"I Am Sorry That It Has Come to This": A Soldier's Last Words

"Military men are just dumb, stupid animals to be used as pawns in foreign policy"

~ Henry Kissinger

Its too bad so many young people don't realize what is actualy going on before they're exposed to things that later require their suicide. Yay! Money for college! But yeah you have to serve in a death squad first. Women? Yup. Children??? YUP. Horrors that will haunt you for the rest of your life? You betcha, kid...sign here.

Originally posted by Cancerwarrior

Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter

 

And, there is no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?

edit on 25-6-2013 by silo13 because: remove bold

Believe it or not most people join the military because they come from nothing. Most people stay in the military even though they may hate it because they feel they have nothing to go back to if they leave the service. I can say this truthfully after having observed it in my 8 years as a Tanker. There is a whole generation of youngsters craving discipline and direction. Every person who signs up to be a solider is told of their purpose, but every recruiter also downplays the reality of what their lives will become. You can't buy a cup of coffee at McDonald's without seeing 10 disclosures of how hot the thing is, but a 17 year old can sign up to be a living weapon for the war machine. And they're easy pickings because they're so often poor, uneducated, young, and easily exploitable. They're not warriors, they're just the next in a long line of weaker humans

Contrary to many opinions spewed on this forum the vast majority of people that enter Army service are not brain washed COD sociopaths that want to play with your blood. I know that my reasons for joining up were the same as I heard from almost all my buddies. I came from an impoverished family. I had only went to high school. The area I lived in had no kind of jobs or schools. I wanted to get married and be able to provide for my wife and I and then go to school after or during service.

Then I put my head down and counted the weeks while enduring two deployments, constant field training, constant stress and worry that comes with being a slave to the flag sucking Army officers. And when it came time to get out I remember being scared as hell. The retention NCO kept offering to get the McDonalds applications ready for me if I left and I remember really doubting myself because I suddenly remembered something that I forgot the whole time I was busy hating the Army. I had nothing to go back to. I ended up closing out that chapter of my life and moving on but I have personally known so many soldiers who did nothing but bitch and moan about the Army and then when their enlistment contract is over they re-up. I never understood why until my time came.

Of course you are gonna have your gung ho types that are born to be soldiers and don't care about what the actual cause of a conflict is for. That's not how a majority of people think though. Its rare that you hear soldiers remark on things like this themselves. See we as civilians have this thing called free speech. Its being dwindled down but for the moment it is still there. If you are in the service and you speak out against certain things you can be prosecuted legally by the Uniform Code of Military Justice. Its much easier to take the path of least resistance and just "suck it up and drive on." Do as you're told mentality.

And until the day comes when you understand the frame of mind of a person who wants to end their life, you will never understand their reasons. I hope that day never comes for you because its a sucky experience. Is it really a wonder for any American that 22 veterans off themselves each day? I guess its easy for an outsider to condemn.

R.I.P. Daniel. I hope you find the peace in death that eluded you in life brother.

edit on 25-6-2013 by Cancerwarrior because: (no reason given)

Thank you for bringing this to the attention of those that replied! Sometimes it's hard to fathom another persons reasons for joining up! We should not judge those who join just to serve their country! These men fail to see the
truth until it's staring them in the face! I'm no longer surprised why so many servicemen come back with serious mental disorders! I too am guilty of thinking these men evil for joining the military but today I pity them!
They joined up not to become murderers of woman and children but to earn the ability to go to college, gain skills, see the world and have a job! In turn they were sold a lie! We should not judge those less we walk a mile in their shoes!
When I was younger I had the opportunity to join the armed forces but decided I did not have the heart to harm another but I can imagine if I needed to go into the military because of circumstance I might have as well!
I don't know if I could have pulled the trigger but can only imagine that any of us could be manipulated by certain
techniques to become killers! What happens after the military is done leaves us broken, guilty and sometimes insane! Maybe we even get sick from being exposed to certain drugs or radiation! May God have mercy on them all.

reply to post by silo13


How dare you presume to pass judgment on that boy. That you've had support in that judgment sickens me still further. The problem is, little man, that people only THINK they know what goes on during war. Unless you have super powers of empathy, most people don't get it at all. Or, even if they kind of "get it," they don't believe they'll actually end up being sent to kill women and children. After all, killing women and children is not something the U.S. does (that's been the indoctrination which every child in America has undergone for at least a century. The Americans pass out chocolate and cigarettes and protect women and children). They are the perpetual good guys. Revisionist history tells you that and gawd knows the North Americans know their revisionist history inside out..

