Life in the universe

Ok I was thinking we know or think we know how old the universe is. We know how life has evolved on this planet. We also know with OUR current knowledge that interstellar travel is not possible. We have SETI and the new planned telescope array to search for intelligent life. I would like input on how many other civilizations are doing the same. I also wonder that our radio and tv signals are nothing more than "space fossils" if you know what I mean. What if we finally do get the "wow" signal again but by the time we could reach it the planetary system was toast and the same applies to earth as well. For example what if a civ with equivalent technology was doing the same as us but they were a billion light years away and by the time our signal was received or picked up we were gone hence the ter "space fossil". Also what if other civs evolved faster because lets say they lived in a solar system the died faster hence a fence on tech knowledge. Just want some input on what others.

Thanks!

reply to post by swampcricket


If the 13.7 billion years this universe has been around only resulted in the creation of a single intelligent species then we truly have some GINORMOUS shoes to fill. Although I believe that's most likely NOT the case, it basically comes down to 3 possibilities.

1. We are really alone in the immense vastness of the cosmos
2. Extraterrestrials do exist, but they don't have the means for interstellar travel.
3. Lastly, we are not alone, but extraterrestrials are keeping a low profile and don't want to reveal themselves.

I am of the opinion that the universe is filled with life, and that there is a galactic counsel somewhere towards the centre of the universe.

This leads to two options:
1. They know we exist. If this is the case, they may not be making contact because of our warlike nature, or we are simply not advanced enough yet. Still a primitive species in there eyes. Or they could be avoiding contact because there is a law stopping advanced races helping the development of less advanced races.

2. They don't know we exist. We might just be too far from the centre of activity, after all the universe is a big place. Hopefully a scouting ship will come across our space debris at some point and decide to come down for a closer look.

Alternatively, Planet Earth is the only planet out of the countless billions to develop life in the 13.7 billion years that the universe has existed (to our present knowledge, could be longer).
Which do you think is more likely?

Originally posted by IEtherianSoul9
reply to post by swampcricket

 

If the 13.7 billion years this universe has been around only resulted in the creation of a single intelligent species then we truly have some GINORMOUS shoes to fill. Although I believe that's most likely NOT the case, it basically comes down to 3 possibilities.

1. We are really alone in the immense vastness of the cosmos
2. Extraterrestrials do exist, but they don't have the means for interstellar travel.
3. Lastly, we are not alone, but extraterrestrials are keeping a low profile and don't want to reveal themselves.

edit on 4/4/2012 by IEtherianSoul9 because: (no reason given)

You forgot number 4
4. we are on the galactic tourist map with a listing saying "Come see the stupid apes trying to play at being civilized. Please keep all appendages inside the vehicle at all times, remember while they may seem harmless, they are an aggressive wild animal." "Also do not feed the inhabitants."

reply to post by Wolfie0827


Whose to say that other life, if it exists which I believe it does isnt exactly like us. Or at some point in there civilization evolution they weren't where we are today.

We are still a VERY VERY young species in the life of the universe we are learning new things every day to help us better our society. Human beings have been estimated to be on Earth for 200,000 years or so. The Milkey Way is projected to be 13.2 billion years old, almost as old as the universe itself. Plenty of time for life to get to where we are and then progress past us.

reply to post by caf1550


I know what you are saying but the basic fundamentals of science include numbers they don't lie and have no boundaries. Regardless of the tech or way they evolved numbers are involved its just fundamental.

I also wonder what we as a human species do if we catch a signal just to find a dead planet that was similar to us technology wise but no longer exists does that tell us we have the same future heading our way meaning the end of our civilization?

Well swampcricket, you ask what people have been asking for 1000s of years.
I'll repeat some information I posted on another thread.

Recently the European Space agency released the following information:-

In OUR Milky Way Galaxy 80% of the stars are Red Dwarfs.
Red Dwarfs are older than our Sun (some billions of years).
40% of these Red Dwarf stars, have Earth like rocky planets located in the "Habitable" zone.
That means that there are approx 10 BILLION Earth type rocky planets in habitable zones around their stars.
JUST IN OUR GALAXY!!!!

