Gaza flotilla ship 'sabotaged by divers'

Please quote the part where I support bombing these ships with Naplam. When you do that, I'll transfer everything I own to a PayPal account of your choice. Do note that I didn't edit that post at all.

Further clarification - I gave an exaggerated analogy to the situation. The point is that the majority of the world (even if it doesn't post on ATS and other loony conspiracy sites) that looks at these cases with an unbiased POV does not care for the fate of these fake activists.

If you think I should be banned for anything I welcome you to report any of my posts.

reply to post by IsraeliGuy

Your post....

"Unfortunately for you, the vast majority of Earth will not care the slightest even if Israel bombs these ships with Naplam. Why? Because everyone that can do a 1+1=2 can see this flotilla is nothing but a bad PR machine? Because nobody cares about lousy activists that don't even care about getting aid into Gaza? Because nobody sympathizes with the same stupid ideology as you do? Just pick one of these reasons.

Happy waiting. I know I am!"

End of post.

Happy waiting.

I still can't figure out where have I supposedly supported or encouraged anyone to Naplam these ships.

Either you can't read very well or you try, sadly, to take my words out of context.

reply to post by IsraeliGuy

Well, tell me how you REALLY feel....
Can you sympathize, in ANY way, with this mission. What do you hope happens to them? If not napalm, what?

First off, I hope they show the world how legit their goal is, and transfer the aid from Egypt's passage.

Knowing they won't do it, and knowing these pitiful flotillas are after nothing but bad PR for Israel (they care not whether their aid enters Gaza or not), I hope they do set-sail here. And if they really think they are going to break a naval blockade they are in for a big let down.

I wish nobody will get hurt. But rest assured that a person that attacks an IDF soldier deserves no mercy or sympathy IMO. If they are not going to turn their ships back, they will get boarded by the IDF. Or do you prefer the IDF will torpedo their ships? Or perhaps try to stop them with fishing nets? Heh.

All in all, I hope they all live the week after to see how all of their efforts can't keep the media busy for more than one or two days at best.

reply to post by IsraeliGuy


First off, this is an illegal blokade,.

Next: you say this is just about PR for Israel. Well, that is up to them, is it not. The story could be that the starving families of Gaza are fed by international aid as Israel was humane enough to let the aid in. Or it could be a repeat of last years story. And it is entirely up to Israel, which story is aired.

But they would rather enforce the starvation of a nation than show any compassion. Disgracefull.

Get your facts straight.

Israel is already allowing tons of UN aid into Gaza.

Whether you or anyone else think this blockade is illegal is not for consideration of any Israeli government. The blockade exists, and it will exist untill Gaza is ruled by a sane government that recognizes Israel's right to exist (or: NOT HAMAS).


My point is that these ships and the entire flotilla trend isn't out to help anyone, they are out to cause bad PR for Israel. If that is what you support, and not actually letting the Gaza have your aid, then we have nothing much to discuss - have we?

If you want to make bad PR for Israel you do it in a sane way. If you choose a stupid way of trying to break a blockade, illegal or not, you will get your ass whooped.

When you actually want to help the people of Gaza with aid, you can transport it through Israel by docking at Ashdod port, or through Egypt with ease. Unless you choose one of these two sane ways, you're out to make bad PR for us in an illogical way. All I can say is good luck and don't whine too much once your ass is kicked back to where you came from.

Originally posted by Shamatt
Next: you say this is just about PR for Israel. Well, that is up to them, is it not.

Nope. We can't take the chances of letting just anyone in and have them unloading anything they desire. If that was the case, what would stop a barrage of ships that unloads ammo for Hamas?

The story is up to the flotilla organizers. They can receive tons of global support if they only decide to pass their aid from Egypt, without the unnecessary inevitable confrontation with IDF ships.



--By the way, read that little link I posted at the top of this post, under the 2011 section you will find the funny fact that the head of Palestinian Authority has stated he is willing to stop the global aid for Gaza in order to achieve unity with Hamas.

In March 2011, there were threats to cut off aid for the PA if it continued to move forward on a unity government with Hamas, unless Hamas formally renounced violence, recognized Israel, and accepted previous Israel-Palestinian agreements. Azzam Ahmed, spokesman for Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas responded by stating that the PA was willing to give up financial aid in order to achieve unity, "Palestinians need American money, but if they use it as a way of pressuring us, we are ready to relinquish that aid."

What can one assume from that pitiful opinion by the head of the Palestinian Authority? That he is corrupted? That he is scared sh*tless from Hamas that he is willing to give up aid just to satisfy his masters? That the aid isn't very needed, even less than a unity with Hamas? That Palestinian ego is greater than the need for aid?
You decide.

