Hell

Now I'm not exactly a bible boffin so please excuse me if I have this completely wrong BUT I was just wondering why the bible teaches that sinners will be 'punished' in hell?

Now if the biblical God was in charge of hell, then yeah, it makes sense but that's not the case. The bible teaches that 'satan' rules hell, so what I don't understand is why would satan punish those who are seemingly doing 'the devils work'.

Surely it would make more sense if sinners were rewarded when they got to hell for doing such a 'good job' of being evil and all that?

Once again, sorry if it's a stupid question, just curious is all

The idea of hell is only a means of control.....

Believe what we believe, do what we tell you to do or....you'll burn in hell...

Dont' believe the hype man, hell doesn't exist.

The Bible does not teach that Satan rules hell. In fact, it doesn't even teach that hell exists now. The Lake of Fire, for the destruction of sinners, doesn't appear until the Final Judgement, which obviously hasn't happened yet. "Hell", itself, means the grave, and is synonymous with "death".
Also, the Bible says that Satan was given rule over the air, and the earth. He is ultimately destroyed in the Lake of Fire just as all of his followers are.

That's the simple way of putting it, anyway.

reply to post by Akragon


Oh I don't..don't buy into any of it to be honest, I'm quite happy to take my chances living my life the way I want to...I'll worry about what happens when I'm dead...when I'm dead

reply to post by snowgirl


Hell is pushed on Christians as a way to keep them under control. With fear. Think of it as jail for the dead.

It's not real. It's just mind control by Christians. Most current concepts of hell don't even come from the bible. They come from the middle ages.

Originally posted by snowgirl
Now I'm not exactly a bible boffin so please excuse me if I have this completely wrong BUT I was just wondering why the bible teaches that sinners will be 'punished' in hell?

Now if the biblical God was in charge of hell, then yeah, it makes sense but that's not the case. The bible teaches that 'satan' rules hell, so what I don't understand is why would satan punish those who are seemingly doing 'the devils work'.

Surely it would make more sense if sinners were rewarded when they got to hell for doing such a 'good job' of being evil and all that?

Once again, sorry if it's a stupid question, just curious is all

That's why some guy edited the Bible and added that little part about Hell in there. Hell does not exist. Now an underground part of Earth may be real but Hell, .

UFOs and Aliens have a higher chance of being real than Hell.

I see this was a rhetorical question with no actual intent to understand what the Bible says, even though that is the question that was asked. I apologize for my Biblical answer.

Originally posted by CLPrime
I see this was a rhetorical question with no actual intent to understand what the Bible says, even though that is the question that was asked. I apologize for my Biblical answer.

No problem, the thing is, and I know this first hand as I went to a catholic school, is that we were always taught that there is a heaven and there is a hell. The good go to heaven and the bad go to hell, unless they repent, in which case they get forgiven and get to go to heaven instead...then there was the whole 'middle section'...limbo I think? what's that one?

Now, if hell isn't actually mentioned unless in the context of judgement day and satan is the one ruling over earth right now...why would there even be any non-evil people alive? Wouldn't satan be tormenting them at least? (maybe he is lol).

Originally posted by snowgirl

Originally posted by CLPrime
I see this was a rhetorical question with no actual intent to understand what the Bible says, even though that is the question that was asked. I apologize for my Biblical answer.

No problem, the thing is, and I know this first hand as I went to a catholic school, is that we were always taught that there is a heaven and there is a hell. The good go to heaven and the bad go to hell, unless they repent, in which case they get forgiven and get to go to heaven instead...then there was the whole 'middle section'...limbo I think? what's that one?

Now, if hell isn't actually mentioned unless in the context of judgement day and satan is the one ruling over earth right now...why would there even be any non-evil people alive? Wouldn't satan be tormenting them at least? (maybe he is lol).

There's a marked difference between Catholic doctrine and Scriptural doctrine.
Satan was given free reign to tempt and deceive. His authority is what God gives him and no more. So, he doesn't so much rule over Earth as he is free to turn its people away from God.
Punishment is an aspect of judgement, which is a Second Coming thing. Also, I'm not your typical Christian with the typical End Times views. Rather, I find that, Scripturally, we are currently in the "Millennial Reign," where Satan is bound for a symbolic 1000 years. Of course, that doesn't mean the world becomes a paradise during the time he's bound... the deceiver is bound, but the deceit remains. After the symbolic 1000 years, Christ returns and the Final Judgement occurs, when Satan and all of his followers are destroyed in the Lake of Fire. They are not punished eternally, because that would perpetuate sin... rather, they are "snuffed" out of existence in what's called the Second Death.

