"United States saves money by switching to a cashless economy" : Here it comes

It looks to me like they are going to start publicly pushing a cashless system in the U.S.

I'm not looking forward to the day when I have to take the time to scan a card instead of laying down some loose change for something that only costs a dollar or less, and walking out.

Plus, how am I going to pay the neighbor boy who comes and mows the lawn, etc.? Or the teenager who comes to babysit on Friday night? I don't think they are gonna have a debit card machine

On the other hand, I believe the bartering and trading system would grow substantially in very little time, along with the black market.


They want their tax dollars from unreported income

We also must pay for the social ills caused by a physical currency system: underground criminal economies, tax evasion, environmental damage, counterfeiting. Banks lost $35 million worth of “loot” (the official FBI terminology) during 5,628 bank robberies in 2010, and that does not include insurance costs, medical expenses for 18 injured victims, and the immeasurable value of lost human life. And that’s chump change compared to Uncle Sam’s tax gap over the past decade, which has been estimated at $3 trillion. More than one half that gap is attributable to underreporting of business income and much of that stems from unreported or underreported cash—that great little cash-only Italian place down the block might not be paying its taxes in full.

Using cards costs less due to e-commerce and self checkout (less employees), which results in less jobs/higher unemployment by the way

One 2003 study estimated that moving from a wholly paper-based network to a completely electronic one could save an economy 1 percent of its annual GDP (a $150 billion sum for the United States). A 2004 AEI-Brookings paper calculated that, even factoring in the benefits of anonymity that cash provides—accounted for by measuring the bonuses grocery store customers were willing to give up by declining rewards cards—cash is twice as costly as debit. Anne Layne-Farrar, one of the authors of the Brookings study—she is now at work on an updated version—says the relative costs of cash have continued to grow, with the rise of self-checkout, e-commerce, and mobile payments making electronic payments even cheaper.

Paying in cash would make us look like a criminal

But even accounting for those billions in interchange fees, study after study shows that cash is more burdensome than debit. If cash is so costly, why hasn’t there been an uprising against the greenback? Because the costs of cash, along with being difficult to quantify, are also practically invisible. The only time people are confronted with the price of paper money is when they pay ATM fees. Everything else—transportation, crime, opportunity costs—is hidden, baked into the prices we pay for goods and services. David Birch, a director at Consult Hyperion, a firm specializing in electronic payments, says a shift to digital currency would cut out these hidden costs. In Birch’s ideal world, paying with cash would be viewed like drunk driving—something we do with decreasing frequency as more and more people understand the negative social consequences. “We’re trying to use industrial age money to support commerce in a post-industrial age. It just doesn’t work,” he says. “Sooner or later, the tectonic plates shift and then, very quickly, you’ll find yourself in this new environment where if you ask somebody to pay you in cash, you’ll just assume that they’re a prostitute or a Somali pirate.”

Banks charge fees for cash transactions by businesses, or have STOPPED ACCEPTING CASH

In Finland, for example, merchants have to pay for cash deposits and banks charge for cash withdrawals. And in neighboring Sweden, another of the most cashless countries in the world, public buses don't accept cash and some banks have stopped dealing with paper money. With these policies compelling consumers and merchants to use cheaper digital methods, cash usage has been pushed largely into the gray and black market.

So, fees for using cash, no fees for using debit cards

but the government can still enact policies to move us toward a less costly, cashless future. One example: Require that banks, as a condition of having a license, provide a free debit service to their customers.

To make up for the resulting shortfall in debit fees, banks could start including a surcharge for cash transactions. If we don’t attach the costs of cash to the use of cash, we’re going to keep paying in other ways—higher taxes to make up for lost government revenue from tax cheats, higher prices to make up for labor inefficiency, and pricier mortgages and banking fees to make up for the costs banks pay for securing and maintaining all that cash.

For the sixth year in a row, pennies and nickels cost more to produce in 2011 than they were worth. While the depreciation of the cent and the increased cost of producing coins is an old story, the U.S. Mint did reach a new milestone last year: For the first time in history, both the five-cent and one-cent denominations cost double their value to produce.

Aren't there enough pennies and nickels out there anyway? I know I always have too many. And when I try to pay with 20 or 30 pennies or so to clean out my wallet, the cashier sometimes says "nevermind" and doesn't want to deal with them

There are also opportunity costs for consumers in taking trips to the ATM or waiting in line while someone makes change at the grocery store, not to mention the price of all the change you’ve lost in your couch.

Umm, the couch is where I get gas money and milk money when payday is too far away

www.slate.com...

edit on 22-3-2012 by tinker9917 because: (no reason given)

edit on 22-3-2012 by tinker9917 because: (no reason given)

reply to post by tinker9917


I am totally Against this! This is just a way to control everything we do! We must not let this happen! Sweden is already doing this.

I rarely use my card, I'm so pissed every time they charge ME a fee for taking MY money from an AUTOMATED system that doesn't cost em NOTHING to give me my money.

The only persons that would save money, are the ones with already too much money and that always wants MORE!

reply to post by tinker9917


What can we do to stop this?

Can you imagine how easy it will be able to wipe you out or control you when some official in government or private industry has the ability to simply push a button and your account is gone or being held in limbo until you satisfy some demand?

Not to mention that complete and total accounts of individual activities using electronic transfers will greatly enable the control aspect that government seems intent upon imposing upon us.

