It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
What happens when you let an open minded scientist amongst politicians corporations + world leaders
page: 124
share:
What happens when you let an open minded scientist amongst politicians, corporations and world leaders? An unbiased world perspective with promising
solutions to world issues!
Space Chronicles: Facing the Ultimate Frontier
This talk contains literally information suitable for every single section of this forum . From politics, media, philosophy, science, economics, the military, consciousness, earth, conspiracies, money, religion, republicans, george bush, democrats, Russian politics, geopolitics, culture, space warfare; the LOT.
Neil gives his interesting experiences working for George Bush's administration (he hated him!), his trip to china and russia, sitting in the EU, interesting facts about the political system, foreign technology and how delusional some are about global modern day problems.
I wrote as I watched, so here is the full transcript
I will tell you how it all began. It was the 1990s I was approached by Columbia university press on a chapter on an encyclopedia they were writing about the history of the 20th century. Now what is significant about it is the person originally scheduled to write it was Carl Sagan. He had been asked to contribute a chapter to but died a year year later. I was honoured to be asked.
At the time I was writing monthly for natural history magazine. I almost declined. But then I thought, no, maybe I can do something different.
Maybe why not think of discovery, not in the 20th century; not even in terms of the discovery of objects, or places, but maybe the discovery of ideas. And I would track the transition from the discovery of places, going back to the the era of the great explorers, to the discovery of ideas, once you've mapped the whole earth. What is left there for you to discover? Yes, there is the bottom of the ocean, but philosophically what is left for you once you know the whole earth is there? You have the exploration of ideas. And these ideas then take you to new places beyond Earth; they take you to space.
And I thought to myself at the time, you know, I really want of go to Mars. Its an unpopular view amongst my astronomy colleagues, maybe a 3:1 ratio see no value of sending human people to space. By the way that sentiment is held by an entire generation, in my colleagues who grew up in the 1960's when we went to the moon and so there is a little bit of hypocrisy there; and I've taken them to task on it … not only that its politically naïve to think that NASA is simply your private science funding agency … but more on that later.
So, I said to myself how much would it cost to go to Mars, say it cost half a billion, it would only take a year, so lets say half a trillion. That’s expensive, that’s a lot. Yet, In reality it's a small percentage of our total economy.
But I thought I am going to go back through the history of time and ask what did we do to propel our community to invest in this way. And I dedicated a whole chapter in my book of a list of things that drove humans to do great things. So I made a list of the most expensive things we have ever done as a species. Such as the Great wall of china, the Manhattan project, the Apollo project, Cathedral buildings in the renaissance, the Columbus voyages, the Magellan voyages, the pyramids, etc.
I thought after this list, the motivations for the most expensive things we have ever done it would fill a whole book. But in my analysis, I could come up with only three drivers.
No more than three.
No fewer than three.
The number one driver of them all; is war. Or, politically, you can call it “defence”. That gets you the great wall of china, that gets you the Manhattan project, and in fact that also gets you the Apollo project. It's the “I don't want to die” driver. If you are threatened, you will spend without risk to not die. That’s the obvious one.
The second is gaining great economic wealth. It's not quite as powerful as the previous, but it is really powerful, operating on the motivations of nations. That’s what gets you the Columbus voyages, Columbus himself was a great discover; but the person who had to write the cheque for his voyage gave the command “when you go, take these flags, declare the new new land ours, and bring back riches”. Queen Isabella did not say “come back and report to us what botany discoveries and fantastic science you may find there!” Columbus might have been interested in it. His crew might be interested in it; but not the people who wrote the cheques.
The third greatest driver. We see much less of this today. And this is the praise of royalty of deities. And this is the need to praise a deity or royalty that is more powerful than you are. This is why you get cathedrals, maybe the pyramids and similar ancient megaliths.
So I said to myself, if we are going to Mars, and since Mars is expensive, it HAS to satisfy one of those criteria.
And this was my first revelation. And this was the centre piece of my revelation.
And I said to myself, my God! How many people know this?! Because you hang around professional qualified space enthusiasts, and what do they tell you? They'll say “Oh, the reason why we stopped going to the moon, we didn't have leaders, we needed visionary people, we stopped being risk takers”. There is a whole list or arguments people will give you for why we are not in space right now. Why the space frontier has not continued beyond humans landing on the moon.
I deduced, without exception, that every single item on the list, is DELUSIONAL.
My experience of history tells me that NONE of these reasons matter to those that are writing the cheques.
So I started exploring which ways our reasons for going into space as a cultural frontier could use one of these three methods.
[watch next non factual, more entertaining section @ 13:00]
A couple of years went by, I get a phone call. From the Whitehouse. April 2001. It's the GW Bush Whitehouse. I got a phone-call, they said , we want to check your interest and see if you want to serve on a commission. I was confused, as I did not know anything about commissions, I was a scientist.
In academia, politics is the barrier between where you are standing and where you want to go, whereas in Washington politics is the currency of all interactions.
(^ profound quote there!)
They said it was called the 'commission on the future of the united airspace industry' and they said they had to ask me a few questions. And then came out all the questions, all the types of questions that are illegal on a job application. Then they asked are you familiar with the presidents politics and policies; what do you think of them? Watch @17:50 for list, and how Tyson replied @20:00.
When appointed to the panel I soon learned, being a liberal brought up in New York, that when talking to someone who is not liberal you can NOT stand there and have that conversation. It doesn't work. Because there is actually a smokescreen there. You can not stand there and have a civilized discussion.
