some research Titor mentioned that the Russians would free us Americans from a Tyrannical Regime in the future In fact I notice that an increasing number of Titorites are believing the Russians are the gud guys. Sounds like the SVR are involved somewhat

I dont know. All I know about up to now is the stuff in the OP. But its interesting how many conspiracy-theories fit the same narrative.

Originally posted by TinfoilTP

JR Nyquist states that Tamerlan Tsarnaev (Boston bomber suspect #1) was trained in the same Russia terrorist camp as the new #1 Al Qaeda leader, Ayman Zawahiri. That Muslim training camp was run by KGB/FSB – Russian Intelligence.

Your conspiracy has recent legs OP.

I was unaware of this. If true it means the "Cold War" is still on and getting hotter.

I don’t know about the rest but it makes perfect sense for the former USSR to have started the Moon landing Hoax conspiracies. They were desperate to discredit us and had been beaten hands down their only recourse would have been to start a conspiracy over it. A few people fell for it so I guess it would be considered a success. If it had been possible to discredit the USSR would have shouted it to the world.

What I don't understand is, if the Protocols of the Learned Elders of Zion is a forgery or fake.

Then why is everything it says happening right now ?


One only needs google to verify everything it says

reply to post by wasaka

By the way, we do the same thing... we find "conspiracy theories" that can be used to sow decent against China in Africa (just one example). It doesn't matter if it is true or not, only that it is effective... that is what propaganda is all about.

Thank you for the reply. Sky writes some bitchen threads. And I acually thought I
had something to contest this time. But instead he has me agreeing with him.
Shot down again oh well. I agree with you also tho. I can only rely
on some personal notes about the day JFK was gunned down.

How my Mom cried conspiracy from day one, over the things she saw happen
with news footage, the first 24 hrs. She was never convinced, it wasn't a total set up.
And she was a sharp woman. She said so many things that didn't become part
of the theory until years later. I grew up with suspicions about LBJ and I was
four years old in 63. I learned to count on what she said and think for myself thru her.
Quite a woman and she loved both John and Bobby. The day Bobby went down
wasn't anything like the tearful, younger woman, I remember the day John was shot.
I even remember her being afraid Bobby was next, when King got shot. Sure enough,
she damn well knew it was coming. I was nine by then and just astonished that she
damn near predicted it. She was completely outraged and angry hurt. She told me
don't you ever go to war for this gov. So I never did. Then come to find out. My Dad
knew Sirhan, from working with him at Hollywood park race track. Sirhan was a hot
walker and groom and my Dad ( horse trainer ) said he was just the nicest kid he ever
met.

And only talked about how much, he wanted to train race horses someday. So my
Dad was just to down to earth, but even he thought something very odd was going
on, for him to be implicated. I know it has nothing to do with propaganda where their
concerned. They becaame highly suspicious on their own. And handed that down to me.
have I digressed enough for ya !

randyvs

i think that pretty much reflects what the former kgb guy was saying -- once a high profile player has played his/her part in the conspiracy, they are shot. in kennedy's case, he was talking about dismantling the federal reserve, which is part of the central banking system so crucial to communism. as the guy pointed out, communism is capitalistic at the top, but only a handful get to take part, everyone else is stuck with whatever is left over after espionage and subversion.

Originally posted by randyvs
reply to post by wasaka

 

By the way, we do the same thing... we find "conspiracy theories" that can be used to sow decent against China in Africa (just one example). It doesn't matter if it is true or not, only that it is effective... that is what propaganda is all about.

Thank you for the reply. Sky writes some bitchen threads. And I acually thought I
had something to contest this time. But instead he has me agreeing with him.
Shot down again oh well.

I agree with you also tho. I can only rely
on some personal notes about the day JFK was gunned down.

How my Mom cried conspiracy from day one, over the things she saw happen
with news footage, the first 24 hrs. She was never convinced, it wasn't a total set up.
And she was a sharp woman. She said so many things that didn't become part
of the theory until years later. I grew up with suspicions about LBJ and I was
four years old in 63. I learned to count on what she said and think for myself thru her.
Quite a woman and she loved both John and Bobby. The day Bobby went down
wasn't anything like the tearful, younger woman, I remember the day John was shot.
I even remember her being afraid Bobby was next, when King got shot. Sure enough,
she damn well knew it was coming. I was nine by then and just astonished that she
damn near predicted it. She was completely outraged and angry hurt. She told me
don't you ever go to war for this gov. So I never did. Then come to find out. My Dad
knew Sirhan, from working with him at Hollywood park race track. Sirhan was a hot
walker and groom and my Dad ( horse trainer ) said he was just the nicest kid he ever
met.

And only talked about how much, he wanted to train race horses someday. So my
Dad was just to down to earth, but even he thought something very odd was going
on, for him to be implicated. I know it has nothing to do with propaganda where their
concerned. They becaame highly suspicious on their own. And handed that down to me.
have I digressed enough for ya !

Interesting your story and thanks for sharing it.
A few points,

Your mother formed her opinions from the media. Media is infiltrated at the top.

To quote you, 'She told me
don't you ever go to war for this gov. So I never did."
Whoever the true culprits are, the situation was successfully used to weaken military, undermine authority and sow distrust.

Subversion steers the effects of events, they don't necessarily create them. Highly opportunistic.

