Soldiers' Votes Could Decide Election

Originally posted by edsinger
so my % might be biased. But as I count it 8 Pro Bush, 0 - Kerry.....

It is, I just came back from Korea and NO ONE there liked Bush. And no one wanted him in office, they didn't want to go to war and didn't like having people they knew sent to war either.

Originally posted by American Mad Man Guess this shows that the guys actually doing the fighting don't think this war is so bad after all....

I fail to see how any poll ever showed jack$h!+.

Originally posted by edsinger

Originally posted by American Mad Man
Guess this shows that the guys actually doing the fighting don't think this war is so bad after all....

AH you right wing war mongerer!


Welcome m8!

LOL - yeah, and I worship satan too, just like my evil mentor Bush


But honestly, I think it is so funny how liberals keep going on and on about how bad this war is going. I know 6 people who have served or currently are serving there. 5 Republicans and 1 democrat. All 6 have said it is going well. All 6 said they are voting Bush. Thats right, the same guy who voted for Clinton and Gore is voting for Bush! The funny thing is that he is the one that can't stand Kerry the most.

It seems that most of the millitary guys took exception to Kerry's actions after his 4 month stint in 'Nam.

This means the DNC must once again try to get military votes discounted just like they did in 2000.

At least is more than the polls done by CNN of 650 voters... where most people said they believed Kerry won the debate.. 4k is quite a bit more than 650.

Are you aware of the statistical difference between a sample N of 650 and one of 4000?

Originally posted by American Mad Man
It seems that most of the millitary guys took exception to Kerry's actions after his 4 month stint in 'Nam.

RRIIGGHHT, cause anyone who saw people they knew and worked with go mad, get injured or die would want to stop this from happening to more people.
Of course, anyone who actually craves peace, well there just plain unamerican traitors.
And anything the N.Vietnamese say intheir temple of propaganda is just honest to GOds truth!No, really they would never lie.
[That was sarcasm for those of you who wonder what that hollow space between your ears is for]
Seriously, I'm sick and tired of people acting like triing to stop a war you don't believe in is wrong.

Originally posted by I_AM_that_I_AM

Originally posted by edsinger
so my % might be biased. But as I count it 8 Pro Bush, 0 - Kerry.....

It is, I just came back from Korea and NO ONE there liked Bush. And no one wanted him in office, they didn't want to go to war and didn't like having people they knew sent to war either.

Originally posted by American Mad Man Guess this shows that the guys actually doing the fighting don't think this war is so bad after all....

I fail to see how any poll ever showed jack$h!+.

Where in Korea did you just came back from? I know hundreds of military members and family members in Korea and all back Bush. None back Kerry because they know that 30 years of anti-military, anti-intelligence record Kerry has does not hold water with what he says.

Originally posted by jrsdls
I know hundreds of military members and family members in Korea and all back Bush. None back Kerry because they know that 30 years of anti-military, anti-intelligence record Kerry has does not hold water with what he says.

"We live in a post 9/11 world" Bush. Times change. People change. The military changes. Believe as you will. I'll do the same.

So can anyone of the people in here give me a decent reason why the military will be so anti-Kerry as it was anit-Gore?

Now with the possibility of a Dishonorable discharge...does it make sense now.

I am in the Miliatary trust me, almost everyone I know hates bush. Here is the problem though, many members are under the false delusion that Republicans will pay us more. THAT is the main reason that Republicans are more popular. This above theory is passed down from supervisor to troop. I think that alot of the reasonong behind it is that Republicans like to load money into the Military and bomb the hell out of people, so it stands to reason they would pay us more too. It is a falicy, but many people buy off on it as if it's absolute.

Bush is hated- he sends us to horrible places for along periods of time, away from our families.
Bush will pay us more.
Some people are more concerned with money.

Military personnel are fed a TON of rhetoric and "propaghanda for lack of a better word and a ton of us believe it. You can not use us as an example.

With the current mistreatment of Iragi children Woman and our own troops I think that you will see more Democrats in the military this year.

Do Not believe any Military affiliated press, most troops will say thay will vote for bush because we for one really aren't supposed to go against the boss like that; for two, don't want to put up with the negative consequences of leaning to the left.

I am by no means supporting Kerry in these statements personnally I am hoping for a coup of some sort, that might boost the morale around the unit abit.

I should also mention that out of the 4000 suscibers 90 percent of them are old vietnam Vets who hate kerry. There has been quite a spin put on his antiwar stuff, You can be anti war and support troops at the same time.

None of the troops asked to be there. I don't even want to hear the signed the dotted line thing, anyone on their first enlistment can not be held accountable frot that, no reenlisting was a choice that you made with full mind and body. But now with stop loss in effect there is no nead for troops to reenlist because their there to stay-- indefinitly.

Proffessional Core my arse--- ask the Army Reservist troop that has been sitting at a Patriot site for 18 months or the Reservist who is on hiatus from his job at AT&T and being captured and cut the hell up.

I will tell you, one thing, I have never seen morale so low as it is right now. If Stop Loss/Stop Movment wasn't in effect there would be no military left. What you see now with heavy Metal Music being blared while slautering insurgents is a peek at the breakdown of control and the general madness of the current situation of this war.

We were all behind Afghani Freedom for the most part. It was a belivable mission This current one very few belive in.

I do not speak for all military personnel but many will agree, the Army and Marines have it the worst, for the rest of us who are behind the line supporting it, it is a different story, but you can see it in these guys.

On Tommy Franks, was he forced to retire or did he resign? What a time to leave your troops stranded.

