Is Astral Projection Demonic?

reply to post by Optimisplanet


Hello Optimisplanet,

I'm going to make this short and to the point (I could rant about this subject all day long...but I don't want to put people to sleep).

1. Is it demonic? No. Without getting too complicated, let's just say that what you believe in came "come to life" on the astral. For example, imagine (remember this an example) that 100 people are boiling mad at you right now - In waking life (aka now), you might only feel a portion of that - Now, say you astral project. This time, you would "see" the anger represented in a form that you would recognize (aka, a demon). The funny thing is: That anger might not even be directed at you, but you will still perceive it as a threat. So I ask you this: How do you know it is actually a demon?

Plus, some of the places I've been to, must have been pretty boring for my demon (I mean, they can't enjoy admiring the architecture of some old medieval churches ).

2. There are negative entities out there, but the only way they can hurt you is if you believe that they can hurt you (NOTE: I am Agnostic, and raised with Christian background, so I know some of you don't believe me when I say this). For example, try to see it from a demon's perspective: Who is the better victim? One that is afraid of every spirit that they cross, or one that says "Hey, fiend, get in my way and I'll open a can of spiritual whoop...butt on your ...behind".

As long as you have the willpower, even the most negative of entities won't bother with you, mostly because you're too much of an effort. Their main goal is to frighten you, because your fear is a source of power to them. Deny them that, and they'll go grumbling to someone else. (I was once told that if I ever encountered something like that, to give it a loving hug, and see the result).

3. You can bring back "visitors" sometimes, which may be the entity that is near you. Or, what I think happened is that while you were getting into astral projection, you were opening yourself up spiritually, and just now started noticing the entity near you.

4. Depending on the literature, the "Astral Planes" does have "layers" - The lower end people keep alluding to is where the following usually can be found:
-People that aren't aware they are projecting (Dreams)
-Thought forms
-NEGs (negative entities)
-Ghosts

And in the higher:
-Spirit Guides
-Other projectors (human and non-human, depending on the literature)
-Spiritual leaders (Buddha, Jesus, God) (I've never seen any of this).
-Parallel/other dimensions/universes.

5. No-one said that just because you were into a.p., you had to continue. I know quite a few people who found it wasn't for them, which is perfectly fine - I however, like to consider it my "other" life away from right now. I mean, don't get me wrong, I'm hardly addicted to projecting (I take breaks, sometimes month-long vacations, before another attempt), but it adds a lot of fun to falling asleep.

I'll be around if there's any questions you want answered (as I've taken up the list of characters already per post).
-fossilera

PS: To all observers, you can try to debunk my info...but seeing as I experienced this stuff alone, it'll be kind of hard to prove it to you .

As a skeptic myself, this is the shortest answer I can give: It's only demonic if you make it out to be.

reply to post by fossilera


Hi fossilera, and it is interesting to see your viewpoint. Have you personally astral projected before? And if you have you do not get negative experiences? What makes you so sure that this is not a illegitimate practice?
I know I am coming from a Christian perspective as some of the answerers have stated but I am quite certain that when I astral project I am not doing it myself. It would be a completely different story If I attempted with MY willpower. Something did it for me. Which leads me to believe it MUST be same experience for others. That they are not consciously doing it but something else is doing it for them also.
I know people not agree to this, and I can understand but please someone tell me if they feel they consciously do it or not.

Satan always has a counterfeit for everything God does.

That is why he is called the "god of this world".

That is why he was thrown out of Heaven.

Wherever there is a counterfeit, there MUST also be a genuine as well.

Below is an excerpt from a Ian Clayton audio which mentions Astral Projection (@ 10 min.)

I recommend listening to the entire audio.

"In the occult world when these guys buzz around in the atmosphere its called astral projection, astral travel they have a silver cord that's connected to them. The reason they have a silver cord connected to them is because their soul is still connected to their spirit man. Their spirit man is inside their body and their body is lying on their bed while their soul is busy buzzing around.

