Penalties for smokers (Obamacare)

Originally posted by Acidtastic
weight and back problems may have other causes other than "this person wants to die soon"

So, (and as a smoker) I agree with it. we smokers are a blight on resources. ban smoking, that's the best way to deal with it.

We smokers are a blight? I can just imagine you getting a speeding ticket, as the cops writing it you'll say to him "don't forget about the red light I ran two streets back.

Originally posted by Ghost375

Originally posted by KawRider9
Really? Obese, bad back, heart problems, meh, you're good!

Well, obesity is often a lifestyle choice, just like smoking is a lifestyle choice. But people don't choose to have bad backs or heart problems. I have no idea why you are associating those things.

But why would you want more people to have to pay more no matter the case?

I don't want ANYONE to have to pay more because of their situation. Why are smokers singled out and not folks with serious heath problems?

reply to post by KawRider9


I don't understand the medical industry's and government's attitude to smoking.

One doctor a friend saw said to him "I don't care if you smoke. The more you smoke, the more money I make off you". Most honest doctor I've heard of. The rest of the medical industry acts as if you are going to hurt their profits if you smoke.

Then you have the governments who make great profit from allowing cigarettes to be sold, then act like the good guy by telling you "it is bad". If your local heroin dealer sells you some smack and then says "I wouldn't use it if I were you, it's not good for you", does that make him a hero or a villain?

reply to post by NuclearPaul

No kidding on that eh? The Government is in the insane position of NEEDING smokers and more of them all the time because so much tax base has come to depend on the money generated by ciggy taxes. Yet, any common sense and public health policy has to consider that first, that tax money isn't going to offset medical costs anymore than FICA withdrawal goes straight to what it's claimed for (Most makes a little detour to the General Fund to join the rest) but more importantly, the costs of treating end stage cancers relating to smoking far outweigh what smokers are paying in the taxes to begin with.

So you're right, it's a crazy thing and a lose/lose with so much mixed messaging, it's amazing anyone stays sane with it sometimes. All I have to say is when I started at 13, the link to cancer was suspected and not established beyond all doubt...let alone proven at that time for knowledge by the tobacco companies well before that.

These days? From preserved smoker's lungs to the raw data and pure stats of medical recording out of the CDC...the linkage is impossible to deny to all but a smoker still making rationalizations to themselves for how suicide on the installment plan really isn't what they're doing.

reply to post by KawRider9


Obesity can be hereditary, your smoking is all on YOU.... And you can quit whenever you choose... Just treat this as a blessing in disguise and give up smoking. I smoked a pack of Newports a day for 6 or so years and finally smartened up and quit. Never felt better, and regularly question why I would pay $6-7 per pack to just take in toxins... I hope you wise up and stop smoking before you cause damage to your body that can't be reversed

Originally posted by Manhater

Originally posted by Jefferton
You choose to smoke. Deal with it.

Since you are murderers you should be treated as such. Be happy this is as far as it is going now...

Well you better stop driving then and a ride bicycle. Look at all the kids who have to inhale your exhaust pipe. You people are just as guilty.

Cars are kinda necessary today, unless you enjoy walking 50 miles to and from work... Now smoking, now that's not anywhere near necessary.. Smokers wouldn't struggle to maintain without it, I once smoked and quit, I feel great and have never looked back. But having no car would truly be a disruption to the whole world...

Relating smoking to driving cars is silly to me...

seems like most are missing the point and debating wether it should or not. one -forced insurance,second attacking a group of people. next group might be yours then another. it is so simple for tptb to put us against each other on trivial personal dislikes. it is no wonder they are winning. for as long as we remain focus in short sight and avoid the big picture we will remain their servants. its amazing to read all comments,a few weeks back the discusion was the obamacare enforced,now?whats ok and whats not. thats like the story of the man who went to jail and said he wouldnt sleep with a gay man,two weeks later?oral would be ok,one month later? sex is ok,three months later?no one better look at my women.lol amazing! like kid short atention span. walking along.

They would save more if they stopped the $5,000 dollar test times two. That you don't need.

It is easy to blame the people. It is also easy to exploit the system if you are a part of the corrupt. Such as medical suppliers, pharmacies, doctors, and for profit medical facilities.

It doesn't matter if you smoke or not.

We all get screwed. You are fooling yourself people.

The man runs the show. Now go get in line.

Originally posted by Yngvarr
reply to post by KawRider9

 

And it includes us Vapors, too. Anything that contains nicotine is under fire, and yes they will
do a blood check.

I didn't see that in the article. I would venture to say that is a unsubstantiated claim...citation needed.

There is no health issues (above that of any other 'ine product (caffine)) associated with nicotine. Wearing a patch in such a circumstance would be equal.

So ya, until I see it in writing that nicotine itself is hammered, then going to be skeptical about that claim.


_____
As a smoker. I understand the ruling. I don't like it..but it is understandable.
I don't understand "willful" obesity not being hammered also. Keep in mind, with the various types of bodies and metabolisms, some people will naturally be overweight without health issues.

reply to post by KawRider9

I agree completely.
Even though I dont smoke i still think this is completely wrong.
Smokers dont increase the costs for health care as they already cover that through tobacco taxes.
In fact in some countries like here in Norway they pay so much tobacco taxes that health care would collapse if it wasnt for the income from those taxes. So in many countries it is smokers who pay for health care.

Originally posted by Acidtastic
weight and back problems may have other causes other than "this person wants to die soon"

So, (and as a smoker) I agree with it. we smokers are a blight on resources. ban smoking, that's the best way to deal with it.

If that was true then it would be different.. But through tobacco taxes they cover that part already.

This is wrong on so many levels I don't know where to even start.

This has to be about insurance companies and MONEY.

To single out smokers is ludicruis compared to other things that cost the health industry more.

Smoking Deaths Cost U.S. $92 Billion a Year

Source

CDC: Alcohol Abuse Costs U.S. $224 Billion a Year

Source

National Estimated Cost of Obesity about $147 billion

Source

A recent survey shows that healthcare executives are the highest earning CEOs, with the top executives at the nation’s five largest for-profit health insurance companies banking nearly $200 million in 2009.

In 2009 alone, UnitedHealth CEO Stephen Hemsley took home a staggering $102 million!

Health insurance companies are eager to blame everybody else when they hike their rates, when their soaring executive pay is one of the primary culprits in the rising cost of healthcare.

Source

reply to post by KawRider9


Ya it's wrong. But doesn't it make you wanna just stomp on your smokes already and never look back? Same discrimination goes for smoking on the sidewalk with our 6 meters away from windows bylaw (which puts you in the middle of the street) or renting an apartment.

Fourth attempt and week-three without smokes. Wish me luck!

reply to post by Julie Washington


Sure, but maybe these obnoxious rules are what we smokers need?

Originally posted by Yngvarr
reply to post by KawRider9

 

And it includes us Vapors, too. Anything that contains nicotine is under fire, and yes they will
do a blood check.

Are they going to ban or regulate these also?

List of Foods That Contain Nicotine, this is not a comprehensive list.

Eggplant
Green Tomatoes
Cauliflower
Potatoes

www.livestrong.com...
cavemanforum.com...!/

reply to post by Yngvarr


So now they are going to force mandatory blood work? KMA Obama....