Cummings: Full IRS interview shows White House didn’t direct tea party targeting

reply to post by Wrabbit2000


LOL!!!

Absitively right!!!

I understand what your father was dealing with, and I had to watch over the next phase (figuratively speaking) when your father's phase of handling the issues was done...tragic direction...

reply to post by Helious

It doesn't matter if Obama directed it or not, what matters is that it happened in the first place.

Let me get this straight just so I know we are on the same page.

You seem to be saying that

• it is wrong for the IRS to ensure that tax exempt status is only given to organizations that qualify for tax exempt status.
  
• when Congress passes a law that says "tax exempt" = "no political activity", they were just kidding
  
• Congress should pillory government agencies for obeying the law as Congress intended
  
• when less than one third of the applications that are reviewed closely are actually from conservative organizations, that conservative organizations are being targeted unfairly, disproportionately, and politically
  
• when the IRS official responsible for the checking is a 'conservative Republican' and two thirds of the 'targets' are not conservative organizations, it is the minority conservative organizations that are being treated unfairly
  
• when obviously political organizations, of any stripe, are attempting to steal from the American taxpayer by lying to the IRS about their purpose, that the IRS should just ignore it?
  
• you don't give a crap about what the law says, and nobody should be responsible for enforcing it?
  
• Congress doesn't give a crap about the laws it passes, and should rip to pieces the people it charges with enforcing those laws for the temerity to try to enforce those laws?
  

Is that about right?

Because those statement all follow from your post. The vetting of applications for tax-exempt status is NOT a political process. Congress set the rules and told the IRS to enforce them.

The fact is that there was NO targeting of conservative groups, only one third of the applications in question were from conservative groups.

The fact is that political organizations are NOT eligible for tax exempt status. If you give your organization a name that says 'we are a political organization', it is going to get looked at more closely.

It is the IRS' job to check these things. They shouldn't have to check them out so closely, but then organizations shouldn't be trying to scam the IRS so they can steal from the American people either.

reply to post by rnaa


Ouch! That beatdown's gonna leave a welt, no question about it.

Nice work.

reply to post by totallackey

Originally posted by totallackey
Not that it really matters, (as it is just a big game) but I read your whole post and see absolutely nothing in it substantiating your statement that, "... Issa practically begged..."

There's a link to the letter in the second source. I included what I determined to be the relevant excerpts from the articles. If you want further detailed information, you have to push a couple buttons

Issa released only the part of the transcripts that supported the Republican agenda and refused to release the rest, showing the truth of the matter - that the White House was not involved.

So not only did you tell a blatant lie in your opening statement to this OP

I did not lie about anything. Maybe you don't like my opinion, but I didn't lie.

...you conveniently left out exactly why the desire to not release the transcripts...

Again, according to posting guidelines, I can only include so much of the source article. If you want more, read the damn thing.

HE is a fraud. And his supporters are frauds.

Your opinions about the president are hardly relevant to this topic.

reply to post by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
The following article says just the opposite and names the names who said it, when and where they said it as well as quotes for precisely what they said in many cases.

There is no doubt the IRS in Washington became involved (I said that in my OP) and probably used the information for political advantage. But your source is talking about January of 2012. The origination of the "tea party screening" was in February of 2010, in Cincinnati. THAT'S when and where it started, not at the White House. Not in Washington. The employees in Cincinnati contacted Washington IRS for help and then Washington IRS looked into it further.

It's clear there was nefarious involvement from the IRS in Washington, it just didn't come from Obama or the White House. Their 'tip off' came from a lowly worker in Cincinnati.

In fairness, I don't think Obama knew a thing about it.

That is the main point.

They need to get to the bottom of this and flush whoever took part in the policy decisions.

I agree.

The boss is always responsible for the actions of his employees. Not knowing that your employees are committing crimes does not mean you will not be blamed. The O is responsible.

Very entertaining watching the Omama haters squirm. I dont back the current administration as promises made were not kept and the destruction of the constitution continues. From the start I didnt see any grand conspiracy in this event. Just humans doing what humans do...

reply to post by Mike.Ockizard


I don't post this to make the "Omama" haters squirm. I think it's important to show the a member of the GOP has been trying to hide this important information from the public in order to influence our opinions. The GOP has done NOTHING but obstruct this administration and poison the public's mind from the start.