So, in actual fact, you and your supporters ain't so smart. Besides, if passing judgment on the weak is your bent, do by all means, fly at 'er. But if you have any gumption whatever, then venture forth and unleash your judgment on those who would cajole others into doing their dirty work. Hmmm,last time I heard, they reside at the top of the food chain--ya know, dems with the money, influence and power who would slit your throat as good as look at cha. But they prefer not to get their hands dirtied--only their souls.

Or, something else you could do is get yourself and your supporters out to the recruitment offices so you can paint your pictures of war for the would-be recruiters. Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean, that would, indeed, take courage......and that's not really what you're all about. You're all about calling out others on what you perceive is THEIR cowardice.

Now, the type of response I get or do not get from my post will tell me a good many things that I've wanted to have cleared up since first arriving here. I think just one day will provide me with answers. Thanks for the opportunity.

My thoughts and prayers are with Daniel Somers and his family. It has taken me over an hour to read his letter due to the tears in my eyes and the memories it brought back, having been through and experienced what this man has I can whole heartedly relate to what he felt. For those who have never experienced the traumatic events of war consider yourself lucky, you are still pure of heart and mind. The act of living your life everyday knowing that you were responsible for the deaths of people, peoples family and loved ones, their sons, husbands, fathers, and even daughters is a burden unlike any other and there is no way possible to convey the feeling.

To say war is hell is an understatement, if I could go back and make the choice of either going to war or being thrust into the bowels of hell I would choose the latter. You never learn to deal with or accept what you had to do while in combat, you only learn to continue living and some people can't accept the guilt that they lived while those they were forced to slaughter can't. It is not in human nature to kill other humans and once you have done that you are never the same, the images and guilt of what you have done haunt you every day for the rest of your life. I can only hope that now Daniel can make peace with his conscience in the afterlife and his spirit may finally be at peace.

They say - those who commit suicide blaming a single reason - are liars. There are many reasons for suicide - not just one. Someone who commits suicide has many problems other than where they ultimately place the blame.

This statement is by far one of the most ludicrous statements I have read in a long time. Have you ever experienced combat, do you wake up in the morning watch the sunrise and breath in the life of a new day knowing that you were responsible for the deaths of tens or hundreds of people and that while you are enjoying another wonderful day of life there are many that can't because of your actions? Until you can answer yes to those questions there is absolutely no way that you can relate to or understand the reasons why a traumatized vet would take his or her own life. And yes, any vet who has experienced combat is traumatized to some degree and that trauma they've experienced never goes away.

That being said? Wake up. There’s no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?

Many people join the military during times of peace. Some join for the educational benefits while others join for the excitement of the training and exercises, and yes some do join hoping they will get to go kill someone. It is my experience that the latter are the first ones to breakdown and are usually out rather quickly on a Section 8 discharge.

Myself for example, I joined the Navy at the age of 17 in March of 1990 almost 10 months before the air campaign and the actual campaign bombings of the First Gulf War started. I didn't go in wanting to fight, I wanted to follow in family footsteps and get a good education. When I enlisted the thought of having to endure combat was the furthest thing from my mind, same goes for the largest majority of new recruits.

However once you join you have an oath to fulfill and an honor to uphold. Not an honor to bureaucrats or politicians but an honor to yourself and your fellow service members.

reply to post by leftofplumb


Damn.....I wish I could give you a flag or an applause, or at least buy you a beer.