THIS is what the television talk shows do. They get people with hot air on both ends and at the end there is just more hot air. You actually have to crawl out of those zones and stand in the middle and have that conversation. And over the period of that commission, that's what I did. And by doing that, I learnt things about the far right, or would not have know or even seen or understood. So it was quite illuminating.
I will give you an example of a liberal smokescreen bias. Because there are biases on both ends of the spectrum, but it's hard to see them when you are there. You have to look at them and step back.
Space Chronicles: Facing the Ultimate Frontier
This talk contains literally information suitable for every single section of this forum . From politics, media, philosophy, science, economics, the military, consciousness, earth, conspiracies, money, religion, republicans, george bush, democrats, Russian politics, geopolitics, culture, space warfare; the LOT.
Neil gives his interesting experiences working for George Bush's administration (he hated him!), his trip to china and russia, sitting in the EU, interesting facts about the political system, foreign technology and how delusional some are about global modern day problems.
I wrote as I watched, so here is the full transcript
I will tell you how it all began. It was the 1990s I was approached by Columbia university press on a chapter on an encyclopedia they were writing about the history of the 20th century. Now what is significant about it is the person originally scheduled to write it was Carl Sagan. He had been asked to contribute a chapter to but died a year year later. I was honoured to be asked.
At the time I was writing monthly for natural history magazine. I almost declined. But then I thought, no, maybe I can do something different.
Maybe why not think of discovery, not in the 20th century; not even in terms of the discovery of objects, or places, but maybe the discovery of ideas. And I would track the transition from the discovery of places, going back to the the era of the great explorers, to the discovery of ideas, once you've mapped the whole earth. What is left there for you to discover? Yes, there is the bottom of the ocean, but philosophically what is left for you once you know the whole earth is there? You have the exploration of ideas. And these ideas then take you to new places beyond Earth; they take you to space.
And I thought to myself at the time, you know, I really want of go to Mars. Its an unpopular view amongst my astronomy colleagues, maybe a 3:1 ratio see no value of sending human people to space. By the way that sentiment is held by an entire generation, in my colleagues who grew up in the 1960's when we went to the moon and so there is a little bit of hypocrisy there; and I've taken them to task on it … not only that its politically naïve to think that NASA is simply your private science funding agency … but more on that later.
So, I said to myself how much would it cost to go to Mars, say it cost half a billion, it would only take a year, so lets say half a trillion. That’s expensive, that’s a lot. Yet, In reality it's a small percentage of our total economy.
But I thought I am going to go back through the history of time and ask what did we do to propel our community to invest in this way. And I dedicated a whole chapter in my book of a list of things that drove humans to do great things. So I made a list of the most expensive things we have ever done as a species. Such as the Great wall of china, the Manhattan project, the Apollo project, Cathedral buildings in the renaissance, the Columbus voyages, the Magellan voyages, the pyramids, etc.
I thought after this list, the motivations for the most expensive things we have ever done it would fill a whole book. But in my analysis, I could come up with only three drivers.
No more than three.
No fewer than three.
The number one driver of them all; is war. Or, politically, you can call it “defence”. That gets you the great wall of china, that gets you the Manhattan project, and in fact that also gets you the Apollo project. It's the “I don't want to die” driver. If you are threatened, you will spend without risk to not die. That’s the obvious one.
The second is gaining great economic wealth. It's not quite as powerful as the previous, but it is really powerful, operating on the motivations of nations. That’s what gets you the Columbus voyages, Columbus himself was a great discover; but the person who had to write the cheque for his voyage gave the command “when you go, take these flags, declare the new new land ours, and bring back riches”. Queen Isabella did not say “come back and report to us what botany discoveries and fantastic science you may find there!” Columbus might have been interested in it. His crew might be interested in it; but not the people who wrote the cheques.
The third greatest driver. We see much less of this today. And this is the praise of royalty of deities. And this is the need to praise a deity or royalty that is more powerful than you are. This is why you get cathedrals, maybe the pyramids and similar ancient megaliths.
So I said to myself, if we are going to Mars, and since Mars is expensive, it HAS to satisfy one of those criteria.
And this was my first revelation. And this was the centre piece of my revelation.
And I said to myself, my God! How many people know this?! Because you hang around professional qualified space enthusiasts, and what do they tell you? They'll say “Oh, the reason why we stopped going to the moon, we didn't have leaders, we needed visionary people, we stopped being risk takers”. There is a whole list or arguments people will give you for why we are not in space right now. Why the space frontier has not continued beyond humans landing on the moon.
I deduced, without exception, that every single item on the list, is DELUSIONAL.
My experience of history tells me that NONE of these reasons matter to those that are writing the cheques.
So I started exploring which ways our reasons for going into space as a cultural frontier could use one of these three methods.
[watch next non factual, more entertaining section @ 13:00]
A couple of years went by, I get a phone call. From the Whitehouse. April 2001. It's the GW Bush Whitehouse. I got a phone-call, they said , we want to check your interest and see if you want to serve on a commission. I was confused, as I did not know anything about commissions, I was a scientist.
In academia, politics is the barrier between where you are standing and where you want to go, whereas in Washington politics is the currency of all interactions.
(^ profound quote there!)
They said it was called the 'commission on the future of the united airspace industry' and they said they had to ask me a few questions. And then came out all the questions, all the types of questions that are illegal on a job application. Then they asked are you familiar with the presidents politics and policies; what do you think of them? Watch @17:50 for list, and how Tyson replied @20:00.
When appointed to the panel I soon learned, being a liberal brought up in New York, that when talking to someone who is not liberal you can NOT stand there and have that conversation. It doesn't work. Because there is actually a smokescreen there. You can not stand there and have a civilized discussion.