Do I defend Obama in this particular issue? Yes and no. When he has been blamed for the whole thing, like it was some sort of masterminded plot from the start, I think it's important to show that that is incorrect. But the more important issue is to get the information out there so the public can make a more informed decision about it. Not that I expect anything less than what I've seen here from the haters.

I think all these "scandals" we're seeing are the result of a concerted effort by the GOP to "scandalize" Obama. They have tried everything else, and Obama still won the election... Now, they're making everything into a "scandal" and placing Obama as the evil mastermind behind it all. It's laughable, really. But the haters buy it hook line and sinker, because they want to believe...

Originally posted by Fromabove
The boss is always responsible for the actions of his employees. Not knowing that your employees are committing crimes does not mean you will not be blamed. The O is responsible.

I once stole a pencil and pad of paper from my employer's supply closet. I suppose the CEO of the company, who is stationed 1500 miles away, should get axed over my actions.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I have a hard time believing this story because if it were true, then there'd have been no issue. This looks like a stop-gap measure.

It also doesn't explain the hundreds of visits to the Obama WhiteHouse, nor does it explain the director (what's her name) who pleaded the 5th earlier this month.

From Fast & Furious to Benghazi to the IRS scandal, it appears that the administration is blissfully ignorant and that the actual running of the country and implementation of policiy is determined by low-level office-types.

Don’t know why people are still trying to carry the water for this president. This guy is a crook and will go down as the worst president ever. Everything he touches fails. Now i thought bush was bad. hahaha

Originally posted by camaro68ss
Don’t know why people are still trying to carry the water for this president. This guy is a crook and will go down as the worst president ever. Everything he touches fails. Now i thought bush was bad. hahaha

edit on 19-6-2013 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)

I agree. Obama will probably be known as one of the worst presidents, but at least we can put everything in the proper context and get our facts straight so that when we tell our grandkids about the worst president ever, we don't look like fools by having the wrong info.

reply to post by beezzer

Originally posted by beezzer
I have a hard time believing this story because if it were true, then there'd have been no issue.

Not true. There was most definitely an issue. Lois Lerner was up to something. But only after these guys in Ohio contacted Washington's IRS, with requests for help as regards the suspicious tea party applications.

From Fast & Furious to Benghazi to the IRS scandal, it appears that the administration is blissfully ignorant and that the actual running of the country and implementation of policiy is determined by low-level office-types.

If you expect a president to have his hands in EVERYTHING that takes place during his administration, you don't have a very good idea of the position or the number of actions that take place. Obama had nothing to do with Benghazi and IRS. They were manufactured scandals. I can't speak to Fast and Furious because I have never looked into it. But the others, I feel pretty secure that I know enough to state that the GOP manufactured them.

I'm not going to continue to argue the facts or opinions. I don't care what people believe. (If you notice, I RARELY post threads). I just wanted to put these transcripts out there for the people here to see. If you still think Obama's at fault, I don't really care. We're all entitled to our opinions.

Since you believe obama & Friends had 0 to do w/ this i thought it a perfect time to sell u land in Miami everglades...errrr yea, thats the ticket.

reply to post by tracehd1


And this kind of juvenile, petty BS is exactly the reason I don't participate much in political threads anymore. The majority of people (certainly over half in this thread) have NO INTEREST in the facts or in actual discussion or debate... They just want to come on and insult people with different opinions.

Just for posting this, I have been called a liar, a fraud, a liberal, and an Obama representative. This is what passes for discussion here. :shk:

What are you, thirteen?

Wrabbit2000, I really appreciate your input and opinions. But, as this thread goes the way of all the other crap here, I find I have better things to do than read personal insults simply for posting information.

reply to post by rnaa


I love the effort to tell everyone to ignore their lying eyes and ears and pretend we haven't heard what we HAVE heard and that sworn testimony doesn't say what it DOES say.

