NEW TITLE: Does This Secret Society Exist, and Am I Being Recruited?

Dear ATSers,

I'm not looking to make a big splash here, just get a couple of opinions and walk away.

I'm also not looking to compete with Bernard Schnitzel. I'm not lying, but I can't prove that over the Internet. All I can do is to ask you to consider my posting history and reputation.

I'm a 60 year-old, white, male. I have no arrest record, never used drugs, and have fairly conservative views. I am pretty much "normal" under the social mores of decades ago. As such a person, it shouldn't surprise you that I've joined clubs. One was just a young man's fancy, I started the Rosicrucian correspondence course forty years ago, but gave it up after three or four lessons.

But you know the sorts of clubs we old men join, Rotary, VFW, Elks, Optimists, Eagles, Masons, American Legion, Moose, Knights of Columbus, the list is lengthy. Despite a few romantic rumors, they are all charitable organizations designed to help their members and their communities.

I've belonged to several of those clubs for the social aspects, and to provide more aid than I could alone. A poster or two has paid me the compliment of saying that I'm a "digger." It should be no surprise that I went digging into the history of one of my "clubs."

I found that at one point in their history they talked about adding a "Circle A" and a "Circle B" to their base organization. Eventually "Circle A" was added to the club and there was no further mention of "Circle B." I went to a member of my club, who is even older than I am, and asked him "Whatever happened to Circle B?" He seemed a reasonable choice to ask because he had done nearly everything the club had offered over his long period of membership.

The fellow, who is normally terse and crusty, said "Don't ever talk about that again." I figured that to do so would identify me as a nut, so I thanked him and walked away. A little after that I was in a small group of people which contained some fairly significant leaders of the club. I said to one "I think we should have a circle which is dedicated to doing (the things Circle B was said to be dedicated to, although I never mentioned Circle B). He responded "That'll come later."

I'm considered an up-and-comer in my club which is why I was able to talk with this individual.

So, my questions:

Does Circle B exist?

Have they started to try to recruit me?

Should I say "no" if they are?

Should I run from the club as a whole as quick as I can?

Have you got any other suggestions or advice?

With respect,
Charles1952

Does not sound good. Without more info, my gut says run. At the very least lay low and keep your eyes and ears open! Also make contingency/escape plans.

reply to post by Magister


Dear Magister,

Thanks for the advice.

I have to admit my head is spinning a little. This club has got a pretty darn near spotless reputation. I joined it's base group thinking there couldn't be any adventure, excitement, or skullduggery involved. I didn't want any, I had my share when I was younger. This is a group of which your mother could say at her bridge game, "Well, my son is a member of this club. He's happy there and they do such good work."

Maybe that's how secret societies work? Not only do I have a real hard time believing that there is a Circle B, it's hard to believe it could be anything bad. This is causing my mind to be seriously reconsidering some fundamental principles. I'm not a happy camper.

Thanks again.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by charles1952


What organization is it?, maybe you don't want to say outright but a clue would be good. I think you should stay in the group, stop digging around and enjoy the benefits. If anything comes to light you can still leave/run.
Better not be a bingo club and you're blowing this out of proportion

reply to post by charles1952


does your club have a name? How can anyone tell you anything without all the information? I have had a few encounters with you Charles and I don't believe for a minute that you would be so easily sucked into anything but Christianity. I smell chum in the water. What are you fishing for Charles?

reply to post by SuicideBankers

Dear SuicideBankers,

Thanks for stopping by, this thing has me a little worried and I'm grateful for any help I can get.

Yes, the club has a name. I'd really run from a group that called itself "The Club." But I'm reluctant to give it becuase I'd rather not have people follow the same research path I did. Maybe it's secret (if it exists at all) for a good reason, and I'd be hurting it. I also have just a general hesitation to give any thing away which is held privately unless I know it needs to be exposed.

I have had a few encounters with you Charles and I don't believe for a minute that you would be so easily sucked into anything but Christianity.

Thanks for the huge compliment. Yep, I'm a big fan of Christianity. Are you suggesting that could be my blind spot? You could very well be right.

As far as the sucked in part goes, I was a member of Rotary 20 years ago. Ooops, it just came back to me, it was Kiwanis I was a member of. ("I have the hat to this day." Copyright, John Kerry. ) I saw groups like that as just community service groups with no possible ulterior motive.

And that's the point here. There are always some people that find sinister conspiracies in the Masons, or Knights of Columbus, or Kiwanis, or Odd Fellows, or anybody else, but for most of the population they're just a group of senior citizens putting on a pancake breakfast to raise money for the Girl Scouts.

I smell chum in the water. What are you fishing for Charles?

Again, I can't provide proof over the internet, but I don't have a fishing license. I don't have any hidden motive. I figure that ATS has a ton of experts on Secret Societies, and Conspiracies, and that makes them the best possible source for opinions. If I don't get any, fine, I'll just have to, as another poster suggested, "Go with my gut."