THIS is what the television talk shows do. They get people with hot air on both ends and at the end there is just more hot air. You actually have to crawl out of those zones and stand in the middle and have that conversation. And over the period of that commission, that's what I did. And by doing that, I learnt things about the far right, or would not have know or even seen or understood. So it was quite illuminating.
I will give you an example of a liberal smokescreen bias. Because there are biases on both ends of the spectrum, but it's hard to see them when you are there. You have to look at them and step back.
edit on 2-10-2012 by ZeuZZ because: (no reason given)
Nobody liked Bush, and when I said I was appointed to the bush commission, they said “Oh, they appointed you because you are black, to make them
look good”. Well actually, there were numerous black people already on the panel, including women experts in the aeronautical industry. So the4
argument evaporates immediately. There were others, the head of Lockheed Martin, Buzz Aldrich (the second person to walk on the moon).
What I noticed there is that everyone REEKED of testosterone. Because they were captains of agency, directors of corporations, former security advisers. Even the women had testosterone. Anything she would say or write would effect your stock price. The rules are six members are appointed by Congress, six are appointed by the Whitehouse. Of the six members appointed by congress there was a mix, a mix that reflected the partisan split at the time. They are trying to be politically fair as they do this. Bush could have appointed six republicans, but he didn't. I just said I am a registered democrat. So people that say they only appoint republicans; no. That's just part of the smokescreen at the limits of each of the political spectrum.
Now …. why am I even taking you down this road? I am just trying to share with you my baptism into this aerospace and NASA. And what I have done with it since then.
So, I am there and apparently in the previous 15 years the aerospace industry had lost about 0.5 million jobs. Congress was worried about this: They were mainly worried as this is military related, yet at the same time with this; they also make the space ships.
I was contracted as one of the space people. One of the trips that we took was around the world. The mission was to visit foreign locations to see other countries to see what they are doing, see if they are ahead of us, see if they are keeping up.
We visited china. I went to Beijing in 2002 and I went there with a complete stereotype of what was there. I was expecting bicycles and small corner shops. It was not like that at all. There were Mercedes, Ferraris, more flash than most American cities.
We go to meet with captains of industry there, and I look closely and see on their hands college rings, graduate degrees from American universities in engineering. Almost every engineer that is shaping the engineering and industrial frontiers in china were trained in the USA, and all experts due to the exploration culture of the 1960s.
We took a trek to the great wall of china. It was spectacular, literally snaking it's way all the way over the horizon as far as the eye can see. Again, this was a great invention based on war.
So here I was at the great wall. This is out in the middle of nowhere. No industry for hundreds of miles. So I really had to try something, and I went to my friend and asked to borrow his cell phone (a GSM enabled cell phone) I called my parents in New York, my mum answered “Oh your home so soon!”.
THAT's how good that connection was! I'm on the great wall of china, I don't see any industry, no antennae. There was NOBODY in china anywhere saying “can you hear me now?” Something was a foot. Something was a foot that we were in denial of.
We visited France, we visited England, we visited all sorts of countries that speak our language. But, here's Russia. I don't even know the alphabet. But, when we met Russia, there was a bond there that I did not get from any other community in the world. Even though we were sworn enemies during the cold war, we alone embarked on that grandest of adventures to explore space. There was a comradely there. I felt it. It was in the timbre of our interaction. A deep connection and mutual respect for each other.
In Brussels we meet a co-ordinated set of a European initiative to explore space together. One of the issues was we were perfecting our GPS, yes it was a military project, but once it became part of our commerce then the ownership kind of shifted, from the military to the public. Our planes are equipt with GPS retrievers and Europe was planning a competing system to the GPSD system, its extremity expensive, and we are there, and we said you can use our GPS. And they said, we can build our own. Our worry was if we did that they will require every one of their aeroplanes to be equipt with their Galileo receivers which is already in a bad economic state.
And I remember the guy sitting across from me and he was kind of smug. We were almost begging them, in fact.
And I had an epiphany at that moment.
I am angry. I am pissed off. Not because this guy looks smug, but because here is an enterprise, that we and the Russians pioneered, bargaining as if its soy beans. As if its some sort of trade regulation that we have to resolve. I don't have experience with this state of mind, I grew up when America lead the world with technology.
And for me to bear witness to this: I was angry with America.
[42:30]
What I noticed there is that everyone REEKED of testosterone. Because they were captains of agency, directors of corporations, former security advisers. Even the women had testosterone. Anything she would say or write would effect your stock price. The rules are six members are appointed by Congress, six are appointed by the Whitehouse. Of the six members appointed by congress there was a mix, a mix that reflected the partisan split at the time. They are trying to be politically fair as they do this. Bush could have appointed six republicans, but he didn't. I just said I am a registered democrat. So people that say they only appoint republicans; no. That's just part of the smokescreen at the limits of each of the political spectrum.
Now …. why am I even taking you down this road? I am just trying to share with you my baptism into this aerospace and NASA. And what I have done with it since then.
So, I am there and apparently in the previous 15 years the aerospace industry had lost about 0.5 million jobs. Congress was worried about this: They were mainly worried as this is military related, yet at the same time with this; they also make the space ships.
I was contracted as one of the space people. One of the trips that we took was around the world. The mission was to visit foreign locations to see other countries to see what they are doing, see if they are ahead of us, see if they are keeping up.
We visited china. I went to Beijing in 2002 and I went there with a complete stereotype of what was there. I was expecting bicycles and small corner shops. It was not like that at all. There were Mercedes, Ferraris, more flash than most American cities.
We go to meet with captains of industry there, and I look closely and see on their hands college rings, graduate degrees from American universities in engineering. Almost every engineer that is shaping the engineering and industrial frontiers in china were trained in the USA, and all experts due to the exploration culture of the 1960s.