Bravo Zulu my friend.

reply to post by silo13


u should maybe get some counselling.

u seem very angry.

reply to post by MDDoxs

"...a regime built upon the idea that suffering is noble and relief is just for the weak."

It's always struck me as confusing that we attempt to end violence, using violence.

How dare you presume to pass judgment on that boy.

I don’t ‘presume’ to do anything - I do it. I ‘dare’ because I have no qualms of standing up for what I believe in. I dare because he is/was not a boy, but a man.

I dare because I will not participate or subscribe to the ‘Nanny State of America’ parade that actual makes excuses for a man who signed up for the military during a time of conflict on many fronts only after to become shocked at the realities of war like they’re all new to the red white and blue.

That it isn’t his fault? Ok, let’s take that road a moment.

Is it only when someone goes off the short pier at midnight we sympathize and cry out ’he’s a hero’? Poor man! Sob sob?

No, not me. I sympathize, empathize and stand up and cheer for the veterans that fought and served who didn’t kill themselves. And they still have no support from their country. They chose to stay alive. They ‘stayed here’ if you will - to care for their families and loved one - even after being given the shaft by the country they loved and served.

The problem is, little man, that people only THINK they know what goes on during war.

I’m not a man, much less a ‘little one’. Insults prove a couple a things though - mostly the one tossing them about is too lazy and ignorant to contribute to a discussion using the tools of constructive criticism. Just sayin‘.

Unless you have super powers of empathy, most people don't get it at all.

What’s there not to get? You chose to join the military during a time of war (conflicts) for a country with a long gruesome bloody history of killing innocents. Of course women and children are going to die.

No, it has much less to do with empathy and much more to do with being realistic.

Or, even if they kind of "get it," they don't believe they'll actually end up being sent to kill women and children.

What would make them think they would not? Are they so special, so entitled they wont have to do the ‘dirty work’? ‘Nooo, all dat ’bad stoof about war’ will fall on ‘da other guy’ - who’s much less less deserving and entitled!

After all, killing women and children is not something the U.S. does (that's been the indoctrination which every child in America has undergone for at least a century. The Americans pass out chocolate and cigarettes and protect women and children). They are the perpetual good guys. Revisionist history tells you that and gawd knows the North Americans know their revisionist history inside out..

Ok, we agree MSM isn’t telling the truth. That’s all good. But as one of my personal heroes George Forman said: If you’re going to box? You’re going to get hit.

I’ll translate that for you. Even if you do believe the MSM? Simple logic (emphasis on simple) would lead one to believe that gun they give you? It’s for a reason. If you’re trained to use it? You’re going to use it.

So, in actual fact, you and your supporters ain't so smart.

*Yawn*

Besides, if passing judgment on the weak is your bent, do by all means, fly at 'er.

Suicide is for the weak. My opinion. Especially when you leave a wife and family behind.

But if you have any gumption whatever, then venture forth and unleash your judgment on those who would cajole others into doing their dirty work. Hmmm,last time I heard, they reside at the top of the food chain--ya know, dems with the money, influence and power who would slit your throat as good as look at cha. But they prefer not to get their hands dirtied--only their souls.

I agree - they’re also responsible and to the far greater extent. Regardless - it’s no excuse for ignorance and self delusion. I have a lot to say about the armchair warriors in the White House - but that’s off topic.

Or, something else you could do is get yourself and your supporters out to the recruitment offices so you can paint your pictures of war for the would-be recruiters. Yeah, yeah, I know what you mean, that would, indeed, take courage......and that's not really what you're all about. You're all about calling out others on what you perceive is THEIR cowardice.

Proven more than once in your reply - you don’t know me. A modicum of civility is in order here.

Now, the type of response I get or do not get from my post will tell me a good many things that I've wanted to have cleared up since first arriving here. I think just one day will provide me with answers. Thanks for the opportunity.

Whatever all that means - as it surely has me confounded - I sincerely doubt it’s on topic.

peace

Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter

 

They say - those who commit suicide blaming a single reason - are liars. There are many reasons for suicide - not just one. Someone who commits suicide has many problems other than where they ultimately place the blame.

