Indian AF breaks USAF record

IAF chopper makes world's highest landing in Ladakh
NEW DELHI, NOV 2 (PTI)
An Indian Air Force Cheetal helicopter today made the world's highest landing at a density altitude of 7621 meters on Sasser Kangri massif in Eastern Ladakh setting a new world record.

The Cheetal, sporting a Cheetah air frame with a more powerful tm-333-2b2 aero engine, thus bettered the record held by the US Bell helicopter of landing at an altitude of 7655 meters achieved on July 28,2004, according to IAF spokesperson Squadron Leader Mahesh Upasani.

Flown by Group Capt A S Butola and Squadron Leader S Sharma the chopper landed at the Sasser Kangri depression between main and south peak at an altitude of 7070, pressure altitude of 7670 meters and density altitude of 7670 meters. The feat was witnessed and validated by Wing Commander Upadhayay, Chief test pilot, helicopters of HAL and Wing Commander Uni Pillay flying India's indigenous light helicopter Dhruv.

IAF sources said the motivation behind the world record breaking bid was that a Cheetah helicopter of the IAF had landed at a record density altitude of more than 7,500 metres just a few months back -- not in the quest of a record, but to rescue casualities from a mountaineering expedition in extremely challenging conditions.

"This feat made the IAF to launch a bid to break the world highest landing record", the spokesperson said.

The achievement would be a great cheer for the country's strategic planners, as India has been in quest for an high altitude helicopter to launch strategic mission over Ladakh and Kashmir Himalayas.

IAF sources said the combination of a light airframe and a more powerful engine has resulted in coming up with a leaner and more capable machine, permitting a higher payload specially suited for flights to Siachen Glacier, world highest battlefield and to areas aroud Daulat Beg Oldi and Karakoram Pass.

The IAF and the Hindustan Aeronautics had till now kept the Cheetal project under wraps. "Air Force has been associated in putting this machine through its trials and is all set to procure them for operations services in the force," the spokesperson said.

The French engine is also fitted on the Advanced Light Helicopter.

The US helicopter giant Bell along with Eurocopter and Italian Westland choppers had been in the race for the Indian high altitude helicopter project.

Source _ www.outlookindia.com...
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IAF chopper creates record with high altitude landing
Publish Date : 11/3/2004 3:13:00 PM Source : India-Defence-Record

The Indian Air Force (IAF) has said that one of its helicopters had created a record Tuesday by landing at an altitude of 25,150 feet in a frozen desert region of Jammu and Kashmir.


The Cheetal helicopter made the high altitude landing at Saserkangri near Leh at 8.45 a.m., and IAF spokesman said here.

The operation of aircraft at such high altitudes is severely affected by lack of oxygen in the air, and pilots have often reported a sharp loss in engine power and difficulty in handling.

A news item stating that a Bell 407 helicopter had set a world record by landing at 24,971 feet on July 28 had spurred IAF and state-owned aviation major Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL) to try to better this feat, the spokesman said.

"This morning, a Cheetal helicopter bettered the record in style. Flown by Group Captain A.S. Butola and Squadron Leader S. Sharma, the helicopter landed at Saserkangri," he said.

The feat was witnessed and validated by Wing Commander (retired) Upadhayay, HAL's chief test pilot for rotary wing aircraft, and Wing Commander (retired) Uni Pillay, flying in another IAF helicopter.

"The motivation behind this attempt was the fact that a Cheetah helicopter of the IAF had landed at a record altitude of 23,240 feet just a few months ago - not in the quest of a record, but to rescue causalities from a mountaineering expedition in extremely challenging conditions," the spokesman said.

The Cheetah helicopter, the workhorse of the IAF, is powered by an engine with 847 horsepower. The Cheetal features a Cheetah airframe and the more powerful TM-333-2B2, 1,000 horsepower engine.

The IAF's helicopter pilots routinely fly missions at heights of up to 21,000 feet to ferry supplies and to evacuate casualties from the Siachen glacier.

"The combination of a light airframe and a more powerful engine has resulted in a more capable machine, permitting a higher payload - a critical requirement when operating at the extreme altitudes of the glacier where every gram matters," the spokesman said.

"The IAF has been associated in putting the Cheetal through its trials and is set to procure them for operational service."

--Indo-Asian News Service
Src : www.onlypunjab.com...

I guess that is ample evidence to one and all that the IAF is no pushover AF. The beating they gave the USAF in the several recent air exercises is ample eidence to this.

Dont quote me but I doubt if the USAF can take back the record.

Way t ogo India!!....

Any got any good links on the above mentioned helicopters ????