We took a trek to the great wall of china. It was spectacular, literally snaking it's way all the way over the horizon as far as the eye can see. Again, this was a great invention based on war.
So here I was at the great wall. This is out in the middle of nowhere. No industry for hundreds of miles. So I really had to try something, and I went to my friend and asked to borrow his cell phone (a GSM enabled cell phone) I called my parents in New York, my mum answered “Oh your home so soon!”.
THAT's how good that connection was! I'm on the great wall of china, I don't see any industry, no antennae. There was NOBODY in china anywhere saying “can you hear me now?” Something was a foot. Something was a foot that we were in denial of.
We visited France, we visited England, we visited all sorts of countries that speak our language. But, here's Russia. I don't even know the alphabet. But, when we met Russia, there was a bond there that I did not get from any other community in the world. Even though we were sworn enemies during the cold war, we alone embarked on that grandest of adventures to explore space. There was a comradely there. I felt it. It was in the timbre of our interaction. A deep connection and mutual respect for each other.
In Brussels we meet a co-ordinated set of a European initiative to explore space together. One of the issues was we were perfecting our GPS, yes it was a military project, but once it became part of our commerce then the ownership kind of shifted, from the military to the public. Our planes are equipt with GPS retrievers and Europe was planning a competing system to the GPSD system, its extremity expensive, and we are there, and we said you can use our GPS. And they said, we can build our own. Our worry was if we did that they will require every one of their aeroplanes to be equipt with their Galileo receivers which is already in a bad economic state.
And I remember the guy sitting across from me and he was kind of smug. We were almost begging them, in fact.
And I had an epiphany at that moment.
I am angry. I am pissed off. Not because this guy looks smug, but because here is an enterprise, that we and the Russians pioneered, bargaining as if its soy beans. As if its some sort of trade regulation that we have to resolve. I don't have experience with this state of mind, I grew up when America lead the world with technology.
And for me to bear witness to this: I was angry with America.
[42:30]
edit on 2-10-2012 by ZeuZZ because: (no reason given)
Meanwhile I come back to America and everyone is talking about the Saturn five. Now I love Saturn 5, don t get me wrong. but every time people
talked about space they kept referencing the golden age of space, I don't have problem with, except … I had my next revelation when looking at the
Saturn five rocket in a museum.
WHY am I genuflecting on the Saturn five rocket?! It's the first earth rocket to leave earth orbit and go some place. Is there ANY piece of technology you can name where you are genuflecting in front of the very first version of it, wondering how they did it? Every form of technology there ever was, as the decades move on, looks more and more quaint until you dust it off, put it in a corner and forget about it.
Yet we are still cherishing the Saturn five rocket, that is 45 years old.
So I knew something else was wrong with America.
If you keep praising something it means nothing comes after it.
More evidence that we stopped dreaming.
The Apollo era ends, If science really mattered to NASA how many scientist would have gone? We would have had loads on every mission? We only had one. And that was the last mission to the moon. Kennedys speech, six weeks after Yuri Gagarin left Earth and went into space safely, we didn't yet have a vehicle that would go into space and kill someone when it returned, JF Kennedy stands up and utters these prophetic words:
“We will put a man on the moon and return him safely to earth”
We collectively have cleansed our memory of that memory and that speech. We think of Kennedy as a visionary, as a charismatic explorer that dreams about space like the rest of us. And there is some of that rhetoric in that speech.
BUT go two paragraphs earlier in that speech. How about that? By the way, in kenndy space centre there is a whole granite wall there where they have the above quote embossed on the wall.
Two paragraphs earlier: “if the events of recent weeks are any indication for this endeavour on the minds of men everywhere then we must show the world the path of tyranny over the path of tyranny”
It was a battle cry. That's the war driver. That's the cheque writer. It garnered fraction of the federal budget that getting to the moon required. Why isn't that part of the speech there on the granite wall? Plenty of room there, I checked.
You could even summarize and say “KILL THE COMMIES, GO TO THE MOON”, it would fit just fine. That’s part of the delusional thinking that goes on. So when we stopped going to the moon, upon learning that russia is not getting to the moon, they stopped their moon program. Russia beat us in every practical achievement until then, first everything in orbit, they won all the records.
Practically EVERYTHING we did in space was either a reaction to something Russia did first, or something they said they were going to do. We trail them. Another delusional point from that era.
So now we've stopped going to the moon, the space enthusiasts say 'all we need is a charismatic leader, and then we can go to Mars!' … NO! There's no reason to go to Mars, because Russia is not going to Mars. So the whole program ends. It just ends.
Lets go forward further, in 1989 George Herbert Walker Bush, on the 21st anniversary of the Apollo mission gave an auspicious speech “we will build a space station, and a colony on the moon, and go onto Mars”. He wanted to emulate the Kennedy speech. But in his speech was there a war driver? No. He just used the rhetoric. He referenced Columbus, and the discovery of our genes, and what we are as humans; always curious to explore frontiers. And then some people estimated the value; half a trillion dollars. It was DOA in congress. Nothing. Some people say, well he didn't have the right charisma.
Its got NOTHING to do with charisma …
… what happened in 1989?
PEACE broke out in Europe. You want to do a half a trillion dollar project and your not even at war, who are you kidding?!
What he was missing was not Kennedys charisma, that’s not what interfered with anyone following his plan. Not only that, but NASA's budget was 17 billion a year. Multiply that by 30 years, you've got half a trillion dollars. So saying we can't afford half a trillion dollars is a lie! It's money already going into the system anyway. Another case of delusional thinking.
