Two-thirds fear 'clash of civilisations' in wake of Woolwich murder

I posted a Thread couple weeks ago entitled 'The Clash Of All Clashes'. I'm pretty sure some you remember this Thread. Well, as this Poll suggests, it looks like this Clash is very close indeed, after the Woolwich Attack on Wednesday.... this shows in the report on this site:

www.guardian.co.uk...

The Poll also suggests that British Muslims pose a serious threat to democracy!

Nearly two-thirds of people believe there will be a 'clash of civilisations' between British Muslims and white Britons in the wake of the murder of a British soldier in Woolwich, a new poll shows.

The number of those who believe such a clash is inevitable has increased by 9% from last year.

There has also been a small increase in the proportion of people who believe British Muslims pose a serious threat to democracy, up to 34% on Thursday and Friday from 30% in November 2012, according to the YouGov survey of 1,839 adults.

The poll will fuel concern of an explosion of race hate, with one interfaith charity reporting a huge increase in anti-Muslim incidents since the murder of soldier Lee Rigby in south-east London on Wednesday.

Faith Matters, which runs a helpline, said they had received 162 calls since the attack, up from a daily average of six.

I would like to point out that the typical pie eating guy provided on the link is of no representation of the British Public! I have to ask why the media decided to put him as the main photo? Why not the average guy who wears a suit? Also, I wonder if by posting this guy on the link, is there another Agenda here? To get people to hate EDL even more???

Anyway, as i said in my Thread www.guardian.co.uk...

I think the Clash is coming.

I will admit that racial tension is definitely on the rise in Briton but I'm curious what type of clash you think is coming.

Will it be gang fights in the street or will the parliament kick out muslims?

I doubt the latter will happen and the former will not change anything so........

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


I would venture that it will be more along the lines of a "Clash of Cultures". We are and have been for some time now exactly that as the world gets smaller, through tech and easier access to transportation (illegal or legally).

But yep, it's coming.

reply to post by Hopechest


How long will it take until we see a party similar to the Norsefire party (From V for Vendetta) coming? In the movie it is explicitly stated they took over by blaming Muslims and other undesirables for all the problems they supposedly started

the photos of the slain soldier, all carefully selected to be shown attired in the regalia of 'the crown'

Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by Hopechest

 

How long will it take until we see a party similar to the Norsefire party (From V for Vendetta) coming? In the movie it is explicitly stated they took over by blaming Muslims

edit on 25-5-2013 by starwarsisreal because: (no reason given)

That could very well happen. You could see an anti-muslim faction grow in power, picking up more and more seats....history tells us that this is how major changes come about in politics...its how the Nazi's gained power and how the Civil Rights movement in America gained traction.

Not any one big event but rather a slow and steady progress. If tensions in Briton keep on rising then I would expect this to be a major issue in each election over the coming decade.

It is more than plausible that an anti-muslim sentiment could become established at the political level in the UK. However, there is only so much a modern day industrialized nation can do without reverting back to what we would not consider barbaric national policies.

Will we ever see something like the Japanese internment camps the US instituted during WWII...I highly doubt it. Will the UK round up all muslims and pack them onto ships and drop them off somewhere?

Doubtful.

Will they tighten up immigration policies? Very possible.

There is only so much action that the UK could take on this issue at a political level I believe. Anything further and they would risk alienating themselves from the rest of the world.

Originally posted by Hopechest
I will admit that racial tension is definitely on the rise in Briton but I'm curious what type of clash you think is coming.

Will it be gang fights in the street or will the parliament kick out muslims?

I doubt the latter will happen and the former will not change anything so........

I would hazard a guess and say 'Race Wars' or 'People Against Islam'.

It has been brewing for years and as this Poll suggests, is nearly here..... I think Demo's are being held soon which will escalate into something more

Originally posted by Hopechest
I will admit that racial tension is definitely on the rise in Briton but I'm curious what type of clash you think is coming.

Will it be gang fights in the street or will the parliament kick out muslims?

I doubt the latter will happen and the former will not change anything so........

I am NOT advocating this but it HAS happened before.
Many times.

Groups of people have been chucked out of Britain and Western Europe - that is a fact.
The British were more or less kicked out of Africa and India.

Unfortunately, in Europe- it last happened very recently[ in relative history] in Germany and we all know that story.

Which then led to another displacement of peoples in the middle east and we all know that story.

France have been kicking out the Roma, as recently as last year.

So do not be so certain in your conclusions.

Addit: The muslims have been kicked out of Europe more then once.

Originally posted by HelenConway

Originally posted by Hopechest
I will admit that racial tension is definitely on the rise in Briton but I'm curious what type of clash you think is coming.

Will it be gang fights in the street or will the parliament kick out muslims?

I doubt the latter will happen and the former will not change anything so........

I am NOT advocating this but it HAS happened before.
Groups of people have been chucked out of Britain and Western Europe - that is a fact.
Unfortunately it last happened very recently in Germany and we all know that story.
France have been kicking out the Roma, as recently as last year.
So do not be so certain in your conclusions.

Actually a more recent example would be Bosnia with the Serbs and Croats going at it.

I do not see the issue in the UK escalating to this level. It is true that in the past many of the Western European powers did engage in this type of behavior but times have changed.

I do not live in the UK so I don't have my pulse on the actual level of tension there, I can only theorize from an intellectual point of view, so perhaps it is getting so bad overthere that clashes may happen at anytime. I know that these clashes can also spread like wildfire if the wind is blowing just right so I'm not saying it is impossible for the UK to ignite but I think calmer heads will ultimately prevail.

reply to post by Hopechest


Very true and they were a settled population of muslims since an invasion in the 1300s ish

It's going to start eventually. Might as well be now.