Please post if you know anything about these

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
I guess that is ample evidence to one and all that the IAF is no pushover AF. The beating they gave the USAF in the several recent air exercises is ample eidence to this.

Dont quote me but I doubt if the USAF can take back the record.

If you actually knew what happened at the exercises you would know that the US airforce is better.

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
IAF chopper makes world's highest landing in Ladakh
NEW DELHI, NOV 2 (PTI)
An Indian Air Force Cheetal helicopter today made the world's highest landing at a density altitude of 7621 meters on Sasser Kangri massif in Eastern Ladakh setting a new world record.

...

Flown by Group Capt A S Butola and Squadron Leader S Sharma the chopper landed at the Sasser Kangri depression between main and south peak at an altitude of 7070, pressure altitude of 7670 meters and density altitude of 7670 meters...

Why does this article contradict its own facts?

Was it a result of poor exit polling? Or were the instruments made by Diebold?

I think Bell should demand a recount.



[edit on 12-11-2004 by Raphael_UO]

Feed your people first. Then to break any non-meaningless record.

[edit on 12-11-2004 by lmairforce]

Originally posted by jetsetter

Originally posted by Stealth Spy
I guess that is ample evidence to one and all that the IAF is no pushover AF. The beating they gave the USAF in the several recent air exercises is ample eidence to this.

Dont quote me but I doubt if the USAF can take back the record.

If you actually knew what happened at the exercises you would know that the US airforce is better.

I think he's convinced that the IAF is superior to the USAF or some other bizzare idea .

Originally posted by lmairforce
Feed your people first. Then to break any non-meaningless record.

[edit on 12-11-2004 by lmairforce]

Whats this crap about "Feed your people first"..heard it too many times to let it go unanswered.

Western countries with populations that equal those of our cities are doing too much bravado about "Feed your people first" taunt.
Why? so we spend more on our people and leave our defences to be catered by some "world policing force?" Or we let our economy be handled by similar entities, so that it can collapse onto itself? (Argentina. South Korea..etc etc.) Self sufficiency is of utmost importance here.Thats what we strive to achieve..

So enough of this "Feed your people first" rhetoric!!I say this on the behalf of all third world countries. Also my intuition is that you are some chicom dude who's been using this "Feed your people first" line against India in other threads as well, kind of lame don't you think

Also maybe you to go learn english before you come and post on english fora dude!! "non-meaningless record" means a meaningful one right?


[edit on 13-11-2004 by Daedalus3]

Originally posted by Daedalus3

Originally posted by lmairforce
Feed your people first. Then to break any non-meaningless record.

[edit on 12-11-2004 by lmairforce]

Whats this crap about "Feed your people first"..heard it too many times to let it go unanswered.

Western countries with populations that equal those of our cities are doing too much bravado about "Feed your people first" taunt.

Why? so we spend more on our people and leave our defences to be catered by some "world policing force?" Or we let our economy be handled by similar entities, so that it can collapse onto itself? (Argentina. South Korea..etc etc.) Self sufficiency is of utmost importance here.Thats what we strive to achieve..

So enough of this "Feed your people first" rhetoric!!I say this on the behalf of all third world countries. Also my intuition is that you are some chicom dude who's been using this "Feed your people first" line against India in other threads as well, kind of lame don't you think

Also maybe you to go learn english before you come and post on english fora dude!! "non-meaningless record" means a meaningful one right?


[edit on 13-11-2004 by Daedalus3]

Hi, Daedalus3, I like u, a die hard fighter,
1) South Korea sounds like North Korea----all member here should have any basic knowledge of the history and geography, especially around the hot pot.
2) Rich country and non-poor (#$#$%#@$) country is obviously different, understand?

[edit on 14-11-2004 by lmairforce]

^^i didnt get what your you were trying to say..My geography is poor? Im sorry please elaborate...If you're refeing to South Korea in my post then maybe yu didn't understand me. I said countries like South Korea, Argentina etc have spent most of their time "feeding their people" and leaving their security/economy in the hands of the US. That led to the economic implosions in those particular countries. Self-Sufficiency is of utmost importance. One has to be self-sufficient in all aspects, economy, defence etc.etc. not just concentrate on one aspect.

And if you read the thread starter post, then you'll realise that the record was attempted only because a previous high-altitude rescue at the same height was successful.
Now theres got to be some "save your people before attempting to break records" twist to that aye?
What do you say iamairforce? Is that dignified enough for you?

And yes, im a die hard fighter, all Indians are.But I "fight" with a
"level head", as you can see from my previous posts. No mindless bashing, not my style

Originally posted by lmairforce
Feed your people first. Then to break any non-meaningless record.

