Woman allegedly arrested for carrying a Union Jack Flag (In Oldham England)

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by dam00

 

It's my personal belief that you can be as insulting as you wish, as long as you're not threatening.

Generally I agree with you that there should be legal consequences for slander and such, and yet people should be allowed to think what they want. But there are a lot of grey areas, so it is sometimes hard to see what is right and what is wrong in regards to this subject.

Anyway - I think you would agree with me that it is in every society, country, community's interest to create a consensus among it's population. I don't think to much uniformity is great either, we need diversity, but in regards to living in peace and harmony, it often seems easier when people agree with each other.

So with out infringing on people personal liberties - how would you suggest one approaches this dilemma? Education? Campaigns? - or do we just let it be, and hope people eventually work things out by themselves?

Originally posted by dam00

Originally posted by Sankari

Originally posted by dam00
What sort of evidence would you like

Details of the court case, direct from the court. Several independent reports from independent media, preferably including an interview with the arresting officer and the alleged offender.

Just to be getting on with.

Dont hold your breath will you (It only happend yesterday)

I have been thinking about this truth and proof thing and I am wondering if the asians thought the flag was racist
if so and they had said to the police officer the lady was being racist she would probably have been arrested as a precaution the fact she was carrying a flag probably enforced there suspicions
just my thoughts on it all

I highly doubt that. I think a police officer should be able to tell the difference between a random person carrying a flag and somebody doing something illegal.

Liberate your brains. First off, who carries flags into a shopping precinct ? Ordinary shoppers ?

Eh, no. Course not. This was part of an EDL protest.

The Police say "vulnerable pregnant racist one" wasn't arrested, she was simply put in the back of the van to shut her gobby mouth & to get her out the way. She was released shortly after, although obviously the video has been tweaked to ensure you don't see everything that's going on.

And she was carrying two flags.

One a Union Jack. And the other an EDL flag ... and it was that flag which the Police confiscated.

The facebook spin just isn't true, you're being deliberately hoodwinked.

reply to post by dam00


blinks -do you really believe that - or are you purposly trolling ?

the claim " arrested for carrying a union jack " - makes a nice propaganda soundbite

but despite your claim - no actal evidence has been put forward

and i contend that if a woman wanted to carry a union jack around oldham - without incident - then she could have - very easily

but its equally easy to deliberatly get arrested for any number of public order offences , while similtaneously carrying a union jack

and there is the rub - the fact that she committed some public order offence " magically " is forgotten - and the lie is born " arrested for carrying a union jack "

absolutly pathetic

reply to post by khimbar


Another racist off the streets, top work by the police.

Originally posted by stargatetravels
Yes that's why she was arrested, not for spouting racist, islamaphobic bile at people in the street.
Your title and subsequent OP are absolutely insane, as if she was arrested for carrying a flag?I really hope nobody believes this utter twaddle.

I'm sure the Asian chap in the video was harassed by this 'lady'

This is just more propaganda, more lies, more fuel for the fire.
Take your hatred elsewhere please, i'm sure ats isn't the place for this.

I have allready been slated for not providing enough proof, and I am looking. The few friends I have in the area, and family not to far away, are all saying the same thing, but I wont be posting the Images from my face book to prove it sorry, I want to keep this thread friendly and as for my hatred it is only aimed at my government who is failing in there job

You're sure the Asian chap in the video was harassed by this 'lady
can you back that up or are you just going to spout bile

No because a woman carrying a union jack is obviously a racist

Originally posted by stargatetravels
Yes that's why she was arrested, not for spouting racist, islamaphobic bile at people in the street.
Your title and subsequent OP are absolutely insane, as if she was arrested for carrying a flag?I really hope nobody believes this utter twaddle.

I'm sure the Asian chap in the video was harassed by this 'lady'

I love this.

In amongst all the demands for proof, someone is 'sure' she harassed someone. Well that's ok then. They're 'sure'. Phew.

Let's see them arrest this lot





I'd have liked to have heard the exchange between the lady and the officers

I doubt she was arrested for carrying the Union flag

Cody

Originally posted by dam00
Dont hold your breath will you (It only happend yesterday)

Still plenty of time to get detailed reports from independent media, including an interview with the arresting officer and alleged offender.

Originally posted by LeBombDiggity
Liberate your brains. First off, who carries flags into a shopping precinct ? Ordinary shoppers ?

Eh, no. Course not. This was part of an EDL protest.

The Police say "vulnerable pregnant racist one" wasn't arrested, she was simply put in the back of the van to shut her gobby mouth & to get her out the way. She was released shortly after, although obviously the video has been tweaked to ensure you don't see everything that's going on.

And she was carrying two flags.

One a Union Jack. And the other an EDL flag ... and it was that flag which the Police confiscated.

The facebook spin just isn't true, you're being deliberately hoodwinked.

^^ Finally someone talking sense. Excellent post, have a star.

Originally posted by LeBombDiggity

Liberate your brains. First off, who carries flags into a shopping precinct ? Ordinary shoppers ?

The only answer needed to this is 'Yes, ordinary shoppers if they also happen to be people who want to carry flags into shopping precincts'.

Originally posted by LeBombDiggity

The Police say "vulnerable pregnant racist one" wasn't arrested, she was simply put in the back of the van to shut her gobby mouth & to get her out the way. She was released shortly after, although obviously the video has been tweaked to ensure you don't see everything that's going on.

Do you have a link to where the police say this please?

Originally posted by LeBombDiggity

And she was carrying two flags.

One a Union Jack. And the other an EDL flag ... and it was that flag which the Police confiscated.