Within 30 light years from Earth (next door in other words), there ARE 100 Earth like rocky planets in the habitable zone.
Possibly, these planets are older than Earth.

So you tell us..........Do you think there is sophisticated life elsewhere in the Universe?

In this day and age, its about time we put the old "Is there Life in Space" question in the bin.

Yes of course there is, We are here are'nt we???...... If we are here, They are there.

reply to post by gort51


Well spoken my friend! I have 100% confidence that we aren't alone, now to play the game we will never know that for sure without evidence. You i and are are not alone in this belief but there are the naysayers that will argue that without proof then we are alone. I am with you the numbers don't lie.

Originally posted by IEtherianSoul9
reply to post by swampcricket

 

If the 13.7 billion years this universe has been around only resulted in the creation of a single intelligent species then we truly have some GINORMOUS shoes to fill. Although I believe that's most likely NOT the case, it basically comes down to 3 possibilities.

1. We are really alone in the immense vastness of the cosmos
2. Extraterrestrials do exist, but they don't have the means for interstellar travel.
3. Lastly, we are not alone, but extraterrestrials are keeping a low profile and don't want to reveal themselves.

edit on 4/4/2012 by IEtherianSoul9 because: (no reason given)

It's pretty obvious that it is 3.

But there is more to option 3 then just keeping low profile. It's never that simple. ever.

Originally posted by gort51
Well swampcricket, you ask what people have been asking for 1000s of years.
I'll repeat some information I posted on another thread.

Recently the European Space agency released the following information:-

In OUR Milky Way Galaxy 80% of the stars are Red Dwarfs.
Red Dwarfs are older than our Sun (some billions of years).
40% of these Red Dwarf stars, have Earth like rocky planets located in the "Habitable" zone.
That means that there are approx 10 BILLION Earth type rocky planets in habitable zones around their stars.
JUST IN OUR GALAXY!!!!

Within 30 light years from Earth (next door in other words), there ARE 100 Earth like rocky planets in the habitable zone.
Possibly, these planets are older than Earth.

So you tell us..........Do you think there is sophisticated life elsewhere in the Universe?

In this day and age, its about time we put the old "Is there Life in Space" question in the bin.

Yes of course there is, We are here are'nt we???...... If we are here, They are there.

The one problem here is that many, if not most planets in the habitable zone around a red dwarf are likely to be tidally locked to the star, because they would be in very close. Red dwarfs burn cool compared to our Sun, so anything in its habitable zone would have to be in very close, like as close if not closer than Mercury is to our Sun. Anything that close is likely to be tidally locked, which means that one face will always be facing the star, baking, while the other faces away and will freeze. There likely would be a thin band around the terminator between day and night side that would be temperate, but how easily life or even yet a whole civilization could rise and thrive in such a situation a big question.

Originally posted by IEtherianSoul9
reply to post by swampcricket

 

If the 13.7 billion years this universe has been around only resulted in the creation of a single intelligent species then we truly have some GINORMOUS shoes to fill. Although I believe that's most likely NOT the case, it basically comes down to 3 possibilities.

1. We are really alone in the immense vastness of the cosmos
2. Extraterrestrials do exist, but they don't have the means for interstellar travel.
3. Lastly, we are not alone, but extraterrestrials are keeping a low profile and don't want to reveal themselves.

edit on 4/4/2012 by IEtherianSoul9 because: (no reason given)

I'd like to add to #2 a bit.

I think some species MAY have interstellar travel (don't ask me their method for interstellar travel -- if I knew of a sure-fire method of interstellar travel, I'd be one of the most celebrated humans of all time). Let's just hypothetically say there IS some method of interstellar travel that one or more alien species know about. It could be that even with this method, interstellar travel is still a difficult, slow and relatively limited endeavor. It is possible that interstellar travel exists, but is limited by physics.

Therefore, the part of the universe that shows ANY outward signs of our existence (the tiny 200 light year diameter bubble that our radio waves have traveled) may have not yet been stumbled upon by alien races.