Originally posted by IsraeliGuy
Get your facts straight.

Israel is already allowing tons of UN aid into Gaza.

My point is that these ships and the entire flotilla trend isn't out to help anyone, they are out to cause bad PR for Israel.

And my point is that Israel has the oportunity to make this GOOD PR for themselves. It can make this a posative story about Israel in the international press. That would be good for Israel and it cause, and it's international reputation. It would also be good for the inhabitants of the west bank, regardless of how many tons of aid already get in, as they are in need of even more, so this WILL help even if only in a small way.

So - over to you guys..... Good story or bad? It is Israels choice.

As I said, while you comfortably ignored - If we let just anyone dock at Gaza while unloading anything they desire, what would stop someone from actually arming Hamas and unloading as much ammunition as they want?

For us, letting them dock at Gaza without inspecting their cargo does not mean good PR, it means being a sucker for childish games and inviting other ships to arm Hamas due to the fact we are no longer inspecting anyone that loads his cargo in Gaza.

For them, docking at Egypt means mission complete. It does not mean they lost anything. Unless they are after PR, and incase they are, we don't give a crap about what they have to say because they are already out to throw crap at us.


Saying that it's up to Israel to have a good PR is just like saying it's up to you to have good PR - you only need to let me slap you once. It's twisting the facts. Why must I slap you at all? I'm the one that starts the conflict, why should it be up to you to handle the PR? You're only out there to defend yourself.


And most importantly, all in all, Israel never was and never will be a country that lives by what the global opinion says (Eventho in the flotilla's case it's not even the global opinion). We rather maintain our security for one year over ten years of good PR.

I love how you ignore everything I post besides the parts about good and bad PR. Like the claims of the head of the Palestinian Authority means nothing, or the fact that the entire ships together cannot even tickle the weekly amount of aid transferred into Gaza from Israel in one week.
If they are in need of more as you say, why would they give up everything just for a unity with Hamas? Doesn't make much sense.

reply to post by IsraeliGuy


Look, this is how the world works: You beleive what you want to and I beleive what I want to. The important part is how we relate to each other in the light of those differeing belleifs. It is already obvious that neither one of us will have any impact on the oppinions of the other. However, consider this..... If you are correct and that this is merely a PR stunt, then it is easily sabotaged. Inspect the boats and let them in.

I am not ignoring the rest of your points, I just feel that they are moot in the light of this easy solution to the issue. By taking away the entire point of the flotilla, Israel wins. Immagine the newspaper headlines:

Israel stuns the world by permitting the freedom flotila to deliver its cargo.
Israel insist that that all such attempt to deliver aid to the west bank will be met by very stringent security checks, and repeats its requests than any such aid be sent via official channels in order to ensure that it is sent where it is most needed. But in a surprise turn arround Israel did allow the freedom flotila to deliver its very carefully inspected cargo. "We only want to make sure that there are no illegal items on board" said a spokesman, "Of course we don't want to stop legitimate aid arriving"

How does that sound?

And the flotila looses all power because the bad PR they were trying to shove onto Israel turns in to good PR for them. Ironically, they can still go home claiming a victory having delivered their cargo. Looks like a win win situation to me.

Sound OK?

reply to post by Shamatt


so isreal has to let this convoy through to be " good " is that what you are saying ?

These boats are being operated by terrorist sympathisers based in Europe and the Middle East, they will probably be transporting weaponry and weapons components to the terrorists in the Arab occupied Gaza/West Bank regions of Israel and as such, should be sunk to the bottom of the sea.

Originally posted by dingdong101
These boats are being operated by terrorist sympathisers based in Europe and the Middle East, they will probably be transporting weaponry and weapons components to the terrorists in the Arab occupied Gaza/West Bank regions of Israel and as such, should be sunk to the bottom of the sea.

West Bank/Gaza is now a region of Israel and Arabs occupy it??

LMAO, obviously you know very little about the region so best you learn before making silly comments.

Originally posted by backinblack

Originally posted by dingdong101
These boats are being operated by terrorist sympathisers based in Europe and the Middle East, they will probably be transporting weaponry and weapons components to the terrorists in the Arab occupied Gaza/West Bank regions of Israel and as such, should be sunk to the bottom of the sea.

West Bank/Gaza is now a region of Israel and Arabs occupy it??

LMAO, obviously you know very little about the region so best you learn before making silly comments.

