What would it take to appease some of you Birthers? (last birther thread)

reply to post by PhotonEffect


The race card is old and has been proven a null and void argument.

Please come back and try again with a real basis for debate.

Originally posted by centurion1211

Uh, do you not remember all the people here claiming Bush's Air National Guard documents were fakes and going over them with a fine toothed comb.

Of course, THAT was different.

You kinda answered your own question.

People with an agenda or suspicion on both sides will peruse the tiniest discrepancies.... and then declare that this is proof positive that it is fake....... the reality may be very different though.

reply to post by centurion1211


You must be a Birther.

So what is the founding premise behind the movement then, if you please.

Name any other political issues, other than where these birther idiots think he was born, that this group and this whole controversy is about.

School me.

Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by PhotonEffect

 

The race card is old and has been proven a null and void argument.

Please come back and try again with a real basis for debate.

edit on 27-4-2011 by Whereweheaded because: (no reason given)

I'll say it to you too then.

Please school me on what the Birther movement is about and what the founding premise of said group was.

In other words, name any other political issue facing this country that the Birther movement is directly addressing.

What else is it about if it's not about where they think Obama is from?

Originally posted by PhotonEffect

Originally posted by Whereweheaded
reply to post by PhotonEffect

 

The race card is old and has been proven a null and void argument.

Please come back and try again with a real basis for debate.

edit on 27-4-2011 by Whereweheaded because: (no reason given)

I'll say it to you too then.

Please school me on what the Birther movement is about and what the founding premise of said group was.

In other words, name any other political issue facing this country that the Birther movement is directly addressing.

What else is it about if it's not about where they think Obama is from?

What is it about? Easy, Its the people of this country simply trying to verify by asking questions on the Constitutional grounds of his legitimacy to be POTUS. With your logic, the very act of asking questions, questioning the very authority that spoon feeds you the information you deemed fit to regurgitate is frowned upon in this establishment. Are these " birthers " right? Wrong? I dunno, but simply asking questions on the grounds of Constitutionally correct should not be looked down upon by you, or any other establishment.
Basing ones sole basis of argument on the grounds of ' racism " is a weak minded attempt to sway the masses. Its old, and tired, and has yet to prove anything, much less done anything for your argument.

Originally posted by Whereweheaded


What is it about? Easy, Its the people of this country simply trying to verify by asking questions on the Constitutional grounds of his legitimacy to be POTUS.

So has any other President of the US been asked publically to display his birth certificate?

Why should Obama's birth place be under scrutiny and not Bush or Clinton before him?

Originally posted by PhotonEffect
reply to post by centurion1211

 

You must be a Birther.

You just can't avoid labeling people can you? there must be a medical name for that condition.

So what is the founding premise behind the movement then, if you please.

Name any other political issues, other than where these birther idiots think he was born, that this group and this whole controversy is about.

School me.

I don't know, since I'm not a "founder".

Now, if I had to make an educated guess, AND since you asked to be "schooled" ...

My educated guess would be that people that dislike obama's stated agenda and/or the liberal agenda were or are seeking a way to say obama is not qualified to be president. to find a way to have him removed from office.

Wait for it ...

EXACTLY, like the people on the other side tried repeatedly to do to Bush II (and Clinton and Bush I and Reagan and Carter and Ford).

But of course Bush is white, so the right cannot claim racism.

Still the Modus Operandi of the two sides is the same - "we've got to find a way to get rid of this guy we don't agree with".

Being fearful of a liberal agenda does not = racism. Nor does basically being just a sore loser = racism.

So, since this kind of thing has been done to every president since Nixon, logically it is quite reasonable to say that opposition to obama is not racially based.

Claiming racism is nothing more than an intellectual cop out. Deal with that.

If Colin Powell or even Al Sharpton won the presidency, no one would question their place of birth, and they are also black. Obama's father being a foreigner, as well as his growing up in Indonesia, along with some other things(maybe rumors), made people question there might be something to this. That's why.

Originally posted by Logical one

Originally posted by Whereweheaded


What is it about? Easy, Its the people of this country simply trying to verify by asking questions on the Constitutional grounds of his legitimacy to be POTUS.

So has any other President of the US been asked publically to display his birth certificate?

