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Don't raise the debt ceiling? Pension fund money the government took is gone

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posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 06:40 PM
This is totally true.

And of course, they keep plundering the pension funds as we speak :

Treasury Continues To Dip Into Retirement Accounts, Prepares To "Take Out" $66 Billion Chunk To Make Room For New Bond Issuance

Today, very quietly, the Treasury released its latest refunding announcement, in which it disclosed it would issue another $66 billion in 3, 10 and 30 Year notes next week.

Furthermore, as was also disclosed by the Treasury, this gross issuance will also be the net amount added in marketable debt, as upon settlement on June 15, there will be no redemptions of maturing bonds. Which simply means that the continued "disinvesting" (which is merely a polite word for plundering) from intragovernmental debt, also known as retirement accounts, is about to kick into high gear. As a reminder, the only solution that Geithner currently has to run the government, at least until August 2 when even this runs out, is to slowly drain the debt in non-marketable accounts, in the form of Suspension of G-Fund and ESF reinvestments, as well as the Redemption and suspension of of CSRDF Investments, measure which when combined will provide a short-term buffer of $232 billion. Yet for all practical purposes, what is happening is that retirement accounts are now being seriously plundered, and if the unthinkable were to happen, and the debt ceiling would not rise, not only would the US be in technical default, but various retirement funds, which already are underfunded, would find themselves even more severely in the Red.

So if the government doesn't raise the debt ceiling : $232B will NOT be repayed by the government to the pension funds.


So... they are basically FORCING the public to push for a debt ceiling increase. This is totally criminal... there's just no other word.
edit on 2-6-2011 by Vitchilo because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 06:43 PM
This is just sickening

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 06:50 PM
privet 401k's Next?

Just saying

Goverment- " your 401k is far to risky in th stock market, lets pass a bill and transfer all privet 401K's to "SAFE" federal goverment bonds".
edit on 2-6-2011 by camaro68ss because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 06:57 PM

Originally posted by camaro68ss
privet 401k's Next?

Just saying
They absolutely will be coming for those soon. We are not able to manage our own retirement, you know. It is in our "best interest" to allow our ever faithful government to "protect" our investments.

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 07:00 PM
hasn't this been speculated would be their plan all along? Just saying...

We all must have known they would start taking from people's retirement funds and making retirement virtually impossible for most people in the country...seems like a shot at the middle class yet again because I'm sure most of these pensions belong to middle class people...

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 07:02 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

Ahh haa!! I guess that's why some government employees are being forced I to paying a larger percentage to their pension funds.

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 07:12 PM
Good idea to post this, since most likely do not know. The government is plundering the federal pension fund -- the retirement assets of the working stiffs in government -- to pay for things. Meanwhile, the fed is ramping up for the big QE3 giveaway to the banks.

That's how Amerika works now, it is a reverse Robin Hood. Just wait, the politicians will wait until this fund is dry before dealing with the situation.

Debt default? I say let it burn, let it all come crashing down. The ONLY reason they will raise the debt cieling is because Wall Street will kill them if they don't. What you think as a citizen is not factored in. We need the bankers to be so distraught they start jumping out of windows.

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 07:28 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

As an ordinary citizen I am not ashamed to say that I don't understand all this. I am glad someone is keeping an eye out.

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 08:20 PM
Take note at this Senate bill. Things seem to be coming together. Limit what you can borrow from your own money so they have more to plunder.

Senate bill to limit 401k borrowing.

posted on Jun, 2 2011 @ 08:44 PM
reply to post by Vitchilo

Something told me not to open a 401K years ago. Maybe this is why. I took all I could get then. I wasn't a bout to save it for someone else. People thought I was crazy all I can say is now who is crazy now? The same thing happened to the Social Security fund. It was bilked for all it was worth now they are broke they want to cheat everyone out of their money. I get tired of people saying how its broke we can't afford it but they never tell the real reason why. This money will al lbe gone then they will scream we can't pay you we can't afford it. I watched my dad lose all his money in the Savings and Loan scandal all under a Bush. As usual nothing was done after all he was a Bush. More crap just different day.

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 04:58 AM
reply to post by pajoly

Bankers jumping out of windows? "I have a dream!"
Looks like blackmail of public employee unions.
Support us or no retirement for you!
The wheels are coming off the wagon folks.
They just want a few more weeks of seeing the sun before they have to retreat to the DUMBs to get away from the lynch mobs that want their blood.

Stock up folks, I jest you not.
The #%^ is getting serious,
They're scraping the bottom of the barrel so hard they're going to make a hole in it.

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 05:01 AM
reply to post by redrose123

Isn't it strange that both of the biggest banking scandals occurred under a Bush presidency? (not really)
And BOTH times the banks got bailed out BUT NOT THE INVESTORS,

Sorry about your dad's money.

