US Army bans soldiers from viewing The Guardian website

Originally posted by Arnie123
Understand this, Soldiers DO think for themselves. Soldiers are not mindless automatons. I still go to chilis after work, I still drink beer and get trashed, I still debate about politics and watch porn. Soldiers can do a lot of things AT HOME and OFF DUTY, the whole point of this thread, as stated numerous times by my brothers in arms is to show that soldiers have to follow certain protocols, we are not to view classified data, simple. Even if we did, what we are looking at is something that we can fully understand? what phase is it in? how is it implemented? a lot of people think just because they saw a movie and understand what a secret document entails is foolish at best.
Just because I don't have access to secret material doesn't mean my freedoms have been stripped, I just don't have the clearance for it, its "Need to Know", hence "Eyes Only".
What we see here is spillage, but not really because it was intentional.

I gave you a star for being so damm honest....sadly you completely drove home my view point.....get wasted, watch porn, follow orders....hey man.......WHY your "brothers" kill people is none of our damm business...orders are orders....follow your protocol....remain a killing machine to the corrupt elite........when your overseas Halaburton will provide you with safe water, food and equipment......and hell when you come home, if you do in one piece....your house won't be foreclosed on because you are soo traumatized and in ill health you can't find a job.

I'm sorry to sound so harsh, but if this were my child, this is what I would say to you before you ever sold your soul to heartless bastards that will sacrifice your life in a minute to make a buck...and heck, if they make you ruthless enough they may even pay you big bucks to be a "private contractor" and screw your "Brothers" anyways.......or maybe you loose your mind and end up a "terrorist"....again, I'm sorry if this sounds cruel......but having military people just say outright that this is the way it is, and somehow their duty makes me sick...

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Originally posted by chebob
So what other reasons could the army have for banning their members from reading the Guardian? A fear that the publication is getting too "anti-authority" and an attempt to quell any thoughts of dissent?

Actually its the same reason given when wikileaks was dumping classified documents. People tend to forget military law is very different from civilian law. Even though the documents were released to the public, they are still classified. A military person accessing those documents would constitute a crime.

This is absolutely true. These measures are being taken to protect soldiers, not blind them.

Originally posted by casablanca887
I am visitting that website. Who has right to forbid me?

Only Allah has that right.

This reply is slightly off topic, but bear with me.

From 1965 to 1972 I was in the United States Air Force Security Service (look it up on Wikipedia). I worked for the NSA. Military Intel. I had a Top Secret Crypto/Codeword Clearance. As you can tell, I'm a newbie on this site.

A couple of weeks ago there was a thread about Snowden and the NSA, so I hit the reply button and was composing a reply consisiting of reminiscences of my time in the "service".

I was typing up stuff from that era, 1965 to 1972, As far as I'm concerned it was history, not current intel. I knew I was not compromising any classified information!!

I was typing some Top Secret "Codewords" and unspecified details when all of a sudden my typing ceased to be controlled by me. I no longer could type anything else and my entire reply was deleted in front of my eyes!! I swear to God!

I thought I was typing old stuff from '65 to '72. What I considered history was obviously still "sensitive" to the NSA guys monitoring my reply that had not even been posted yet!! WOW!!

Talk about "live" monitoring. When I saw my reply being deleted in front of my very eyes I knew the extent of NSA's reach. Sorry NSA, I just had to relay this info today. I notice I still have control over this reply, perhaps it's because they're not "keying" in to certain codewords.

But anyway, our troops are so restricted now it is no surprise.

I was once proud of our country. In my youth it was the bastion of freedom and democracy..... "Land of the free, home of the brave".

Today it seems to be....."Land of the greedy, home of the knave".

How very sad.

I still believe most of the citizens in this once great Republic are honorable people who just want to be left in peace and privacy to live their lives as they see fit, raise their families as they see fit and do an honest day's work for an honest day's pay.

Unfortunately, the government doesn't seem to manifest the ideals of its bosses ..."WE THE PEOPLE".

Machiavelli wrote a book a couple of centuries ago on how a tiny group of powerful, nefarious people could rule over a very large body of citizens by dividing them into antagonistic factions. "United We Stand...Divided We Fall".

Well, folks, we're falling and you know it.

And the very government that is dictating what its soldiers can or can not read or think is also training and indoctrinating those very soldiers to control and suppress us with deadly force when we eventually and inevitably rise up to protest the evils of that very government with righteous indignation!!

Down with Tyranny!!....Up with Freedom!!

To Life!...To Liberty!!...To the Pursuit of Happiness!!!

Damn that felt good!

Originally posted by MildBill

As far as I'm concerned it was history, not current intel. I knew I was not compromising any classified information!!

I was typing some Top Secret "Codewords" and unspecified details when all of a sudden my typing ceased to be controlled by me. I no longer could type anything else and my entire reply was deleted in front of my eyes!! I swear to God!

Yeah, occasionally that happens to me, only it's my better sense kicking in and I delete what I just typed. The rule is, if I hesitate three times I abort the post. Saves a lot of trouble.

Military personnel don't work for NSA. Some units specialize in collecting data for NSA, it is true. They do little else. But they work for their particular service, not NSA directly. They're generally trained these days in a place near and dear to my heart, Corry Station. Which also trains SOCOM operators and whatnot.

Next thing they'll attempt is to take over the Guardian from inside (by gradual infiltration) and erase all that incompatible data, down the Memory Hole. Then they'll control reality...

