NSA admits listening to U.S. phone calls without warrants - Angry yet?

reply to post by elouina

Innocent people will voice dissent over our government at times. And they should be able to do this without some pimple faced analyst listening in. This is not the principles that our country was built on. If you want intrusion into your private life, move

The internet is not private, it is a public network owned by thousands of companies. The idea that your packets are special and cannot be looked at is dumb, naive, ignorant of how the tech works. The problem is people with no understanding of the technology make up rules in their head about how it all should work. The internet was created by the DoD. It's about information flowing back and forth. It isn't about privacy. If anything, the only privacy you have is due to the enormous volume of information traveling on the networks.The very nature of the mesh network means you don't "really" know which route your packets will take. Not only that, a clever person could manipulate that path. But i would always assume that what you do "could" be monitored. Is it? Unlikely unless you get on a list. There is simply to much volume.

Another person said earlier that, your information is not monitored directly, but rather a piece of software looks for keywords and various other things to see if your traffic is interesting. Still, even then, think about this logically, there is child porn on the web. Everyone of sound mind despises this activity. It is totally illegal. Yet it still goes on, even though, the government is "Monitoring" all this traffic. You may say, "well there not looking for this" well i would say there are groups in the government that probably are, its just that the sheer volume of information makes it very difficult to find these people. So, if they cannot target an eliminate these people from society how hard do you think finding terrorists would be. Damn hard.

I just don't want the tin foil hat crowd, who are already five slices into the crazy cake, to start thinking their alien visitation and anti Obama/Bush threads mean the NSA boogie men are looking at their packets. It's highly unlikely. Feel wrapped up in a warm blanket of comfort, safe in the knowledge that your kinda crazy isn't really that interesting. Not only that, the sheer volume of talk on the web snuggles you a bit more.


V

The NSA has officially become that guy that nobody knows, who crashes your party, makes lewd remarks to every female present and when asked to leave, heads to your bathroom and drops an upper-decker out of spite.

It's long past time to clean house here in the U.S.

reply to post by elouina


Ever since the Patriot Act.. It seemed the use of the surveillances on the terrorist was a prototype or invite of some sort for others. And so 1 is not surprised echelon is said to of been up to this for years. And if that's shared you got to consider more advanced techs existing. The mind imaging another topic

yes this is shocking to discover that this ACTUALLY goes on, but surely us on ATS had a bit of an idea that this went on anyway,.

are people just angrier because its been confirmed?


I wonder if the NSA has ever been embroiled with any political movements / presidents?

Surely if anyone high profile was "being naughty" they would have the tools to find out exactly what!

S&F.

Oh but just think, as the FBI said, if we'd had this in 2001 we could have prevented 9/11.

Funny that they couldn't prevent Boston with all this Big Brother crap, even after a warning from the Russians AND having had the bombers in for questioning years before..

reply to post by elouina


Since my bros entered the military we have been hearing clicking noises ever since, every time I talk to them. They went to fight in Iraq, heard the clicking, came home, heard the clicking. They have kids and houses now, live off base (in the States), one isn't even in the military anymore, and guess what, phone is still clicking. "Click Click Click." F'in annoying.

this type of wire-tapping has been around for ages.

this is the first time im posting on this topic on ATS since Snowden blew the whistle.

We've been monitored like were being monitored now since the 70's and 80's. the only reason why this is big news now is that it is official public knowledge now. Before that its just been a topic whispered about in the back of diners, and forums like this one.

im not shocked, im not surprised, and im not even mad.

The time to be upset and angry over this has long since passed. we should've been angry about the over-reaching powers that the patriot act enabled the government to do. reason for this was to prevent terrorist attacks... yet hasn't proven to work (Case and point, Boston, 7/7.. etc.) I include 7/7 because prism is supposed to be intercepting anything/everything that comes through the US (Which is a huge chunk of world comms)

This isn't about preventing terrorism... this is going to be used against the people one day... either individually one by one at random and using this database to crucify someone for something they said 15 years ago. (Benign or not)

this will enable future witch hunts, and entrap innocent people. Oh but this is just a CT now... would never happen.

