The Mars Underground

A very well-crafted documentary with excellent special effects and awesome musical score that outline a basic, affordable and realistically plausible plan for the human exploration of the red planet in the very near future -- as few as just 10 years away (if it can be funded).

It shows Dr. Robert Zubrin, aerospace engineer and president of The Mars Society, for the visionary and futurist that he is. Mars, as a destination for our planet's various combined space agencies, is both an amazingly welcoming Earth-like world, as well as a cold, forbidding and distant challenge.

Unlike our Moon, Mars will be the stepping stone to the rest of the universe, and will be the first real and sustainable off-world human colony. A great glimpse of our future as a space faring species.

I hope this is not derailed it is the future and we need to stop thinking of space as a delicate restriction.This was really interesting and entertaining to watch..peace,sugarcookie1..

And yes i know this was posted a few years back but its worth another watch..peace,sugarcookie1

Thank you for watching the video and the flags peace,sugarcookie1

I'm about half way through the video.

Thank you for sharing this sugarcookies.

First,I will start with this.
I was thinking about in order to be able to put someone on Mars and bring them back,they would need to put some sort of plant to manufacture fuel for a return trip.
And tada! It was covered.

The two problems I see is funding and finding enough resources for making the fuel.

Now off to finish watching the video.

Peace,
K

reply to post by kdog1982


kdog..
I think the big problem will be money for funding..With all the problems we have here, we need to start seriously looking for somewhere else to go.

Mars atmosphere is thinner. therefore even if the capsule weighs more with 4 people..... it will still need considerably less thrust than the rocket leaving earth gravity.

Why couldn't we build space stations on the moon and launch our ships from the moon to go to mars just my thoughts

reply to post by sugarcookie1



Money.
Thats the bottom line.

Just think what could have been accomplished with all the money wasted on our current wars.

So,in essence,we need to take care of our own,feed the hungry,house them and clothe them.
Educate them.

Stabilization of the people of Earth is needed before we are ready to move on.
I really don't ever seeing that happen in my lifetime.

reply to post by kdog1982


kdog
I agree we need to take care of our own..I know i wont see this happen in my lifetime but maybe someday we wont be at constant war and spending billions of dollars on it..
But i truly believe one day we will move on and see this happen..peace,sugarcookie1

I forgot to mention the video is long about 45 mins but well worth the watch if you have the time..sugarcookie1

I haven't watched the video yet, I will do so tomorrow when I have some more time.



I just wanted to comment on the whole 'world peace' and 'wasting money on warfare' comments:

As detestable as warfare is, there is no doubt that it has been the catalyst for most of our technological advancements in the last two thousand years (if not longer).

Please don't get me wrong, I am not advocating warfare, but it has, without doubt, propelled us as a species to the position where we are today (technologically). Without warfare, there may not have been the inclination to build rockets. Without warfare, there might not have been the urgent need to beat the opposition to put a man on the moon.

Warfare is what drives all species forward. It is evident in natural selection and in evolutionary advancements in arms races between predator and prey (and in inter-species warfare). Advancement in adversity. The need and will to survive is a very powerful thing, when harnessed with clear thought and objectivity.

It's quite ironic, that when you stand back and look at it from a distance, warfare is just as likely to be the salvation of our species through a technological discovery, as it is the exterminator of our species. It's a fine line our species walks upon, but it is the natural universe at work. You survive or you die. Harsh, but never the less, true.

If you locked two men in identical rooms, and told one "if you get out first, you'll get a lovely bunch of flowers" and you told the other "unless you get out first, you'll be killed", who would you 'put your money on' getting out of that room first?


It's an interesting, yet disturbing, ethical quandary.

Originally posted by AmatuerSkyWatcher
I haven't watched the video yet, I will do so tomorrow when I have some more time.



I just wanted to comment on the whole 'world peace' and 'wasting money on warfare' comments:

As detestable as warfare is, there is no doubt that it has been the catalyst for most of our technological advancements in the last two thousand years (if not longer).

Please don't get me wrong, I am not advocating warfare, but it has, without doubt, propelled us as a species to the position where we are today (technologically). Without warfare, there may not have been the inclination to build rockets. Without warfare, there might not have been the urgent need to beat the opposition to put a man on the moon.

Warfare is what drives all species forward. It is evident in natural selection and in evolutionary advancements in arms races between predator and prey (and in inter-species warfare). Advancement in adversity. The need and will to survive is a very powerful thing, when harnessed with clear thought and objectivity.

It's quite ironic, that when you stand back and look at it from a distance, warfare is just as likely to be the salvation of our species through a technological discovery, as it is the exterminator of our species. It's a fine line our species walks upon, but it is the natural universe at work. You survive or you die. Harsh, but never the less, true.

If you locked two men in identical rooms, and told one "if you get out first, you'll get a lovely bunch of flowers" and you told the other "unless you get out first, you'll be killed", who would you 'put your money on' getting out of that room first?


It's an interesting, yet disturbing, ethical quandary.

Well,sugarcookies,if it's alright with you and the mods,I think this is an interesting direction this conversation is taking.

Responding to AmatuerSkyWatcher,I agree with you.
If we didn't have the stress of being hunted down and the competition for food as a species,would we be where we are now?
I'm talking about when our species came into play,for the record.