US Army is the "Party".... NSA is the "Inner Party".

At this point in US history a soldier cannot claim any moral ground. There is NO threat to the US that is not an insider threat (insider NOT meaning a citizen, but the Corporate State itself) and a soldier is NOT keeping the citizens safe from attack. What they ARE doing is re-shaping the world for MONEY and CONTROL. Sorry, but soldiers right now are NOT our friends. Same for cops. Don't hate me for noticing. I didn't create the mess. I simply observed it.

Originally posted by Arnie123
Understand this, Soldiers DO think for themselves. Soldiers are not mindless automatons. I still go to chilis after work, I still drink beer and get trashed, I still debate about politics and watch porn. Soldiers can do a lot of things AT HOME and OFF DUTY, the whole point of this thread, as stated numerous times by my brothers in arms is to show that soldiers have to follow certain protocols, we are not to view classified data, simple. Even if we did, what we are looking at is something that we can fully understand? what phase is it in? how is it implemented? a lot of people think just because they saw a movie and understand what a secret document entails is foolish at best.
Just because I don't have access to secret material doesn't mean my freedoms have been stripped, I just don't have the clearance for it, its "Need to Know", hence "Eyes Only".
What we see here is spillage, but not really because it was intentional.

The government owns their asse for the term of their contract and they can tell them to do whatever they want them to do or not to do, including jumping on The Gaurdian. This shows is all part of their brainwashing their soldiers. They don't want any new ideas being implanted.

reply to post by Bedlam


I was in the Air Force but I worked for the NSA, trained in the building at Fort Meade. In the main lobby of the HQ building is a Memorial Wall titled "They Served in Silence" with the names of all military personnel killed in action while working for the NSA. Go to the NSA website, it has a photo of the wall and a list of the names. I knew a couple of the guys killed Feb. 5, 1969.

Peace

Originally posted by lacrimaererum
Members of the army are not paid to think or have opinions. Reading material like this could lead them into a dangerous area of thinking for themselves.

They are paid to follow orders.

The funny thing about this is that so many other sites are discussing the information. The only way to really stop members of the army seeing this material is to simply ban them from using the internet.
In the future I am sure there will be a special army internet. The guys can go on, play games, chat, and most importantly only read the news the government wants them too.

Nope...you are wrong, my friend. In the military we had a DUTY to disobey any illegal orders. We are NOT a mercenary force. Stop blaming the military members for the wrongs of their superiors. Also, don't think that their isn't friction going on in the military right now. So much disinformation from the truly paranoid. Get your facts straight.

reply to post by MildBill


Which unit?

eta: fer instance, if you were Navy during that time, you'd be in a unit in navsecgru, but would work for Navy tasked to collect for NSA. It's organized a bit differently now, but NSA is and always has been civilian and not a military service. Even today with it funneling through CSS you still belong to your service branch but your assignments come down through CSS.

etaa: was wined and dined for SCS coming out of college, do contract work with them now

reply to post by Bedlam


I started with the 6947th Security Squadron, then transferred to the 6994th Security Squadron (we've got our own website) and ended up at the 6949th.

reply to post by MildBill


Sweet. I generally run into more Navy than anything else. Although that's likely because I'm out at Corry all the time.

reply to post by Bedlam


Actually although many civilians work for the NSA, it is primarily tasked with collecting military intel and as such the majority of its manpower is military which is the primary reason that DIRNSA (Director NSA) is, was and always will be an active duty Army/Air Force General or Navy Admiral. Military leader...military mission.

But you are right, things have changed since my days. One of the guys I work with was a civilian employee of the NSA, he was an ELINT analyst. We were discussing the Snowden affair and I mentioned that back when I was in, intel was strictly need-to-know. I expressed my surprise that Snowden had access to so much different material. He explained all of the changes that had taken place regarding classified materials. I was really astonished.

I'm sure that because of Snowden there are lots more changes happening within NSA!!

Well, there's a question. You guys HAVE heard of SCS, right? It's sort of like NSA's direct action group.

reply to post by Bedlam


Right after I posted my last reply to you and returned to the ATS "front page" this thread was removed. Hmmm?

Anyway, to answer your last question, no, I've never heard of SCS. Did it exist from '65 to '72 when I served?

reply to post by MildBill


IIRC they cranked off in 1978. They go into areas where you can't collect the SIGINT you might otherwise like but can't get to. Venezuela comes to mind. Or the nether regions of Russia. Or someone's embassy. You see them working with SAD/SOG sometimes.

the governments does so much to prevent people from thinking about anything and another thing why in this day and age would any one sigh up for the army don't people realize that's one of the things that let the government keeping acting the way it does

reply to post by Bedlam


Man, times have changed. I kinda feel like a dinosaur! The NSA has greatly evolved over the years. It's interesting chatting with you Bedlam.

Originally posted by fenson76

In the military we had a DUTY to disobey any illegal orders.

I've no doubt you do, Fenson, and I am very pleased that that's the case but, with respect, wouldn't it be true to say that there would be pressure to obey illegal orders that would play a significant part as well, pressure from fellow soldiers, pressure from a particularly scary CO, say, who threatens to # you up unless you obey?

Wouldn't it be similar to the NSA having a duty to uphold the Constitution, say? And the one that stands up and does the right thing, well, we know what happens...

I really do not mean to cast aspersions on the military but in reality, I would imagine that pressure from peers and COs would rule the day ahead of any disobedience.