Openly homosexual man denied right to speak at brothers highschool graduation

Well this has been the talk of my town the last few days and it is very serious. This man is a former student/graduate of the this Catholic academy and was scheduled to speak at his younger brother's upcoming graduation, but was later told he was not allowed to speak due to his facebook containing a picture of him and his significant other and being openly homosexual as well. This not only disgusts me but is a direct assault on this man's civil rights.


Link to story: www.themorningsun.com...

Catholic - Homosexual = Can't Mix. Not Now, Not later. Not Ever. Ever. Ever.

How is that so hard for so many to understand? It isn't right or wrong to my thinking, it's just the way things are and it's the Catholic's right to keep it that way in their functions, schools and Churches.

Perhaps they didn't even want to screw with the possibility that an openly gay student from the past had in mind some surprise to pop the subject in a Catholic Graduation event. A little late once that cat's out of the bag and a special day for the kids becomes another activist event if that happened. Not saying he had that in mind...but I'm thinking the School/Church weren't even in the mood these days to take the chance.

Some may see the war Obama declared on the Catholic Church in total isolation or something.. Don't.. That would be a big mistake. It's made the Church far harder and less tolerant on EVERYTHING on straight up principle than they ever were before being pushed hard into a corner.

reply to post by Theprimevoyager


That's like saying that because I don't allow a homosexual in my home I am depriving him from
his civil rights.
They have the right to choose who they want speaking at their school.
I'm not condoning what they did, I'm just saying that no one is "assaulting" his rights.

Originally posted by Theprimevoyager
Well this has been the talk of my town the last few days and it is very serious. This man is a former student/graduate of the this Catholic academy and was scheduled to speak at his younger brother's upcoming graduation, but was later told he was not allowed to speak due to his facebook containing a picture of him and his significant other and being openly homosexual as well. This not only disgusts me but is a direct assault on this man's civil rights.


Link to story: www.themorningsun.com...

Careful to channel your "outrage" correctly. The man has NO right to speak anywhere at the school. This is not a constitutional right at all, you have a right to say what you want but NOT where you want. What if the guy was a Nazi?

People confuse the government's right to control what you say - despite the constitutional section, they fully control what you say, and the right to say what you want in a private setting. This man was an "invited" guest, and, after the church folks saw his lifestyle, the choose to uninvite him - which is THEIR right.

So, in truth, real truth, you should be applauding the school's right to change there mind WITHOUT government interference. You're outrage is actually inviting MORE government control as the only logical outcome from that outrage would a law mandating anyone who wants to speak at a private function, like a funeral, birthday party or graduation, must be allowed to or it is a hate crime.

One needs to think these things out, the only "law" people should see in their review mirror is the "unless you cause some real damage to someone, damage that can be measured beyond 'hurt feelings,' then live and let live" and let those who isolate themselves due to narrow thinking work their way to the accepting ones as a result of their isolation and not a law.

I really don get it, just this is idk tragic or comedy.
The whole church throughout the world is affected with homosexualism and pedophilia and no one talks about that, but they didn't let the guy have his speech.
Let me think, what would've he said: "I congrats to my little brother and hope that he will be a good gay like I am and all that priests who have been dismissed from church for their sexual beliefes. Long live the church!"

yeah lets pretend most catholic leaders (Priests!) have not had homosexual interludes and are not GAY

*giggle*

the message homophobic churches exude is an oppressively hypocritical one - it makes total sense the last thing persons with repentant/oppressed orientation (1 in 10) want to be reminded is they condemn part of who they are.

which is extremely unhealthy - no wonder the HIV rate in PRIESTS is HIGHER than in the general population - go figure! but thats a separate topic/statistics in and of itself..

Its discriminatory regardless of how any of you try and spin it. Being put on as a keynote speaker and then later being denied making your speech due to a picture on facebook and personal preference in sexuality is bullsh!t. He is an alum, was an honors student and comes from one of the 'top' families in this town.

reply to post by Theprimevoyager


Sorry but this is not an assault on his civil rights. This is a private Catholic school, it is their choice.

I don't think it is an assault on his civil rights, as the church has the right to invite (or un-invite) who they want.
I do think it's ironic that the Catholic church is so tolerant of the illegal pedophile actions of their priests, but so intolerant of a law-abiding homosexual. It's a crazy world.

Edit: What would be AWESOME is if the students all boycotted the ceremony in protest. It would probably never happen, but it would be awesome.

And yet most of you think its funny or ironic this has happened. That is sickening to me. I guess assaulting wasn't the best choice of a word, considering you are flaming me pretty hard over using it.

reply to post by joyride0187


The church is in no way in the wrong regarding this situation. Just as it is the gentleman's right to be gay and speak out about being gay it is the church's right to speak about homosexuality as they see it. When on private property you do not enjoy Constitutionally guaranteed "rights" as you do on your own property or in public settings; therefore the church has every right to refuse to allow this man, or any person, to speak for any reason. The man in question also has every right to deny those same priests/officials entry to his home and can censor their speech while they are in his home.