Now wasnt Hell only introduced to the christian/catholic doutrine around the time they were needing to convince people to obey the rules of the church and the nobles, selling tickets to heaven(not the earlier concept of eternal kingdom), pardonishing sins in exchange for money or labour to build those big cathedrals designed to scare the ignorant masses while making them feel tiny compared to the lord.

now excuse me while i laugh a little

while living on this hell on earth

Originally posted by CLPrime
"Hell", itself, means the grave, and is synonymous with "death".

John 11:11 "These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep."

you are dazzled by your own reasoning... and baffled by your own BS..

have you stocked up on kool aid yet?

Originally posted by CLPrime

Originally posted by snowgirl

Originally posted by CLPrime
I see this was a rhetorical question with no actual intent to understand what the Bible says, even though that is the question that was asked. I apologize for my Biblical answer.

No problem, the thing is, and I know this first hand as I went to a catholic school, is that we were always taught that there is a heaven and there is a hell. The good go to heaven and the bad go to hell, unless they repent, in which case they get forgiven and get to go to heaven instead...then there was the whole 'middle section'...limbo I think? what's that one?

Now, if hell isn't actually mentioned unless in the context of judgement day and satan is the one ruling over earth right now...why would there even be any non-evil people alive? Wouldn't satan be tormenting them at least? (maybe he is lol).

There's a marked difference between Catholic doctrine and Scriptural doctrine.
Satan was given free reign to tempt and deceive. His authority is what God gives him and no more. So, he doesn't so much rule over Earth as he is free to turn its people away from God.
Punishment is an aspect of judgement, which is a Second Coming thing. Also, I'm not your typical Christian with the typical End Times views. Rather, I find that, Scripturally, we are currently in the "Millennial Reign," where Satan is bound for a symbolic 1000 years. Of course, that doesn't mean the world becomes a paradise during the time he's bound... the deceiver is bound, but the deceit remains. After the symbolic 1000 years, Christ returns and the Final Judgement occurs, when Satan and all of his followers are destroyed in the Lake of Fire. They are not punished eternally, because that would perpetuate sin... rather, they are "snuffed" out of existence in what's called the Second Death.

Ok, I sort of get it, but I don't understand, if that is the case, why satan would then choose to tempt people, knowing full well that his follwers will all perish along with him, in the lake of fire. What then happens to them after that, to their spirits I mean? (what is the bibles stance on this as I know that the catholic church still carries out exorcisms, which leads me to believe that they have some sort of belief in demons/evil spirits) does god have the power to 'snuff out' their spirits?

Originally posted by snowgirl
reply to post by Akragon

 

Oh I don't..don't buy into any of it to be honest, I'm quite happy to take my chances living my life the way I want to...I'll worry about what happens when I'm dead...when I'm dead

Your body is only a vessel for your soul, when you die....your body dies, and you return to where we all came from. No not this lovely place in the sky called heaven. Heaven and hell are the same thing, a means of control, yet slightly more positive....If your a good boy, and you obey what we tell you, you can go to the cloud city where all your favorite dead celebrities are waiting to hang out with you with all your dead relitives...

Though i do believe you will see your loved ones that have past once you die, the idea of these pearly gates waiting for me, with St.Michael waitng at the enterance with a book of your deeds on earth. Just makes me laugh....the media glamorized the idea of death, in reality death is a part of life, we all have to die one day, but living in fear of that day is illogical.

Fear does nothing but handycap you in any and all circumstances, yet almost all religions use it to suck you into their belief. Which brings be back to the topic of this discussion.....Hell is a fear based tactic to control you, to take your money, and to keep you living in fear.

Fear hinders the progression of your spirit! You can not progress in life if your fear rules your being!

Hell is being strapped down in a chair and being forced to listen to Michael Bolton records.... Hell is a construct of the religio-political industrial complex. It's created to make you a slave. Free your mind. Free your consciousness.

reply to post by snowgirl


The way I understand it, and I don't have references atm, but I will look for them, is that in the original languages the bible was written in, the word for hell that was used, basically meant "away from god." it wasn't necessarily a place people went when they died. It was just a state of being, or not being. It might have even meant only those who "chose" god were the only ones who had a so called "afterlife," and the rest were just dead.

It was during the first the dark ages, then the middle ages, where the current concept of hell comes from. Mose notably from Dante's Divine Comedy in the 14th century.

Then it was then the idea was really picked up by the church as a way to "keep the masses" inline. If you don't follow our ways, you WILL go to this hell.

The current concept of hell was never referred to in the bible at all.

Hell is going hunting with Dick Cheney. Hell is going on a date with Prince Charles... listen to George Bush read outloud and watching him chew bubble gum and walk at the same time. Hell is made up by a bunch of guys who wrote a made up book that they say is the word of God. Don't believe any of it! It is a load of rubbish! Free your mind and your consiousness.

Originally posted by reeferman

Originally posted by CLPrime
"Hell", itself, means the grave, and is synonymous with "death".

