Turtles, snakes and lizards head toward extinction

This is really stunning. 1/3 of reptiles, some of the longest surviving species on the planet, are nearing extinction.

NBC News

Nearly one fifth of all reptiles — turtles, snakes, lizards and crocodiles — are on a slippery slope toward extinction due to loss of habitat, overharvesting and other factors, a new report says.

The study is the first of its kind to summarize the global conservation status of reptiles. More than 1,500 species were selected at random from around the world for conservation assessments in an effort to gain a representative sample.

The results highlight "conservation priorities and knowledge gaps which need to be addressed urgently to ensure the continued survival of the world’s reptiles," more than 200 researchers led by Monika Böhm at the Zoological Society of London write today in the journal Biological Conservation.

The study is linked above and is quite startling if you ask me. We always hear of endangered species but hardly ever about these particular animals.

I don't expect this to be seen as drastically important by the general population or government however. We as humans have a pretty crappy record of conservation to begin with.

Thoughts ATS?

~Tenth

reply to post by tothetenthpower


Not to sound cruel towards animals, but is it not inevitable that a species which lacks the ability to survive in an ever changing environment will be wiped out, and the one more suited to live in such an environment flourish?

I mean if the human race survives for another thousand years there is not going to be any "natural" environments left for the majority of reptiles, birds, and mammals to live in. This is just the result of us existing. Now these animals "will" be able to live on in some capacity, as we will and do provide areas for these animals to live both for our own utility, enjoyment, and some small sliver of what one may call morality.

Sorry turtles but the destruction of the land you live on could mean fields of rice to feed starving humans.

reply to post by Openeye


Strange how all this decline only starting occurring since the industrial revolution.

Not to sound cruel towards animals, but is it not inevitable that a species which lacks the ability to survive in an ever changing environment will be wiped out, and the one more suited to live in such an environment flourish?

But some of these species have been around for MILLIONS of years. Far longer than any human. Or at least that we know of.

Sorry turtles but the destruction of the land you live on could mean fields of rice to feed starving humans.

No, mostly it means developing projects that line the pockets of rich people and keep money out of the mouths of the poor .

But I see your point. We can do a far better job at conservation. The planet is a big place, and 9 Billion people is a drop in the bucket.

~Tenth

reply to post by tothetenthpower


it kind of has me wondering how much the pet trade has to do with this, reptiles are particularly tough animals and I would expect the to be not doing well but managing seeing as what theyve gone through, though im no expert. but at the pet stores i see alot of exotic reptiles and with the exception of some geckos, anoles and bearded dragons most are taken from the wild not bred in captivity. but the pet trade could help keep the species alive after the habitiat is gone

reply to post by tothetenthpower

Strange how all this decline only starting occurring since the industrial revolution.

Because that's when humans discovered the technology that allows us to live longer and live more comfortably. Sorry if the priorities of the only thinking beings on this planet capable of actually observing, and explaining the universe are higher on the importance scale than a gecko.

But some of these species have been around for MILLIONS of years. Far longer than any human. Or at least that we know of.

So, that does not mean they are more important than a human child who could grow up to invent a teleportation device.

Roaches have been around for much longer than us. Do they have a greater right to life?

If we have to sacrifice a portion of a species to sustain are own then so be it, but if the turtles develop language and reasoning skills (unlikely) and actually start telling us to stop maybe I would change my position.

No, mostly it means developing projects that line the pockets of rich people and keep money out of the mouths of the poor.

Is that what this study proves, or is this simply emotional conjecture on your part?

But I see your point. We can do a far better job at conservation. The planet is a big place, and 9 Billion people is a drop in the bucket.

We could actually put some money into some pseudo-terra forming projects to turn the deserts of this world into lush biospheres, however this wont happen anytime soon.

If we don't find a way to expand off this planet we will just have to accept that animals are not as important as we are, and prioritize accordingly.

doen't forget man

reply to post by Openeye

Because that's when humans discovered the technology that allows us to live longer and live more comfortably. Sorry if the priorities of the only thinking beings on this planet capable of actually observing, and explaining the universe are higher on the importance scale than a gecko.

You don't know that animals aren't capable of self observation. We simply do not have the ability to communicate. That does not mean they have nothing to say.

Recent studies have shown that animals one some level, seem to be just as sentient as we are.

Source

There are many more.

Is that what this study proves, or is this simply emotional conjecture on your part?

Not emotional conjecture. Please show me how the destruction of the rain forest has helped the native populations? Large scale projects that involve large scale destruction for the environment are always negative.

If we don't find a way to expand off this planet we will just have to accept that animals are not as important we are, and prioritize accordingly.

What most fail to realize is that animals and insects play a vital role in the health of our current environment.

I'm not disagreeing with looking outwards to find other places to settle, but I certainly disagree that we should just cast our environmental responsibilities aside. Especially considering that we haven't really needed to destroy our environment to live properly.