[edit on 12-11-2004 by lmairforce]

A "non-meaningless record," eh? So wouldn't that in fact mean to that the record does have meaning?

Anyway, go India's Air Force! India in general is really starting to become a powerful country. It's good to see somewhere balancing out China.

Originally posted by Blackout
I think he's convinced that the IAF is superior to the USAF or some other bizzare idea

.

Dont get me wrong. The USAF is the best under the sun. But i was just trying to say that does no necessarily mean they are invinceable.

The IAF can never take on the USAF, in full numbers. but indian pilots, aircrafts are no pushovers.

Jetsetter : 6 mig-21's beating 3 F-15's is good in my book

Why do most americans beleive that the rest of the world is sh*t and that they are always going to be the only superpower? India and China are advancing there forces way faster than the US and pretty soon they shall past them in technology and have the superior forces. They already have the man power its just a matter of time before the US gets crushed.

^^^Sad isn't it? Its like I said in another thread, the amount of whining and probing that went into the results of the Cope India exercise in this Forum was like a bunch of kids throwing a temper tantrum after being robbed of their "first" place!

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Originally posted by Blackout
I think he's convinced that the IAF is superior to the USAF or some other bizzare idea

.

Dont get me wrong. The USAF is the best under the sun. But i was just trying to say that does no necessarily mean they are invinceable.

The IAF can never take on the USAF, in full numbers. but indian pilots, aircrafts are no pushovers.

Jetsetter : 6 mig-21's beating 3 F-15's is good in my book

As I said, if you know the specifics. The Indians flew with AWACS. That is advantage that is very hard to beat. The US did not.

I don't know about the other exercise, but in this one Indians clearly showed their talent.

Surf

This article pretty much sums it up:

More details have come out about the "losing" performance of U.S. F-15Cs (from the Alaska-based 3rd Wing) against India's air force in the "Cope India" air-to-air combat exercise earlier this year. The Air Force and some members of Congress have used the "failure" of American aircraft to further justify the need for new F/A-22 and F-35 fighters. Some are calling the results a dramatic example of weakening of American air combat capabilities

Two factors have been cited as major reasons why the 3rd Wing took a drubbing. None of the participating American aircraft had the latest long-range AESA radars, although some of the F-15Cs of the Wing had this equipment. A decision had been made beforehand not to send the AESA equipped planes to India due to the additional maintenance package required to support them. A total of six F-15Cs were sent to India, each equipped with a fighter data link, short-range AIM-9X heat-seeking air-to-air missiles, and the U.S.'s helmet-mounted cueing system.

Secondly, at India's request, the U.S. agreed to mock combat at 3-to-1 odds and without the full range of capabilities of simulated long-range radar-guided AIM-120 AMRAAM missiles. U.S. fighters could not use the active on-board radar capability of the AMRAAM, and the missile was limited to around 32 kilometers range and required the use of the F-15C's onboard radar to target Indian aircraft. In standard use, AMRAAM has a range of over 100 kilometers and is a fire-and-forget missile that doesn't require additional guidance from the F-15. Practiced tactics by the F-15 crews mix two AESA-equipped F-15Cs with two stock aircraft. The AESA aircraft take long-range missile shots to thin out and disrupt the formation of a numerically superior force before the two sides close up for closer fighting.

The F-15s flew in groups of 4 against packages of 12 Indian Air Force aircraft consisting of a mix of Mirage 2000, Su-30, Mig-21, and Mig-27 aircraft. The Mirage and Su-30 aircraft were used in the air-to-air role, while the Mig-27 was used as the strike aircraft with the Mig-21 providing escort to the Mig-27s. The Indians also had a simulated AWACS platform and the use of simulated active radar missiles such as the AA-12 and the French Mica, unlike the F-15Cs. This gave the Indian Air Force a fire-and-forget air-to-air missile capability that the U.S. fighters didn't have, a heavily unrealistic assumption in actual hostilities.

However, the U.S. pilots admitted that they did have problems with the simulated active missile threat and don't normally train against launch-and-leave threats. They also admit they underestimated the training and tactics of the Indian pilots. Indian air force planners never repeated failed tactics and were able to change tactics as opportunities became available, mixing things up and never providing the same tactical "look." Some of the Indian aircraft radars had different characteristics than U.S. pilots had seen on stock versions of the aircraft, including some of the Mirage 2000s.

From www.strategypage.com...

Can I get a pro-India article too?

It seems to be that the article is very biased.

Surf

Originally posted by surfup
Can I get a pro-India article too?

It seems to be that the article is very biased.

Surf

You can get that article from Stealth Spy,if its biased,its probably the truth,because thats what most of the reports state.