Whenever I see them I cut them..... cause they are doing it illegally, that's their problem. I just walk along, light dismiss' darkness, their in darkness, ffffttttttttttt. I had a guy when we were in London, in fact it was in Wales this guy comes up and says: "Your it, your that thing, and this guy was one of the chief occult people in England, alright he got saved "Your it, your that thing, your that thing that comes out of that realm that we can't go in, your that thing that comes into our realm and you shred everything that's around you. They nick named me the shredder, cause I'm sorry I have no mercy for darkness."

Ian Clayton - Saturday mid-morning

Astral Projection must be a satanic counterfeit where you are in a trance like state and lucifer allows you to see his realm. There is an interview with US ambassador and Maitreya disciple Wayne Petersen on YouTube (Peterson has completely accepted the deception BTW) He was taken into another realm, to Shamballa, which is lucifers HQ and initiated there. Astral Projection is probably one way to become totally possessed by a satanic entity.

Astral Projection Is it safe?

"Ian Clayton, a New Zealand prophet and father of four, is a man who found himself seemingly chosen by the demonic realm to become a great occult leader.

At age 12, his growing awareness of God led him to the Bible and he started reading it from the beginning. Halfway through Deuteronomy he decided that it was full of rules and regulations and didn’t want anything to do with it. Just as he shut the Bible he heard a voice say, “Put your hand on top of the table and pick the table up.” Ian put his hand flat on the table top and it rose, sideways off the floor.

“It was an amazing power rush,” Ian explained. “Suddenly, I walked in power.”
Spirits started materializing at night and taught Ian how to do things such as astral travel and psychic healing, pendulum diagnosis, use of herbs in healing and in gaining power, and the power of demons in the spirit world. As the lessons continued, people grew frightened of Ian’s power. Many would talk about the headaches they got after being around him—headaches Ian attributes to the demonic resonance of the spirit force around his life. Meanwhile, signs and wonders manifested in Ian’s life much to his surprise and others’ shock.

“I would put my hand out and it would go into the wall—not up against it,” he said. By age 17, Ian was frightened of his own power and turned into an introvert attempting to shelter himself from others because of the phenomena that would occur.

According to Ian, the spirits taught him to become a psychic healer and he would lay hands on a body and take out the bits that were diseased. He could heal and he could kill with the same power that resided within him. “The moment I touched their flesh they submitted to the demon in my life. When I got angry at somebody I would release spirits and the people either were killed or became sick. At one point, my father got sick and my mother ended up in hospital because of my cursing them.”

Excerpt from Shifting Shadows of Supernatural Power

How To Build A Galaxy - Ian Clayton

Ian Clayton Interviews

reply to post by Murgatroid

According to Ian

Is there anyone who has come forward and substantiated "The Shredders' " claims?

Why warn of false prophets and offer one in their place?

reply to post by Optimisplanet


I used to experience what you described ,but for me it was more sleep paralysis. Once i broke free of the paralysis i would go into a very vivid / not knowing i was dreaming state. In fact one time i woke six times to make coffee and there was this alien invasion going on at the same time,and every single time i woke up i was convinced i woke up. Now as far as it being demonic i am not 100% sure and i have heard both sides of the argument.

reply to post by daskakik

Originally posted by daskakik
Is there anyone who has come forward and substantiated "The Shredders' " claims?

Would it really matter if there were?

I wouldn't bother to share the information if I didn't believe it 100% myself.

I'm more interested in sharing the truth than I am in convincing those who refuse to believe regardless of how much proof they see.

reply to post by Murgatroid


Of course it would matter, otherwise your star player is just another in a long line.

You being convinced doesn't make something true.

Originally posted by daskakik
You being convinced doesn't make something true.

Thanks for confirming what I just said above...

"Would it really matter if there were?"

You NOT being convinced doesn't make something false...

Travelling to strange and exotic places can be exciting and you can learn a lot. But if you overdo it, are naive about it, and dont have a map or any sort of protection whatsoever, then dont be surprised if one day you pick up something bad along the way.