A prime example would be if you threw a Passover dinner party and one of the guest's started extolling the virtues of Hitler; you (the property owner) would have every right to tell him to censor his speech or leave your property. You could also refuse this person entry into your home if they have a firearm with them (even though it is their constitutional right to bear arms) and you could insist that they submit to a search before entering your property as well.

To insist that some government entity compel the church to allow him to speak would be to insist that the church be stripped of the basic rights of property ownership; and in doing so we all would lose some of our individual freedom and liberty by letting that happen.

Yes, lets bring up extreme hypothetical scenarios to justify the church's actions. It is my opinion that his civil rights are being violated. OPINION. Opinions are neither right nor wrong and extremely subjective.

reply to post by Theprimevoyager


Just because you are upset about it doesnt mean you are right......

Like many others have stated, they DO have the right to decide who speaks at this event and who does not.....

I love how people love to brow beat others with their belief system........but when another belief system implements THEIR rights, then all the sudden they have no right to do so.....

you dont get to choose that just because you believe differently........one must know the right of free speech and where it applies and where it does not......

reply to post by Theprimevoyager


To Catholics homosexuality is as evil as Hitler is to Jews. I don't think the comparison was all that extreme. A gay man is banned from speaking at the Church due to the potential for rhetoric that could be against their dogma and a jewish family could throw a supporter of Hitler out of their home. This speaks to the validity of the Church's actions.

Do you feel it is extreme if I should insist that someone I do not know be searched to prove they hold no weapons or contraband that I do not want in my home before allowing them entry? Would it be extreme if I were to remove someone from my property for speaking in a manner I find offensive?

Last question: If the church was forced to let this gentleman speak would not the gentleman have to let priests into his home and listen to a sermon regarding the ills (as Catholics see it) of homosexuality?

What ever happened to majority rule? If the majority voted him down because they do not believe in homosexuality...then that's the way it is!

It seems few people can change the majority of the vote because they scream it's against their rights...we as a majority...should have the last say.

Originally posted by Theprimevoyager
Yes, lets bring up extreme hypothetical scenarios to justify the church's actions. It is my opinion that his civil rights are being violated. OPINION. Opinions are neither right nor wrong and extremely subjective.

I'm sorry to point this out, but you are incorrect again. when you use the term "civil rights" the term comes with an agreed upon meaning, like french fries mean fried potatoes and not pickles. The mans civil rights were not infringed upon because civil rights offer no right to speak at this or any other event. Were his moral rights not to be judged unfairly infringed upon - sort of, but that's what the church does so why he wanted to speak at judgment central us curious.

The outrage is misplaced, the church system is judgmental, bigoted, and the greatest purveyors of death via "jesus made us do it" who ever did mass killings. All of that is true, but to deny their right to their beliefs is the same thing you don't want done to you. What if I publicly cried "I don't care for your stance, I think it is wrong and I'd really like to write a law that prevents you from espousing your views on this semi-public forum. Is that cool?

Do you have a civil right to say anything you want on this forum?

Originally posted by Dilligaf28
reply to post by Theprimevoyager

 

Do you feel it is extreme if I should insist that someone I do not know be searched to prove they hold no weapons or contraband that I do not want in my home before allowing them entry? Would it be extreme if I were to remove someone from my property for speaking in a manner I find offensive?

Well Said!

Originally posted by Theprimevoyager
And yet most of you think its funny or ironic this has happened. That is sickening to me. I guess assaulting wasn't the best choice of a word, considering you are flaming me pretty hard over using it.

Please don't misunderstand my feelings about it. I think the sad, hypocritical, backwards, hateful, homophobic actions of the Catholic church are a real shame. But, legally speaking, his civil rights haven't been infringed upon.

All we can do is continue to raise awareness, so that eventually all the Church's members may start to put more and more pressure on the Church to change their homophobic ways. Faced with the possibility of losing all their members, Church officials might find it in their hearts to be more tolerant.

reply to post by kaylaluv


I love your sentiments as it's certainly well meaning and anything but mean spirited toward the Church but it's also just not realistic. I'm not a Catholic but my entire family up my Mother's side is and they are devout, practicing 'never miss a day to attend' type for the most part.

It's from that background I say this isn't an issue the Church can or EVER will bend on. It can't and it just isn't that sort of thing, As difficult as the context is for someone who holds no deep deep religious belief of their own, this is a Salvation issue to the Catholic Believer. That means it's an issue which could bring into question the future of their eternal Soul. It's no small thing and really can't be overestimated for the importance it represents to a practicing Catholic.

No one has to agree with The Church, but it's important to at least see it from there side -long enough- to gain the insight as to whether there is ANY room for negotiation, under ANY circumstances. On this issue? I have to say no..and 1,000 years won't change that one bit. The Book and where it came from won't have changed so neither will the Church. In some ways..it's even reassuring that at least ONE institution has codes and morals which don't shift to the day's breeze.

Originally posted by Theprimevoyager
This man is a former student/graduate of the this Catholic academy

he was not allowed to speak due to his facebook containing a picture of him and his significant other and being openly homosexual as well. This not only disgusts me but is a direct assault on this man's civil rights.

www.rbslaw.com...

"Federal Court Finds Sexual Orientation Discrimination Unlawful"