I believe our country was already at an all time low but this is insanity!!! I have no sense privacy anymore!!!

reply to post by ugie1028


i knew it was rumored but it shocks me that they would admit it. and your statement about the how they will use the data is sadly very likely.

Who cares.

Hey NSA, you can listen to all my phone calls and read all my texts and emails, as much as you want. I don't care. I have nothing important or relevant to hide. But if you're really interested in hearing me talk to my girlfriend at night, or read emails between me and my college professors, go for it.

Other non-NSA people. Unless you've got something to hide, why do you care if people are listening to your stuff?

This whole idea of personal privacy is modern anyway. Five thousand years ago, there was no privacy. You pooped and gave birth and died in front of your village. Get off your high horses expecting that privacy is a right, not a privilege.

Originally posted by Schmidt1989
Who cares.

Hey NSA, you can listen to all my phone calls and read all my texts and emails, as much as you want. I don't care. I have nothing important or relevant to hide. But if you're really interested in hearing me talk to my girlfriend at night, or read emails between me and my college professors, go for it.

Other non-NSA people. Unless you've got something to hide, why do you care if people are listening to your stuff?

This whole idea of personal privacy is modern anyway. Five thousand years ago, there was no privacy. You pooped and gave birth and died in front of your village. Get off your high horses expecting that privacy is a right, not a privilege.

By far the best example of what is wrong with people in this day and age. Thank you for reminding me that it was apathy and self-absorption that got us into this mess to begin with.

Originally posted by elouina

Rep. Jerrold Nadler, a New York Democrat, disclosed this week that during a secret briefing to members of Congress, he was told that the contents of a phone call could be accessed "simply based on an analyst deciding that."

NSA admits listening to U.S. phone calls without warrants

So does that mean that Rep. Jerrold Nadler will be sharing a cell between Private Manning and Snowden??

Originally posted by shockedamerican
Okay?!?

So what is the news?

Am I in a time loop or something?

This is old news......

yup...this is one big DUH!!........especially here on ATS....it's like saying we have phones that can take pictures now.....and the terrorists have known for years too...nobody is fooling anybody, except for the most ignorant in our society......a good start might be to do away with the patriot act

Originally posted by Schmidt1989
Who cares.

Hey NSA, you can listen to all my phone calls and read all my texts and emails, as much as you want. I don't care. I have nothing important or relevant to hide. But if you're really interested in hearing me talk to my girlfriend at night, or read emails between me and my college professors, go for it.

So in a few years when a new President is elected and a new administration is in place.....suppose an agenda of intolerance or bigotry comes to be? Or any kind of political agenda that you feel compelled to protest and organize against?

The FBI and CIA ran a long campaign of bugging/tapping Rev. Martin Luther King Jr. to amass information to discredit him. That is not conspiracy...that is documented.

See why you might not think you have anything to hide right now...that your life is boring...the issue is that the government can change thier mind as to what is boring...and you can change your mind as to how outspoken against government you might be.

By saying it's OK to listen in on you now...you abdicate the people's authority to the government. You might trust government now, but what if you choose to not trust government in the future?

FBI tracked King's every move
www.cnn.com...

The FBI Wrote A Letter To Martin Luther King Telling Him To Commit Suicide
news.firedoglake.com...

continued from above:

COINTELPRO (an acronym for Counter Intelligence Program) was a series of covert, and at times illegal, projects conducted by the United States Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) aimed at surveying, infiltrating, discrediting, and disrupting domestic political organizations.

The FBI has used covert operations against domestic political groups since its inception; however, covert operations under the official COINTELPRO label took place between 1956 and 1971.[2]

Indigo5 insert [ Notice the qualifier "OFFICIAL cointelpro Label"...not be confused as only happening during these years...it happened since the FBI's "inception" but was only given an official OP Label during those years]

COINTELPRO tactics have been alleged to include discrediting targets through psychological warfare; smearing individuals and groups using forged documents and by planting false reports in the media; harassment; wrongful imprisonment; and illegal violence, including assassination.