Are you against all flags or just flags of people you disagree with? Or is it a dislike of more than one flag?

You should watch Sheldon Coopers 'Fun with flags' if it's a general phobia of all flags. It might help.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by dam00

 

I think posting vile comments about anyone on the internet is just stupid sure people are enntitled to there opinions even if nobody agrees with them but there is no need to post it all over its just rude

I don't think there should be a law against being rude. I think it's a slippery slope. If you're actively threatening someone or slandering them, I do believe that should have legal consequences but my saying I believe a certain person is a jackass should be left alone. It's my belief.

I can understand the police monitoring things like EDL pages as these drunken "lets go burn a mosque" Ideas are idiotic esspecialy as all they do is get caught and cause more division
but being offended by a countrys flag if its the country your living in or even just visiting get a grip and the police should be spending there time on real crimes I feel ill and am almost ashamed of my country

I think there is a huge difference between someone saying "It's time to burn down the mosques" and "Hey guys, meet me at the corner of Mary Poppins Street and 1st, we are burning that mosque down! Sir Tremble Bowels the 5th is bringing the gas, and I know McMatches has a lighter!"

It's my personal belief that you can be as insulting as you wish, as long as you're not threatening. If I decided to walk into Harlem wearing a sandwich board that said I hate N-words (mind I respect ATS and realize certain words are not accepted here) that is my right, and anyone who attacked me should be arrested. Yes in this scenario I was being a jackass, and clearly an idiot, but that doesn't give people the right to assault me. So at the same time, being a racist on Twitter in the UK should not be grounds for arresting someone for provoking violence. Words are not an excuse for violence. A clear call for violence is a different matter, but it seems if you're sipping tea you can't even voice an opinion.

Yes I agree completely maybee we should focus more on good manners rather than political correctness
we used to have laws similarly about blastphemy I dont know why it was abolished but I can certainly understand it

Thank you for your input

Last Friday the EDL put out a false tweet claiming Muslims were celebrating in Oldham. It turned out to be a lie, even a unit of the EDL turned up to find no celebrating Muslims. Conned by their fellow members. There's freedom of speech, then there's shouting FIRE in crowded cinema.

Here is Greater Manchester Police's statement:

GMP did not arrest a pregnant woman during tensions in Oldham on Saturday, and no Union Flag was confiscated from her.

Chief Superintendent Catherine Hankinson said: "Yesterday (Saturday) afternoon, police became aware that a number of people had gathered in Oldham town centre who were shouting and had flags, some of which were provoking passersby.

"As a result there were tensions and some minor disorder.

"While we will always allow and help facilitate peaceful protest, we felt that the actions of these people threatened our community cohesion, so it was our duty to do all we could prevent tensions from escalating.

"Officers dealing with this altercation saw that a woman had a Union Flag and another flag which was highly inappropriate and in our view solely designed to further inflame tensions.

"This woman was therefore taken to one side, the second flag was taken from her and she understood that the flag was causing offence.

"At no point was she arrested, or did she have her Union Flag confiscated from her."

The question here is whether this woman is being arrested for carrying a flag, or simply whilst carrying a flag.

Given it is not in any way, shape or form illegal to carry a flag, I'm going to go with the latter.

Edit:

I see the GMP have clarified this.

reply to post by khimbar


My son has one of these metal fold up scooter things
he has a Union Jack from the jubilee and a St Georges Cross from....... well not sure where that came from to be honest, they are taped to the front, do you think I should be worried he is out playing on it now

thanks for your input

reply to post by lacrimoniousfinale

Chief Superintendent Catherine Hankinson said: "Yesterday (Saturday) afternoon, police became aware that a number of people had gathered in Oldham town centre who were shouting and had flags, some of which were provoking passersby.

why is this man never arrested

Originally posted by lacrimoniousfinale
Here is Greater Manchester Police's statement:

GMP did not arrest a pregnant woman during tensions in Oldham on Saturday, and no Union Flag was confiscated from her.

...

"This woman was therefore taken to one side, the second flag was taken from her and she understood that the flag was causing offence.

"At no point was she arrested, or did she have her Union Flag confiscated from her."

^^ Bingo, we have a winner. Star for you too.

Originally posted by DrHammondStoat
reply to post by dam00

 

I can't say exactly what happened here but there was an asian man on the video that seemed to be pointing at the woman with the flag and was taken to one side when the police got there. Maybe she was doing more than just carrying the flag?

Obviously no-one should be arrested for carrying a flag alone but I don't think we know the whole story here.

Agreed. I'll wager any amount of money that she wasn't arrested for merely carrying a UJ, and that she was babbling some kind of hateful crap before the camera-guy started filming.

Originally posted by dam00
reply to post by lacrimoniousfinale

 

why is this man never arrested

Sometimes we gotta be the bigger people. Just because a group of people does something wrong, and even if they get away with it, it doesn't excuse you sinking to their level.
But frankly I agree that the picture you shared is pretty offensive. So if all your implying is that they should be stopped in their tracks as well, I agree with you. But it still doesn't justify what that women in the video was doing.

Originally posted by khimbar

Originally posted by LeBombDiggity

Liberate your brains. First off, who carries flags into a shopping precinct ? Ordinary shoppers ?

The only answer needed to this is 'Yes, ordinary shoppers if they also happen to be people who want to carry flags into shopping precincts'.

If "ordinary shoppers" only started doing it after a specific event, it wouldn't be ordinary, would it? Under the circumstances, this was far from "ordinary shopper" behaviour, but you carry on defending such bovine-like actions in the name of freedom of speech, if it pleases you.