My nephew just came back from Iraq....

Originally posted by Affirmative Reaction

Originally posted by curme

Maybe you should check your sig.

Maybe you should read it and heed it.....

BURN!

Now I am not going to denied that when Clinton started to cut in the military we were all worry but I guess it was not that bad.

Now my husband is greatful to the president now because he has made posible for our local base to stay open it was in Clinton's list to be close, but with the war in Iraq, its a lot of constractors that are benefiting from the goverment and the war. It is so much money involved that is not funny.

That is why you will not find many civilians working in bases and for contractors that are against bush.

Originally posted by marg6043
its a lot of constractors that are benefiting from the goverment and the war. It is so much money involved that is not funny.

That's right! And there's people driving trucks for these contractors making $75 an hour, being paid with the exact same tax dollars that are paying our troops. And this is the way the Bush administration wants it.

That, to me, is an outrage.

Originally posted by aimlessly
and from what he has told me, the military backs President Bush by a staggering percentage. They have no respect for Kerry and do NOT want him as their commander in chief.

Also, I was glad to hear that most of them do not keep up with the news as they know it is just a bunch of bull. They know they are there doing good and a lot of good things have come out of us being there.

His exact words at one point were "I don;t know who you plan to vote for, but if you vote for Kerry, your voting in the draft." I believe him.

I'm so proud he went, I am glad he's home. Hopefully we can learn from the men and women coming back this time, instead of demean their mission and courage by not giving the war it's due. We are there, get over it. We are doing a good job, and we will continue until Iraq can stand on its own.

What ??? What?? A conspiracy I tell you ! Certainly there can be no one that feels this way! Michael Moore wouldnt approve of it! I tell you it must be a fabricated lie from a Bushie!

Without even reading the responses yet, this is what I feel i will see.



I for one have no doubt the military supports Bush, I ahve even posted proof to the blind ears as far as the polls go anyway.

Tell your Nephew he can be proud he served and he is an American Patriot and served his country with honor.

(Internet Salute)

Yes I know but see even when I don't agree with this things happening, my husband is a contractor benefiting also by the goverment and thanks to the war in Iraq, but he also served his country.

I am against the Iraqi conflict, I am against the bush goverment and his dirty goverment but I am in the middle of all that, like my husband said bush pays the bills.

And now is another question that we do not talk about it and is, will things stay the same under Kerry? will our base stay open and people like my husband will keep his job? at least his contract is funded for 6 more years.

[edit on 19-10-2004 by marg6043]

Originally posted by marg6043
Yes I know but see even when I don't agree with this things happening, my husband is a contractor benefiting also by the goverment and thanks to the war in Iraq, but he also served his country.

If I were working with a contractor, I guess I might have a different point of view. That is, if I also had the liberty of having it both ways, which I don't allow myself in most cases.

No, I'm just a humble quasi-educator, and I'm doing all right. Bush is a fraud, and he's screwing this up for everyone in the long run, including you and your husband. American money is fleeting. American dignity, when stained, unfortunately lasts.

I am against the Iraqi conflict, I am against the bush goverment and his dirty goverment but I am in the middle of all that, like my husband said bush pays the bills.

I'm going to assume that you and your husband are getting up in the years and can't afford to live up to your ideals. And I can't say I fault you for that. You gotta do what you gotta do. I just hope your children and children's children can afford to live in a USA that has been severely marginalized by such apathy toward the situation.

And now is another question that we do not talk about it and is, will thinks stay the same under Kerry? will our base stay open and people like my husband will keep his job? at least his contract is funded for 6 more years.

This is what scares me. So far as I can tell, we're pretty much screwed either way.

We must do better than these two innefectuals. McCain in 2008.

to everyone for the well wishes for my nephew. He is doing great.

He is a Marine, Lance Corporeal. He has seen heavy fire, has had his vehicle fired upon and could have lost his life many times. He never felt he was over there for no reason.

As for the good things that have come out of it, there was a very good post up a bit that covers some of the good things, and the one that I know is the largest.........SADDAM is out of power.