I suppose there's an infinitesimal chance that someone knows what I'm talking about. That would be like winning the lottery for me. But no, no hidden purpose.

With respect,
Charles1952

P.s. Let me tell you this. If there is a Circle B, and if I correctly understand it's purposes, it would be in support of part of what many posters here call the Illuminati. Gahhh! I hate that word. Just uttering it makes you sound like a kook. But that's how it's considered here. - C -

Originally posted by SuicideBankers
reply to post by charles1952

 

does your club have a name? How can anyone tell you anything without all the information? I have had a few encounters with you Charles and I don't believe for a minute that you would be so easily sucked into anything but Christianity. I smell chum in the water. What are you fishing for Charles?

The lack of information and especially the lack of a name is clearly a filter. Charles1952 cleverly has set up a means of getting an answer by which he can determine is from someone knowledgeable about the "circle B." What he doesn't know is if he can trust the answer if it is received. It's also much more likely to be answered in a personal email than openly in the posting if it should remain deeply secret. If this is a well known club, lack of any public answer is probably = "yes."

reply to post by EA006

Dear EA006,

I'm glad you stopped by. Let me add a little more that seems safe.

Better not be a bingo club and you're blowing this out of proportion

Even if it were a bingo club, if it was a front for the Mafia in the area, it would still be significant. But that's not the case. Setting a lower limit on these numbers, the club has at least 75,000 members, and operates in at least 40 states. As I say, I guarantee that it's more than that.

I think you should stay in the group, stop digging around and enjoy the benefits. If anything comes to light you can still leave/run.

Alright, I can do that. I don't know how to do any further digging in any case. (Of course, if you have a suggestion in that area, I'd be glad to give it a try.)

But what do you suggest if Circle B exists and I am being recruited? Or is it just to early to ask that question? I would like to prepare a little in advance if they do.

With respect,
Charles1952

Originally posted by charles1952
reply to post by EA006

 

Dear EA006,

I'm glad you stopped by. Let me add a little more that seems safe.

Better not be a bingo club and you're blowing this out of proportion

Even if it were a bingo club, if it was a front for the Mafia in the area, it would still be significant. But that's not the case. Setting a lower limit on these numbers, the club has at least 75,000 members, and operates in at least 40 states. As I say, I guarantee that it's more than that.

I think you should stay in the group, stop digging around and enjoy the benefits. If anything comes to light you can still leave/run.

Alright, I can do that. I don't know how to do any further digging in any case. (Of course, if you have a suggestion in that area, I'd be glad to give it a try.)

But what do you suggest if Circle B exists and I am being recruited? Or is it just to early to ask that question? I would like to prepare a little in advance if they do.

With respect,
Charles1952

Sinse you have been a member of many good organizations, you already know the answer to your question.

You will know it by it's fruits, Charles.

Interesting, i have a similar situation as you Charles.
I'm not about to steal your thread with my situation, ill make a thread someday.

But you got me wondering about my situation now. I'm gonna stick around for a while.

reply to post by charles1952


I was teasing ya on the Christianity thing. We had a very lively exchange over Muslim extremist a while back. I used to be TRGreer. back to the topic. I am no expert on secret societies but it seems to me if you dig deeper into your club I am sure you will find the answers you are looking for. I really don't want to throw out anymore advice without having more information. I will say this. You strike me as an intelligent man. A stubborn set in his way kind of guy who wouldn't be fooled easily. Trust your gut. I am confident you will be fine.

reply to post by BayesLike

Dear BayesLike,

The lack of information and especially the lack of a name is clearly a filter.

Except it's not.

Charles1952 cleverly has set up a means of getting an answer by which he can determine is from someone knowledgeable about the "circle B."

What I'm actually looking for is some idea of how to approach or consider this situation. I don't have any experience in this area, so I'm relying on ATSers to tell me things like, oh, I don't know, wear a wire to the next meeting? Or, go tell the prominent leader right away that I have no interest in Circle B if it exists? Or, swallow my principles, try to penetrate, and write a book to fund my retirement?

What he doesn't know is if he can trust the answer if it is received.

I'm primarily looking for advice and suggestions, not information. If somebody has information I doubt they would give it to me. Besides, I know which club I'm talking about, and the name of Circle B. What are they going to tell me?

It's also much more likely to be answered in a personal email than openly in the posting if it should remain deeply secret.

Ok, then, don't send me a U2U, just tell me, based on your experience, what you would suggest as a course of action.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by Siberbat

Dear Siberbat,

I'm really grateful to you and everybody else who offers their thoughts. I'm just not sure how to apply yours in this case.

You will know it by it's fruits, Charles.