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 05:05 AM

Originally posted by Sorayugiman
This is just sickening

yep, star 4 u

it's like a heroin junkie that
steals his mother's social
security check for his next

disgusting indeed

I have no clue who is
gonna even buy these bonds.
They are junk rated as it is.
It's a lost cause

as they say in Vegas:
There's a sucker born every minute

edit on 6/3/2011 by boondock-saint because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 05:18 AM
they can't agree to raise the debt ceiling so they can borrow more....
they've plundered the social security fund, and are no doing it to the gov't employees retirement fund...
next will be the IRA's but what no one is realizing that well, both the federal retirement fund along with these IRA's were heavily invested in the toxic cdo's or whatever, so they aren't worth as much.....
soon, they will be plundering all of us, along with borrowing out the arse....

so well, someone, please explain to me....
why in the world was obama traveling all over the place giving money to our "friends" overseas last week....
he's taking money from the employees funds and just giving it away, to strangers in far away lands!!!
not paying the troops was considered, anyone younger than 55 can kiss their healthcare goodbye!!! but well....
let's give a few more million to our "friends"!!!

and then there's this coming from the solicitor general......

they must have alot of faith in our educational system, that it's creating complete fools out of our kids if they believe we will buy all this crap!!!!
edit on 3-6-2011 by dawnstar because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 05:35 AM

Originally posted by dawnstar
and then there's this coming from the solicitor general......

and then there was the statement
from a governor telling folks, if they
need a job to go work on the farm.

doesn't matter if they got a PH.D.

why don't they tell that to Wall Street ???

edit on 6/3/2011 by boondock-saint because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 05:37 AM
The government pensions were marketed with the idea that contributions would stay ahead of inflation. The contract seemed to imply that if you would deffer withdrawal your eventual yield would be greater.

There really is not much difference between the government reducing the pension payouts and the government not reducing the payout but instead inflating the cost of everything the pension would buy.

In the latter case everybody would be hurt except the inflation hedge investors.

Its a difficult situation to resolve fairly.

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 10:06 AM
As Dawnstar said, this is a repeat of what the government already did to the Social Security account. It used to be that money paid into SS went into an account, and the proceeds and interest from that account paid for the benefits that were paid out to individuals. During the Reagan, Bush and Clinton administrations, that account was systematically tapped to pay for other government programs with the promise that the money would be paid back later when tax revenues improved. Well later never came, and they tapped the account until it was completely dry. Yes, our government LOOTED the SS account! There was even a book written in 2004 about it, it's called "The Looting of Social Security: How the Government is Draining America's Retirement Account". The title pretty much says it all. So now the government is in trouble again and is looting government retirement accounts on the promise that they'll pay it back later. Well folks, "later" is never going to arrive. Kiss that money goodbye. That's not to say retiring government employees will not get benefits, what it's saying is that it is going to become a "pay as you go" system in which the money is gone, so benefits will have to be paid using current tax revenue which will further add to the overwhelming debt and deficit spending already in place.

We've talked about this in other threads, but this is all leading to a debt default. First comes the debt default, then we will be unable to borrow any more money because the risk will be too high, then there will be a run on our debt (debtors will attempt to cash out what they can while they can) and it will continue in a downward spiral. It's going to be ugly and the America that emerges on the other side will be quite different. We'll survive, but we will no longer be THE world power and we will no longer live like kings on borrowed money.

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 10:38 AM
reply to post by Vitchilo

There are a few elements of this that are interesting politically all of them bad for the Democrat party.

The democrats are strong supporters of organized labor, yet they're folks being attacked here. I've done a bit of research on this topic and have yet to come across a Federal union representative doing anything that would constitute standing up for their members in this matter.

When this scheme runs dry, which it will they will then move on to state workers. Having worked to service a number of very large public sector, state, union pension funds, there is absolutely no way that these folks sit back and let this happen to their members. CALPERS, for example, the largest public employee pension fund in the country will not take this laying down, nor Ohio Teachers, none of them. These state level, public funds are run by smart, tough folks. Politically they are supporters of the Democrat party, this will place them squarely at odds with them and confronted with the choice of supporting a party that on the one hand is pro labor and on the other is ripping labor off.

Paying some of these funds off and making the members whole will be likely impossible. Many of these funds are run by managers who generate returns far in excess of the market index, let alone government bonds. Were the government to take cash out of a public fund that has historical returns of 6%, how do they pay them back when government bonds are generating less than half the return? The notion is of course that the government will take the cash (equities) out of the pension funds and then substitute it for government bonds. These folks will never be made whole.

That creates the strange bed fellows of the constitutionalists, Wall Street, 10th amendment crowd and organized labor. If of those groups can get together effectively, there will be a massive political realignment in the US that will all but destroy the Democrat party.

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 10:51 AM
This is actually good news!

It's not like the public could ask for interest rates on their "loan".

For the first time in years, the money borrowed by the country is not impossible to give back, in theory with the inflation. Too bad in reality, they won't give that money back, even without interest.

How about they take the money from black ops or the army or nasa or investors or companies?
Oh I forgot, we can't. Those guys have to power to say : Hey don't steal my money.
edit on 3-6-2011 by User8911 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 3 2011 @ 12:02 PM
I can't imagine the dire state of financial crisis US government is facing.

If I'm an American, I would have planned to immigrate to another country since QE2.

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