We As Americans

I am not the most staunch supporter of the Occupy Movement as I disagree with a lot of what they are for, but I do agree with some of it as well. I am a working class American who has served his country in the US Army and work for the government as a mediocre civil servant etc.. I was a member of the Armed Services because I believed in what America stands for and that it was worth defending. I find myself torn at the moment as a citizen and as a veteran. I fought for your right to protest and speak your mind. What I see now is sickening to me. I do not understand why the police act the way they do, and more so why the governments and hierarchy of the respective cities allow them to continue to do so.

If there is anything that I have always had an issue with in any of the places I have lived or been; It's the police force. Aside from collection agencies it seems to be the most popular place for the bullies and assholes of society to go. Not saying all cops are bad but seriously the good ones never speak up against there "brothers in blue" I have always had a distinct issue with any group that has there own "clique" such as cops not writing other cops tickets. I don't care what city or town you are in you will see them running red lights, speeding, parking illegally, and anything else that they will turn around and cite someone for doing 10 mins later or earlier.

The thing that really irks me is the way I have seen cops acting with the Occupy movement specifically NY and Oakland. There behavior is intolerable and unacceptable. I also do not understand why we the people are not doing more to stop this. Whether you agree or disagree with the point at hand it is there right to protest, and it's a right that many many men and women have died for over the years. Also aside from those trying to gain political favor by siding with the occupiers the vast majority of the government is either not paying attention, doesn't care, or is just waiting for them to go away. It's sad that we as Americans are still sitting here allowing our government to ignore the people and continue on as business as usual.

The people are speaking and they're voices are falling on deaf ears. In my own town the protestors were ousted from there camp after the city said they could stay, because the state said no. I fail to understand how anyone can be thrown or removed from a public place.. I can understand stopping them from sleeping on the streets etc, but why do the protestors continue to be bullied by the local municipalities or state government. I guess what I am saying is not get violent but start standing up for these young men and women. If you are a taxpayer or a citizen of the US then I say the time is now to speak up. I understand if you don't want to take to the streets and I'm not suggestion you should agree with the Occupiers hell I don't even agree with them 100%. What I am saying is tell the powers that be, the government, whatever you want to call them that the it is time to start listening to us again. Write or email your local representatives, write or email the white house, write or email your city officials, write an editorial. Speak up. If enough of us speak up they can't continue to ignore us.

I for one am sick of working nearly 80hrs a week and still struggling to survive while there are those that don't work by choice and get all the assistance they want or need. I am trying to keep myself fed, and I am barely getting by where is the assistance for those who do contribute to society and do work for a living? Where is the government when it's people need bailouts? Where is the government when the people of America are calling for them to do something different? They continue with business as usual and just continue to ignore the people knowing that inevitably the people will go away or be thrown in jail by the overzealous police force. How long before they just call in the National Guard to keep the peace (shut them up). This country was founded on the ability to protest and demonstrate your constitutional rights and they are throwing the constitution out the window. I for one have already written letters to those that serve me. This is the time to speak up about all the problems you have with the way things are. I do not think we need total change, but it's time for change.

reply to post by Phantom28804


You are spot on. I will say it this way. We just need a million ( 500,000 in front of The White House and 500,000 in fornt of The Capitol saying "Change you can believe in soon" and that would probably do it.. thanks op for the thread s/f

Questions that have plagued my mind for many moons. I honestly blame the very idea of pacifism, hey but that's just my own thinking.

reply to post by Phantom28804

Being a veteran myself and a former civil servant, I agree with many of your points. But the problem is there is no cohesive message. Everyone has a grievance and they think that it should be first and foremost.

What diluted the Tea Party will also dilute the OWS. But the OWS dilution will be done through violence. The writing is already on the wall. It’s the 60’s all over again.

reply to post by violence=answer


I disagree as I do not think violence answers anything. The only thing violence will achieve is giving them more reason to take action against us. It gives them more reason to demonize the actions we as a people have the right to take.

reply to post by TDawgRex


I agree and that is actually one of my biggest beefs with the Occupy movement is they need to narrow down there protest instead of as I have said before running the car to a garage and telling the mechanic it's broken fix it. The system has been broken for a long time. the first big change we as a country need is to end the two party system as they have had control long enough. The Socialist agenda is at a crucible and this is the really in my eyes a turning point. We are kind of like a frog sitting in a pot of water and by the time we realize we are being cooked it's to late.