[50:00]
WHY am I genuflecting on the Saturn five rocket?! It's the first earth rocket to leave earth orbit and go some place. Is there ANY piece of technology you can name where you are genuflecting in front of the very first version of it, wondering how they did it? Every form of technology there ever was, as the decades move on, looks more and more quaint until you dust it off, put it in a corner and forget about it.
Yet we are still cherishing the Saturn five rocket, that is 45 years old.
So I knew something else was wrong with America.
If you keep praising something it means nothing comes after it.
More evidence that we stopped dreaming.
The Apollo era ends, If science really mattered to NASA how many scientist would have gone? We would have had loads on every mission? We only had one. And that was the last mission to the moon. Kennedys speech, six weeks after Yuri Gagarin left Earth and went into space safely, we didn't yet have a vehicle that would go into space and kill someone when it returned, JF Kennedy stands up and utters these prophetic words:
“We will put a man on the moon and return him safely to earth”
We collectively have cleansed our memory of that memory and that speech. We think of Kennedy as a visionary, as a charismatic explorer that dreams about space like the rest of us. And there is some of that rhetoric in that speech.
BUT go two paragraphs earlier in that speech. How about that? By the way, in kenndy space centre there is a whole granite wall there where they have the above quote embossed on the wall.
Two paragraphs earlier: “if the events of recent weeks are any indication for this endeavour on the minds of men everywhere then we must show the world the path of tyranny over the path of tyranny”
It was a battle cry. That's the war driver. That's the cheque writer. It garnered fraction of the federal budget that getting to the moon required. Why isn't that part of the speech there on the granite wall? Plenty of room there, I checked.
You could even summarize and say “KILL THE COMMIES, GO TO THE MOON”, it would fit just fine. That’s part of the delusional thinking that goes on. So when we stopped going to the moon, upon learning that russia is not getting to the moon, they stopped their moon program. Russia beat us in every practical achievement until then, first everything in orbit, they won all the records.
Practically EVERYTHING we did in space was either a reaction to something Russia did first, or something they said they were going to do. We trail them. Another delusional point from that era.
So now we've stopped going to the moon, the space enthusiasts say 'all we need is a charismatic leader, and then we can go to Mars!' … NO! There's no reason to go to Mars, because Russia is not going to Mars. So the whole program ends. It just ends.
Lets go forward further, in 1989 George Herbert Walker Bush, on the 21st anniversary of the Apollo mission gave an auspicious speech “we will build a space station, and a colony on the moon, and go onto Mars”. He wanted to emulate the Kennedy speech. But in his speech was there a war driver? No. He just used the rhetoric. He referenced Columbus, and the discovery of our genes, and what we are as humans; always curious to explore frontiers. And then some people estimated the value; half a trillion dollars. It was DOA in congress. Nothing. Some people say, well he didn't have the right charisma.
Its got NOTHING to do with charisma …
… what happened in 1989?
PEACE broke out in Europe. You want to do a half a trillion dollar project and your not even at war, who are you kidding?!
What he was missing was not Kennedys charisma, that’s not what interfered with anyone following his plan. Not only that, but NASA's budget was 17 billion a year. Multiply that by 30 years, you've got half a trillion dollars. So saying we can't afford half a trillion dollars is a lie! It's money already going into the system anyway. Another case of delusional thinking.
[50:00]
Let me wrap up here.
In the sixties, that was arguably the most destructive decade, there was a cold war, a hot war, civil unrest, student revolts, people getting arrested; the one shining beacon of that decade was the Apollo program. The end of 1968 the first mission to leave Earth orbit, in a figure 8 loop round the moon one of the astronomers picked up a camera. Saw the beautiful lunar landscape; and there rose Earth.
Earth, as never before seen by human eyes.
That picture called Earth rise is one of the most well known pictures ever taken. What else happened in the 1960's ? You didn't have to go far, there would be news articles, talking about the city of tomorrow, the hopes of tomorrow, the dreams of tomorrow, the home of tomorrow. We never got the flying cars, and I'm still angry about that, but none-the-less we were dreaming. We were imagining a tomorrow. And who would enable that tomorrow but scientists, engineers and technologists. They are the enablers of tomorrows dreams. We actually had an innovation decade.
What do you think the world fair was all about? It was about tomorrow. 1964 we are on our way to the moon, the Gemini is testing pieces of the moon voyage, each one more ambitious than the next. Space was inspiring a nation to dream about tomorrow. It was inspiring innovation. Bill Gates and Steve Job were 13 and 14 when we landed on the moon.
I submit to you, that in spite of the moon voyage being drawn with military motives, that the return on that investment is HUGE economically. And I'm not talking about spin offs, countless current everyday technologies commercialized today are due to technological inspirations due to NASA research. The curved pavements on the side of highways? NASA invented that. You might say, now why did no one else think of that? They were not motivated to do so. You know why NASA came up with this? Because they care more about the shuttle that goes into space than your car! That's an important fact here.
Science has never caused governments to pay huge amounts of money. There is a threshold, that we hit with Hubble. Anything above that, the interest to do it has to survive changes in political leadership and political fluctuations in the economy for the cheque writing political entities. That's why if I say lets go to Mars then we can do science, if there is a downturn in the economy the press goes to the unemployed who cant feed the family, saying 'but we are going to mars!' does not play well. That's why ONLY two drivers work.
The I don't want to die driver.
And the I don't want to die poor driver.
I finally claim that NASA is a force of nature on the educational pipeline of America. It is what inspires people to think big, to dream of tomorrow.
The concluding remarks are at 60:00 exactly in the OP video. The other half of the video is Q&A.
