Egyptian Military Using Nerve Gas on Protesters

reply to post by bekod


I was thinking about this, but I think what we are seeing is a a low form of Cyanogen chloride,( blood agent) combined with a low yeild VX . Something like what you described above but with a twist. The US have Never made anything like that. know any country that has? I know Russia has nothing like this either.

That is a good read.

reply to post by SJE98
the only country that makes this is China, ill go back and see where that post is.

So they protested for democracy and they still didn't get it (it is after all still an Arab country).

In the USA they are protesting against democracy (in reality).

The world is so funny

yea well they do not call it a circus for nothing, or it that a marry go round? , back to the topic www.abovetopsecret.com... this is the post that ;links china to CR gas manufacturing if any one would be willing to pay with nasty stuff , it would be them... just saying.

here is the VX never agent chem makeup www.cbwinfo.com...

Synonyms: EA1701
O-Ethyl S-(2-diisopropylaminoethyl) methylphosphonothioate
O-Ethyl S-(2-diisopropylaminoethyl) methylthiophosphonate
O-Ethyl S-diisopropylaminoethyl methylphosphonothioate
S-2-Diisopropylaminoethyl O-ethyl methylphosphonothioate
S-[2-(Diisopropylamino)ethyl] O-ethyl methylphosphonothiolate
TX60

be back with the CR makeup here is the chem makeup for CR www.lookchem.com...

Detail of > 257-07-8

CAS Number:
257-07-8
Name:
Dibenz[b,f][1,4]oxazepine
Formula:
C13H9 N O
Molecular Structure:
Molecular Structure of 257-07-8 (Dibenz[b,f][1,4]oxazepine)
Synonyms:
CR; CR(lacrimator); NSC 293779
Molecular Weight:
195.23
Density:
1.16g/cm3
Boiling Point:
329.3°Cat760mmHg
Flash Point:
125°C
Safety:
Poison by intraperitoneal and intravenous routes. Moderately toxic by ingestion and inhalation. Experimental teratogenic and reproductive effects. A human skin and eye irritant. Questionable carcinogen with experimental carcinogenic and tumorigenic data. When heated to decomposition it emits toxic fumes of NOx.Details

edit on 24-11-2011 by bekod because: (no reason given)

Originally posted by Corruption Exposed
reply to post by Expat888

 

Thanks for the feedback

Here is a picture of the alleged canisters from the ABC link I posted on page one just in case anyone missed it.

edit on 23-11-2011 by Corruption Exposed because: (no reason given)

I'm not looking at that picture with much detail, especially since the zoom-up occupies most of the canister view, but there is something striking me as odd:

Why is the safety pin on the grenade still on? It's that round thing close to the top, like a key-hanger. From a first glance it looks to me like the safety pin is still on, and I can't see if the trigger (the "plate" that pops after you take the safety pin) is still on (which would prove it wasn't armed)...

There is no use in throwing a grenade without arming it, it's really rather stupid. Which makes me wonder if someone is showing those grenades with "Made in USA" for some type of parallel agenda.

And like some other members have stated, let's not jump steps and take wrong conclusions, there is no evidence that supports the fact that the actual canisters made in USA are the ones responsible for the deaths or even hazardous symptoms.

During a riot control all sorts of measures are taken, from water cannons to tear-gas grenades and/or projectiles fired from a grenade launcher, or shotgun for rubber bullets. Saying that USA is somewhat responsible because of one canister that says "Made in USA" is found in a protest where thousands of other projectiles are used, is a bit stretching the correct view of things.

It's possible, if not even provable that they are using US made crowd control measures, and also using other types of ammunition. Don't forget that this whole revolution in Egypt is lasting for months, even from the first "episode". Again, its very provable that they have ran out of anti-crowd ammunition, and using anything that is available, unless someone unknown is supplying them non-stop.

In case they are running out of ammunition to control the crowd, I wouldn't be surprised if they re-use or manipulate the ammunition canisters that they have in order to control the crowd, which opens the door for wrong doing in the "recipe" of the chemical, causing the symptoms we are seeing, and that practice, allied with ignorance, makes the projectiles (if they are being manipulated or re-used) very, very dangerous and lethal.

On a side note and to be fair to the argument, I wouldn't be surprised if this was actually supplied by the US. Not saying it was, I actually don't think the US has any fault at this instance, but let's not forget that the US didn't hold back with using Napalm in Vietnam, for instance... Or using uranium shells during the Kosovo conflict, that some studies suggest it causes the same type of poisoning of other radioactive materials.

Again, not saying the US is the puppet-master behind this, I just think it's too uncertain to call any responsibilities. At least for now.

reply to post by Tifozi


There have been reports of the crowd finding some of the people throwing these canisters and lynching them. This may have been found before it was used. There have also been MANY canisters found. If you go back a page or two you will find link I provided that brings you to the website of the company who sells these. These are made in Pennsylvania. The canisters were made in the USA but we have no idea where the chemicals came from since the buyer of the canisters loads them after they're purchased.