That's what I'm having trouble with. I know the guys and their activities at the lowest level. That's all good stuff, a little disorganized and apathetic maybe, but still good guys. I know this to be true as I was their boss for awhile.

At the next higher level, we get reports and presentations, and they all look good. It seems like that level of organization may very well be just the same as the lowest level, except that more work, or decision making, or whatever you want to call it, seems to be in fewer hands.

At the next level up, who knows what they do? Again, reports and presentations, but that's about it. I know what they report they do, but what do they actually do? (Curse you ATS for turning me into a conspiracy theorist.) That's where Circle B exists, if it does. My point is I can't judge their fruits, because I don't know what they are at that level. I don't even know for certain if the fruits exist.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by shaneslaughta

Dear shaneslaughta,

Good idea. Stick around. You might very well be able to use the advice I get. Send me a message when you start your thread and I'll stop by.

With respect,
Charles1952

My gut tells me you are having fun with us.

Only because, as this story progresses, you give more romantic details that only points to dramatize your original inquiry.

My question is simple. Why would the members mention club b in the first place and then get evasive if you asked about it? I mean, wouldn't they just not mention openly that club b was an option?

Moreover, what would make you think that club b is anything out of the ordinary?

Isn't it possible that the other member was just pulling your leg? It is very cliche sarcasm to answer "Never ask about "BLANK" when questioning something secretive that you are on the outside circle of?

Just my thoughts. I have seen nothing here that indicates you should have any paranoia. Even so, if its true, nothing to indicate a reason you should be afraid.

If I'm wrong, don't take the red pill.

AAC

reply to post by charles1952


id go for it this may be your chance to see how far the rabbit hole goes, isnt the goal of most people here on ats?

reply to post by charles1952


Dear Charles,

I wouldn't worry too much, you know your motives for joining this society. Just stick to that principle and keep reminding yourself at any level...

I'll be following this thread to see what you come up with.

Peace

reply to post by AnAbsoluteCreation

Dear AnAbsoluteCreation,

I am really sorry that you think this is a joke. I value my reputation for honesty and integrity too highly to risk it for a brief chuckle over the Internet.

The things I have added are only because I didn't think of them at the start, and as people ask questions, things come to mind that didn't seem necessary in the OP. But I'd be happy to discuss or explain anything I've added.

My question is simple. Why would the members mention club b in the first place and then get evasive if you asked about it? I mean, wouldn't they just not mention openly that club b was an option?

Nobody's ever mentioned it to me. I don't know if I forgot to put it in earlier (I'm pretty sure I did) but I found out about Circle B when I was researching the club and Circle A, which are both public.

Moreover, what would make you think that club b is anything out of the ordinary?

I don't even know if it exists. I just found that Circle A and Circle B were considered at one time. Circle A was established and Circle B seems to have vanished. Maybe it is gone, maybe it's hiding.

Isn't it possible that the other member was just pulling your leg? It is very cliche sarcasm to answer "Never ask about "BLANK" when questioning something secretive that you are on the outside circle of?

Absolutely it's possible. As I said he's a crusty old guy with a lot of experience. I took him seriously, but I could have been wrong. Even if I was wrong, I still don't understand the prominent leader's comment about waiting until later.

I don't think I'm frightened, more concerned that I might have to make a decision I'm not prepared for. I'm hoping that ATSers will help prepare me.

If I'm wrong, don't take the red pill.

You might not believe this, but I've forgotten what the red pill is supposed to do.

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by DocHolidaze

Dear DocHolidaze,

Thanks. Finding out what it's all about is a strong temptation. I have to admit that the things I've done so far seem to be an attempt to "get inside." I asked the person I did at the lower level because he seemed to be most knowledgable of the club as a whole. And I must admit, I tried to get close to the prominent leader in order to ask my (maybe not so subtle) question.

But now I'm wondering. As with many other people here, sometimes you just don't want to know another secret. Then you become responsible, involved, and you have to keep it secret yourself. And that's even if it's a good secret. If it's a bad one, well, I can only imagine.

That's why I'm looking for guidance, and not trying to sniff out information on anybody or anything. If someone has made a similar decision and wants to tell if it was a good one or not, that would be helpful. But I don't want to hear that NSA partnered with Company X to monitor military radios in Country Y. (I already know that secret.)

With respect,
Charles1952

reply to post by charles1952


I would enquire into the progress of Circle C, and Circle D...since they are taking on the unfinished business of Circle B (wink, wink)...

"Circle C & D? As far as I know, there exists no C & D?!"

Charles1952
"Oh, then I must be mistaken, I could've sworn I overheard that conversation" (Charles1952 quizzically puts his forefinger to his temple)

"What conversation?"

Charles1952
"The one that mentioned C & D tying the loose ends of B"

"Mmm...interesting"

Bond...Akushla Bond