John 11:11 "These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep."

you are dazzled by your own reasoning... and baffled by your own BS..

have you stocked up on kool aid yet?

No, he's right about this from what I have learned.

I am a former catholic myself, and once, I believed in the whole hell story. I was was taught the hell story, and purgatory, and limbo, lol? It's a money making scheme, and a horrible one.

What better way to get money out of poor, grieving relatives whose loved ones have died.......than to promise them that prayers from the priest, or masses said, for money of course, would lessen their loved one's time being tortured in purgatory?

In Kings, in the Old Testament, it says when the king died, he would be put in the grave, where he would sleep like his fathers.

According to the Bible, hell is the grave, and death is sleep, where we know nothing, just like being asleep.

That's why Jesus said Lazarus was asleep, and that He would wake him.

reply to post by snowgirl


God, and Satan are the one and the same, two faces of the same coin. Besides having the two twisted around, Satan is the better face of God, this has been the most difficult incongruence, among many others, with which Religious Theologians have had to deal with. It is, of course, a propaganda, and control system, from a religion that took, read stole, so much from others that it no longer knows what it is.

The God/Satan dichotomy, which is contested by many Church Scholars, stresses, to the point of destruction, the concepts of Monotheism, god's omnipresence, omnipotence, and, above all, denotes the Pagan evolutions of a small Apocalyptic sect that just happened to catch the attention of an Empire crumbling under it's own weight. Add to that the cult of the Christ, and of the various Marian followings, and you have an rampant Pagan religion...

In such a religion, borderline Paganism, a Hell, as a place outside the influence, and control of god, is perfectly understandable, also resolving the problem of Sin, and Freewill...

Originally posted by snowgirl

Originally posted by CLPrime

Originally posted by snowgirl

Originally posted by CLPrime
I see this was a rhetorical question with no actual intent to understand what the Bible says, even though that is the question that was asked. I apologize for my Biblical answer.

No problem, the thing is, and I know this first hand as I went to a catholic school, is that we were always taught that there is a heaven and there is a hell. The good go to heaven and the bad go to hell, unless they repent, in which case they get forgiven and get to go to heaven instead...then there was the whole 'middle section'...limbo I think? what's that one?

Now, if hell isn't actually mentioned unless in the context of judgement day and satan is the one ruling over earth right now...why would there even be any non-evil people alive? Wouldn't satan be tormenting them at least? (maybe he is lol).

There's a marked difference between Catholic doctrine and Scriptural doctrine.
Satan was given free reign to tempt and deceive. His authority is what God gives him and no more. So, he doesn't so much rule over Earth as he is free to turn its people away from God.
Punishment is an aspect of judgement, which is a Second Coming thing. Also, I'm not your typical Christian with the typical End Times views. Rather, I find that, Scripturally, we are currently in the "Millennial Reign," where Satan is bound for a symbolic 1000 years. Of course, that doesn't mean the world becomes a paradise during the time he's bound... the deceiver is bound, but the deceit remains. After the symbolic 1000 years, Christ returns and the Final Judgement occurs, when Satan and all of his followers are destroyed in the Lake of Fire. They are not punished eternally, because that would perpetuate sin... rather, they are "snuffed" out of existence in what's called the Second Death.

Ok, I sort of get it, but I don't understand, if that is the case, why satan would then choose to tempt people, knowing full well that his follwers will all perish along with him, in the lake of fire. What then happens to them after that, to their spirits I mean? (what is the bibles stance on this as I know that the catholic church still carries out exorcisms, which leads me to believe that they have some sort of belief in demons/evil spirits) does god have the power to 'snuff out' their spirits?

Because Satan doesn't like to believe that he will be defeated, even though he knows he will be. It's his nature to deceive, and he does God's will...he knows that his end is coming, but that only makes him try harder. In fact, in Revelation 12:12, we find, "Therefore rejoice, you heavens and you who dwell in them! But woe to the earth and the sea, because the devil has gone down to you! He is filled with fury, because he knows that his time is short."

And, at the Second Death, the souls of the sinful are destroyed. This is the nature of the Second Death. The first death was physical...this death is spiritual and final.

Originally posted by reeferman

Originally posted by CLPrime
"Hell", itself, means the grave, and is synonymous with "death".

John 11:11 "These things said he: and after that he saith unto them, Our friend Lazarus sleepeth; but I go, that I may awake him out of sleep."

you are dazzled by your own reasoning... and baffled by your own BS..

have you stocked up on kool aid yet?

The original Greek word for "Hell" is 'hades', which is indicative of the unseen - the grave. Why is it indicative of the unseen? Because 'hades' is from the roots 'a', which is the negation, and 'eido', which means to perceive, or see. Hence, "unseen".