That being said? Wake up. There’s no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?

I applaud your sentiments OP - and peace to those who lost a friend/family member.

My opinion? If you can’t take the heat - don’t become a cook. Or something like that.

What an extraordinarily ignorant response.

Did you miss the part where he mentioned war crimes and crimes against humanity, and that it's far worse than people realize? The military doesn't advertise that they're involved in this stuff. Some people claim it, but then are called liars by the pro-military camp. I don't imagine this guy pictures crimes against humanity when he signed up. Maybe he was just patriotic, and thought he was doing something good. Maybe he bought into the official party line, that we are "The Good Guys" and we're only doing what's right overseas.

Maybe he just wanted money for school, and didn't understand the gravity of what he was getting himself into.


And what do you think.... he could have just walked away if he chose to do so?


I mean, they do just let those guys walk away when they don't agree with what's going on, right?

reply to post by Nucleardiver

First and foremost - Thank you for your service.

This statement is by far one of the most ludicrous statements I have read in a long time.

Well I'm honored to be the one to bring it to you.

Really though - I’m not a psychiatrist nor do I play one on ATS. I’m only parroting what every psychiatrist I interviewed about suicide said to me. I’m a victim of suicide. I went looking for answers and was told repeatedly if someone is going to commit suicide and blame it on just combat or just PTSD or just this or that? It’s false. It would seem the doctors I spoke to must not have been in combat either - or treated veterans? I dont’ know. Something of what you said rings true - the rest? I can't say.

That being said - I don’t think it’s fare for either of us to make absolutes. Some men/women can go to war and come home with PTSD without killing themselves. Some can’t. It’s a horribly sad thing when it happens.

peace

reply to post by iwilliam

Maybe he just wanted money for school, and didn't understand the gravity of what he was getting himself into.

Exactly my point. But it's no excuse. War is war - and again - the good old USA has a long and horrible history of killing innocents.

You do make a good point concerning once he was in he couldn't walk away from it. He signed up - he was in for the duration. But... Well... There's a lot more I'd like to say about that only I have a feeling it would fall on deaf ears so I'll leave it at this:

And what do you think.... he could have just walked away if he chose to do so?

What do you think suicide is - if not this?

Have a great evening.

peace

reply to post by muzzleflash

He has regained his lost honor.

By killing himself and leaving a wife and family behind? What a load a stool meat.

Redeem yourself by taking even more life - by committing an even greater atrocity? Nawwww!

Honestly I don't know if your post was intended to be inflammatory or you truly believe what you wrote. If you do? I apologize for my flagrant disagreement. I mean no insult to your belief system I just find it appalling to mine.

peace

If I may interject a point here.
Can you imagine what it would be like to be drafted?
But for this man at least one invouluntary person didn't HAVE to go.
Combat arms troops life experiences don't translate well to civilian jobs.
They are cutting down our active duty COMBAT BRIGADES from 45 to 33 in 4 years.If something were to happen requiring a large commitment of troops I feel very sorry for what would come without people like us. We,so far ,have been successfully avoiding a draft.
Unless some idiot gets us into one.

Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter

 

They say - those who commit suicide blaming a single reason - are liars. There are many reasons for suicide - not just one. Someone who commits suicide has many problems other than where they ultimately place the blame.

That being said? Wake up. There’s no draft. What was going on in this guys head? ’Joining up’ for military service yet not being prepared to kill?

I applaud your sentiments OP - and peace to those who lost a friend/family member.

My opinion? If you can’t take the heat - don’t become a cook. Or something like that.

Edit to add:

Here's the point so many of you are failing to get.

How many wars do American's have to experience before they wake the hell up and STOP SIGNING UP!

The government is NOT going to take care of you when you’re through with your service. Not medically - Not psychologically!

You WILL (in many cases) be ordered to kill innocents. WAR is NOT a freaking video game!

No? Tell me a war when these atrocities have not been committed by military? Duh. Can you say Vietnam? Desert Storm? Etc?