You're not going to able to pass this one off as anti American propaganda, sorry. I think you may be looking into it too much.

reply to post by Xcathdra


I have seen sources saying it was used in the 50's too, but then I read it was first synthesized in 62.
Either way they are pushing it using this stuff. Even though it's not nerve gas, it can be a deadly irritant and isn't going to help the situation or gain any support elsewhere.

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


Another source, regardless if you hate Russia, its still true.


rt.com...

Will Obama invade Egypt now that Egyptian military is killing people for the fun of it? Will we see what happend in Libya happen in Egypt? Will NATO start bombing the Egyptian military like they did in Libya for the SAME REASONS? Only time can tell.

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


They thought Mubarak was bad?

This is not democracy taking a hold
it is a militant Islamic regime taking power..

reply to post by Tifozi


Diamond in the rough post there...


Nail hit on the head it is being used as a propaganda piece!!

Originally posted by SJE98
This is not a CR Agent. reason number 1 , there coughing up blood., number 2 asphyxiation . This tells me one thing. This must be some sort low yield nerve agent some sort of form of CX agent. no dought in my mind what so ever. The made is USA are the CS grenades. that appears to propaganda by the media trying to associate this so called nerve agent with the U.S. My guess is what ever this is that is being used, you can bet it will be colorless.

I have been exposed to both CS and CR agents in my military training and done some study in this field as well. What these people are describing is some sort of nerve agent. ( whatever it is is not in the US arsenal) I'm not going to get in details about never agents. There are two tell tale signatures of a nerve agent 1, nerve agents draw blood internally from the lungs 2, asphyxiation occurs in the lungs,because your downing in your own blood, The other symptoms of a full blow nerve agent are, is blood being drawn though the skin and eyes. What we are seeing is only two of the symptoms of a full nerve agent gas CX , but yet this gas still has two of the main signature of a full nerve agent. I seen the film of this kid shaking on the ground, and trying to breath( Neuro Toxic Symptoms) from Egypt ( That is a nerve agent )

These symptoms that we are seeing in Egypt seem to be of a lessor nerve agent, but yet have a Neuro Toxic signature. it is NOT a CR Agent. No way no how. Also keep in mind most forms of nerve agents are colorless, the thick white smoke is CS.

If any of the riot police are carrying anything on their hip or leg that even might resemble a Nerve Agent Antidote Kit, AKA ,MARK I. then this would tell us that this is some sort of nerve agent. also see if any of the police are wearing any charcoal type garments. yet another indicator that this low yield nerve agent. A MD also mention the drug he was administering. that drug is also used in many military nerve agent kits around the world. ( Diazepam )

It might also help to look for Cans of some type in these photos like the size of coffee can or maybe even a soup can size' placed near a curb, in the street, or crushed on the street. (Not cylinder delivery systems in the photos posted or grenades)

Another way to find out is ask a Russian soldier. Russian soldiers used to train with real nerve agents , up to the 1980's They might shed some light on this as well.

edit on 24-11-2011 by SJE98 because: (no reason given)

How Nerve agents really work Nerve Agent wiki
:::

Poisoning by a nerve agent leads to contraction of pupils, profuse salivation, convulsions, involuntary urination and defecation, and eventual death by asphyxiation as control is lost over respiratory muscles. Some nerve agents are readily vaporized or aerosolized and the primary portal of entry into the body is the respiratory system. Nerve agents can also be absorbed through the skin, requiring that those likely to be subjected to such agents wear a full body suit in addition to a respirator.

How blood agents work Blood Agent wiki
:::

The symptoms of blood agent poisoning depend on concentration and duration. Cyanide-based blood agents irritate the eyes and the respiratory tract, while arsine is nonirritating.[2] Hydrogen cyanide has a faint, bitter, almond odor that only about half of all people can smell. Arsine has a very faint garlic odor detectable only at greater than fatal concentrations.[1] Exposure to small amounts of cyanide has no effect.[2] Higher concentrations cause dizziness, weakness and nausea, which cease with the exposure, but long-time exposure can cause mild symptoms followed by permanent brain damage and muscle paralysis.[2] Moderate exposure causes stronger and longer-lasting symptoms, including headache, that can be followed by convulsions and coma. Stronger or longer exposure will also lead to convulsions and coma. Very strong exposure causes severe toxic effects within seconds, and rapid death.[2] The blood of people killed by blood agents is bright red, because the agents inhibit the use of the oxygen in it by the body's cells.[2] Cyanide poisoning can be detected by the presence of thiocyanate or cyanide in the blood, a smell of bitter almonds, or respiratory tract inflammations and congestions in the case of cyanogen chloride poisoning.[2] There is no specific test for arsine poisoning, but it may leave a garlic smell on the victim's breath.[2]

Hey man, I dont mean to correct but blood agents and nerve agents are different...You describe blood agents and are calling them Nerve Agents.....The OP is about mislabeling by the media of CR Gas as a Nerve Agent. You seem to know what you are talking about until you call Blood Agents Nerve Agents....As long as we are here we may as well get the stories strait.

the more I think about your description I think of BIO Agents...a nasty little bug based on Ebola comes to mind