What are we really upset by?

reply to post by blazenresearcher

The government working for us is the biggest lie ever sold on the international market.
Something is wrong with us, but I think we can heal ourselves. We have to insist that we have that right.

reply to post by SirClem


Of course we have that right...only collectively we can enforce it! Please, I am not for violence at all...even confrontation upsets me to a degree. However...non-compliance on a mass scale is the only way out.

I'm sure I'll be flagged for that statement......oh well, there is only so much philosophy and metaphsyics that I want to discuss...sometimes is redundant....

reply to post by blazenresearcher

Collectively, we have more power. That is true, but it is also a statement that you make AFTER the fact.
In other words, we shouldn't wait until we think we have overwhelming numbers. We must act out of principle.
This is a war, but it doesn't have to be a violent war. We just quietly do what we know needs to be done.
This is new territory. The world is changing fast. We should realize we are not governed by a legitimate government. How that happened is a whole other topic and discussion.

reply to post by SirClem


Yes, but I've also realized that sitting and reading a conspiracy theory website will not change anything. However, to go out everyday and consciously make a subtle change....by your choices is what we should be doing. Also, we must do the work within...that is what this time if for....Yes it is horrible and I cringe daily at the atrocities, but I believe the time and place will present itself.

reply to post by blazenresearcher

I feel your pain, I really do.
I am sure I could do more than I do. Truth is, I really don't know what to do....

I think that most people have come to the realization that to get ahead you generally have to screw someone else and they don't want to do that so they "drop off" or underachieve while keeping their principles.

reply to post by SirClem


Just know that you...within yourself, want a change and that the choices that you have in life, you can decide how to move forward. Yes, it is hard in the world (prison) that we live in and it will take generations...but by your saying NO...I won't stand for this...even subtly is a start.

I don't want to be labeled "New Agey" or anything like that....I would just like to see peaceful change. So, I try to tell everyone to bring out your own peaceful warrior....we all have one.

reply to post by sligtlyskeptical


That is true to get ahead...you have to take it in the inner sanctum of your integrity and decency....it sucks...Just say No...is all that I can say!

I think that a great deal of the anger and malcontent in Western society today (I'm only talking about the Western world because that's all I know about) is conditioned. We are taught, to a substantial degree, to be unthinking emotional creatures. I'm not saying that it's intentional or that there's a vast conspiracy, but I still believe that condition occurs.

Look at the forms of mindless entertainment that are ubiquitous in our society. Movies, television shows, and even many books celebrate and explore emotion without any appeal to the intellect. We grow up seeing people do stupid and crazy things for "love" and come to believe in the Disney fairy-tale world. We grow up seeing, hearing, and reading about violence originating in anger. There's a serious disconnect between reason and emotion.

And, regardless of whether or not it is intentional, this conditioning is useful for many.

Look at advertising, for instance. The cosmetics industry relies on inducing feelings of insecurity; they have no *logical* reasons for purchasing their products in many cases. Movie trailers try to get the adrenaline pumping, they don't try to appeal to intellect. The "emotional appeal" is one of the most useful argumentative techniques. Sure, it's fallacious, but people fall for it so easily. "Well, eating meat is bad because watch this video of an animal suffering!" That's an emotional appeal--watching suffering triggers an emotional response. There are many reasonable ways to protest eating meat, but anti meat-eaters usually go with emotional responses because that's what we respond best to. Look at our present situation in the middle east, even. Is it a reasoned or emotional response that explains the fact that many Americans still support the war efforts?

In summary, a greater unity between intellect and emotion is needed. It is important to logically analyze emotional responses in order to determine if acting based on them is reasonable. In many cases, feelings of anger and malcontent can be greatly reduced simply by realizing that they are stupid and baseless.

Originally posted by SirClem
reply to post by NorEaster

 

I believe it is happening. I don't think there is any commercial purpose in bringing that news to us.
Our personal interpretation of what is real is so narrow, and most of that is controlled by commercial interests.
The federal government seems to be only an enforcement arm of huge corporations. Doesn't anybody else see this?