Anyone want to guess the outcome as far as the military outcome just in absentee ballots alone?

I give 3-1 odds that it will be Bush 3-1.....any takers?

Originally posted by edsinger

The survey was conducted Sept. 15-28 by the Army Times Publishing Co., which sent e-mails to more than 31,000 subscribers. The magazine received 4,165 responses on a secure Web site.


www.newsmax.com...

This is laughable Edsinger.

Absolute junk science. What biased polls like this do is poll a small number of people (4000 out of 31000!) and then using attributable fractions, multiply the figure across an entire population of people.

That's like some fellow saying that 3 of his 4 friends in Iraq are voting for kerry therefore 75% of the troops are pro-kerry.

And, hell, what if 90% of people who read the army times are republican to begin with. Skewed right from the start.

What kills me is, the non-military members keep quoting this poll, while the people in the military say it's bs. Who are you going to believe?

farhyde:

I am 59, spent three years in Viet-Nam in 66-67-68. I DO NOT
like to be called old.
ZOOMER

Originally posted by slank
.
THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE US AND A MILITARY JUNTA IS THE CIVILIANS LEAD THE MILITARY AND NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND. PERIOD.

It is the way the thoughtful founding forefathers of this nation designed it. Period.
.

Basically this is a truthful statement, although it is simplistic and irrelevant to the subject of this thread.

Well the military was pro-Bush the first time around by a wide 2-1 margin and Kerry the .......well we cant see the 180 , wasnt running. Why not ask the vietnam vets who they support? Here is ATS would be one of the biased poles in which you speak. As I see it the Vietnam vets dont like Kerry to much......and I bet Bush will get a 3-1 to 2.5-1 against Kerry. I guess we will see....

My contacts suggest a very differenet result to this bogus poll.

At every turn, the Bush admionistration has done disservice to miltary families.

I think the "staggering" margin is "staggering" because it's negative to Bush, with serving military members against being sent to war on trumped up, false, fabricated intelligence and seeing their conditions deteriorate day after day. Many more stand against Bush than for Bush.

I back those that say this thread is based on junk.

Originally posted by edsinger
So can anyone of the people in here give me a decent reason why the military will be so anti-Kerry as it was anit-Gore?

As many have noted, there are issues with the sample pool and method.

E-mail responders I'm sure tended to be more high ranking with butts in chairs safely behind computers and not boots on ground.

But all that aside. Can you tell me a good reason why 27% even from this skewed sample still want to fire their boss?

Were this an employee satisfaction study in any other organization, it would be as much of a mandate for change as you could possibly expect. Sorry, that's just how internals work. They always skew for the incumbent boss thinking along the lines of loyalty and that nothing is "really" anonymous so they go soft (as internal assessments go), but over a quarter STILL say fire the bum? Yikes. And you're proud of this?

Not something I'd advertise on my company website.

And in employee relations over a quarter of our insiders "in the know" want to fire the boss. Won't you please join our team?

RANT! I actually agree with you on this one! Can you believe it? Don't faint or anything. The respondants were clearly already biased toward a single view. How many boots on the ground actually get this particular periodical? Even so, as we're discussing poll results. I found this (okay, I found the link on Drudge, but it's an independant site, as far as I know).

Summarized poll results

Bush has been shown in the lead by an overwhelming margin in these polls, collectively, although barely outside of the margin of error an many. It will be very interesting indeed to see which way these are all skewed come election day.

And here's the latest polling fodder, for all to enjoy:

CNN/USA Today Gallup Poll

ABC/Washington Post

Believe it or not, RANT, I tend to agree that these polls can be spun whichever way the various political pundits see fit. We'll see. Now even major newspapers are endorsing candidates. NYT endorses Kerry (yeah, big surprise), but the real surprise is the left leaning Chicago Times endorsed Bush. Can you hear the grinding teeth?

What you people fail to realize is that even if the numbers of responders is what is claimed, it is still a much, MUCH larger sampling of persons than any other poll out there, and the people polled are from the same group...US military personnel which is what the poll was based on. The Air Force Times reported almost identical results. Unfortunately, you must be a subscriber to view the story online.


I_AM_that_I_AM

Just got back from Korea and NOBODY supported President Bush? Bull snickers, bucko. If you come up with a statement that is so blatantly a lie, I don't even buy that you were in Korea. So, where were you? What base? What unit???? Tell me all about it.

Oh, by the way, I spent three years in the Far East, and know Korea quite well. I'm still on active duty, and still have many friends over there, so I can check out your story very easily, so make it a good one...

Come on, let's hear it....

Originally posted by coronamoz


This is laughable Edsinger.

Absolute junk science. What biased polls like this do is poll a small number of people (4000 out of 31000!) and then using attributable fractions, multiply the figure across an entire population of people.

That's like some fellow saying that 3 of his 4 friends in Iraq are voting for kerry therefore 75% of the troops are pro-kerry.

And, hell, what if 90% of people who read the army times are republican to begin with. Skewed right from the start.

Actually, it's YOUR answer that is laughable!! How the hell do you think surveys are conducted??? All surveys are conducted JUST THE WAY YOU DESCRIBED!!! Holy smokes, get a CLUE, man!!!

90% of those who read the Army Times are Republicans, eh? And just where did you come up with THAT statistic? Pulled it out of...where?

But let's say, for arguments sake, that you are correct on the 90%. Would it then surprise you that the numbers were correct? Way to prove your opponent's point, Sherlock!!! You win a spot on the debate team!!!!

Whew�some people make it so easy�.