Driving Off the Fiscal Cliff

I was reading Beezzers thread that the State of Washington is leveling a tax to supplement road funding. It made me think about how bad our Infrastructure really is in the United States. So bad that Obama is reexamining a Federal gas Tax. Yes, you read that right.

In the meantime, President Obama has recycled an old idea during the fiscal cliff talks by proposing once again a one-time infusion of $50 billion for the nation’s infrastructure. Many House Republicans quickly argued that the expense should not be made as part of a compromised package, including long time infrastructure advocate, and retiring Congressman, Steve LaTourette (R-OH). Talks continue behind closed doors, and President Obama and Speaker Boehner are reported to be personally communicating on ways to avert going over the cliff, including the possibility for a much anticipated but mythical “grand bargain”.

I find this preposterous as he has failed to even allow more drilling here in the United States. I am also perplexed that with all the bailouts, and money wasted with his "green" schemes (Solyndra, Abound Solar, etc ), that he didn't ONCE purpose to put Americans back to work, by fixing our failed Infrastructure.



Just how bad is our Infrastructure?

This was 2009 Grades....... I can only think of what the grade is now.........

2009 Grades
Aviation D
Bridges C
Dams D
Drinking Water D-
Energy D+
Hazardous Waste D
Inland Waterways D-
Levees D-
Public Parks and Recreation C-
Rail C-
Roads D-
Schools D
Solid Waste C+
Transit D
Wastewater D-

America's Infrastructure GPA: D
Estimated 5 Year Investment Need: $2.2 Trillion

"With the economy slowly recovering, infrastructure investment will help spark growth and continue our path towards prosperity," the society's president said in a statement. "In 2009, ASCE gave America’s infrastructure a 'D-' grade and called for $2.2 trillion in investment over the coming five years. Obviously, this investment has not been made, and consequently, we have jeopardized our economy, our quality of life, and our very safety."

ASCE did praise Congress and the Obama Administration for passing the Moving Ahead for Progress in the 21st Century Act in July. That legislation will inject more than $105 billion dollars into surface transportation programs for FY 2013 and 2014. Transportation Secretary Ray LaHood calls the act a win-win bipartisan measure that would help all Americans.

Unfortunately, this is NOT enough to get the Job done. Even with an additional 50 billion, with Obama's reexamination of a Federal Gas Tax, it wouldn't put a dent into fixing our Nations crumbling infrastructure. Taxing an already weakened Nation will do nothing but push this Country into an even worse situation. We need fixes NOW. I would propose to put our Nation back to work, and allow the unemployed to earn a check. I don't understand why this couldn't be enacted or at least a plan formulated.

If a plan could be worked out, would these Jobs have to be unionized? Could this be done on a State level, working in conjunction with the Federal level? I don't want to see any new taxes, but I do want to see Job creation and our infrastructure fixed.



I leave ATS with this, as I found it prevalent as to what should be done about it, immediately.

America's gross domestic product in 2006 was $13.2 trillion--we can afford to have world-class infrastructure. As a stepping-off point, we should insist that our elected representatives publicly acknowledge the risk of neglecting the bridges, roads and other essential hardware that goes into making a modern civilization. Then we should hold them accountable for setting priorities and for marshaling the requisite resources to repair our increasingly brittle society.

Infrastructure Reportcard
Driving Off the Fiscal Cliff
Just how bad are America's bridges and roads?
Minn. Bridge Collapse Reveals Brittle America



ATS, Thoughts?

reply to post by sonnny1


S&F Sonny!!!

People are blind as to how obsolite our infrastructure is in this country. Out electrical grid is waaaaaaay outdated, as well as our water lines and sewage lines.

Not sure if people remember history, but the Cholera outbreak of 1854 really comes to mind as to how vulnerable we really are..........

reply to post by seeker1963


Thanks for the kind words.


I think people really take for granted on what we actually have. I also think we are not holding our elected officials feet to the fire, when it comes to our infrastructure.I don't know WHY we cant put Americans back to work fixing it, but we can give millions of dollars to businesses that go bankrupt, all at the Taxpayers cost. Its ludicrous.

Originally posted by sonnny1
I don't know WHY we cant put Americans back to work fixing it, but we can give millions of dollars to businesses that go bankrupt, all at the Taxpayers cost. Its ludicrous.

In order for that to happen, you'd first need to expect that your elected government would spend wisely.

That is like giving a bag of candy to a kid and expecting them to eat wisely.

Well, I don't have much to add except that I think our country as a whole needs updating.

I have dialup internet, let's start there.

reply to post by sonnny1

I also think we are not holding our elected officials feet to the fire, when it comes to our infrastructure.

I relate that to how we are in our personal lives....... Everytime I think I want to buy something, I pause and ask myself, "Do I want it, or do I NEED it?"! It amazes me the amount of money I can save, when I ask myself, this simple question. Surviving versus living the high life, can make a whole lot of difference in the way people choose to spend their money. Including our elected officials.........

Originally posted by ausername


In order for that to happen, you'd first need to expect that your elected government would spend wisely.

