Darby-ism, What is It, Who Started It, and Are Believers in It Doomed?

reply to post by pthena


You highlighted everything but God revoking a promise He made. Which was the original claim by jmdewey60.
Can you show me an example of God revoking any promise He made to Jews is particular, or anyone in general?
Father isn't capricious, He delights in keeping His Word as a consistent them throughout scripture..

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by pthena

 

You highlighted everything but God revoking a promise He made. Which was the original claim by jmdewey60.
Can you show me an example of God revoking any promise He made to Jews is particular, or anyone in general?
Father isn't capricious, He delights in keeping His Word as a consistent them throughout scripture..

Are you a mystic and a prophet now, and "channeling" Jesus?
It looks like it to me, that you have mystically "become" the spokesperson of Jesus on Earth.
I guess your newly adopted doctrine of "instant righteousness" has gone to your head where now you think you literally "are" Jesus, and are not merely seen as being "covered" by Christ's righteousness.
I suppose you are now a "Super Apostle" like what Paul was talking about in 2 Corinthians 11:5.

A couple of examples would be The Lord telling Jonah that he was going to destroy Nineveh, and that The Lord told Moses that he was going to destroy Israel and make of Moses a new nation. But I don't think you need earlier examples to say that something could happen, especially in a singular sort of case where The Lord did not create several different successive "nations", destroying each in turn. The Lord made one nation and they did not have faith and especially was that evident when God's only son came to them in person and they rejected him.

You still insist on ignoring my actual words I wrote in my earlier post so that you can build a straw-man. I did not say The Lord or anyone else revoked the promise. The original promise was fulfilled in the individual descendant of Abraham, Jesus, and the benefits have been expanded to the entire world. What did happen was; the people who were to do that themselves, expand their beneficial knowledge of God, instead turned it into a personal possession to be kept for themselves, and holding to the promise as being an end in itself.

reply to post by pthena

There seems to be a certain theme throughout the New Testament that mentions the futility of people claiming to be "children of promise" . . .

And it should be taken as a warning to people who think they are now the children of the promise because they "believe". Faith implies faithfulness, more than a mere intellectual ascent to something being a fact, such as 'Jesus came to earth to save humanity'. It does not necessarily mean you will be saved yourself by just acknowledging this as part of your internal data base of world history.

Originally posted by jmdewey60

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by pthena

 

You highlighted everything but God revoking a promise He made. Which was the original claim by jmdewey60.
Can you show me an example of God revoking any promise He made to Jews is particular, or anyone in general?
Father isn't capricious, He delights in keeping His Word as a consistent them throughout scripture..

Are you a mystic and a prophet now, and "channeling" Jesus?

No. I haven't even been talking about Jesus, I said "Father". Jesus is the Son.

It looks like it to me, that you have mystically "become" the spokesperson of Jesus on Earth.

That's consistent with most your other observations, completely wrong. Hey, can you focus for a second here? I'm not talking about Jesus. It's been over a day now, surely you can provide us with an example of God revoking a promise He made to the Jews. You're the one who claimed God did, so where is the evidence for this? (And I mean Biblical evidence.)

I guess your newly adopted doctrine of "instant righteousness" has gone to your head where now you think you literally "are" Jesus, and are not merely seen as being "covered" by Christ's righteousness.

1. It's not "new".
2. It's not "my" doctrine.
3. No. No one claimed to replace Jesus, heck I'm not even talking about Jesus, but okay.
4. We are "gifted" His righteousness, here do you come up with this nonsense? talking to you is like talking to a person with Alzheimers. Where they forget or confuse basically everything you've previously said.

I suppose you are now a "Super Apostle" like what Paul was talking about in 2 Corinthians 11:5.

I'm not any kind of apostle. They start churches. Did you mean evangelist?

A couple of examples would be The Lord telling Jonah that he was going to destroy Nineveh,

The Lord told Jonah He would destroy Nineveh IF they didn't repent. The people of Nineveh were given a choice, they chose wisely. God didn't revoke any promises to Nineveh, they repented and God KEPT His word not to destroy them in judgment. Congratulations, you provided an example of God keeping His word, not revoking it.

and that The Lord told Moses that he was going to destroy Israel and make of Moses a new nation.

And He did.

The Lord made one nation and they did not have faith and especially was that evident when God's only son came to them in person and they rejected him.