This is akin to real life travel where you just venture out into the jungle like a little kid having fun, all exuberant and curious. But you take no map, nothing to ward off insect and snake bites, no knowledge of the crooks living in the forest, etc.

So now your best deal is to forget about it all - at least until you get your normal daily life back. By not writing about it, not reading about it, not practicing it, not being interested in it, not buying into it, it gradually recedes.

reply to post by Murgatroid

So all you have is words for the choir.

You NOT being convinced doesn't make something false...

In a world which, you say, is full of lies wouldn't it be a good idea to ask for proof before rubber stamping it true?

reply to post by Optimisplanet


I don't think Astral Projecting is demonic or anything like that. The unfortunate turn of events in your life may be unrelated but very easy to associate to something such as AP. But again, I don't think it's related. Perhaps it's your own way of explaining what's happened in your life due to the strange nature of projecting. I usually got the "whooshing" sound when I was just coming back/waking up from projecting. Also sleep paralysis seemed to plague me quite a bit when I projected more and more. Specifically in my case, it takes a couple of weeks to project (because I'm lazy and don't keep up with it all the time lol). Usually I start out with lucid dreaming for the first week and eventually break into astral projecting. During that time between lucid dreaming and early projecting, I get alot of sleep paralysis. It's nothing to worry about per se. (Obviously it sucks during it though. Sucks ALOT actually.). But I don't think there's anything to truly worry about in regards to possession or demonic activity. At least in MY situation. Results may vary due to different beliefs. Also, don't think I'm a astral projecting guru. Because I'm not. I can't even get out of my own house when doing it! (BTW if anybody has any tips on countering my lack of range issue, please let me know!) I hope others here have better advice to give you than my own lousy "advice/ input.

Originally posted by daskakik
In a world which, you say, is full of lies wouldn't it be a good idea to ask for proof before rubber stamping it true?

Have you any proof that astral projection ISN'T demonic?

Or are you only interested in proof that supports YOUR side of the argument?

Did you also ask for proof from all those in the thread who said that astral projection isn't demonic?

No? I didn't think so...

Are you actually interested in what's real or are you only interested in what you THINK is real?

Do you actually have anything else besides your cynicism to offer?

I still favor the alien hypothesis.

And even if you want to call them demons, that's fine. To me they are devious trickster aliens with too much time on their hands.

And what is an "Alien" anyways? Some foreign entity I don't know much about.

We could speculate all day.

However some important notes to share:
Overcome your fear and be brave. These things fear bravery greatly.
I don't know why, maybe they are leeches or some type of parasitic entity? Sure would explain a lot.

Always believe in your inner strength. Do no waver.

--------
Why do I not bother 'astral projecting'? Because of it's ultimate futility.
To find spiritual truths one must project inwards. Projecting outwards only brings one illusions and delusions.

Please consider these precepts at least briefly.

reply to post by Murgatroid


I wasn't talking about astral projection, I was talking about your appeal to authority in the form of Ian Clayton without knowing if the guy isn't just out to increase the number of donating members in his ministry.

Originally posted by Optimisplanet
reply to post by fossilera

 

Hi fossilera, and it is interesting to see your viewpoint. Have you personally astral projected before? And if you have you do not get negative experiences? What makes you so sure that this is not a illegitimate practice?
I know I am coming from a Christian perspective as some of the answerers have stated but I am quite certain that when I astral project I am not doing it myself. It would be a completely different story If I attempted with MY willpower. Something did it for me. Which leads me to believe it MUST be same experience for others. That they are not consciously doing it but something else is doing it for them also.
I know people not agree to this, and I can understand but please someone tell me if they feel they consciously do it or not.

Yep, I've personally done it a handful of times - a couple times I've probably had help from a source apart from myself, but I feel that the other times was all on my own. In my quest to find the best method for coming out, I did read in a few spots that I (and you) aren't the only one that has experienced this before - Sometimes it does seem that entities do lend a hand.

