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Why the lack of job growth? Recovery Stalled After Obamacare Passed

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posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 01:02 PM
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Well I can't say that this issue was not discussed in detail around ATS and other forums in the months leading up to the passage of Obamacare. Now, time has passed and the rubber is certainly hitting the road and reality is getting in the way.


Private-sector job creation initially recovered from the recession at a normal rate, leading to predictions last year of a “Recovery Summer.” Since April 2010, however, net private-sector job creation has stalled. Within two months of the passage of Obamacare, the job market stopped improving. This suggests that businesses are not exaggerating when they tell pollsters that the new health care law is holding back hiring. The law significantly raises business costs and creates considerable uncertainty about the future. To encourage hiring, Congress should repeal Obamacare.


Obamacare discourages hiring


The law discourages employers from hiring in several ways:

Businesses with fewer than 50 workers have a strong incentive to maintain this size, which allows them to avoid the mandate to provide government-approved health coverage or face a penalty;
Businesses with more than 50 workers will see their costs for health coverage rise—they must purchase more expensive government-approved insurance or pay a penalty; and
Employers face considerable uncertainty about what constitutes qualifying health coverage and what it will cost. They also do not know what the health care market or their health care costs will look like in four years. This makes planning for the future difficult.


The big stall


In May 2010, the job situation stopped improving. Employers created just 48,000 net jobs, and the trend in job creation changed. Starting in that month, private-sector hiring took a new course, improving by only 6,500 jobs per month—less than one-tenth the previous rate.[8]



Businesses Say Obamacare Is Holding Them Back

The fact that improvements in the job market ground to a halt after Congress passed Obamacare does not prove that the health care law caused it—correlation cannot prove causation. However, the fact does lend strong weight to the voices of businesses who say that the law is preventing hiring.

In a recent survey, 33 percent of business owners said the health care law was either their greatest or second-greatest obstacle to new hiring.[11] Federal Reserve officials report similar concerns. Dennis Lockhart, President of the Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta, reports that:

In addition to slow and uncertain revenue growth, contacts in this recovery are frequently citing a number of other factors that are impeding hiring. Prominent among these is the lack of clarity about the cost implications of the recent health care legislation. We’ve frequently heard strong comments to the effect of “my company won’t hire a single additional worker until we know what health insurance costs are going to be.”[12]


www.heritage.org...

I don't know about you, but my insurance costs increased by 12% since the passage of Obamacare and we still have 3 more years before it supposed to kick in. Will the job market just continue to wither in dry air of uncertainty that has clouded Obamacare??

online.wsj.com...



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 02:58 PM
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reply to post by jibeho
 


Well your sources WSJ (Ruport Murdoch) and the Heritage Foundation (Koch Brothers) is predictable.

Perhaps this has something to do with the economic stall?

S&P, Moody's threaten to lower U.S. rating
"I think it would be a calamitous outcome, create a very severe financial shock that would have effects not only on the U.S. economy but on the global economy," Bernanke said. "Treasury securities are critical to the entire financial system. … Default on those securities would throw the financial system into chaos."

www.upi.com...

Really? Obamacare is creating economic insecurity? Making business leaders nervous?

As opposed to the US Gov. going into default?

Idealogical blindness at it's peak.
edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:05 PM
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sources do not matter when you talk about obamacare and the impact on the economy and peoples wallets.

business has stalled because they dont know whats going to happen or what obama is likely to do in the future.

if its you or a business they do what everyone does its called self preservation if its between employer and employee the employer will win everytime.

obama fails to see this or maybe he does the more people out of work means more people he can put on the government dime.

the flip side of that is the more business he destroys the less capital he has to put people on the government dime.

this country is what you get when you elect the left in power they have no clue how business works.

the more people make the more they spend and the more money they pump into the economy creating more revenue for the government and the people.

i sit back and look at this country today and i am disgusted.


edit on 20-7-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:06 PM
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Let's ask some other authorities...



US Chamber of Commerce Urges Lawmakers to Raise Debt Limit ‘Expeditiously’

The business community’s chief lobby in Washington made the case in a letter to lawmakers signed by Bruce Josten, the group’s head of government affairs, arguing that failure to pass legislation authorizing an increase in borrowing by Aug. 4 “would create uncertainty and fear, and threaten the credit rating of the United States.”

blogs.wsj.com...