These next two videos summarize the above talk in a concise way:
Oddly Neil Has the same birthday as the day NASA was created, and when he was 49 he wrote them a birthday letter [below]. He reads it out at the end of the clip, if you watched it.
In the sixties, that was arguably the most destructive decade, there was a cold war, a hot war, civil unrest, student revolts, people getting arrested; the one shining beacon of that decade was the Apollo program. The end of 1968 the first mission to leave Earth orbit, in a figure 8 loop round the moon one of the astronomers picked up a camera. Saw the beautiful lunar landscape; and there rose Earth.
Earth, as never before seen by human eyes.
That picture called Earth rise is one of the most well known pictures ever taken. What else happened in the 1960's ? You didn't have to go far, there would be news articles, talking about the city of tomorrow, the hopes of tomorrow, the dreams of tomorrow, the home of tomorrow. We never got the flying cars, and I'm still angry about that, but none-the-less we were dreaming. We were imagining a tomorrow. And who would enable that tomorrow but scientists, engineers and technologists. They are the enablers of tomorrows dreams. We actually had an innovation decade.
What do you think the world fair was all about? It was about tomorrow. 1964 we are on our way to the moon, the Gemini is testing pieces of the moon voyage, each one more ambitious than the next. Space was inspiring a nation to dream about tomorrow. It was inspiring innovation. Bill Gates and Steve Job were 13 and 14 when we landed on the moon.
I submit to you, that in spite of the moon voyage being drawn with military motives, that the return on that investment is HUGE economically. And I'm not talking about spin offs, countless current everyday technologies commercialized today are due to technological inspirations due to NASA research. The curved pavements on the side of highways? NASA invented that. You might say, now why did no one else think of that? They were not motivated to do so. You know why NASA came up with this? Because they care more about the shuttle that goes into space than your car! That's an important fact here.
Science has never caused governments to pay huge amounts of money. There is a threshold, that we hit with Hubble. Anything above that, the interest to do it has to survive changes in political leadership and political fluctuations in the economy for the cheque writing political entities. That's why if I say lets go to Mars then we can do science, if there is a downturn in the economy the press goes to the unemployed who cant feed the family, saying 'but we are going to mars!' does not play well. That's why ONLY two drivers work.
The I don't want to die driver.
And the I don't want to die poor driver.
I finally claim that NASA is a force of nature on the educational pipeline of America. It is what inspires people to think big, to dream of tomorrow.
The concluding remarks are at 60:00 exactly in the OP video. The other half of the video is Q&A.
These next two videos summarize the above talk in a concise way:
Oddly Neil Has the same birthday as the day NASA was created, and when he was 49 he wrote them a birthday letter [below]. He reads it out at the end of the clip, if you watched it.
edit on 2-10-2012 by ZeuZZ because: (no reason given)
Tyson and NASA share the same Birthday, so he sent them a birthday letter
www.nasa.gov...
[cont]
www.nasa.gov...
By Neil deGrasse Tyson
Dr. Neil deGrasse Tyson is the first occupant of the Frederick P. Rose Directorship of New York City’s Hayden Planetarium. A recent member of NASA’s Advisory Council and a recipient of the NASA Distinguished Public Service Medal, Tyson wrote this essay about NASA’s struggle over time to inspire all Americans to be a part of the adventure of space exploration, and his hopes for the space agency’s future.
Dear NASA,
Carrying the fire-Astrophysicist Neil deGrasse Tyson has carried on Carl Sagan’s tradition of helping inspire the public about the wonders and mysteries of space exploration. Photograph by Dan Deitch for PBS / NOVA “Origins”Happy birthday! Perhaps you didn’t know, but we’re the same age. In the first week of October 1958, you were born of the National Aeronautics and Space Act as a civilian space agency, while I was born of my mother in the East Bronx. So the yearlong celebration of our golden anniversaries, which begins the day after we both turn 49, provides me a unique occasion to reflect on our past, present and future.
I was 3 years old when John Glenn first orbited Earth. I was 7 when you lost astronauts Grissom, Chaffee and White in that tragic fire of their Apollo 1 capsule on the launch pad. I was 10 when you landed Armstrong and Aldrin on the moon. And I was 14 when you stopped going to the moon altogether. Over that time I was excited for you and for America. But the vicarious thrill of the journey, so prevalent in the hearts and minds of others, was absent from my emotions. I was obviously too young to be an astronaut. But I also knew that my skin color was much too dark for you to picture me as part of this epic adventure. Not only that, even though you are a civilian agency, your most celebrated astronauts were military pilots, at a time when war was becoming less and less popular.
During the 1960s, the Civil Rights movement was more real to me than it surely was to you. In fact, it took a directive from Vice President Johnson in 1963 to force you to hire black engineers at your prestigious Marshall Space Flight Center in Huntsville, Ala. I found the correspondence in your archives. Do you remember? James Webb, then head of NASA, wrote to German rocket pioneer Wernher von Braun, who headed the centre and who was the chief engineer of the entire manned space program. The letter boldly and bluntly directs von Braun to address the “lack of equal employment opportunity for Negroes” in the region, and to collaborate with the area colleges Alabama A&M and Tuskegee Institute to identify, train and recruit qualified Negro engineers into the NASA Huntsville family.
In 1964, you and I had not yet turned 6 when I saw picketers outside the newly built apartment complex of our choice, in the Riverdale section of the Bronx. They were protesting to prevent Negro families, mine included, from moving there. I’m glad their efforts failed. These buildings were called, perhaps prophetically, the Skyview Apartments, on whose roof, 22 stories over the Bronx, I would later train my telescope on the universe.