Okay, we agree on that point. That Tea Party stuff is pushback from the corporates against anything that smacks of seizing control away from "the Private Sector" (ie: Wall Street and it's criminal cabal). Then, that same marketing arm of the corporate elite accuses the feds of jackboot thuggery if they try to pull away from Wall Street's stranglehold, and the lunchpail crowd cheers them on. It's gotten pretty effed up over the last few years, what with this administration getting hammered for trying to crowbar Wall Street's hand out of our Treasury and all. Just so that you know where I'm coming from as I look at the implications of what you've suggested.

They kill people in so many different ways it is just mind boggling to me. If they aren't killing you outright, they are preventing you from healing yourself, and that is the same thing as killing you.

Again, I can only agree with you to the degree that you're referring to the corporate henchmen that have been fighting back against the effort to push Wall Street, and the global business elite, from the backrooms of Congress. If you're suggesting that Obama is trying to prevent me from healthcare access, then you're out there on your own. That bullsh*t has been thoroughly discredited as being a tactic of the professional corporate media and its bottomfeeding punditry, meant to derail any efforts to shut down the predatory practices of the health insurance industry.

If we are part of an international organization, like NATO, and NATO is killing innocent people, they are killing us.

And, where is NATO gratuitously slaughtering people? In Libya? Egypt? Are you one of those "NATO is setting up concentration camps here in the US" folks? I guess I don't fall in with that sort of thinking, since I'm more dependent on actual proof of major atrocities, and with so much of the world engaged in their own versions of same, I'm not seeing NATO as a real performer in that specific arena.

You simply cannot kill innocent people. If you are party to that, you are party to your own destruction. You are committing suicide in the worst possible way. A slow but sure poisoning of the soul.
It is SO clear to me, but so many people are trying to "debate"...
At some point we, collectively, are going to have to take to the streets. I fear we will be in rags at that time.

I'd be careful of who you're following into the streets, and why they have you in the streets in the first place. The Communists had people in the streets, the Nazis had people in the streets. The streets are a pretty popular destination for most really destructive movements, and it's folks like you (all emotional and stuff) who end up opening the doors for those bastards to come in and really f*ck things up for everyone.

Positive reform isn't easy, and it isn't quick. It sure as hell isn't exciting or romantic. It's boring and tedious as all hell, and the only exciting part of it is ripping the heads off those *ssholes who have been seduced by the elites who are trying to prevent positive change from occurring. And it sucks to have to take those poor bastards down, because those are the people who - if they'd been more careful of whose "truth" they'd embraced - would've been the ones to benefit directly from that positive change.

They say that when you're saving a drowning man, the most dangerous part of the effort is being killed by the man himself as he thrashes. It can happen that you have to cold-cock the guy to save his life. Rescuing societies can be very similar, and in our case, it may very well be that a certain % of this society may have to be harshly dealt with on behalf of the majority that deserves a better shot at overall survival. The Wall St. elites have proven that they don't care about any of us, and that their control over our government is a threat to our survival. Those who fight to preserve their domination - even if it's due to being duped by the professional marketing efforts of those criminal elites - will have to be taken out as well, and that's going to really suck. The hope would be that they'd take a good look at what they've been defending, but that hope is fading.

reply to post by petrus4


hey, take a step back, check out some mellow tunes ie Sally oldfield, "water bearer". any who I think all this hatred and anger is coming from the lack of morals, honesty, ethics and core values that have been thrown in the can. many of us out here still carry them. all that you see and have to put up with is coming to an end. I won't go into a lot of detail but, there is a sht storm like you would never believe coming our way. All I can tell you is thaT AFTER ITS' DONE , NO OF THIS WILL MATTER.

reply to post by petrus4


not sure about others, but when people post positive responses and hear you out, that makes one feel better. positive and civil interaction. wish we saw more of that here.