Homeopathy is 'rubbish', says chief medical officer

Does it matter to this 'medical official' that Homeopathy works or not as long as it heals?
Of course not because they are in th pockets of big pharma and their poisonous agenda.
Homeopathy whether or not it is a genuine remedy or a 'placebo' is moot as long as people get well isn't it?
I for one DO NOT believe anything doctors say anymore because they are more often than not PAID to tell you what you NEED to get well, and I call BS on that, flu shots to prevent flu, then you get flu is a big giveaway that regular 'medicine' is the real con.

I believe that even IF homeopathy is fake or not its all in the mind of the patient anyway, maybe I'm one of the lucky ones but I have convinced myself to the point of not having to say to myself " I won't get unwell today, I AM healthy " to the point of its so ingrained that I KNOW it to be true, any colds I get last an hour and that includes ALL symptoms, sniffly nose, sneezing and cough, so much so that during my last job I didn't have a day off sick for 2 years even though an office environment is rife with people coming in and passing on colds ( Bstards).

IF it makes a person well isn't THAT the point of MEDICAL SERVICES? or is it just about the money, besides why cure people, that wont mean a profit to the pharma companies, more money is made in keeping the problem going than curing it, I also believe that a cure for cancer and the common cold has been found but there is no profit in curing a disease.

reply to post by snowspirit

You were describing, as you rightly suspected, vaccination, not homoeopathy.

Homoeopathy is based on a premise that 'like cures like' meaning a substance that causes a set of symptoms in a healthy human being cures the same when consumed by a person exhibiting the same symptoms before consuming it. This was discovered by observation, hypothesis and experimentation by Samuel Hahneman, who was a conventional physician himself. He also noticed that the effectiveness of the medicine increased as he started diluting it, a discovery that was quite accidental. He termed this potentisation. Since then the process of potentisation has been taken to a level where not a single moelcule of the original substance can be expected to be found in a commonly administered homoeopathic medicine. This is the reason why conventional thinking finds it exteremely difficult to accept the idea that it works and equates it to placebo. But the efficacy of potentisation has been tested over time and found to be valid by all homoeopathic practitioners.

There is no explamation, in strictly convetional terms, for why homoeopathy works. So conventional thinkers to dismiss it as placebo.

reply to post by OccamsRazor04


Gave you a star as I agree with the chief medical officer statement, at the same time I think you are being too simplistic in:

Homeopathetic remedies work as well as a packet of sugar.

Its all about the power of self delusion, hypnosis, faith. You can will yourself to die (nocebo) you can will yourself to live (placebo) the limitation is the same as the effect on reality that you can exert with your brain.

I see no advantage in attempting to demolishing other peoples delusions if they are beneficial for them and cause you no harm.

Originally posted by DataWraith
Of course not because they are in th pockets of big pharma and their poisonous agenda.

It is more than Big Pharma. Many involved do not have to be bribed by anyone to denounce Homoeopathy, like some of the posters on this thread.

To a conventional mind, it is impossible for Homoeopathy to work, simply because all homoeopathic medicines (other than mother tinctures which are rarely prescribed) are exact chemical equivalents of each other. To admit to it working is to admit to miracles or a serious lack of understanding of how life operates, both of which they are loathe to.

Originally posted by Panic2k11
Its all about the power of self delusion, hypnosis, faith. You can will yourself to die (nocebo) you can will yourself to live (placebo) the limitation is the same as the effect on reality that you can exert with your brain.

If the person actually gets better, it is not delusion. You may call it suggestion, but not delusion.

Incidentally it is not necessary for a patient taking a homoeopathic medince to know that it is medince (placebo) for it work. Otherwise I am not sure how veterinary homoeopaths, would be communicating that to the animals.

reply to post by ollncasino

And it is true. Anyone with half a brain cell will know that if they research the topic. There is not a single molecule left of the so called active ingredient after the dillution has been done.
So how could it even work??? It is just not possible.

Originally posted by Amanda5
reply to post by ollncasino

 

Well it does stand to reason that the established members of society would have this opinion. There are many many regular people who turn to homeopathy and state that it works. I imagine the establishment need to keeps the pharmaceutical money coming in and telling the public that something does not work is a tactic they are willing to try.

Long gone are the days that anything a government spokesperson stated was taken as up front truth. Should people want to engage in homeopathy as a option - so be it - freedom of choice for all!

Much Peace...

But now instead we have people who take everything they say as a lie even when it is the damn truth.
And placebos work as well.. The placebo effect has been documented long ago.