So what? God says He will regather them a second time and glorify Himself in them, NOT for the sake of their faithfulness, but to defend His good name that they had defamed amongst the gentiles wherever the Jews went. Some of the covenants made with Israel were made when Israel was in a condition of unbelief! The promises rest upon God's integrity and faithfulness, not Israel's.

You still insist on ignoring my actual words I wrote in my earlier post so that you can build a straw-man.

I'm ignoring nothing. YOU said God revoked promised to the Jews. I asked for Biblical references to this happening. You made the claim, I've asked you now to provide support. If you want to dictate who responds to your comments and who does not then start a blog, you can disable any comments you don't like.

I did not say The Lord or anyone else revoked the promise.

I never said "the" promise, as in the promise of the Messiah. You said "ones" (plural promises) "just like He did with the Jews", meaning you are claiming God did already revoke "ones" (plural promises) to the Jews.

You said it already happened, multiple times. WHERE???

The original promise was fulfilled in the individual descendant of Abraham, Jesus, and the benefits have been expanded to the entire world.

Correct, but I'm not talking about the promise of the Messiah. That already happened, so we both know God didn't revoke that promise. And you claimed God revoked "promises" to the "Jews". Abraham WAS NOT A JEW! He was a Hebrew. Abraham was the grandfather of Israel (Jacob), he wasn't his son.

What did happen was; the people who were to do that themselves, expand their beneficial knowledge of God, instead turned it into a personal possession to be kept for themselves, and holding to the promise as being an end in itself.

We're not even talking about the promise to Abraham of Christ. First of all, that's not a promise made to Jews, but Abraham and his seed. And secondly, that promise was fulfilled in Christ. Fulfilled promises are not revoked promises.

reply to post by jmdewey60


Here we go, your OWN words:

The reason being, according to the quoted author, that how would the gentiles feel safe in that God is going to keep the promise to them if he took back the ones with the Jews.

You said God revoked promises (plural) that He made with the Jews.

reply to post by jmdewey60

The Lord did not create several different successive "nations", destroying each in turn.

How do you know this? Is it not true that there were civilizations with quite impressive abilities before this era? Archaeologists and divers are constantly finding relics and ruins of other quite advanced civilizations right here on Earth. How do you know what or who destroyed them? How do you know that we aren't a colony of a mighty race of humanoids that span the universe?

The Lord made one nation and they did not have faith and especially was that evident when God's only son came to them in person and they rejected him.

I disagree with ya here, friend.
What I'm leaning toward is that Jesus came as a perfect, divine being to let us know that we also are divine beings. I don't believe in the "chosen people"...we are all chosen, all connected, and all need to know the Truth. He wasn't the first one, either. There have been a few manifestations and there are, according to researchers, several names used throughout various ancient manuscripts.

I think possibly at intervals these occur, and the message is delivered again. So far, everyone has not rallied together which I believe may be the whole point. Until we all get it we are bound to keep faltering.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

Here we go, your OWN words:

I was quoting an author who was in turn quoting another author.
Because I post something, it does not automatically mean it is my opinion.
You have to comprehend the complete sentence and the context.

reply to post by NOTurTypical

. . . God didn't revoke any promises to Nineveh, . . .

When Jonah began to enter the city one day’s walk, he announced, “At the end of forty days, Nineveh will be overthrown!”
Jonah 3:4

And He did.

I suppose now you are using you prophetic gifts to reverse the Bible story as it is in the Old Testament.

So what?

That they killed Jesus. You think that is completely irrelevant. I don't think you are right about what people do not having any relevance.

. . . to defend His good name . . .

The name of The Lord is, Jesus. If you don't think so, then you are really not a Christian and have thrown out the New Testament in favor of the old.

reply to post by wildtimes

How do you know this?

I know it is not in the Bible, and that was what he was asking for, an example. apparently where some divine entity going by YHWH, or some other name, is promising nations to be his chosen people and then later reversing that. My point is you are not going to find such a thing in a book which is all about themselves being the chosen people.

I disagree with ya here, friend.

When I am saying all that, what I mean is, "according to the Old Testament" which of course is slanted in favor of the people who wrote it.

R.C. Sproul:

We believe that the Church is essentially Israel. We believe that the answer to, “What about the Jews?” is “Here we are.”

Arnold Fruchtenbaum:

Too bad you were not declaring this on the streets of Berlin around 1941.