The sure signs of such coming to pass will first be the enacting of new laws and restrictions on bartering, black markets, and personal activities as raising your "own" veggies and chickens, etc. Self-sustainment will be seen as terrorism against TPTB.

reply to post by tinker9917


I got pissed off when I had to palm scan at the Doctors Office much less having to accept that we are getting ready to go cashless. I dont trust banks or ATM machines! I know where all of this is going and someway this must be stopped.

In the near future the ATM machine is not going to work. Banks are going to lose data of how much an individual even has in the bank. In my opinion, Something is getting ready to go down..I do not know what. I am not Anti-Government but I do not agree with them attempting to sneak something in on all of us.

Originally posted by tinker9917
Plus, how am I going to pay the neighbor boy who comes and mows the lawn, etc.? Or the teenager who comes to babysit on Friday night? I don't think they are gonna have a debit card machine

That's exactly the point. They don't want you to be able to hire people like that, because they aren't a registered business, and when you pay them in cash it's impossible for them to trace it. The neighbor who mows the lawn and the teenager who babysits on Friday are evading taxes and they get to keep all the money they earn... big brother can't have that, they must have their cut of the pie. They will say you need to hire a licensed babysitter and that you need to pay a registered lawn mowing business to send someone out and cut your lawn for 5 times the price.

I think we've seen the beginnings of this in the USA. A few weeks ago I went to put some money onto my pre-paid cellphone, which is carried by a popular, nationwide provider, and they charged me extra for paying in cash!!!

Seriously, I had to pay more for using cash versus using a debit or credit card. I asked the sales rep. why and he said "The bank charges us more for cash transactions, so unfortunately we have to pass that on the the customer." I was furious.

But now it makes sense, they want to force people into using a corrupt system. Awesome.

Originally posted by Apollo7
reply to post by tinker9917

 

What can we do to stop this?

I think it would take the majority to use strictly cash. No credit cards, no debit cards. Even if they impose fees for cash.

There is no chance this would happen. There would be a revolution before this could take place. Cash is far too much an importance in our society.

Originally posted by ChaoticOrder
The neighbor who mows the lawn and the teenager who babysits on Friday are evading taxes and they get to keep all the money they earn... big brother can't have that, they must have their cut of the pie.

I got an easy solution, no income taxes, more sales taxes. Everyone would pay the same %, rich and poor.

Too bad the rich that evade income taxes all together wouldn't want to pay the same % than the middle class.

Originally posted by literofcola
There is no chance this would happen. There would be a revolution before this could take place. Cash is far too much an importance in our society.

If they stop the cash flow, by demanding direct deposit on payroll, electronic/wire transfer of payments etc. by law, and confiscate cash at bank level when it flows through the general population, it would not take long for cash to almost disappear from the public.

So since we're going cashless won't that eliminate the need and overbearing cost to the government and the people of the Fed printing physical cash and LOANING it to us with instant and automatic interest? Fed will become obsolete! Yay! I could see THAT saving us a bundle

Originally posted by Apollo7
reply to post by tinker9917

 

I got pissed off when I had to palm scan at the Doctors Office much less having to accept that we are getting ready to go cashless. I dont trust banks or ATM machines! I know where all of this is going and someway this must be stopped.

You have to palm scan at the Dr. Office? I have not heard of this!!

I stopped banking all together because my income is so pathetic that it is nearly impossible to have a bank account without getting robbed at every corner.

If we go to a cashless system. I will have no choice but to hunt for my own food and grow a garden of course, which I already do.

reply to post by tinker9917


You know, I didnt even think about a fee for Cash. This is not the same Country I was born into! What are we becoming! Is there really nothing we can do to Stop this New World Order? I work so physically hard for my 80.00 a day job. I work in a Bio-Hazard job and cant even afford to provide me and my children our own home to live in. I was forced to direct deposit my paycheck..this pissed me off but I had to do this anyway. I never leave anything in the Bank except what I have to. I carry cash on me at all times and I keep my gas filled up in my Jeep. All I do everyday is School, Work and Sleep..with the hope that I will find a better paying job by improving my education. Now I have to worry about the damn Government wanting more.

reply to post by thehoneycomb


I pretty much do the same thing. My payroll is direct deposit, but I cash a check to withdraw my money and pay in cash, unless I absolutely cannot (internet purchase-electronic transfer).

Will not work. This is predicated on everyone being able to have a bank account. Considering there is a very large portion of our society that is unable to keep a bank account this would not work. Furthermore, if the lights go out there is no money. That's not going to work. Next problem: How do you deal with yard sales? Farm Stands? Even the government has areas that are cash only because they don't have access to dedicated broadband or credit card processing.

It's just talk, there will be cash of some kind. People will simply make their own currency and the government will have to deal with that.

And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:

And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
Revelation 13:16-17

It's been a long time coming

Originally posted by Apollo7
reply to post by tinker9917

 

What can we do to stop this?

Up here in the Great White North I RARELY see anyone using cash anymore.

I find it extremely annoying. You have your 6 items at the "express" checkout counter only to have some dimwit ahead of you fiddling around with his/her cards because the chip reader won't work (AGAIN) or they forgot their PIN, or they can't figure out which way to stick it in the machine, etc etc

I always pay in cash. I do not own a credit or debit card.

What can you do? Make flyers and post them around town making people aware of the situation, what the changes really mean, etc ??

Start locally, and hope it catches on. It's a matter of convenience for most people unfortunately though. It's easier for them to just pull out this magic card ...

Going fully electronic with regards to commerce is another death knell to freedom in society. It should never be allowed.