Originally posted by Honor93
reply to post by OccamsRazor04

 

i do understand.
homeopathic medicine is NOT dangerous

nor is it comparable to a placebo, regardless what this paid mouthpiece says.

it is all of the above because no 'study' was actually performed.
opinion is hardly a study and where's the source 'evidence' ??

in case you didn't read the OP, there is no 'study' included or a link to one.
it is an OPINION piece, nothing more.

rubber and glue, which are you ?

But there has been plenty of studies done in the past that all came to that very same conclusion.
And how is it not dangerous if you have naive people who think that it might cure diseases that will lead to your death if left untreated??
Plenty of people have died due to homeopathy already including young children because their parents were so naive they refused real treatment.

reply to post by Observor

Homoeopathy is based on a premise that 'like cures like' meaning a substance that causes a set of symptoms in a healthy human being cures the same when consumed by a person exhibiting the same symptoms before consuming it.

So I'm half right.
The vaccines work on the premise that the body builds immunity by giving a bit of a virus, to build an immunity to the same virus.
It sounds as though the homeopathic substances have been diluted so much that they don't think they should work.
It's still like cures like, just diluted.

I don't do flu vaccines, I got talked into a measles shot in college, and woke up with red spots everywhere that I had to cover with makeup for a week so I could continue classes

I've seen people get the flu shot and get sick the next day also. Sick for weeks.
Maybe if they diluted flu or measles vaccines more, less people would get the flu or spots after getting the shot?

reply to post by Observor

If the person actually gets better, it is not delusion. You may call it suggestion, but not delusion.

Disagree, you are implying that a causal relation exists, and it does not. Because I do XPTO I get RTPY when dealing with creed, faith or delusions that manifest outcomes in reality. It is not because you did XPTO but because your internal mind-map of reality changed so that the RTPY outcome would be promoted, this is why religion, faith and hypnosis is stronger when the desired RTPY outcomes is strictly on the mental plain and why they do not get proper validation about being useful in object reality.

Mind over matter exists only on the eye of the beholder and that there is a indisputable relation between mind and body has been long proven scientifically to exist (even if not fully understood).

Originally posted by snowspirit
I was under the assumption that homeopathy was about taking a tiny bit of a substance to trigger the body to heal.
Or taking a tiny bit of a substance to build your immune system.

I must be completely wrong and will take the time to go and reread exactly how it's supposed to work.

Maybe I'm thinking about vaccines, because that's how they say they're supposed to work.
By my logic, if a vaccine works, so does homeopathy

This is exactly how they claim it works. Only problem is that it is dilluted so many times that here is not a SINGLE molecule left of the substance that they originally put in there. When you take homepoathic "medicine" it is nothing but pure water.

reply to post by snowspirit

Not quite. Vaccines are administered to healthy people and homoeopathic medicines on people who are afflicted.

The process of potentisation (which keeps reducing the quantity of the the substance until there is nothing left in the nomrally administered potencies) is expensive, since it takes a lot of effort and discarding all intermediate potencies. If it indeed did not result in increasing the efficacy of the drug, why would they keep doing it, especially because that is what the detractors hold against it? Why not start administering mother tinctures, potency 1 (100 time sdilution) or potency 2 (10,000 times dilution) instead of the 6, 30, 100, M, CM, DM potencies that are common?

Yes they think anything that a person can do to improve their health without spending a fortune with them is rubbish. It's understandable and predictable of them. Lets say it's a placebo and people are getting well off of sugar pills, so what as long as they get well which should be the focus.

This information comes from people that have made a world wide, multi-trillion dollar business of using modern medicine to keep billions of people perpetually sick and dependent upon drugs.
Snake oil comes in many forms.

My dad uses natural medicines and in my entire lifetime I don't remember him ever once getting so much as a cold. If he's never been sick, he must be doing something right.

Originally posted by Chai_An
Yes they think anything that a person can do to improve their health without spending a fortune with them is rubbish. It's understandable and predictable of them. Lets say it's a placebo and people are getting well off of sugar pills, so what as long as they get well which should be the focus.

But what about those that do not get well from a placebo??? Like lets say you have some naive parents with a very ill child and then decides to go for homeopathy instead when there are real treatments that actually works?? This actually happens in real life...
I dont understand why this is so hard for you believers to understand.

And why are you still acting like it is wrong to call it a placebo when all studies show that this is the case??
There is not even a single logical reason why it should work since there is no damn active ingredient in any of those homeopathy bottles. They all contain just water and nothing else.
So please explain how drinking pure water could even do anything more than a placebo does?

