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Norwegian Terrorist Manifesto: Christianity vs Secularism

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posted on Jul, 24 2011 @ 05:05 PM
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Religiously Motivated Manifesto?




Christian political thought therefore cannot concede that the secular realm should have
been, should be or should remain, in the hands of a godless ideology.


So it appears this could be somewhat of a religiously motivated attack.

Shown in the manifesto are frustrations and concerns voiced towards the ‘ideology of reason’ and an agenda on behalf of Christianity to "reclaim the commanding heights of media, parliaments, coucnnils, business and goverment authority"

The manifesto can be found HERE


Christianity’s presence in the structures of power that mould the paradigm of culture and
society. Christians must reclaim the commanding heights of media, parliaments, councils,
business and governmental authority. They must storm the walls between church and
state and remove all traces of Liberal Modernity. They must do so from an authentically
Christian narrative and worldview.


The manifesto seems to be defending a percieved Christian injustice in world affairs:-


This forced conversion of society has pushed the Christian faith back into a metaphysical
box, where some argued it would die an irrelevant death


References are made regarding the "enlightenment elite" or the secular left:-


This ‘wall’, has become the means via which the state
has secured power away from the church and is challenging the identity of Christians as
well. Attacking our beliefs and values and presenting modern liberal alternatives in short
all that makes us who we are as Christians by presenting alternatives with the
assumption that these alternatives are better and the polemical engagement of the
‘enlightenment’ elite.


Here we see there is a concern for the separation of church and state, this separation that is written into the American constitution which allows for freedom of religion and freedom from it.

The story is starting to unravel, he appears to be a Christian and militant zionist.....

Again, here is the link:-

politisktinkorrekt.info...

REFERENCES



***SEE SECTION: 2.85 A future Christian identity for Europe?******

****PAGES 695-699****

EDIT TO ADD:-

The word "Christian" appears 2247 times in the manifesto.
edit on 24-7-2011 by ExistentialNightmare because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 24 2011 @ 07:47 PM
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Please note this was within a 1,500-page document written in English, said to be by Mr Breivik - posted under the pseudonym of Andrew Berwick - was also put online hours before the attacks.

Peace



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 05:53 AM
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I was thinking this yesterday.

Is there now going to be a war between Christians and Muslims within Europe as a result of what this individual has done?

Are those who are extremists within Islam going to hit back? Or those who accept Multiculturalism.

Either way if they is another attack I can see this escalating.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 06:21 AM
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One thing I have noticed also. No Christian Denomination, have come out and condemmed what this individual has done. Doesnt anyone find this bizzare?



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 06:24 AM
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Originally posted by AnonymousFem
One thing I have noticed also. No Christian Denomination, have come out and condemmed what this individual has done. Doesnt anyone find this bizzare?


I wouldn't call it bizarre, a little hypocritical maybe, had this been muslim terrorism, we would be demanding the moderate Muslims speak out about it.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 06:27 AM
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reply to post by AnonymousFem
 



Is there now going to be a war between Christians and Muslims within Europe as a result of what this individual has done?


Nope.

When the research is done it will be Jews, Christians and Muslims against Zionist Extremists.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 06:28 AM
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reply to post by woodwardjnr
 


Well Leaders from Muslim groups usually do, come out to either condemn or to praise the attacks. Now why is the Leaders from Christian groups not condemning this? That to me is rather bizarre to say the least.

Are they staying silent, in case of a backlash from these so called far right groups?
edit on 25-7-2011 by AnonymousFem because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 06:30 AM
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reply to post by woodwardjnr
 


Because Islamic attacks are cheered by groups like the Muslim Brotherhood, propaganda and preaching within Deobandi Movements don't exactly condemn the attacks; they are done as a group effort, in the name of Allah. (I'm not suggesting ALL Muslims cheer the success of the Holy war)

These attacks were by a single case of extreme nationalist ideology or frustration at a percieved failure of multiculturism. You can read his manifesto and find that he is a Christian Nationalist and a Zionist.

Killer could argue that he had a reason, whereas Muslims are fighting for a Holy War, and fully expecting paradise for their percieved justice for the cause of Allah.
edit on 25-7-2011 by ExistentialNightmare because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:26 AM
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Originally posted by AnonymousFem
One thing I have noticed also. No Christian Denomination, have come out and condemmed what this individual has done. Doesnt anyone find this bizzare?


Really? You need Christians to come out and condemn murder of innocent people?? That should be common sense, don't murder people. But since it will make you sleep better at night:


Official Statement by Christians:

"We Christians condemn murder of innocent people. Christ taught to love, bless, and serve our enemies not shoot them."



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:30 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Shame they wern't doing that during the Crusades.

They very much thought they were justified in the killing, they thought they had a Holy warrant, some still do, Deobandi movements of Islam definetly feel these have divine warrant for their violence.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:31 AM
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reply to post by ExistentialNightmare
 



The word "Christian" appears 2247 times in the manifesto.



So? You have a wacked-out nutjob psycho. That's it. He's no different than the crazy lady that drown her children in the bathtub because she was convinced they had demons inside them. He's insane. You cannot prevent insane people from picking up a Bible, a Quran or any other book and reading it. And if there were no books, there would still be crazy people finding another reason for mass murder.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:36 AM
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Originally posted by ExistentialNightmare
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


Shame they wern't doing that during the Crusades.

They very much thought they were justified in the killing, they thought they had a Holy warrant, some still do, Deobandi movements of Islam definetly feel these have divine warrant for their violence.


Talk to the medieval Catholics about that. During the inquisitions it was the Christians who were being murdered.. by the millions. And why are we talking about Muslims now? They have nothing to do with Christianity.