The fact employees of the I.R.S. have stated this WAS politically driven, isn't a question. Not debatable. It's testimony given, under Oath to the United States Congress and on the record for you, me and everyone else to go read. Any time we'd like to see it again. So this "Nothing to see here....move along now..." won't wash here. Not even a little bit. We're WAYYY too far into it for that approach now. Prior to Congress taking testimony? Perhaps that could have worked. Now? It's sad to even see attempted.

The question IS valid to ask, did those I.R.S. employees lie? If they did, I want to see them prosecuted for perjury before Congress in having started the mess which didn't need to be. *IF* they lied. The usual practice of simply calling them liars, pretending like that's been proven to be true, then walking away from the whole problem based on what never amounts to more than unfounded or proven accusation to their credibility...likewise won't hunt on this one.

So.... Great attempt to whitewash what's already been established under Oath ...but it's not happening that easy. Not by a LONG shot. The IRS is not a political tool. White House or not... SOMEONE thought it was a great idea to use it that way, and SOMEONE needs a prison cell along side the 'tax evaders' they put there every year.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


Thanks for the reply... I did misunderstand your OP then and I'm big enough to admit that by your clarification. It doesn't change a thing about my reply above to another post, but I'd taken your point to be what others have said and stating the whole thing started, existed and pretty well ended with rogue agents inside the Cincinnati field office. Some in the Government have suggested that and tried to hang a couple lower IRS employees out for the media to feed on and call it a day. lol... Oh .. not so fast I say.

Now on the White House, Yeah, it sounds like we probably do see very similar on that. IF the White House actually thought up or directed any of this, I'll be surprised. It's very 'inside baseball' for THAT high level to be aware of on more than a passing staffer level...if that much. The IRS has never needed help from the White House to go wildly out of control in other ways before, eh? Why people assume the President himself would be required for that particularly agency to have a political power trip now is beyond me.

(Well, actually, it's not...it's the hunt for Obama's scalp on any basis, however absurd it may be on the face of it.)

The less Obama comes into this specific scandal, the easier it will be to get the little crooks who used an accounting agency as a political hammer.

Originally posted by xuenchen
With all the lies so far,

why would this new miracle be truthful ?

Because this is testimony that Darryl Issa gathered? Are you saying that the selected, out-of-context, excerpts that Darryl Issa released from this same testimony was credible?...But the full transcript is not?

There are "partisan glasses" and "blinders"...but that standard of reality seems to fall along the lines of fun-house mirror?

Full Transcript - LIE!!!....Excerpted bits of the same transcript twisted to fit a partisan agenda...ahhh..that works!

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I've got to say, this doesn't put anything to rest or make anything easier. I believe it only highlights the need for serious investigations into what happened here.

Darryl Issa is the wrong man for serious investigation.

I too would like to see safeguards in place to make sure politics does not leak into the IRS.

But Darryl Issa is doing the precise opposite of that, desperately politicizing the inquiry.

BTW IT'S NOT JUST REPORTERS OR DEMS THAT HAVE BEEN CALLING FOUL ON ISSA...

"Let's see everything," Sen. Rob Portman (R-Ohio) told Grove. "Let's see it all."

But Issa has steadfastly refused to release the full transcripts of those interviews

www.huffingtonpost.com...

reply to post by Indigo5


I do agree on that. Issa was as good as anyone to get the first things started, but for true and meaningful investigation which may define historic record on a thing like this? Yeah... Right.... He's about as fair and unbiased as walking into a courtroom as a Hatfield when the Sheriff, Judge and Prosecutor are all named McCoy. The outcome isn't in doubt but even the janitor will laugh at the idea of justice done.

I'd say Special Prosecutor....but not for THIS one. SP's make for a circus the Shriners would call a world class production and this one is too serious to make a big game out of. Someone...or several someone's in the IRS need busted out without pension and with a sentence in a quiet place to think about their actions. An SP won't do that as he takes it all over the Government and White House just because he can.

I'm not sure, in this Super-Partisan atmosphere in Washington, just what is the right answer to get a REAL investigation that may well clear as many as it indicts. Any honest investigation is likely to do just that, too.