We simply chose to do so, because it was more convenient and easy, not because it was the only choice.

~Tenth

I feel really bad that we are creating the chemicals that are doing this. Global warming is not the cause of most of these extinctions. We are overfishing the ocean and killing the great forests that regulate the weather and support these other creatures. I wish I could do more than complain and watch what I do that contributes towards this destruction. I no longer desire to buy anything that I do not need and have self examined what my needs really are.

S&F for spreading the word.

reply to post by tothetenthpower

You don't know that animals aren't capable of self observation. We simply do not have the ability to communicate. That does not mean they have nothing to say.

Recent studies have shown that animals one some level, seem to be just as sentient as we are.

Sure animals are conscious, this does not mean they have the same mental capacities that we posses which are what make us superior and more important.

If they could use logic they would be capable of creating hierarchical languages, they would also be able to use reason, and thus be able to express some form of empathy. So far the only animals (other than humans) to express anything close to this are higher primates, and arguably some aquatic mammals.

Therefore, the male lion who would kills its own cubs, or the birds who watch members of their own flock be torn apart by a predator who could easily be overpowered by the group should not be placed on the same pedestal as human beings, who while capable of great "evil" have accomplished more as species in ten thousand years than they will ever accomplish because of their unfortunate evolutionary development.

Not emotional conjecture. Please show me how the destruction of the rain forest has helped the native populations?.

Well I never mentioned the rain forest. I also never said that us humans are not capable of doing harm.

Large scale projects that involve large scale destruction for the environment are always negative.

Not true, look at modern cities.

What most fail to realize is that animals and insects play a vital role in the health of our current environment.

Yes they do. The Great Leap Forward was great example of how the killing off of a species can effect the ecosystem. I have not been advocating for the destruction of animals. I have been advocating for the prioritizing of the survival of our species over another one.

I'm not disagreeing with looking outwards to find other places to settle, but I certainly disagree that we should just cast our environmental responsibilities aside. Especially considering that we haven't really needed to destroy our environment to live properly.

Well considering that our way of life today is vastly superior to anything that we have had in the past I would disagree with you. How else are 300 million people supposed to live in the united states without the system we have in place?

We simply chose to do so, because it was more convenient and easy, not because it was the only choice.

The hard way is not always the best way. In fact, the easier it is for a species to eat, have shelter, and multiply the more likely it is to survive. Correct?

ETA: IMO eventually this planet will become I giant mega city with "artificial" everything, i.e. trees, bee drones, bird drones, and tones of cloned animal food product.

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reply to post by tothetenthpower


Stunning. Scary. Makes me wonder why "habitat loss" isn't routinely evaluated for humans - our adaptations are not so great, as evidenced by the chronic disease pandemic. ...which is not to say that space exploration looking for a new planet to pollute is any answer.

S&F&

Hardy reptiles with environmental adaptability traits will thrive and conquer, i've heard some have specialised and are so in tuned with human society they have actually become Royalty.

reply to post by tothetenthpower
Whoever came up with the 1/3 number definitely didn't conduct any studies on my property. It's not even March yet and I've already had 2 snakes cross my path and the lizards never hid out this winter. Also the last time I went fishing at the river (less than 2 months ago- my dad dragged me) there was absolutely no shortage of alligators and turtles took my bait several times.

Maybe the lessening number of reptiles in some parts of the world is due to their breeding places being destroyed (developed by humans). In the woods behind my neighbor's house there is a shallow pond where every year many thousands of water moccasins gather to mate. There are so many snakes that you can hardly see the water due to the wiggling and writhing. It is quite a sight to see, but I wouldn't want to fall in! Before I saw it for myself I never realized that they returned to the same place every year to mate. I guess I should have paid more attention in my science classes.

I've seen an increasing number of rabbits, snakes, small green lizards, and more recently large red lizards. I don't care for snakes but I like seeing the lizards because I believe they will eat up any bugs around my house. I suspect all the monkey grass and other vegetation I have growing all over my yard has attracted a number of reptiles and possibly a rabbit at times, plus more birds than I care for. I suspect I'm seeing all this increased activity because my neighbors yards are pretty barren compared to mine. My immediate neighbors never even planted a single tree in their yards.

We don't have to sacrifice one for the other (sustainability for progress), that's the real kick in the teeth. We don't have to flatten millions of acres to grow food and cities don't have to be barren of non human life to flourish. 'Dead' soil produces nutritionally deficient food and we don't need 10 million chemicals to keep pests off them or our homes for that matter. We don't even have to wait for these things, we have the knowledge and the ability to do these things now, sadly it all gets lost in politics because the corporations behind the politics have to keep getting richer.

Herpetologists have been working towards slowing this trend for years. We have seen it coming and have done what we can in regards to the species hurting the most but it doesn't seem to be doing much good. We get one species to a positive level just to have to work on another. The loss of habitat is a major problem but it comes down to the ignorance of man that makes it all the harder to fix.