Why should Obama's birth place be under scrutiny and not Bush or Clinton before him?

Not that i Know of, however no other president before in our history has ever been associated within questionable persons ( shady individuals like Sotoro,) that have had a direct impact on the questions leading up to Obama.


ETA: Clinton was impeached because of his mis deeds in the oval office, but I guess that just the media hype isnt it? He actually got impeached because he was white, and frowned upon in this establishment.

Originally posted by Logical one

Originally posted by Whereweheaded


What is it about? Easy, Its the people of this country simply trying to verify by asking questions on the Constitutional grounds of his legitimacy to be POTUS.

So has any other President of the US been asked publically to display his birth certificate?

Why should Obama's birth place be under scrutiny and not Bush or Clinton before him?

I would guess that none of the presidents you mention had foreign parents, or a foreign-sounding name. I would also guess that none of the presidents you mentioned acted like they had anything to hide. Also, their history in this country going back many years was well known by a lot of people. In contrast, obama showed up basically all of the sudden and out of the blue.

Reason after reason ...

Originally posted by Whereweheaded

What is it about? Easy, Its the people of this country simply trying to verify by asking questions on the Constitutional grounds of his legitimacy to be POTUS.

And why would this question of his legitimacy even come up you think?

I tell you why. Because he's a black man with the name Barack Hussein Obama. That's why.

With your logic, the very act of asking questions, questioning the very authority that spoon feeds you the information you deemed fit to regurgitate is frowned upon in this establishment. Are these " birthers " right? Wrong? I dunno, but simply asking questions on the grounds of Constitutionally correct should not be looked down upon by you, or any other establishment.

I don't have a problem with asking questions. That's the beauty of this country. What I do have a problem with is the premise by which these questions are being asked. You are dancing around what I've asked you.

Is it any wonder that the first black President of this country with a muslim sounding name is the first president to have ever been questioned publicly about the validity of his citizenship. And then he finally does provide the proof and people still don't buy it and think that it's a forgery... HA!

I ask you. Why do you think that is?? He's got the documents to show he's a natural born citizen. So what's the problem?

But people still don't want to believe it. So what's the motivating force behind that belief you think?

I tell you one thing. It has nothing to do with his healthcare plan or foreign policies.

Originally posted by tom502
If Colin Powell or even Al Sharpton won the presidency, no one would question their place of birth, and they are also black. Obama's father being a foreigner, as well as his growing up in Indonesia, along with some other things(maybe rumors), made people question there might be something to this. That's why.

But surely the constitution's legal department would have cleared all of these matters up way before they became public curiosity.

It's more likely to do with the fact that Obama's other name is Hussein ........and that is uncomfortable for many.....it's sad but true.

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by PhotonEffect
reply to post by centurion1211

 

You must be a Birther.

You just can't avoid labeling people can you? there must be a medical name for that condition.

I haven't labeled anyone. You still didn't answer the question.

that birth certificate may as well be this.

Originally posted by centurion1211

I would guess that none of the presidents you mention had foreign parents, or a foreign-sounding name. I would also guess that none of the presidents you mentioned acted like they had anything to hide. Also, their history in this country going back many years was well known by a lot of people. In contrast, obama showed up basically all of the sudden and out of the blue.

Reason after reason ...

So you think that the US authorities don't check out these details before hand?

Originally posted by Logical one

It's more likely to do with the fact that Obama's other name is Hussein

However, last time I checked not liking someone's name is not an example of racism.

For example, if someone doesn't like the name "Colin" or "Powell", would that make them a racist?

Answer: No.

More likely the people claiming racism are really doing a reach in an attempt to cover up their own lack of critical thinking.

reply to post by PhotonEffect

And why would this question of his legitimacy even come up you think?

Maybe because never before in our history has a President had a " questionable " name ?

I tell you why. Because he's a black man with the name Barack Hussein Obama. That's why.

So the very fact that his father is a foreigner has no bearing in this case then huh?

You are dancing around what I've asked you.

No actually I answered your question presented to me, it is you who chose not to acknowledge that, on the grounds that it didnt coincide with your basis.

Is it any wonder that the first black President of this country with a muslim sounding name is the first president to have ever been questioned publicly about the validity of his citizenship.