Chamber of Commerce Pressuring GOP Lawmakers on Debt Limit
news.firedoglake.com...



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:08 PM
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Originally posted by neo96

this country is what you get when you elect the left in power they have no clue how business works.



edit on 20-7-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)


The GOP is in power. They pass the budget and laws. How is that working out?

Strange that the economy stalled soon after the GOP took Congress with their proud "Do nothing - stop everything" slogan.
edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:14 PM
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reply to post by Indigo5
 


how do you figure when the the left has the senate and the presidency?

blah



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:36 PM
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reply to post by jibeho
 


One of Obamacare's provisions was changes in the tax code - 1099.

Small business account for much of the new job growth. They have generated 64 percent of net new jobs over the past 15 years. (SBA.gov) When you hit them with a major headache like Obamacare and that blasted 1099 red tape nightmare what did you expect???

All of my small business buddies are NOT happy about the additional regs and red tape. It is now a major topic of conversation.

Do not believe me? Walk into a small business and mention tax or regulations to the owner and you will get an earful.



...The provision calls for all businesses to file 1099 forms with the IRS for all transactions with other businesses over $600. This new requirement will force businesses to divert scarce resources to complying with additional bureaucratic red tape that they could better use creating new jobs...

blog.heritage.org...



Health care law's massive, hidden tax change



NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- An all-but-overlooked provision of the health reform law is threatening to swamp U.S. businesses with a flood of new tax paperwork....

....The stealth change radically alters the nature of 1099s and means businesses will have to issue millions of new tax documents each year.

Right now, the IRS Form 1099 is used to document income for individual workers other than wages and salaries. Freelancers receive them each year from their clients, and businesses issue them to the independent contractors they hire.

But under the new rules, if a freelance designer buys a new iMac from the Apple Store, they'll have to send Apple a 1099. A laundromat that buys soap each week from a local distributor will have to send the supplier a 1099 at the end of the year tallying up their purchases. money.cnn.com...



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:36 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Indigo5
 


how do you figure when the the left has the senate and the presidency?

blah


You dont follow this too closely do you -- you would understand how it is working if you did. FOX news is not following Limbaugh is not following Beck is not following. The republicans led by low functioning tea baggers are the ones causing the problem.

The healthcare act is slowing the economy -- laughable - just laughable.

Example of republicans being stupid --

www.nydailynews.com...

edit on 20-7-2011 by spyder550 because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-7-2011 by spyder550 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:43 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
sources do not matter when you talk about obamacare and the impact on the economy and peoples wallets.

business has stalled because they dont know whats going to happen or what obama is likely to do in the future.

if its you or a business they do what everyone does its called self preservation if its between employer and employee the employer will win everytime.

obama fails to see this or maybe he does the more people out of work means more people he can put on the government dime.

the flip side of that is the more business he destroys the less capital he has to put people on the government dime.

this country is what you get when you elect the left in power they have no clue how business works.

the more people make the more they spend and the more money they pump into the economy creating more revenue for the government and the people.

i sit back and look at this country today and i am disgusted.


edit on 20-7-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)


There is absolutely not a coherent thought in this rant.

If I understand this bit of incoherency

"if its you or a business they do what everyone does its called self preservation if its between employer and employee the employer will win everytime."

This is what happens when you crush the unions -- who wants to crush the Unions -- not a hard question.

or this bit

"obama fails to see this or maybe he does the more people out of work means more people he can put on the government dime."

What is gods name is the benefit of killing jobs -- you really have to quit listening to the alcoholic skin head at you local pub.


What a bunch of drive! Only to be expected when you start out with "sources don't matter"
edit on 20-7-2011 by spyder550 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 03:52 PM
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Why would anyone hire American workers when they can pay Haitians 24 cents an hour - and have the State Department work as their union-busting goons?

The lack of job growth is in reality the result of 30-years worth of failed trickle-down economics and outsourcing. The only growth sector left in America are low-paying service-sector jobs, largely because those can't be outsourced.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:17 PM
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Originally posted by crimvelvet
reply to post by jibeho
 


One of Obamacare's provisions was changes in the tax code - 1099.

Small business account for much of the new job growth. They have generated 64 percent of net new jobs over the past 15 years. (SBA.gov) When you hit them with a major headache like Obamacare and that blasted 1099 red tape nightmare what did you expect???

All of my small business buddies are NOT happy about the additional regs and red tape. It is now a major topic of conversation.