I am proud of every person over there fighting for liberation of a country. Lots of people think we don't have the right to be over there, none of our business, let the Iraqi's rise up and overthrow him (yeah right, he's been in power how long now?). Well it is our right to kick him out. This is our world also. The middle east needs some cleaning up. Apparently no one else is going to do it, including the UN with their "sanctions" and oooohhh I'm so scared "warnings". War is not friendly, pretty, or clean. But at times it is necessary.

Originally posted by DeltaChaos

This is what scares me. So far as I can tell, we're pretty much screwed either way.

We must do better than these two innefectuals. McCain in 2008.

I like your reasoning whoa you are very nice, well we are not that gone into the "years" we keep ourselves in good shape, and my husband is very good and smart he has and alternative route if things don't go the way he wants.

We are not voting for bush, "we are not crazy" but we know a lot of people that are scare of losing their jobs if kerry wins, they are misinformed.

Originally posted by marg6043
we know a lot of people that are scare of losing their jobs if kerry wins, they are misinformed.

So are you saying that you think that if Kerry wins, their jobs will be OK, or the other way around?

Are these people voting for Bush because they are afraid of losing their jobs?

I think it's a toss-up, myself. I really have no idea what Kerry'd do. That's what scares me. He really hasn't told us what he would do with regard to the war. He says he has a plan, but once I heard him say that he wanted to commit 20,000 more troops to Iraq, which would be a good thing, but two weeks later, he said something completely different.

I hate the tone of the whole 'flip-flop' think, so I avoid it, but in this case, it applies.

Originally posted by DeltaChaos

So are you saying that you think that if Kerry wins, their jobs will be OK, or the other way around?

Are these people voting for Bush because they are afraid of losing their jobs?

On the first question well you are right we don't know what his plans are we know that Clinton was down sizing the military, but now with Iraq we are awared that is going to be problems in that country for a while, the job of the base is to keep the eqipment working, the equipment comes is fix and is send back I am not going to tell what equipment but trust me is very important.

As long as is problems in Iraq the base is important so if kerry wins the base will not be an issue as long as the iraqi conflicts goes on.

On the second question well, this is the south and is a lot of hard die republicans and the word around in the base is that if kerry wins the base is going to closed and it will be not jobs, now we know better but most of these people actually believe all that.

I was curious to hear how things are going from someone actually in the situation instead of all the armchair generals behind their tv sets. My thoughts are, if the people involved in it truly say it's a good thing, then it probably is a good thing. Glad to hear he's back.

Also wondering if there are unbiased statements from Iraqi people. Everything I've read so far has been completely one way or another without percentages of who feels what.

[edit on 19-10-2004 by saint4God]

It is no secret that the military supports Bush. He raised the military budget to 420 billion dollars. A democrat slashed and burned the military and a Republican raised it up again in 4 years. What soldier would take a chance at giving the Commander in Chief chair back to a democrat?

Cheers to your Nephew

Originally posted by bodrul
nice to know people are proud of killing others

Untill there is some sort of world wide "enlightenment" this is the way it has been, will be, and always was.

One cannot say that they are proud of what war envolves, only that they do not want to embrace what would happen if it were not for war.

Unforturatly politics only go so far in this world of greed, power, and money.

...Where is the Messiah when you need him...

[edit on 10/19/04 by HumptyDumpty]

Originally posted by saint4God
I was curious to hear how things are going from someone actually in the situation instead of all the armchair generals behind their tv sets.

I agree. I always think it's funny when people who have never been over there, say, in the past year or so, try to tell other people what it's like for the servicemen and women. After Bush sent me to Iraq, he tried to cut my combat pay. It kind of sent a mixed message.

Hi aimlessly

it was my post you were refering to regarding Sadam out of power.

Looks like we got something in common eh?

keep up the postings, and dont let the minority get you down.

you are like me, totally against the war, but we have to accept we are there and we have loved ones doing there bit etc.

Forget all the people who say they are against the war. they maybe havent got loved ones dealing with it through the say so of their relevant governments.

Any time you want to U2U, then you go for it. would love to hear from you regarding this issue.