That is like giving a bag of candy to a kid and expecting them to eat wisely.

True, but then lets get these elected officials who CANT do their jobs, out...

This problem is only getting worse. I believe we will see deaths because of our Governments failures to address the problem. Even more then the occasional "bridge" collapse. I fear that day.

I totally agree that our infrastructure is failing but relying on the federal government is not the way. Those employed to fix roads, rebuild bridges, upgrade power systems, etc. would have to be paid. Where do you think that comes from? No, in the end you would only get the taxes you say you do not wish to have. I do not have an answer to the infrastructure problem but a New Deal style works program is not it. The last thing this government needs is another reason to tax the people. Furthermore, one of the highest unemployment representatives, college graduates, won't take jobs building roads. Jobs creation and the prosperity of the next generation must come somewhere else.

New World Capitals are coming. Fret not, you will be moved into a mega city.




(Astana Kazakhstan pictured)

reply to post by TheWinnersRight


So how about the State level, if not the Federal one? We are going to have to pay for this, one way or an other. How about slashing the Defense budget? I know, MANY wont like it, but our infrastructure needs to be fixed.

reply to post by sonnny1


Many states dominated by liberals and liberal agendas are in worse shape than the federal government, take a good long look at the fiscal crisis in California for an example, the exodus of business has been motivated by the heavy burdens of high taxes and excessive over-regulation, to the point where it is a very unfriendly place for business, you have counties that are bankrupt, and places in the state where the unemployment is over 20% and it is getting worse. The state is going to go after the rich for even more eventually, and then even more of them will leave.

Tax and spend liberal BIG government is doomed to fail. The federal government would be wise to learn from that state in particular, because something similar is happening at the federal level, only on a much larger scale, nationally.

The best solution is simple... Smaller government, more liberty and freedom, less regulations, lower taxes, and get the government the hell out of the way of real progress, and you will see magic happen.

It is that simple.

reply to post by sonnny1

So how about the State level, if not the Federal one? We are going to have to pay for this, one way or an other. How about slashing the Defense budget? I know, MANY wont like it, but our infrastructure needs to be fixed.

Your onto something there brother! The states created the Federal government and we can see how that developed!

It is up to the states to take our country back!! We the people have already been shown how the federal government feels about us (TSA, Police State etc etc..) It is time for WE THE PEOPLE to kick these criminals out, send em to prison until their trials for treason and have the State Legislatures do a Constitutional RESET.

Contrary to the NWO puppets and their dreams, the states are the only hope we have in saving our Republic!

reply to post by seeker1963


As I think needs to be done.

We need to reign in the Federal Government, that's for sure. I think the infrastructure can be fixed, with a little creativity.

Stop building up the infrastructure in the sandbox, and put the $$ to work on our own. I would love to see that happen. Hubby spent part of '04 working on getting electricity to parts of Iraq - every time they put down line, it would get pulled up and sold for the copper. Why bother?

Another thing to keep in mind is the vulnerability of our current electrical grid to either a solar storm or man-made EMP. We could use some fixing up there as well.

Originally posted by Mountainmeg
Stop building up the infrastructure in the sandbox, and put the $$ to work on our own. I would love to see that happen. Hubby spent part of '04 working on getting electricity to parts of Iraq - every time they put down line, it would get pulled up and sold for the copper. Why bother?

Another thing to keep in mind is the vulnerability of our current electrical grid to either a solar storm or man-made EMP. We could use some fixing up there as well.

Agree 100%



I know it might sound selfish, but we need to take care of THIS country.

Wish I could give you more Stars!

Reading this thread I decided too look up how many home owners there are in this country turns out 75 million or so.



Then I looked up how many people rent which is 38 million or so now considering property taxes are suppose to pay for roads,bridges,electric grids, etc aka what people call "infrastructure",

Never letting a good crisis go to waste Congressman are elected to go to Washington to get their piece of the pie to where we hear of bridges, railroads, and airports to know where.

Here it comes get ready for the punch line people say how bad the current state of "infrastructure" is over 38 million Americans are not "paying their fair share" as in property taxes.

www.nmhc.org...

Infrastructure spending and championing is wealth redistrubition that is what the current admin is all about taking from that haves and giving to the have nots who aren't paying anything back and still "reaping" the benefits.

Which is a local and state issue.

reply to post by neo96


For so long we have left our infrastructure rot. Now, we are going to pay the price for it.

Wheres our Infrastructure stimulus?

If we are going to spend the money we frivolously waste on "green" Jobs, why cant we take that money and fix the infrastructure?

Texas has it's own power grid and keeps their roads and bridges in pretty good shape. They have no state tax but they do have fairly high property tax rates which pay for the infrastructure maintenance. It should be addressed at the state level. The Federal government wastes too much in every endeavor they undertake.

reply to post by sonnny1


I would be curious to see how much money was allotted to infrastructure and what was actually spent on infrastructure.

It'd be a safe bet to say that there is probably 10 times the money needed, but was spent elsewhere.

An excellent topic and well put together thread!

reply to post by beezzer


How odd that i posted pretty much the same thing on another thread you started no more than 3 minutes ago.