Killing civilians. That’s the reality of war. And it’s no secret anymore - Period.

So - what happens? Do these people who sign up just get selective amnesia? ‘Oh, I’ll never be asked to shoot civilians!’ Idiots.

Do I respect the ‘little man’ in the military? Yes, I do. But not when he/she ruins the lives of their loved ones by killing themselves - like they didn’t know war was going to be hell. No no no no. There’s NO WAY people can pretend to be ignorant over the atrocities of war these days. Just no way.

Am I sorry for the guy? Guess what? No, I'm not. I'm sorry the family and friends he left behind.

peace

edit on 25-6-2013 by silo13 because: see above

Wow....this is ridiculous. No one joins the military thinking these things. That is just asinine. You don't join the military thinking you will do immoral things, your post tells more about YOU than anything else. You can't just leave after you joined. Have you even served? I doubt it with that outlook on the people protecting you. You are the psycho.

reply to post by fenson76

What has happened to us all as a country? We attack people that have not attacked us - we ruin their country and culture and bring death and destruction thru it with our new and improved weapons. I am 67 years old and have seen a lot. I served during the Vietnam war (1965 - 1971) - it was another unwanted war - and I believe that is why Kennedy was killed - period.

The country has always had some rogue troops and that will never change. My father served in World War 11 and believe me he would not talk about it. I ask him one time what he did. He told me he was in charge of a tank - it had a flame thrower - and he said do you get the picture -Yep I did and never asked anymore questions. He did also mention that some of the troops there went crazy and did some horrible things and didn't want to think about it.

The point is our country has lost it's moral compass - the serving in this countries military has gotten to be a job for a lot young people that need money and a little recognition by also wearing a uniform. They step into it being proud and having the feeling of accomplishment. Then they get deployed and find out what our government really wants them to do for the industrial greedy bastards that really run this country - reality sets in - suicide rate in the present military climbs to new highs never seen before in this country. And you end up with this poor soldiers note times hundreds.

quote: "If I am elected president I will bring the troops home in 6 months". What a joke on us. I am just over whelmed by the number of you that have forgotten this statement.

reply to post by Dukesy


Well said, Dukesy. I think you hit the nail right on the proverbial head on all points.

Originally posted by Dukesy
reply to post by fenson76

 

What has happened to us all as a country? We attack people that have not attacked us - we ruin their country and culture and bring death and destruction thru it with our new and improved weapons. I am 67 years old and have seen a lot. I served during the Vietnam war (1965 - 1971) - it was another unwanted war - and I believe that is why Kennedy was killed - period.

The country has always had some rogue troops and that will never change. My father served in World War 11 and believe me he would not talk about it. I ask him one time what he did. He told me he was in charge of a tank - it had a flame thrower - and he said do you get the picture -Yep I did and never asked anymore questions. He did also mention that some of the troops there went crazy and did some horrible things and didn't want to think about it.

The point is our country has lost it's moral compass - the serving in this countries military has gotten to be a job for a lot young people that need money and a little recognition by also wearing a uniform. They step into it being proud and having the feeling of accomplishment. Then they get deployed and find out what our government really wants them to do for the industrial greedy bastards that really run this country - reality sets in - suicide rate in the present military climbs to new highs never seen before in this country. And you end up with this poor soldiers note times hundreds.

quote: "If I am elected president I will bring the troops home in 6 months". What a joke on us. I am just over whelmed by the number of you that have forgotten this statement.

That has nothing to do with what I said. I said the PEOPLE joining the military. Not talking about the government. Saying that those who join are as corrupt as the govt is ridiculous.

Im sorry that it has to come to thiiiiiiiiiiiiiisssssssssssss.....

Most of these articles scream false flag, false info, and false story because these stories are meant to be passed around by someone who has a chip on their shoulder or just like to be plain stupid or the government.

Like this for example:



This picture hit the net so fast with a story about a high school cheerleader becoming a sniper in Air Force Security Forces. The story goes to say that she has an impressive amount of shots, including one that shot an IED from over 725 yards away. Saving countless lives.