I've been through the Bible numerous times and still can't find Christ ever teaching to torture, to murder et cetra. So if a person is doing these things by default they are not following Christ or His teachings. I can tell you all I'm a millionaire all I want to, but if you look at my bank account and it says $2.15 I'm not a millionaire despite how much I claimed I was.

Actions speak louder than words, it works that way in Christianity too. Not everyone who says they are really are, the proof is in the pudding.




edit on 25-7-2011 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:38 AM
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reply to post by AnonymousFem
 


I know it doesn't count for much, but I condemn it!

I don't see the left hitting back with violence. I really don't. With more restrictions on freedoms like gun control, yes, but not violence.

I can't say the same for the parents of the kids on that island. If there were any Muslim children attacked, I can see it escalate because it gives the fundamentalists on the other side a reason, a banner to fly. "We're doing it for the children!" That will probably be the same banner the left will fly to get more restrictions on speech and arms passed. (Both parties have used kids to further their agendas in the US)

Whether it is a god or a country or a state, fundamentalism to a cause is dangerous. The word "mental" is right there in the middle! Fundamentalism, not a believe in a god or cause is dangerous. Fundamentalists on all sides of the religious and political spectrum scare me because there is no reasoning with them.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:44 AM
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Reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


So glad we can have this view about a Christian terrorist.....what about the Muslim ones?


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 08:48 AM
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European conservatives tend to loathe Americanisms like separation of Church and State. One of the largest political parties in Germany is the Christian Democracy Party, for example. These are ignorant, provincial thinkers like the Tea Party in America that want to establish a theocracy (point and case). The difference between American and European conservatives i this case is that European monarchies were traditionally theocratic, ruled by divinely-appointed monarchs, and the USA was unofficially ruled as a republic of Christians. The introduction of American ideologies of Democracy and Liberalism to post-war Europe brought real liberalism to that godforsaken continent.

This Norwegian jerk is just one example of the rollback of Liberalism across the First World. The Tea Party, which rejects EVERYTHING gained in the 20th Century; the Conservative victories in Britain and the commonwealths, the creeping Islamophobic fascism on the Continent; the return of Putin-ish power to Russia. The general trend in the first world is away from liberty and towards "moral re-armament" (wiki).

Hooray fascism!


reply to post by AnonymousFem
 


This was an attack against liberal/secular democracy, if anything I would imagine that Muslim extremists are sympathetic to this guy's attack on Free Religion.


edit on 25-7-2011 by SmedleyBurlap because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 09:01 AM
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Originally posted by acmpnsfal
Reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


So glad we can have this view about a Christian terrorist.....what about the Muslim ones?




Again, when did this thread become about Islam?? I thought we all gathered here today to blame Jesus and Christians.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 09:18 AM
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Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by acmpnsfal
Reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


So glad we can have this view about a Christian terrorist.....what about the Muslim ones?




Again, when did this thread become about Islam?? I thought we all gathered here today to blame Jesus and Christians.



So what's your view on Muslim terrorists? They're not "TRUE" Muslims, are they? Or have you read the scripture they preach and base their actions on?

(It's very much related so don't claim this is off-topic)

This thread is to discuss concerns written in the terrorist manifesto regarding about Secularism and Modern Liberalism.

reply to post by SmedleyBurlap
 


Thanks for your two cents.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 09:24 AM
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reply to post by ExistentialNightmare
 



So what's your view on Muslim terrorists? They're not "TRUE" Muslims, are they? Or have you read the scripture they preach and base their actions on?


Ask a Muslim perhaps? I'm only qualified to tell you what Jesus taught, not Muhammad.


(It's very much related so don't claim this is off-topic)

This thread is to discuss concerns written in the terrorist manifesto regarding about Secularism and Modern Liberalism.


What does the bolded "Religiously Motivated Manifesto" question mean? No, it's not "religiously motivated"..

it's a nutjob psychotic mass-murderer. The world had those before Jesus was born.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 09:34 AM
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reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm not going to start an argument and have to quote abhorrent dogma from the New Testament.

And besides, you didn't know Christ, you don't know what's Christ-like and what isn't., you just take the bible word for word, like many Muslims take the Quran word for word. Unfortunately, there's a much clearer focus on a Holy War in the Quran than in the bible.

You've read pages 695 to 699? What's your opinion, what do you agree with? What do you not agree with?

I assume you've read it, as you seem to know it's not religiously motivated.



posted on Jul, 25 2011 @ 09:45 AM
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Originally posted by ExistentialNightmare
reply to post by NOTurTypical
 


I'm not going to start an argument and have to quote abhorrent dogma from the New Testament.


Whew, that's a relief.


And besides, you didn't know Christ, you don't know what's Christ-like and what isn't., you just take the bible word for word, like many Muslims take the Quran word for word. Unfortunately, there's a much clearer focus on a Holy War in the Quran than in the bible.


Hmm, the ONLY record we have of what Jesus taught and did is in the New Testament from the apostles who walked around with Him for 3 1/2 years. And again, why are you talking to me about Muslims/Islam? I'm not Muslim, I don't practice Islam. I think Allah is a Babylonian moon God. I don't read the Quran.


You've read pages 695 to 699? What's your opinion, what do you agree with? What do you not agree with?


No, I haven't read it. I don't need to read it to know if his actions aligned with the teachings of Christ or not. Christ taught to love, bless and serve one's enemies, not to murder them. Didn't I say that already?


I assume you've read it, as you seem to know it's not religiously motivated.


It could be religiously motivated, the psychotic mass-murderer religion. That's why it's unwise to make rash assumptions, you're generally wrong. I don't need to read his insane ramblings to determine if Christ taught for Christians to murder people.




edit on 25-7-2011 by NOTurTypical because: (no reason given)



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