Herps (reptiles and amphibians) are a resilient bunch and can adapt to changing climates better than most people understand. This is why they have been able to survive on this planet as long as they have. Species have developed many different ways to deal with the changing environment from being able to be frozen solid and thaw back to life or to be able to survive direct contact with fire by producing an enzyme that protects them from flame.

Those that state that they are not needed within our world just do not understand how things work in the natural world and how reptiles can actually protect us from extinction. If they actually stop and think about some things they just might get how important Herps are to mankind and almost all the other species on this planet. For one moment, stop and think about what makes up the vast majority of reptiles food source. The answer is insects and rodents. Then stop and think about what the leading cause of plague spreading is. The answer is the same, insects and rodents. With the extinction of reptiles comes mass disease.

Yes, man can create more poisons to combat this, but in doing this it simply changes what kills us off. The fact remains that herps play a major role in maintaining workable levels of insects and rodents on Earth. Yes, birds also help in the maintaining of workable levels in both insects and rodents and there are other species that eat insects, bats for example, but they too are in a decline due to loss of habitat and hunting/breading grounds.

The only way to save mankind is to realize the balance that is nature and to let go of their arrogance and ignorance in what makes this a planet of life and not simply a rock flying through the universe. It is the stupid fears and dislikes of herps that has caused a lot of the issue as well as the destruction of habitats that has forced them to encroach into society.

The pet trade has added to this situation greatly as well. Instead of the herps being in the wild helping to maintain insect and rodent levels they are kept in cages and feed from another sector of capitalism. Breeders are breeding insects and rodents to feed these captive herps which bring to the world even more insects and rodents than are produced in nature so the population is growing out of control on both ends while their predators are beginning to go extinct.

So unless man decides to add insects and rodents to the mainstream diet, it is high time to address the situation of the extinction of what is basically our last line of defense against global plagues.

reply to post by tothetenthpower

reply to post by Openeye


For the past 18 months I have been working on the Gorgon Project, a oil & gas joint venture in the north West cape region of Western Australia.

The Kellogg Group, headed by Chevron, spent many years and millions of dollars lobbying the federal government for rights to exploration and eventual drilling the area for the resources.

In being granted those rights, significant environmental considerations for the protection of marine fauna and flora were imposed and the entire project is overseen by AQIS (Australian Quarantine Inspection service).

Barrow Island is at the centre of this project and any consequential use of her land has strict guidelines which must be adhered to. She is home to Whale Sharks, Dolphins, Dugongs, Turtles and many other protected species. My vessel, and all others working in the region had to have special fit-outs of lighting (yellow spectrum) to ensure the Turtles are protected and the impact on their natural environment minimised/eliminated.

There is a common understanding between all parties involved in the project that the protection of these species takes precedence over all other considerations, commercial or otherwise.

Chevron has done a fantastic job in this regard and continues to do so. They work very closely with AQIS on a daily basis.

Chevrons final tender documents were so impressive mainly due to the fact that what the government required in order to be awarded the contract was not only met, but exceeded.

For instance, all marine personal have undergone specialised training to become Marine Fauna Observers (MFO's) and daily observation, lighting and waste reports are submitted to AQIS - this is just one aspect.

This project is a good example of how, if we all work together, we can benefit not only ourselves but protect the other living creatures that we share this planet with.

(The underlined sections above are for your further consideration, unfortunately I am on satellite uplink so providing actual links so too time consuming)

S&F tenth

Darn it why is everything on my "Things I want to eat before I die" list heading for extinction?

Funny how all the people who push evolution as a fact, are the same to freak out when natural selection is observed.

Originally posted by tothetenthpower
This is really stunning. 1/3 of reptiles, some of the longest surviving species on the planet, are nearing extinction.

NBC News

Nearly one fifth of all reptiles — turtles, snakes, lizards and crocodiles — are on a slippery slope toward extinction due to loss of habitat, overharvesting and other factors, a new report says.

The study is the first of its kind to summarize the global conservation status of reptiles. More than 1,500 species were selected at random from around the world for conservation assessments in an effort to gain a representative sample.

The results highlight "conservation priorities and knowledge gaps which need to be addressed urgently to ensure the continued survival of the world’s reptiles," more than 200 researchers led by Monika Böhm at the Zoological Society of London write today in the journal Biological Conservation.

The study is linked above and is quite startling if you ask me. We always hear of endangered species but hardly ever about these particular animals.

I don't expect this to be seen as drastically important by the general population or government however. We as humans have a pretty crappy record of conservation to begin with.

Thoughts ATS?

~Tenth

edit on 2/15/2013 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)

VICTORY!!!

We have finally defeated the earth ruling reptiles. took us a few hundred million years but we persevered and emerged victorious once again.

Soon the entire Galaxy will learn of our dominance... then the UNIVERSE.

I will celebrate tonight with the finest snake wine and my electric fly swatter!