I like how your nephews supports the killing of innocent people and how his life was put in danger needlessly. How can people who are in the line of fire support someone who put them there because of "chemical weapons" that were never found, and because SADDAM is such an evil character. The dicator of North Korea is 10 ten times worse, and he actually has in his possession, nuclear weapons and plants in which they can produce more. BUT WAIT, lets attack a country that has basically done nothing for the past 10 years, and then shove so much propaganda down the throats of americans that they begin to actually believe you.

I used to work with a Iraqi. Of course i asked him how bad Saddam truly was. His response was not something i was prepared to hear. "He was a pretty alright guy" This is coming from a CHRISTIAN Iraqi, the lowest minority in Iraq.

Originally posted by faiz
I like how your nephews supports the killing of innocent people...

This statement is just the example of how out of focus some people can become. This statement, which is not the first instance I've seen, is so full of blind hatred and self-indulgent ignorance that it causes me to lose faith in the race just that little bit more instantly.

Tell me, faiz...

Just because this woman's nephew served in Iraq, do you really believe that he has no soul, no conscience, to the point that he would actually suppport the killing of innocent people? Let me tell you something. There actually are people out there that are like what you describe above, but they certainly are not the 18, 19, and 20 year olds fighting in Baghdad.

Just so you feel better, they are Americans, but they're sitting in the White House and the Pentagon. And they're not the ones you'd think.



[edit on 19-10-2004 by DeltaChaos]

The current mantra that the US 'needs' to maintain the current ludicrous amount of spending as if Al Quada is anything like the 'threat' the US faced during the 'cold war is ridiculous IMHO.

The US taxpayer is being gouged on the basis of fear and a refusal to weigh the 'threat' up with anything remotely approaching rationality.

Americans are being led up the garden path as if terrorism was invented on 9/11 and only ever happened to them in the USA.

The absurd fear of gangs of Islamic loonies 'destroying America' has your current gov outspending on your miltary the next 35 highest military spending countries in the world combined (and to hell with your national and the global debt implications).

This fact is never even mentioned.

In fact the 'orthodoxy' has become quite the opposite.....'did you not vote to bloat-out the US military to even further absurd amounts or are you some kind of traitor' seems to be the current line; which, incredibly, gets taken seriously and treated reasonably.

Cutting the gross over-spending is not going to leave anyone open to anymore 'threat' than already exists.

Naturally anyone in the military wants the spending like it was going out of fashion to continue (and naturally there will be those - as always with that crowd - who hate anyone who even contemplates injecting any kkind of sanity into things; it was always thus and it is never enough for these guys).

The rest of the western world just wonder when you will finally come to your senses and wake up to the fact that this kind of threat and war does not actually require $420billion annually, no matter what you are told.



[edit on 19-10-2004 by sminkeypinkey]

Originally posted by sminkeypinkey
This fact is never even mentioned.

Sure it is. Its mentioned all the time if you look places other than CNN, NBC, FOX, ABC, CBS, or CNN. Or FOX.

It's not so much that the military needs to be downsized. It's already smaller than its been historically. The problem is that it is a model of bureaucratic inefficiency.

Bureaucracies exist solely to justify and continue their own existence. And to grow larger, and more inefficient, and thus further justify their existence. And so on...

Its basically the 'too many chiefs, not enough indians' principle. (Sorry if that racial reference to the noble American Indian (God bless them) was too much for you, LadyV).

The military needs to be LED. Civilian military leaders need to do nothing other than shut up and listen to the military military leaders. The biggest reason we're in the mess we're in is because we didn't listen to people like Gen. Shinseki, Gen. Powell, and Gen. Franks.

Hell, we didn't even think to ask Gen. Grange, under whom I served on a UNpeacekeeping mission. Nor did we even ask for the advice of Gen. Clark, who was the Supreme Allied Commander of NATO. Both of whom have more experience in each of their little toes than the entire combined ego of the Bush administration.

[edit on 19-10-2004 by DeltaChaos]

Let me clarify.....I do support this war. Not for oil, etc. I support it because it is a step to a more stable middle east.

Fiaz, would you support pre-emptive attacks in North Korea? Didn't think so. I would, as a way of securing our interests as well as the interests of our allies.

I can not say how much it sickens me to hear the kind of comments that come from ignorance and selfishness. My nephew was over there fighting for your butt too, at least show him the respect he deserves.