Originally posted by trollz
My dad uses natural medicines and in my entire lifetime I don't remember him ever once getting so much as a cold. If he's never been sick, he must be doing something right.

I wonder why he even needed to take natural medicines if he never ever got ill.
And some people have better immune systems than others...

Homeopathy is 'rubbish', says chief medical officer,

Oh really, how shocking!

Basic marketing right here folks!

"Chief medical officer" of course makes no money on people choosing homeopathy as that is not the ware he is peddling, but rather the alternative, alleopathy.

Why is this even ATS worthy?

Originally posted by Pardon?

I certainly can't disagree with the findings OP.
Homeopathy is the "emperor's new clothes" of the natural medicine world.

For the poster above who says it works on a quantum level, oh please. You're deluding yourself.

Yeah I and millions of others are deluding ourselves who have seen he results of homeopathy while idiots continue to pump themselves and their children with poisons at the behest of false authorities on medicines...Sigh

The study was cut short and altered to fit the outcome those who funded it wanted:

The terms-of-reference for the PEK study stated that the results of the study would determine which complementary medicines, if any, would continue to be supported by the national insurance program in Switzerland. However, before the study was completed and the final draft report reviewed by the international Review Board, the government announced that it would withdraw support for all complementary approaches to medicine.[5]
Considerable uproar followed, including protests from many scientists involved in the study (including the scientific director of the program) about political interference in the scientific process:[5]
"The international review board of PEK has publicly protested at political interference in the scientific process."[6]
"There is a consensus among the review board members that the final PEK process deviated from what would have been expected by conventional standards."[7]
[edit]ECH evaluation of PEK report
According to the European Committee for Homeopathy's evaluation of the PEK report,[8] the results were, for the government, surprisingly positive towards complementary medicines. According to the ECH evaluation:
The PEK study showed that the quality of homeopathic care was superior to that of conventional care. This difference could not be explained by the seriousness of the illnesses, because homeopathic doctors saw even more seriously and chronically ill people. (Page 2)
Whereas the authors of the overall PEK report drew the conclusion that there is sufficient evidence for the effectiveness of homeopathy, the authors of the meta-analysis came to a different conclusion. This seems rather odd, because both groups of authors based their conclusions on the same extensive literature search and predefined inclusion criteria. (Page 4)
The Swiss Association of Homeopathic Doctors (SVHÄ) highly criticizes the PEK report and asserts that the study has serious flaws. (Page 5)
The meta-analysis was conducted at the Department of Social and Preventive Medicine (ISPM) of the Bern University, under the direction of Prof. Dr Matthias Egger. The ISPM did not include any expert from the field of homeopathy. It was not before January 2005 that homeopathic experts were allowed to peruse the meta-analysis. ISPM Director Prof Egger repeatedly has pronounced his conviction that homeopathy cannot be effective because its working mechanism is implausible. This does not seem to be a particularly unbiased position. (Page 6)
Although homeopathy and other CAM therapies proved to be cost-effective and may save millions of Swiss Francs on the health budget, the Swiss government decided to exclude all CAM therapies from the compulsory health insurance scheme as from 30 June 2005. (Page 6)
A conference scheduled for April 2005 to present and discuss the results of the PEK was cancelled because the National Health Office suppressed the publication of the study data. (Page 7)
Some collaborators were coerced into deleting all PEK related data from their computers. (Page 7)
A final meeting of the international Review Board (of 6 professors from Switzerland, Germany, Denmark and the UK responsible for the scientific quality of the PEK) to be held in June 2005 for a final assessment of the project, was cancelled. (Page 7)
A recommendation in the report's final draft to keep homeopathy, anthroposophical medicine and herbal medicine in the compulsory health insurance scheme was deleted in the final publication. (Page 7)

en.wikipedia.org...

So the study actually proved homeopathy had better results then conventional care so the Swiss government cut it short and put together a panel to analyse it and found completely the opposite of the doctors who actually did the study... Sigh! And fools here wanted us to just take the word of the article occam posted by this bogus panel who wrote this article that it was scientific fact... LOL! Yeah ok we are all delusional... Go drink some tap water and hurry to your doctor who is part of the club that is the number 3 cause of death and keep calling us delusional irrational etc...

Like I said it is damn hard to argue with facts evidence and results but fools keep trying...

So what were the parameters of the testing that was done? Were they testing the ones they knew would flop? So by this the Cheif Medical Officer is admitting that vaccines don't work because vaccines are a homeopathic concept.