Yes, Israel is being occupied by a hostile Islamic enemy, based around Occupied Israeli Gaza and Occupied Israeli West Bank. The Muslims have no claim or right to be in that land or Israel as a whole. We need to Keep Israel Jewish and Christian.

Originally posted by ignorant_ape
reply to post by Shamatt

 

so isreal has to let this convoy through to be " good " is that what you are saying ?

No, no - that's not what I'm saying.

I'm saying that there is a solution which avoids conflict and allows everyone to walk away with respect and dignity. A win win situation. Surely also preferable?

Originally posted by dingdong101

Originally posted by backinblack

Originally posted by dingdong101
These boats are being operated by terrorist sympathisers based in Europe and the Middle East, they will probably be transporting weaponry and weapons components to the terrorists in the Arab occupied Gaza/West Bank regions of Israel and as such, should be sunk to the bottom of the sea.

West Bank/Gaza is now a region of Israel and Arabs occupy it??

LMAO, obviously you know very little about the region so best you learn before making silly comments.

Yes, Israel is being occupied by a hostile Islamic enemy, based around Occupied Israeli Gaza and Occupied Israeli West Bank. The Muslims have no claim or right to be in that land or Israel as a whole. We need to Keep Israel Jewish and Christian.

I hate seeing this ignorant hate filled cr@p from people.
You will fight to your last man for strip of earth to bury him.

Originally posted by Shamatt

Originally posted by dingdong101

Originally posted by backinblack

Originally posted by dingdong101
These boats are being operated by terrorist sympathisers based in Europe and the Middle East, they will probably be transporting weaponry and weapons components to the terrorists in the Arab occupied Gaza/West Bank regions of Israel and as such, should be sunk to the bottom of the sea.

West Bank/Gaza is now a region of Israel and Arabs occupy it??

LMAO, obviously you know very little about the region so best you learn before making silly comments.

Yes, Israel is being occupied by a hostile Islamic enemy, based around Occupied Israeli Gaza and Occupied Israeli West Bank. The Muslims have no claim or right to be in that land or Israel as a whole. We need to Keep Israel Jewish and Christian.

I hate seeing this ignorant hate filled cr@p from people.
You will fight to your last man for strip of earth to bury him.

I will fight to the last, so every Israeli child can grow up without the fear that some barbaric foreigner from a brutal 3rd world cult will harm them or their family simply for being a proud Israeli Jew or Christian.

reply to post by dingdong101


Everyone who has lived in that land for the last few thousand years,have been conquerors or the descendents of Conquerors. Have you ever read the bible? It details the genocide and mass murder committed in the name of religion in that land quite thoroughly.

Just out of curiosity, what about the Palestinian Christians? You are aware that it was a Palestinian Christian who founded the PFLP, one of the more radical groups who were committed to war with Israel. Though alot of the Palestinian Christians have fled, many were exiled in 1948, there is still a small population within Palestine. Many international organisations in support of the Palestinians are headed or have been founded by Palestinian Christians, the ISM being the most prominent. 80% of Christians within Israel are Arabs who lived in or are the descendents of the people who lived in that land before there was such a thing as the 'state of Israel'.

The Palestinians, regardless of their religion have just as much right to live in the entire land of Israel and Palestine just as the Israelis, regardless of their religion do.

Originally posted by lifeissacred
The Palestinians have just as much right to live in the entire land of Israel and Palestine as the Israeli population do.

No they don't, they never will, and thankfully they are contained to certain regions in the interest of safety.

Originally posted by Shamatt
Inspect the boats and let them in.

I hope you're joking.
Israel have suggested to inspect the boat and let them in.. it's them who refuse to be inspected. If they wouldn't refuse to have their ships inspected this would end eons ago.

I am not ignoring the rest of your points, I just feel that they are moot in the light of this easy solution to the issue.

No, you just can't come up with a valid answer.

By taking away the entire point of the flotilla, Israel wins. Immagine the newspaper headlines:

...

How does that sound?

Again, you seem to make the impression that the flotilla was not offered to dock at Ashdod and have their cargo checked. They were, and they refused.

And the flotila looses all power because the bad PR they were trying to shove onto Israel turns in to good PR for them. Ironically, they can still go home claiming a victory having delivered their cargo. Looks like a win win situation to me.

The flotilla lost all power long time ago. As I said, the only people who would be in an uproar because of what happens to the ships, are the people who criticize Israel all the time. The bad PR you speak of is totally irrelevant to Israel and nobody in the Israeli government could care less if flotilla supporter continued to support it.

Sound OK?

You dock at Ashdod, we inspect the cargo, then you get it in.
OR
You dock at Egypt, and let it in.

Sounds good?