My father was active in the Civil Rights movement, working under New York City’s Mayor Lindsay to create job opportunities for youth in the ghetto – as the “inner city” was called back then. Year after year, the forces operating against this effort were huge: poor schools, bad teachers, meager resources, abject racism and assassinated leaders. So while you were celebrating your monthly advances in space exploration from Mercury to Gemini to Apollo, I was watching America do all it could to marginalize who I was and what I wanted to become in life.
I looked to you for guidance, for a vision statement that I could adopt that would fuel my ambitions. But you weren’t there for me. Of course, I shouldn’t blame you for society’s woes. Your conduct was a symptom of America’s habits, not a cause. I knew this. But you should nonetheless know that among my colleagues, I am the only one in my generation who became an astrophysicist in spite of your achievements in space rather than because of them. For my inspiration, I instead turned to libraries, remaindered books on the cosmos from bookstores, my rooftop telescope and the Hayden Planetarium. After some fits and starts through my years in school, where becoming an astrophysicist seemed at times to be the path of most resistance through an unwelcoming society, I became a professional scientist. I became an astrophysicist.
[cont]
edit on 2-10-2012 by ZeuZZ because: (no reason given)
www.nasa.gov...
Over the decades that followed you’ve come a long way, including, most recently, a presidentially initiated, congressionally endorsed vision statement that finally gets us back out of low-Earth orbit. Whoever does not yet recognize the value of this adventure to our nation’s future soon will, as the rest of the developed and developing world passes us by in every measure of technological and economic strength. Not only that, today you look much more like America – from your senior-level managers to your most decorated astronauts. Congratulations. You now belong to the entire citizenry. Examples of this abound, but I especially remember when the public took ownership of the Hubble Space Telescope, your most beloved unmanned mission. They all spoke loudly back in 2004, ultimately reversing the threat that the telescope might not be serviced a fourth time, extending its life for another decade. Hubble’s transcendent images of the cosmos had spoken to us all, as did the personal profiles of the space shuttle astronauts who deployed and serviced the telescope and the scientists who benefited from its data stream.
Not only that, I’ve even joined the ranks of your most trusted, as I served dutifully on your prestigious Advisory Council. I came to recognize that when you’re at your best, nothing in this world can inspire the dreams of a nation the way you can – dreams fueled by a pipeline of ambitious students eager to become scientists, engineers and technologists in the service of the greatest quest there ever was. You have come to represent a fundamental part of America’s identity, not only to itself but to the world.
So as we both turn 49, and begin our 50th trip around the sun, I want you to know that I feel your pains and share your joys. And I look forward to seeing you back on the moon. But don’t stop there. Mars beckons, as do destinations beyond.
Happy birthday, buddy. Even if I have not always been, I am now your humble servant,
Neil deGrasse Tyson
Astrophysicist, American Museum of Natural History
edit on 2-10-2012 by ZeuZZ because: (no reason given)
That guy is the "Zahi Hawass" of astronomy, if he was really going against the grain you would never have heard of him. He knows what he's talking
about, but doesn't talk about what he knows.
Without your transcript I would not have paid this post the attention it deserves. Thank you! Worth the effort.......for me at least.
Originally posted by Mandrakerealmz
reply to post by ZeuZZ
Thank You so much for the Transcript !!
Thanks! I can type shorthand in real time, and I wrote a program that converts my shorthand to normal text. Then I just had to tidy it up
So now ive seen it and i agree on most parts.
I just see one problem...
If planetary migration isnt gonna happen..
Were will put everyone....
I just see one problem...
If planetary migration isnt gonna happen..
Were will put everyone....
I don't watch videos. Had you only posted a video, i would have clicked off the page immediately.
Instead, you stepped up and provided me with 40 minutes of reading and discussion with my wife. Thank you very much.
I am on the fence about Tyson. But his letter to NASA....that is good stuff. And what he says in your transcript is spot on truth.
Instead, you stepped up and provided me with 40 minutes of reading and discussion with my wife. Thank you very much.
I am on the fence about Tyson. But his letter to NASA....that is good stuff. And what he says in your transcript is spot on truth.
Yep - he's good. Even if he did demote Pluto. Poor Pluto
I've watched him on several TV specials - documentaries - etc.
I also like Phil Plait - - the Bad Astronomer. www.badastronomy.com...
Sure wish I had more time to spend on this type stuff.
“Yes, we have one less planet in the solar system,” Tyson told the group of students and invited guests. “And Pluto got what was coming to it so get over it. We have Pluto counselors if you can't deal with it.”
www.aroundosceola.com...
I've watched him on several TV specials - documentaries - etc.
I also like Phil Plait - - the Bad Astronomer. www.badastronomy.com...
Sure wish I had more time to spend on this type stuff.
edit on 3-10-2012 by Annee because: (no reason given)
reply to post by ZeuZZ
Science can't solve all the world's problems because many of them are rooted in our emotional mind. Much of it began in childhood when people did not receive guidance and love from their parents. Scientists are a good example of this. They probably did not receive enough love from either parent. Together with the lack of direction (usually scientists lean towards liberalism), they channeled their unspent emotions and feelings of unbelonging into a search for meaning in the universe. This adventure sadly will never end because their search is in vain unless it can solve the underlying emotional problems that sit deep inside them. In my view, scientists, more than most, need some therapy to improve their inner well being and interpersonal skills. This would bring them back down to earth and ground their more wild and fantastic theories and actually make them better scientists.
I don't know if this man is an example of this, but if he points to science and says that's what the world needs then my reaction is he may in fact have experienced a unfulfilling childhood.