If Obama makes a gaff in a public address tomorrow, whatever foolish thing he said will be turned into a conspiracy, then the subversives will see it and grab a hold to nurture it along. Their accomplices will give it more than its 15 minutes of fame time at the media level. It will be used to undermine anything important he has to say for a long time to come. Now, did he purposely say it to feed the subversives or was it a genuine mistake, that will be turned into the next level of the conspiracy and so on.

The NWO (immortalized by Bush Sr.'s speech), could in theory just be the counter to Russian subversion. The idea of the Western powers conspiring to control the world would definitely counter a Socialist agenda to do the same. Kind of like how Reagan's fictitious Star Wars defense system was used to make up for a lack of warheads when compared to the Soviet's warhead count.

Wow

Twisted...but it's quite believable imo. The Russians are not about to show their hand and will wait patiently as the US continues to weaken. Now we have to ask...is it the Russians who instilled most or all of the conspiracies to date? 911, which I believe did happen, but also has some credible conspiracies to make us once again doubt our gov't and their agenda. A few more years and the US will have it's own War within the states and the USSR will come in with a bang.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
The Mideast wasn't always that riled up. In fact, most normal folks still aren't riled up. But there is some force that is feeding certain segments of the MidEast with all this "America is Satan" stuff.

I'd personally question any sort of information that riles people up, that divides them.

See, I wonder if that "America is Satan" stuff was originally spread about by the Soviets, and then has continued on without outside help. Talk about the myth overtaking the reality.

reply to post by TinfoilTP

The NWO (immortalized by Bush Sr.'s speech), could in theory just be the counter to Russian subversion. The idea of the Western powers conspiring to control the world would definitely counter a Socialist agenda to do the same. Kind of like how Reagan's fictitious Star Wars defense system was used to make up for a lack of warheads when compared to the Soviet's warhead count.

And yes as I said I must agree to that. But in the case of my parents. They drew their conclusions
thru only the slightest amount of media. And what that involved mostly, was footage of the assassination
very graphic, that was seen on CBS within the first hour. She never did get to have my pop see it as
it disappeared from history after her seeing it twice. she said with'in the first hour
That's what I believe involves the tampering of the Zapruder film. They cut out all the
bullet splashes that missed.

Her account of what she saw going on in the motorcade was at least six shots fired. And Kennedy
dying in a hail of bullets. She would only laugh with disgust at the three bullet account.
Kennedy was totally and absolutely set up. No denying that.

Because of her I see the Zapruder film completely different from most people.
i see Kennedy being hit and going forward trying to get down out of site.
Because bullets were coming from every where but we don't see them.
Then the last shot made him, as if it were meant to be the one with his name on it.
And I would wager a dollar to a donut the sick basturds did write his name on it.

reply to post by KilgoreTrout


Except for the fact that defectors who were high ranking officers from the communist bloc have also been warning the west about these same tactics that Skyfloating is pointing out in this thread, and how socialist and even communist doctrine will even be taught at universities and colleges in the U.S. Not to mention that so much they warned the west about has actually come to pass.

If you would read up on how communist states became communist and even socialist dictatorships you will find that it was through similar indoctrination and propaganda.

Not only that, but this has worked so well that I would dare say quite a few people in power these days all over the world were brought up not only believing in this propaganda, but have been actively seeking to destroy what once were viewed as western ideas, values and doctrines.

Originally posted by ElectricUniverse
What to this day still gets me puzzled is that it has taken DECADES for these changes the world elites have wanted to apply to the world at large have been wanting implemented, and to be accepted by a large enough population, but... How in the world does this benefit those same people who started this "master plan" so many decades ago?

This is an interesting question. Philosophies that have persisted for thousands of years (such as the various Religions) have done so because it was believed that the idea is more important than the individual. Societies that don't want to be changed can still be changed incrementally and so slowly that its hardly noticeable. Those who started these long-term plans must have known that they wont see the fulfillment of their Utopia in their lifetime.

Disinfo, lies, rumors, etc,. have all played in all of our lives at some point, and all through out history. Before internet/radio/t.v, there were plays, music, books, theatrical disinfo that people took as fact, and very well could have been fictional, but was misinterpreted.

If this is true (Im not saying that it is or isnt) then it could very well make everyone think twice about almost everything.

The difference with the things that you presented and the things that we discuss is that we have actually done (most of us) our homework, and if they were nothing else but confusion tactics, then they would have never made any sense in the minds of those that have studied them for countless years.

There is a reason that true or false tactics work on the US its because every time something comes up, it in fact does lead to lies, and deceit.

I did a thread not to long ago where during the Nuremberg trials there was a mention about eugenics in the US, and that they tried to use it as a basis on why they were during some of the horrific things that had been done.

That the US taught them how to commit these crimes, and low and behold, I had NEVER heard of that before, and was fought on it, but the evidence was there.

The reason why the AIDS issue is still considered a conspiracy, is because even if the Russians started a campaign to say the US has made this disease and gave it to people, it seems easier to believe then, the story most are told about it, that some guy had sex with a monkey.

But I digress.

We have to think of this in 2 ways... either all thats in the OP is correct and it is all lies, or that the US, has successfully shot itself in its own foot, by not only not trying to settle these issues, but giving people that believed in government a reason to distrust them.

Peace, NRE.

Originally posted by AnyoneSeenJustice


you think Russians put explosives in building 7, why do I even bother replying in this thread

edit on 6-8-2013 by AnyoneSeenJustice because: (no reason given)

Nobody is claiming that Russians organized the attack. Apparently you didnt read the OP at all.