As for it being a illegitimate practice or not, I hate to sound naive, but I don't know - I've never had a bad experience, at least with astral projection. It could be my attitude maybe (that part in my first post about "opening a can of spiritual whoop..." was a real example; if I ever feel like something is bothering me, then I mean what I say. So maybe they take the hint right from the start and leave me alone ).

Back in the days before I went Agnostic - I did talk to my preacher about astral projection specifically one day after Church got out. To my surprise, not only did he say that it wasn't bad, but he encouraged me to continue, unless it made me uncomfortable. His reasoning was that if I was truly not meant to do it, then I would've been stopped or prevented from doing it from the start.

And if it were ever proven that this is "a sin" (I use the term loosely, as I don't feel it is), then I'm sure I'll have to account for it later on - but I'm not going to worry about that until my time is up. At least I'd be in the company of some people like Robert Monroe and everyone that used to post on AstralSociety (a forum that used to have about the same number of members as here - everyone was practicing astral projection over there).

-fossilera

Originally posted by muzzleflash
I still favor the alien hypothesis.

And even if you want to call them demons, that's fine. To me they are devious trickster aliens with too much time on their hands.

And what is an "Alien" anyways? Some foreign entity I don't know much about.

We could speculate all day.

However some important notes to share:
Overcome your fear and be brave. These things fear bravery greatly.
I don't know why, maybe they are leeches or some type of parasitic entity? Sure would explain a lot.

Always believe in your inner strength. Do no waver.

--------
Why do I not bother 'astral projecting'? Because of it's ultimate futility.
To find spiritual truths one must project inwards. Projecting outwards only brings one illusions and delusions.

Please consider these precepts at least briefly.

What you mentioned concerning projecting inward definitely makes a whole lot of sense. If more people could realized that we already have everything we need inside ourselves to fulfill our life instead of seeking happiness from the outside, the world would be turned upside down, people would be much more happy.


Well, said I gave you a star for this post.




Thruthseek3r

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by Murgatroid

 

I wasn't talking about astral projection, I was talking about your appeal to authority in the form of Ian Clayton without knowing if the guy isn't just out to increase the number of donating members in his ministry.

edit on 25-6-2013 by daskakik because: (no reason given)

Who said one has to spend anything in order to listen to the men? There was a website mentioned earlier which led to some recorded talking and in no way was anybody obligated to buy anything in order of listening to him.


Thruthseek3r

Originally posted by thruthseek3r
Who said one has to spend anything in order to listen to the men?

Nobody did but, he does make a living from selling his tale as truth so whats wrong with questioning his motive and honesty?

As for the OP, my take is that it is like anything else, of you go to ________ and run into trouble does that make going to ________ demonic?

reply to post by fossilera


Finally someone with like me with a similar sort of experience. I immediately understand when you said you had some ''help'' of some sort. What baffles me is that when '' i try'' to astral project it never happens, not once! It happens just unconsciously, or spontaneously. I never think about it, i wonder if its in my subconscious, and my soul just leaves my physical body because it truly wants to be set free.

Answerers however have left this question blank which I am really curious about. After the wind roaring noise, I am transported somehow into this plane of darkness, more like a vortex. Its like I am falling, sometimes i see stars and sometimes I see stars. But what baffles me is why I am I transported into this place? I am not supposed to be seeing my Room? Am I being just transported into the lower astral plane?
The place i visit i know is not of the earth it is elsewhere, whether it is in my head or in the astral i dont know but I DO know that i never got to see my room or surroundings.
It cant be in my head this visualations because almost EVERYTIME i hear this wind roaring i find myself there.

reply to post by Skyfloating


Its not that I am not ready, I just feel as if its evil that is all. I enjoy reading about this/writing but somehow people seem to think that astral projection itself, but i am not ready yet. I dont think an individual can somehow ''shape'' whether they have bad/good experiences.
I think its the process itself really.

Hey we can have our own opinions right?