Like Aeron says in The Chronicles of Riddick.

'In normal times, evil would be fought with good. But in times like these, well, it should be fought by another kind of evil.'

reply to post by Hopechest


When the economy collapse I'm pretty sure the Fascists wouldn't care less when they do their campaign of persecution against the Muslims which happened in 1930s when Nazi Germany persecuted the Jews without any issue in the 30s (While there are some condemnations it is very largely ineffective due to many factors) In the international community at this time would be distracted by many issues. In fact look at the recent headlines in other parts of the world especially Asia. I'm pretty sure when the fireworks started the international community wouldn't care less about Fascists rising to power.

reply to post by HelenConway


History is a great tool to use when looking at issues such as this. Muslims and Western Europe have a very long history of integration, invasion, and expulsion. They have pushed and settled as far as Spain and then the anti-muslim settlement has pushed them back into the ME.

This was one of the myriad of reasons the Crusades were fought. The Ottoman Empire pushed deep in Europe before they were pushed back so there are definitely larger trends here at work and the situation in the UK looks to me to be a repeat of history.

However, the advent of globalization has added a whole new factor to this trend. How do you push back a people in today's age without global reprecussions affecting your country in a negative way?

Originally posted by starwarsisreal
reply to post by Hopechest

 

When the economy collapse I'm pretty sure the Fascists wouldn't care less when they do their campaign of persecution against the Muslims which happened in 1930s when Nazi Germany persecuted the Jews without any issue in the 30s (While there are some condemnations it is very largely ineffective due to many factors) In the international community at this time would be distracted by many issues. In fact look at the recent headlines in other parts of the world especially Asia. I'm pretty sure when the fireworks started the international community wouldn't care less about Fascists rising to power.

You are absolutely correct in your assessment of the past but today's economic collapse is not and can't be blamed on the Muslim population. It has been directed at the banking system, other financial institutions, and the politicians themselves.

Originally posted by Hopechest
reply to post by HelenConway

 

History is a great tool to use when looking at issues such as this. Muslims and Western Europe have a very long history of integration, invasion, and expulsion. They have pushed and settled as far as Spain and then the anti-muslim settlement has pushed them back into the ME.

This was one of the myriad of reasons the Crusades were fought. The Ottoman Empire pushed deep in Europe before they were pushed back so there are definitely larger trends here at work and the situation in the UK looks to me to be a repeat of history.

However, the advent of globalization has added a whole new factor to this trend. How do you push back a people in today's age without global reprecussions affecting your country in a negative way?

edit on 25-5-2013 by Hopechest because: (no reason given)

Good point - but history also teaches us that things change - and sometimes very quickly.

reply to post by starwarsisreal


Talking of Asia, I also saw this headline: 'Two child limit for muslims'. This is in Burma. I think people are starting to realize the problems will arise, if population growth of one Minority begin to takeover and fights occur.

www.guardian.co.uk...

There's been things happening in Sweden too but I won't go into that in this Thread.

But anyway, I don't want this Thread to go off Topic about Burma. I'm just pointing something out in reference to what you said.

Originally posted by Hopechest
reply to post by HelenConway

 

. How do you push back a people in today's age without global reprecussions affecting your country in a negative way?

edit on 25-5-2013 by Hopechest because: (no reason given)

Good point but things can change swiftly, especially when things get heated, such as with recent events.

We are also being told that Abu is being funded by the Tax-payer... do you think this will incite Anger and Resentment more? Yes, it will.

We also have the Germans coming over today for the Champions League Final. I wonder if trouble will be kicking off.

I'm beginning to wonder if all this has been planned.

Originally posted by HelenConway

Originally posted by Hopechest
reply to post by HelenConway

 

History is a great tool to use when looking at issues such as this. Muslims and Western Europe have a very long history of integration, invasion, and expulsion. They have pushed and settled as far as Spain and then the anti-muslim settlement has pushed them back into the ME.

This was one of the myriad of reasons the Crusades were fought. The Ottoman Empire pushed deep in Europe before they were pushed back so there are definitely larger trends here at work and the situation in the UK looks to me to be a repeat of history.

However, the advent of globalization has added a whole new factor to this trend. How do you push back a people in today's age without global reprecussions affecting your country in a negative way?

edit on 25-5-2013 by Hopechest because: (no reason given)

Good point - but history also teaches us that things change - and sometimes very quickly.

Absolutely.

The world is always walking the edge of complete chaos and it is dependent on an overall general feeling, especially among major powers, that could be set off by the smallest events.

I liken it to a balloon filling with air. Eventually so much gets in there that a simple pin prick can make it explode. It is rather obvious that anti-muslim sentiment has been rapidly growing since the 9/11 attack and that particular balloon is filling quite quickly.

If this continues you may see something like the kidnap of a little British girl by a muslim man set the whole country off on a rampage and if this sentiment has been growing in other european countries they may explode also.

This is in effect how WWI started. It wasn't just because of the assassination of the Archduke, that was only the event that released the tensions.

Stop being so alarmist

I live next door to Luton in a mainly white christian community all be it a rough area, armed police are walking the streets in Luton, one of the largest Muslim communities in Britain

No tension here, no thoughts of retribution for a couple of nutters with a knife that lost the plot.

Just life as normal

Cody

My wife works in a school that is about 70% British Muslim 25% British Christian and 5% immigrants.

The kids are closer now than ever, it's amazing to see.

Source ? Life experience and truth

Cody