For example, we humans have mastered ocean travel. However, even with the thousands of ships traveling the oceans, the odds of a ship stumbling across a specific tiny desert island in the middle of vast oceans is small. Earth (and any outward signs of our civilization) may be just a tiny desert island in the vast ocean that is space, and be relatively easy to miss.

reply to post by Soylent Green Is People


Yeah I wish in my lifetime something spectacular would happen and we could figure out interstellar travel but I'm sure it will not, I'm not saying its impossible just improbable for humans in our tech age but you are on page with me about the radio/human tech signature in space being picked up by another somewhat advanced civilization. That's why I like to call our human footprint in space via radio signals and the such as "space fossils" because the time another advanced civ picks them up more than likely we will be gone as a race much like the dinosaurs. It's sad but more than likely true.

reply to post by BenTFH


Honestly, until I find a scientific explanation for abiogenesis (life coming from non life), I am stuck with us being the only life in the universe. So far the only scientific studies conducted I am aware of have further proved abiogenesis to be impossible.

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by BenTFH

 

Honestly, until I find a scientific explanation for abiogenesis (life coming from non life), I am stuck with us being the only life in the universe. So far the only scientific studies conducted I am aware of have further proved abiogenesis to be impossible.

Ok you say you can't find a scientific explanation for abiogenesis so you are stuck with us being the only life in the universe according to your post. Can you provide the evidence that says abiogenesis is impossible and by proof I mean scientific. Once again as I have put in earlier post I can't prove or disprove it but the law of probability work in the favor of life elsewhere, not just life but intelligent life. Do the math look at the numbers. Instead of using impossible use improbable "with the knowledge we currently have". Let's face it we are NOT alone.

Man, the Universe is infinite. Every sort of Civilization/world you can imagine in your head most probably exists out there...


We are just a tiny little speck, probably less significant than 1 little grain of sand amongst all the beaches/deserts on Earth.

It is amazing... When I think about this, I don't feel so alone anymore

hehe

Originally posted by OccamsRazor04
reply to post by BenTFH

 

Honestly, until I find a scientific explanation for abiogenesis (life coming from non life), I am stuck with us being the only life in the universe. So far the only scientific studies conducted I am aware of have further proved abiogenesis to be impossible.

Well, we know life DOES exist, and THAT that life needed to have a genesis.

Therefore, if life had one genesis -- not matter now improbable it may have been -- then life may have had a separate genesis somewhere else, especially if we consider the sheer vastness of the universe.

But I agree that until we find that other life, we cannot be 100% certain that it exists. I'm 99.999% certain, but I can't be 100% certain yet.

reply to post by Soylent Green Is People


Actually we know two things. Abiogenis does not occur naturally, and we have life on Earth. This points to an unnatural explanation for our existence. This means that life elsewhere would have to have an unnatural explanation.

Science can not explain our existence, as our existence contradicts what science currently knows. Looking to science to explain life elsewhere, when science can not explain life here, is foolish.

Until such time as science can explain how we are here, I will use the only explanation I have, one of faith, which does not help me in determining if life is elsewhere. My personal belief is that it is not, I am open to the facts as they may unfold.

Vastness does not matter, if you have a 6 sided die and roll it an infinite amount of times you will never get a 7. Something that can not occur will not occur, regardless of how many 0's you add.

reply to post by OccamsRazor04


So in your faith based belief when the die was rolled it landed on 7 and life on earth popped up? Wouldn't that be in direct contradiction to your post?

reply to post by OccamsRazor04

I'm neither religious nor nor-religious; I don't see the need to take a side.

However, just because science cannot (yet?) fully explain the origins of life deriving from non-living chemical compounds, I'm not going to assume that it didn't happen. I don't understand your position of "If science hasn't yet explained the origin of life, then I need to go with it having a supernatural creator"...

...I mean, maybe the explanation is that it is a natural process that we don't yet understand. There is nothing wrong with leaving it as an "unknown" while science keeps trying to understand it.

I suppose I could turn it around and say "Until you can prove to me that life has a sentient, supernatural, supreme creator (e.g., God), then I'm going to have to go with that life derived from a yet-unknown process"