The FBI's stated motivation was "protecting national security, preventing violence, and maintaining the existing social and political order."[6]

FBI records show that 85% of COINTELPRO resources targeted groups and individuals that the FBI deemed "subversive",[7] including

communist and socialist organizations;

organizations and individuals associated with the civil rights movement,

including Martin Luther King, Jr. and others associated with the

Southern Christian Leadership Conference, the

National Association for the Advancement of Colored People, and the

Congress of Racial Equality and other civil rights organizations;

black nationalist groups;

the American Indian Movement; a broad range of organizations labeled "New Left", including

Students for a Democratic Society and the Weathermen;

almost all groups protesting the Vietnam War,

as well as individual student demonstrators with no group affiliation;

the National Lawyers Guild; organizations and

individuals associated with the women's rights movement;

nationalist groups such as those seeking independence for Puerto Rico,

United Ireland, and

Cuban exile movements including Orlando Bosch's Cuban Power and the Cuban Nationalist Movement;

and additional notable Americans —even Albert Einstein, who was a member of several civil rights groups, came under FBI surveillance during the years just before COINTELPRO's official inauguration.[8]

The remaining 15% of COINTELPRO resources were expended to marginalize and subvert white hate groups, including the Ku Klux Klan and the National States' Rights Party.[9]

en.wikipedia.org...

You can say some of those groups deserved to have thier civil rights violated, thier homes and phones bugged, and be the target of "psych warfare" and smear campaigns...even arrest on trumped up charges...

But Martin Luther King Jr.? Student Protestors? War Protestors? NAACP? Womens rights movement???...Albert Einstien????

It is either freedom for all or none.

This was before modern tech. afforded them to do it on a near omnnipotent scale....

Out government changes all the time by design, but the rules stay the same...

You give a government you agree with NOW or trust NOW this power...legitmize and legalize it...and then what happens when the pendulum swings and the government decides those that disagree with war or GMO crops or any of other issue are "subversive" and a danger to our "Social and Political Order"?

Three comments.....

1. Big phone companies is just the tip of the iceburg. They are also gather info via internet, hotel chains, travel agencies, airlines, rental car agencies, civic organizations and any government agency people or organizations interact with.

2. Our government has proven that if given the opportunity IT WILL ABUSE INFORMATION IT COLLECTS.

3. IF PRISM was implementated by ANY OTHER NATION besides the US - the US would brand it a WMD and attack the implemnting nation.

Why do we put up with it from our own government?

To the people of the rest of the world - don't think the NSA program is limited to US citizens or only info flowing into the US - they are looking your data as well - in Russa, in Great Britain, in France, in Iran, in Autstralia, etc, etc, etc.

reply to post by Schmidt1989


because you loose your sense of privacy. knowing that at the press of a button people can listen to our phone call read our text and emails... idk about you but that makes me uncomfortable, and i have nothing to hide... and besides all that, its just not morally right. were supposed the be land of the free not land of the suspicious. Would you feel comfortable with someone you dont know watching you 24/7 in your house. I've also heard that they can get into your cameras too

I'm still wondering what will be news in the next few weeks/months. With the whole Syria rebels support, G8 and Iranian election, the NSA thing is a diversion?

It's been going on since 2006. Were you angry then? What's different now? Obama instead of Bush? Is that what the anger is about? Personally, if the gov't wants to listen to me ordering a pizza, or checking out an ESPN web site, or ordering a new DVD from Amazon, who cares? I always arrange my anti-gov't terrorisim via carrier pidgeon. So, I'm good.

No not angry HAPPY

The National Security Agency plans to release details on Monday about the “dozens” of terror plots thwarted by the use of recently leaked surveillance programs,

LOSE LIPS SINKS SHIPS