Right off the bat, the first issue...there is no Security Forces sniper. Security Forces run gates and guard planes on the flight line.

www.truthorfiction.com...

This one is the same thing.....

He was part of Task Force Lightning, an intelligence unit

where he ran more than 400 combat missions as a machine gunner in the turret of a Humvee, interviewed countless Iraqis ranging from concerned citizens to community leaders and and government officials, and interrogated dozens of insurgents and terrorist suspects

HAHAHA...No. Intelligence units don't run humvee missions, let alone let the gunner of a humvee interview anyone. For one, that is a position reserved for the expendable and for two, that is a support position. You leaving your post where there is a 50 cal in your hand, is a bad thing. Why is "Humvee" capitalized? Moving on...

During my first deployment, I was made to participate in things, the enormity of which is hard to describe.

Okay, what made you reenlist? Everyone who can't handle the position they are in or disagree with the way the government is handling things. They GET OUT. I know because there is plenty of people jumping ship because of this reason.

They offer no help, and actively block the pursuit of gaining outside help via their corrupt agents at the DEA. Any blame rests with them.

And as usual, find a government group and blame them. I have worked with the DEA on countless occasions. They are geeks that crap themselves in any sign of labor. I know because I have to move their stupid cargo for them all the time. They try to help, but just make it worse because they are not the brightest.

Is it any wonder then that the latest figures show 22 veterans killing themselves each day?

So, during this man's trying time, he decided to look up facts. Hmmmm...how many soldiers have I been around that have committed suicide. More than any of you need to know, but the one thing they don't do is look up facts. They just want the pain to end.

So you see, not only am I better off dead, but the world is better without me in it

Why? There was no credit taken by this gentleman. He blamed the DEA and Bush, but this article fails to mention that he also allegedly protested against Obama as well.

His wife and family have given permission to publish it.

No, they didn't. He outed a government group and the government. This would not be allowed to hit the internet without the chance of it being government propaganda. So, in turn, you may be supporting government propaganda. I know some of you will be asking, "how is this propaganda." This is propaganda to get you to revolt from the government. This article was first published on a BLOG site....where most things seemed to be made up. I will not post this website because I do not support fake articles for an excuse to declare martial law.

For personal experiences, Special Forces in any branch careless about anyone of you or their actions. They like what they do and continue to do it. They think what they are doing is for the greater good of a nation and continue to do it. Zero Dark Thirty is a perfect example of this. Those individuals tortured countless people for years to find Osama.

And lastly, you will never know that these people die. When the bodies of any spec ops come through my job, they are nameless with no rank or SSN. No one knows how they died or when they died. And, the spouses/family members know that they will be killed allowing information like this to be on the internet.

Do none of you get it??? All this crap happening with the IRS, Snowden, this. They are wanting us to revolt against the government. They want an excuse to declare martial law and wipe half of us of the Earth, because there is no coming back from how far our hole is.

I mean who in their right mind would never guess that the NSA was listening to our phone calls??? They have been doing this stuff since WW2. MKUltra is a great example of that, drugging people with '___' at parties to create walking assassins.

It is so awesome to see how many of you are this gullible. And, conspiracy theorist are the most gullible.
Stop thinking sugar coated poop tastes good.

Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by johncarter

 

Am I sorry for the guy? Guess what? No, I'm not. I'm sorry the family and friends he left behind.

peace

edit on 25-6-2013 by silo13 because: see above

He didn't ask anyone to be sorry for him, sorry is just a word. You are just talking about suicide and trying to rationalise it in his before experiences. What was that statistic, 22 war veteran suicides per day? were they all ignorant savages to begin with?

reply to post by FyreByrd


I also think service in the armed forces should be Mandatory for the POTUS.
After all he is the commander in chief.
I don't think it's fair that a person can run for president and not have prior experience.
This in my opinion could stop some of these stupid useless wars.
Former presidents Dwight D. Eisenhower, John F. Kennedy ETC served and knew what war was all about.
Just do some research and see just where they stood on WAR.