Again, most of the problems in this world are rooted in emotions. All humans have a deep potential to express emotion, but some humans are intensely repressed and denying it. A lot of this can be seen in the high divorce rate, the amounts of various forms of abuse and addiction, and the many personality disorders. Any solution that doesn't address this is a cure worse than the disease.
Science can't solve all the world's problems because many of them are rooted in our emotional mind. Much of it began in childhood when people did not receive guidance and love from their parents. Scientists are a good example of this. They probably did not receive enough love from either parent. Together with the lack of direction (usually scientists lean towards liberalism), they channeled their unspent emotions and feelings of unbelonging into a search for meaning in the universe. This adventure sadly will never end because their search is in vain unless it can solve the underlying emotional problems that sit deep inside them. In my view, scientists, more than most, need some therapy to improve their inner well being and interpersonal skills. This would bring them back down to earth and ground their more wild and fantastic theories and actually make them better scientists.
I don't know if this man is an example of this, but if he points to science and says that's what the world needs then my reaction is he may in fact have experienced a unfulfilling childhood.
Again, most of the problems in this world are rooted in emotions. All humans have a deep potential to express emotion, but some humans are intensely repressed and denying it. A lot of this can be seen in the high divorce rate, the amounts of various forms of abuse and addiction, and the many personality disorders. Any solution that doesn't address this is a cure worse than the disease.
edit on 3-10-2012 by jonnywhite because: (no
reason given)
Almost every engineer that is shaping the engineering and industrial frontiers in china were trained in the USA
I doubt that, given how here it has got to the point of not tripping over Chinese students in the street.
ironic, space and going to moon helped bill gates and steve jobs to dream, and they invented microsoft and the iphone which causes people to be
motionless zombies staring at their mobile devices as it fries their brain while the world and dreams pass them by.
edit on 3-10-2012 by randomname because: (no reason given)
Originally posted by randomname
ironic, space and going to moon helped bill gates and steve jobs to dream, and they invented microsoft and the iphone which causes people to be motionless zombies staring at their mobile devices as it fries their brain while the world and dreams pass them by.
edit on 3-10-2012 by randomname because: (no reason given)
BS. They are tools. How we have mismanaged those tools is another matter entirely. YOu would likely be better blaming Facebook.
I just upgraded to a smart phone on Sunday (one of the last holdouts). Today i was amazed to be able to use VNC to get into my desktop computer and access some important files. Over my phone. I also set up my phone to access the security cameras at my hotel so i could track what is happening in real time.
The productivity that this device will give me is byond what I had thought was possible. It is an amazing tool. If i don't misuse it, the effect will be greatly positive for me both personally and professionally. And, as far as professionally goes....that is what Tyson is talking about, isn't it?
Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan
Originally posted by randomname
ironic, space and going to moon helped bill gates and steve jobs to dream, and they invented microsoft and the iphone which causes people to be motionless zombies staring at their mobile devices as it fries their brain while the world and dreams pass them by.
edit on 3-10-2012 by randomname because: (no reason given)
BS. They are tools. How we have mismanaged those tools is another matter entirely. YOu would likely be better blaming Facebook.
I agree with this.
Saying that the goal of Bill or Steve was to do what you said bigfatfurrytexan is equivalent to saying the goal of NASA is make people stay inside and watch their youtube videos and media releases.
new topics
-
I'm new here. Avid conspiracy fan.
Introductions: 2 minutes ago -
Denmark's Notre-Dame moment - 17th Century Borsen goes up in Flames
Mainstream News: 1 hours ago -
We need less laws in the UK not more
General Chit Chat: 3 hours ago -
The Baloney aka BS Detection Kit
Social Issues and Civil Unrest: 9 hours ago -
Suspected Iranian agent working for Pentagon while U.S. coordinated defense of Israel
US Political Madness: 9 hours ago
top topics
-
Suspected Iranian agent working for Pentagon while U.S. coordinated defense of Israel
US Political Madness: 9 hours ago, 15 flags -
USO 10 miles west of caladesi island, Clearwater beach Florida
Aliens and UFOs: 16 hours ago, 9 flags -
The Baloney aka BS Detection Kit
Social Issues and Civil Unrest: 9 hours ago, 6 flags -
We need less laws in the UK not more
General Chit Chat: 3 hours ago, 4 flags -
How does my computer know
Education and Media: 12 hours ago, 3 flags -
Denmark's Notre-Dame moment - 17th Century Borsen goes up in Flames
Mainstream News: 1 hours ago, 3 flags -
I'm new here. Avid conspiracy fan.
Introductions: 2 minutes ago, 0 flags
active topics
-
It has begun... Iran begins attack on Israel, launches tons of drones towards the country
World War Three • 652 • : Oldcarpy2 -
I'm new here. Avid conspiracy fan.
Introductions • 0 • : MrMez -
Are the 'Abrahamic Religions' all Really the Worshipping the Same Abrahamic God?
Conspiracies in Religions • 182 • : Astrocometus -
Freedom from evil.
Introductions • 7 • : MrMez -
Hello Everyone, Nice To Meet You All :)
Introductions • 11 • : MrMez -
Hello from the Northern East Coast
Introductions • 13 • : MrMez -
Denmark's Notre-Dame moment - 17th Century Borsen goes up in Flames
Mainstream News • 4 • : BearDK -
DerBeobachter - Electric Boogaloo 2
Introductions • 11 • : MrMez -
-@TH3WH17ERABB17- -Q- ---TIME TO SHOW THE WORLD--- -Part- --44--
Dissecting Disinformation • 481 • : Thoughtful3 -
How does my computer know
Education and Media • 15 • : AlexandrosOMegas
24