I'm sure this quote has been posted ad nauseum, but it is more than relevant:

"Those who make peaceful protest impossible will make violent protest inevitable." - John F. Kennedy

Apparently, TPTB are going to force this to go violent. I figured they would just ridicule the protest in the mainstream media and then hope it would go away. But throw in some cops with a penchant for bullying and cruelty, and you have the perfect storm for a civil war.

reply to post by Phantom28804


I agree with everything except the last sentence. I think it's long past time that we remove this disgusting crap from our society. I agree with some cops being bullies and law breakers.

Originally posted by TDawgRex
reply to post by Phantom28804

 

Being a veteran myself and a former civil servant, I agree with many of your points. But the problem is there is no cohesive message. Everyone has a grievance and they think that it should be first and foremost.

What diluted the Tea Party will also dilute the OWS. But the OWS dilution will be done through violence. The writing is already on the wall. It’s the 60’s all over again.

My dad reminded me that Vietnam ended his first year of high school. He personally remembers the unrest from Vietnam, and he figures people that really remember the violence of it are going to be mighty upset when this round does the same.

I am quite conservative, and I figure 90% of the Occupy protesters either got the wrong idea, or no real clear idea. That said I keep hearing about the 1% that have it all and then the rest of us. I don't think anybody owes me anything I didn't earn. However I am quite skilled at what I do, and I work hard and work long. I am not sure of how the system needs to change exactly, I sure don't believe in redistribution of wealth by the government. However I do recognize the sentiment of the OWS protesters, and those that are true to that cause I stand by. Maybe a larger scale protest in the form of massive work place walkouts would send a message. Is there enough of us out there that could miss a weeks pay to join these folks in mass for a week? Let our CEO's know they need to take a little less and let the workers that make their companies make a little more? I would give it a go.

Originally posted by Evolutionsend
reply to post by Phantom28804

 

I agree with everything except the last sentence. I think it's long past time that we remove this disgusting crap from our society. I agree with some cops being bullies and law breakers.

What? Are you serious?

reply to post by discharged77


Very. We are looking at the results, and not at the problem. The problems in this country go deep, and we can't sustain those problems forever. If by large changes you include changing the way Americans think. I saw this little quote in an episode of DS9 tonight, "Ferengi do not want to change how people are taken advantage of, they want to be the one taking advantage of others". Wisdom can be found in many places and that statement describes our country right now. Everyone that calls out OWS are the ones that desire to be the one on top and taking advantage, so they disagree with OWS.

reply to post by Evolutionsend


Really?

Did you ask everyone who is opposed to OWS and their ideas?

reply to post by Phantom28804


I would love to be able to believe that mans nature has gone past the need for violence, though mans very actions up until this day and age has given me very little reason to believe we are as humane as we would like to believe. I always find it funny that nobody likes the idea of violence, but the reality is it exists. As I am a rational thinking human being I honestly cant bring myself to believe that the powers that be are going to just hand it over. I always give peace a chance, though when I watch men and women whom I don't even fully agree with getting beat and humiliated, screaming and begging for help. Pleading for the authority's to stop, my heart just stops. Though this is not what enrages me no not the police brutality, rather the hundreds of people that just stand around allowing it to happen... Idle passers just watching in awe! Men just standing there filming. I mean Wow! The question always runs through my head, why are these people allowing this? I mean lock the fools in an arm-lock or something. Kick him in the head do something to get that person out of that situation, not to just hurt but to help. But know pacifism teaches us to just deal with it, let it pass justice will be served we will be right in the end even if it cost us our lives. I am sorry but it just seems naive to me. When is enough actually enough do thousands half to die? Hell at the end of the day I hope I'm wrong. But I never enter a movement under a peaceful banner its set up for disaster, making the people all the easier to walk all over. Personally I am no an door mat, so violence will always be my answer.

reply to post by projectvxn


Ask? Why would you ask someone if they're dishonest and greedy? Would you really expect an honest answer?

reply to post by Evolutionsend


I'm not dishonest or greedy.

I tend to speak my mind and say what I mean.

And while I believe I should keep what I earn, I am a very charitable person.

I'm also very suspicious of OWS and do not stand with them.