Do not believe me?



...The provision calls for all businesses to file 1099 forms with the IRS for all transactions with other businesses over $600. This new requirement will force businesses to divert scarce resources to complying with additional bureaucratic red tape that they could better use creating new jobs...

blog.heritage.org...


No I don't beleive you. That or your Small Business buddies are morons for worrying about a clause that was repealed before it ever took effect

AND with the approval of President Obama AND by a BIPARTISAN VOTE.



The U.S. Senate approved a bill Tuesday to repeal a health care reform provision that requires businesses to file a 1099 form with the Internal Revenue Service every time they spend more than $600 a year with another business.

By a 87-12 vote, the Senate passed legislation repealing the 1099 provision, which was included in health care reform as a way to help pay for that measure. Third-party reporting of income makes businesses less likely to try to hide income from the IRS, according to supporters of the provision.

Businesses already are required to file 1099s for payments of more than $600 to unincorporated service providers. The health care reform bill expanded this requirement in 2012 to goods as well as services, and applied it to all types of vendors. Small businesses contend this expansion would create a paperwork nightmare, forcing many of them to file hundreds of 1099 forms instead of just a few.

Senate passage of the bill, which previously cleared the House, sends the bill to President Barack Obama for his signature. The president supports repeal of the 1099 provision

www.bizjournals.com...

Keep on with the BS though.
edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:31 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
reply to post by Indigo5
 


how do you figure when the the left has the senate and the presidency?

blah


Seriously? Civics?

The House Creates the Laws, Holds the purse-strings, The Senate? The Dems do not have a filibuster proof majority as has been repeatedly demonstrated.

The GOP is in the drivers seat and waving their arms about like a drunk while speeding down the road pretending that they aren't driving makes that reality no less real.

Remember all the jubilation from the GOP when they won Congress? Remember that long list of things they said they were planning on doing now that they seized power? Now ask yourself what they have done.

Suddenly the GOP doesn't want power, cowers and proposes plans to cede the Debt Ceiling authority to the POTUS. They would rather pose and rant like children, but they have done and are doing literally nothing.

Don't believe me? Ask David Brookes...A well known fierce conservative columnist.




Earlier this month, Brooks wrote in his New York Times column that the deal Democrats have put on the table is “the mother of no-brainers” and that the GOP “may no longer be a normal party” because it has put its anti-tax ideology ahead of practical governing.

Today, Brooks follows up by naming names.

He calls out the "Beltway Bandits," particularly Grover Norquist, the head of Americans for Tax Reform, who Brooks calls "the Zelig of Republican catastrophe."

Also to blame for the current impasse are talk radio jocks -- "Big Government blowhards" -- who get ratings by firing up their listeners with partisan rhetoric; "show horses" such as Sarah Palin and Michele Bachmann who "produce tweets, not laws"; and "permanent campaigners" in Congress who care more about getting re-elected than they do about governing.

These groups "do not believe in seizing opportunities to make steady, messy progress toward conservative goals," Brooks writes. "They believe that politics is a cataclysmic struggle."


www.vxec.com...
edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:34 PM
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reply to post by Indigo5
 


fine lets have it your way then considering the left held the house from 2006 to 2010 the economy started tanking.

its all their fault.

the left has held the majority in the senate since 2006 to present and they have the presidency.

the left holds 2/3 of the government blame the right all you want still doesnt make it the truth.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 04:56 PM
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Originally posted by Indigo5
reply to post by jibeho
 


Well your sources WSJ (Ruport Murdoch) and the Heritage Foundation (Koch Brothers) is predictable.

Perhaps this has something to do with the economic stall?

S&P, Moody's threaten to lower U.S. rating
"I think it would be a calamitous outcome, create a very severe financial shock that would have effects not only on the U.S. economy but on the global economy," Bernanke said. "Treasury securities are critical to the entire financial system. … Default on those securities would throw the financial system into chaos."

www.upi.com...

Really? Obamacare is creating economic insecurity? Making business leaders nervous?

As opposed to the US Gov. going into default?

Idealogical blindness at it's peak.
edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)


A source attack? Really? Not a great way to lead off your post.
I'll agree that naturally economic uncertainty plays a factor here as does our nations debt crisis however, this about the impact that Obamacare has had on business. According to the US Chamber of congress

Small business owners also feel challenged by economic uncertainty (49%) the national debt (47%), the new health care law (39%), and the impact of regulations (36%)

www.uschambersmallbusinessnation.com...