Well considering he is the first POTUS to ever spent 2 million dollars to " hide " that very document I would say would be a cause for concern.

He's got the documents to show he's a natural born citizen.

Which were proven to be forgery. Even the long form was proven to had been " doctored " by the adobe reader program under the PDF format.

How did Obama get this after Dr. Fukino recently said the long form is not available to citizens, it is for the records department only?

But certainly you have a reasonable answer for that huh?

Originally posted by PhotonEffect

Originally posted by centurion1211

Originally posted by PhotonEffect
reply to post by centurion1211

 

You must be a Birther.

You just can't avoid labeling people can you? there must be a medical name for that condition.

I haven't labeled anyone.

You said: "You must be Birther" (see just above)?

You still didn't answer the question.

That would seem to be true for you ONLY if you hadn't bothered to read ANY of my responses.

Originally posted by centurion1211


More likely the people claiming racism are really doing a reach in an attempt to cover up their own lack of critical thinking.

Did I claim racism.......no I don't think so.

But what I am claiming is a "distrust" based on the name "Hussein".........and what assumptions people have about the name "Hussein".

This is getting interesting real quick. In fact I had to travel back in time to the 2008 election campaigns. Remember the early part of 2008? The MSM was all over the McCain eligibility issue like a fly on !@#$.

Many of the same news organizations and research groups today dismissing concerns about Barack Obama's constitutional eligibility were far more eager to cover the issue when Republican presidential candidate John McCain was the subject.

An archive search shows the question of McCain's birth certificate and his eligibility to be president was actively pursued by Democratic Party activists and the mainstream media in the run-up to the 2008 presidential election, despite the ridicule now heaped upon those questioning Obama's qualifications under Article II, Section 1 of the Constitution.

In an article published Feb. 28, 2008, months before McCain was nominated for president by the Republican Party, FactCheck.org, at the very center of Obama's defense against eligibility questions, was itself raising them about McCain.

See the movie Obama does not want you to see: Own the DVD that probes this unprecedented presidential eligibility mystery!

In a piece that led off with the question, "How can Panamanian-born McCain be elected president?" FactCheck.org conceded McCain did meet the natural-born citizen requirements. But the website qualified its answer, stating that if McCain did win the presidency, the issue could be challenged in court.

After the Republican and Democratic conventions, on, FactCheck.org weighed into the Obama eligibility debate Aug. 21, 2008," claiming its "staffers have now seen, touched, examined and photographed the original birth certificate." The certificate in question, however, was a short-form Certification of Live Birth, or COLB, not a hospital-generated long-form birth certificate listing the hospital where Obama was born as well as other relevant birth information, including the name of the attending physician.

Almost coincident with the FactCheck.org article, a flurry of mainstream media news pieces popped up about McCain's eligibility to be president.

Then came the Leahy-McCaskill resolution
leahy.senate.gov...

YES, McCain showed his Birth Certificate.

Dismissing the Senate resolution, Dobbs wrote that the Senate vote "is simply an opinion that has little bearing on an arcane constitutional debate that has preoccupied legal scholars for many weeks."

Dobbs noted at the time the article was published "three pending cases are challenging McCain's right to be president" because even though both his parents were U.S. citizens, his father was in the Navy, and McCain was born at the U.S. Naval Station based in Coco Solo in the Panama Canal Zone on Aug. 29, 1939.

While acknowledging that a senior official of the McCain campaign had shown reporters a copy of McCain's birth certificate issued by the Canal Zone hospital – something the Obama presidential campaign and presidency have so far refused to do – he questioned why McCain did not release the birth certificate to the press generally.

In addition to media scrutiny, McCain testified before a U.S. Senate committee and produced his long-form birth certificate for inspection.

Interesting. Obama just CHOSE to drag his feet to fuel the flames of doubt and dissent.

It goes on from there. This article has a link to every story written on the topic of McCain and Obama in the months before the election.

www.wnd.com...

It just shows that despite the Leahy resolution, McCains naysayers never let up on his citizenship issue and had he actually WON the election the tables of this conversation would be turned against the GOP President.

The Truth will appease me. The truth about Obama's past and the past of his mother and father, whomever that may be. I don't deny his US citizenship.