Complacency is a continuous struggle that we all have to fight, adaptability is the key to our survival.

reply to post by sugarcookie1


S+F!

I agree. We, humanity, need get off this planet, either to the moon or Mars in establishing permanent independent self sustaining footholds off-planet as the next steps in our development and exploration of the greater universe.

Money is indeed a problem, but, there's also engineering concerns as well.
For a permanent moon base, for instance, what's used for power? Solar will only work half the time for cycles of near 30 days of light and 30 days of dark. I nuclear power expected for use in the darkness, or something else?

Radioactivity is also a concern.
In LEO (Low Earth Orbit) astronauts and cosmonauts are protected inside the safe bubble of the Earth's Magnetosphere.from most of the high energy deadly particles zipping around space.
Long term habitation on the Moon, or Mars where magnetic fields are negligible if not nonexistent would thus require ether some technology to produce an artificial magnetic field locally, as well as likely requiring to be buried beneath the Lunar or Martian surface.

We know there's water on the Moon and Mars, and at each location fuel in the form of H3 on the moon, and rocket propellant from Martian atmosphere can be harvested for local power production needs, but, do we have the reliable means to do this yet? We run into issues of engineering.

Certainly we need get off Earth with a foot on the moon, and/or Mars.
There are, still, a number of great challenges that need be met, but, so long as we sit and do nothing about them, we go nowhere.

Originally posted by kdog1982
reply to post by sugarcookie1

 

Money.
Thats the bottom line.

Just think what could have been accomplished with all the money wasted on our current wars.

Just print more from the ass crack of Ben Bernanke.

reply to post by AmatuerSkyWatcher


AmatuerSkyWatcher

I agree with what your saying without war we wouldn't have the advancements such as sonar,lunar navigation development relied on such newcomers in the field as computers and a worldwide tracking and communications network. By the 1960s, the electronic computer had become an integral tool of science, technology, and business, the list goes on and on..

Its a sad thing to say but warfare is what drives all species forward its a man eat man world out there right now and its going to be hard to adapt to this ever changing world but if we don't were not going to live long as a species and i think that thought is scary..

But please do watch the Doc its a very good and well worth the watch..Peace,sugarcookie1..Id like to add i love your avatar

reply to post by kdog1982


kdog..I like the direction this conversation is going also its very interesting..sugarcookie1

reply to post by solarstorm


solarstorm
I'm glad you decided to join in the conversation but could you please add something to the thread besides what you did..We are talking about Mars and development and the exploration of this planet ..peace,sugarcookie1

reply to post by sugarcookie1


Hey Sugar, did you find this movie by searching youtube for full length movies? I ask because I found and watched this today by doing just that.

Gotta say, I am scared to death for the first astronauts to go to Mars. So far away and so many things can go wrong. As much as I love space exploration, I'm afraid I wouldn't go.

Originally posted by sugarcookie1
reply to post by solarstorm

 

solarstorm
I'm glad you decided to join in the conversation but could you please add something to the thread besides what you did..We are talking about Mars and development and the exploration of this planet ..peace,sugarcookie1

Good. Let me ask, did you see the part about sending a ship that will land on Mars and create the fuel needed for the trip back? They didn't go into detail exactly how the fuel making process works (or I forgot). Does the fuel maker just pull the co2 from the atmosphere?

Also, assuming they're talking about thousand of gallons of fuel, how will the astronauts refill the fuel tanks if they land even a hundred feet from the fuel maker?

reply to post by Druscilla


Druscilla
Thanks for posting..Is there shield technology that we have that is capable of protecting us from radiation? Besides lead walls?( I dont think so) Also These are no ordinary protons, but high-energy proton particles from galactic cosmic rays. We on Earth are kept safe from them by our atmosphere and magnetic field, but astronauts in space remain vulnerable.

But i think Somebody, somewhere, someday will develop an artificial magnetic field, like we have around the Earth, that could surround spacecraft, buildings, and/or people.

My idea is to build space stations on the moon and launch our ships from the moon to go to mars (probably a silly one)
but just a thought..Propulsion, fuel, and sustainable life support are bigger hurdles at this point i would think..

On Mars, snow has been observed made up of water ice, and water ice has been seen just beneath the surface in rover tracks. It appears to be everywhere, just below the surface.But i don't think we have the reliable means to do this yet to harvested it but i might be wrong maybe someone else would know..

I agree we need to get of this planet because planet earth is falling apart and were part of the problem..

peace,sugarcookie1

reply to post by jiggerj


jiggerj

I searched Utube but i was just trying to find a shorter video for people to view most hate long videos or don't have time to watch them even this one is to long for most

But all the videos are a great watch i wish everyone would take the time to watch them...

I love space exploration also, and yes so many things could go wrong but sooner or later were going to have to make this step and i believe we will..peace,sugarcookie1

reply to post by jiggerj


Im not sure if this question was for me..

jiggerj
There going to send 2 rockets up both unmanned and one will pull what they need from Mars environment its looks almost like a still we use to make beer..

Then years later send a manned rocket up and the trip back would be easy the rocket fuel will be already made plus the oxygen they need to stay on this planet for a long time..
Thats the gist of what i got from the film and it sounds exciting plus doing it this way will be less expensive well what they consider less expensive its still going to cost millions of dollars but we will have to see if they ever fund this to happen and i hope they do..peace,sugarcookie1

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