We're talking since May of 2010 when the stall began. Our nations debt did not cause the increase in my health insurance costs. Moody's recent veiled threat to downgrade didn't cause businesses to clam up on hiring due to unexpected and healthcare costs that they are unable to budget for. Yes, companies actually operate on a budget. Unlike our Federal govt. Along with these costs comes the uncertain litany of red tape that will certainly accompany Obamacare.

From the head of the Federal Reserve in Atlanta


Dennis Lockhart, President of the Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta, reports that:

In addition to slow and uncertain revenue growth, contacts in this recovery are frequently citing a number of other factors that are impeding hiring. Prominent among these is the lack of clarity about the cost implications of the recent health care legislation. We’ve frequently heard strong comments to the effect of “my company won’t hire a single additional worker until we know what health insurance costs are going to be.”[12]


www.heritage.org...



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 05:08 PM
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Originally posted by neo96
sources do not matter


5 minutes after coming back from a break and I get this jewel.

Stay classy, Neo.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 05:30 PM
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reply to post by SpectreDC
 


there are a number of articles on obamacare for anyone who cared to even bother looking up the subject matter.

whether or not if its articles or personal experience from the law passed

the subject of the thread is well known so why does it matter who says what when their are hundreds of other people saying the same things?

classy to dimiss the detrimental effects of yet another fascist. government program

thought the left was suppose to love immigrants or is it the fact that murdoch isnt illegal or hispanic?
edit on 20-7-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 05:37 PM
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well since dittoheads feel that the president is powerless, and congress holds all the power, (at least when a republican president is in power) how is boehner going to fix it ? they campaingned on jobs, jobs, jobs

they do have a plan.....right ?



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 06:07 PM
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If your going to blame Obamacare for the rise in insurance premiums and the lack of job growth then you might as well go ahead and call out the real culprits in your scenario which is the republican/tea party. If I'm not mistaken, is was the progressive democrats that wanted "Single-Payer Medicare for All" or a "Public Option," the only two not-for-profit means by which to provide insurance in the U.S.. It was the republican/tea party that refused them a seat at the table in their never-ending quest for total privatization of everything. Now that private insurers are raising your rates, again, you want to blame Obamacare? Please!

Not to worry though, we progressives are a persistent bunch and I'm confident that we will eventually achieve a not-for-profit healthcare system that covers everyone in the U.S.. The republican/tea party cannot continue to show their asses in the manner they have been lately and expect to get re-elected. There's already a severe case of buyer's remorse going around this country over the last election. If you don't believe me, just watch what happens in Wisconsin next month when the democrats regain control of the state legislature via the recall elections.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 07:22 PM
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Originally posted by Indigo5

Originally posted by neo96

this country is what you get when you elect the left in power they have no clue how business works.



edit on 20-7-2011 by neo96 because: (no reason given)


The GOP is in power. They pass the budget and laws. How is that working out?

Strange that the economy stalled soon after the GOP took Congress with their proud "Do nothing - stop everything" slogan.
edit on 20-7-2011 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)


Where are you getting your talking points from? Rachel Maddow? Ed Schultz? The Democrats took power before the 08 election and that's when the econ went belly up and has still not recovered.



posted on Jul, 20 2011 @ 07:25 PM
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Originally posted by Flatfish
If your going to blame Obamacare for the rise in insurance premiums and the lack of job growth then you might as well go ahead and call out the real culprits in your scenario which is the republican/tea party. If I'm not mistaken, is was the progressive democrats that wanted "Single-Payer Medicare for All" or a "Public Option," the only two not-for-profit means by which to provide insurance in the U.S.. It was the republican/tea party that refused them a seat at the table in their never-ending quest for total privatization of everything. Now that private insurers are raising your rates, again, you want to blame Obamacare? Please!

Not to worry though, we progressives are a persistent bunch and I'm confident that we will eventually achieve a not-for-profit healthcare system that covers everyone in the U.S.. The republican/tea party cannot continue to show their asses in the manner they have been lately and expect to get re-elected. There's already a severe case of buyer's remorse going around this country over the last election. If you don't believe me, just watch what happens in Wisconsin next month when the democrats regain control of the state legislature via the recall elections.



You Statist Totalitarians never seem to get the fact that communism doesn't work.



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