WHO: "H5N1 Bird Flu is Back" …and Infects Fish Too

Russia's Pravda is the only press admitting H5N1 Bird Flu is back after a 7-year break. And the fact is, H5N1-9A Bird Flu infects fish.

From Pravda, WHO: "Avian flu, or Bird flu, A H5N1, is back":

The World Health Organization is monitoring closely the development of the deadly Bird flu virus, A H5N1, which has killed 40 people so far in Egypt and which has affected people in five different countries since it reappeared in 2010, after a break of seven years. The WHO warns that the virus has met all the prerequisites to start a deadly pandemic bar one.

H5N1- 9A Bird Flu infects fish:

Recombinomics reports that H5N1-9A severely attacks fish with particular virulence:

3. H5N1 9A
This is a virus from Shantou (northern Guangdong province) in November 2004. It is a contagious and does not differ from H5N1 markedly. But the feces of the infected poultry is very unusual. The feces of chickens, ducks and pigs are emptied into fish ponds in some parts of China, and this virus severely attacks fish with particular virulence. The fish bones turn soft, but the reason is not known and needs to be tested in laboratories.

From China. Between 2003 and 2005, China identified 10 'types' of H5N1 Bird Flu. H5N1-9A, was found to infect fish.
Translation: H5N1 bird flu in Qinghai in China's internal classification of information:

3, H5N19A

This is in November, 2004 the Shantou area virus, the contact infection, not too greatly distinguishes with H5N1, but infects this virus domesticated fowl's excrement is very special, because Chinese partial area excrement and so on use chicken, duck, pig pours into the fish pond, therefore, is had by this kind of viral influence fish the very strong aggressivity, and has the certain toxicity, the fish bone can change softly, the reason is unclear, this conclusion obtains by the laboratory.

...the rate of virus mutation fast, usually the virus mutate into a new generation of viruses, genetic re-combination time is from the 7 months of 2003 fell to 4 months

So H5N1 Bird Flu mutates at the biological equivalent of lightening speed - AND it's been infecting birds, fish, people and a huge variety of animals for a while.

Now, anomalies in the Earth's magnetosphere are stressing birds' and other lifeforms' immune systems, along with other effects.

There's no doubt: Stress kills. …And multiple stressors kill faster.

Electro-magnetic stress and infection from pandemic flu's are just two of the most obvious stressors contributing to mass die-offs. …There is little doubt H5N1 Bird Flu is pandemic in animals at least - thanks to industrial agriculture, and the fact that the disease spreads via infected waste in water and soil, as well as on goods and in feed.

A German scientist said Tuesday the entry of faeces from infected poultry into the food chain via fish was a likely cause of the global spread of bird flu - and not migrating wild birds.

'We are moving away from the assumption that migrating birds are the cause,' said Josef H. Reichholf, a zoology professor at Munich's Technical University, in a comment published by the newspaper Die Welt.

… Reichholf suggested the more likely vector for the disease was the heavy use of poultry faeces as fertilizer on fields.

Poultry fecal matter was washed into lakes and rivers and ingested by fish or other aquatic animals, he said. The contaminated fish were then eaten by birds and animals. [Don't forget, the Mississippi carries agricultural run-off into the Gulf.]

Fish meal is also widely used as protein in animal feed, including poultry feed.

… He said bird flu developments in East Asia indicated that wild birds were being infected by poultry and their faeces - not the other way around.

***

The virus may be spreading through contaminated feed, Munich-based ornithologist Josef Reichholf said, according to Focus magazine.

***

Birds spread the disease through droppings and other secretions, which often contaminate shared feed and water.

The circle of infection includes a huge variety of different animals, not just birds and fish.

"A far wider range of species, including rare and endangered ones, may be affected by highly virulent avian flu than has previously been supposed," United Nations Environment Program (UNEP) said in a statement in March 2006. It said experts at the Convention on Biological Diversity (CBD) conference in Brazil said "there is growing evidence that the H5N1 virus can infect and harm big cats like leopards and tigers, small cats such as civets and other mammals like martens, weasels, badgers and otters."

***

According to a Statement issued by the UN Environment Programme (UNEP) Office here, the experts emphasised there was evidence pointing at the possibility for the H5N1 Virus to be transmitted to Wild Animals such as Cats, Panthers and Leopards in the Jungle habitats.

The experts, who are discussing the Convention on Biodiversity (CBD), stressed the need to give special attention to biodiversity-rich countries, particularly those with populations of chimpanzees and gorillas.

No one is saying outright that H5N1 bird flu is epidemic in fish, sharks or whales - never mind tuna. But scientists at the 2004 international Convention on Biological Diversity highlighted the possible links between H5N1 bird flu and the planet's sixth extinction event.

...(H5N1's) impact on biological diversity and on species may be far wider and more complex than might have been initially supposed," Ahmed Djoghlaf, CBD executive secretary, told conference attendees.

* The average abundance of species declined 40 percent between 1970 and 2000 while species in rivers, lakes and marshlands have declined by 50 percent.
* Between 12 and 52 percent of species within well-studied higher taxa including birds, mammals and amphibians are threatened with extinction.
* In the North Atlantic, populations of large fish have declined 66 percent in the last 50 years.

Seems we brought this on ourselves, or more accurately, agricultural industry's practices brought it on us.

"... (H5N1) is in many ways a threat of our own making. For example, reduced genetic diversity in domestic animals like poultry in favor of a 'monoculture' in the last 50 years has resulted in a reduction of resistance to many diseases."

"There is also growing evidence that a healthy environment can act as a buffer against old and the emergence of new diseases whereas a degraded one favors the spread of infections.

So animals have a hard time fighting infections in a "degraded" environment - because they're already too stressed, and their immune systems are already overworked.

Now, our planet's animals have to cope with magnetic anomalies on top of toxic soup, pollution and new diseases. No wonder they're all dying.

But the "official" answer is to add even more stressors: GM flu-resistant chickens and a universal flu vaccine.

Just to clarify - IMHO - the mass animal die-offs result from multiple stressors - the 2 most important being H5N1 Bird Flu infection and the current magnetic anomalies.

More info...

North American authorities recognize two "pathotypes" of bird flu or Avian Influenza (AI): low or mildly pathogenic(LPAI or MPAI) and highly pathogenic (HPAI). A strain is not categorized as highly pathogenic until it kills 75% of birds infected.

HPAI strains typically are detected as a result of poultry deaths... The designation of high pathogenicity generally is based on what happens to healthy chickens when they're exposed to the virus. If the virus kills at least 6 out of 8 chickens in a challenge trial, it is deemed highly pathogenic.

Mild bird flus are known to mutate into highly pathogenic forms. However, only an HPAI diagnosis triggers government intervention in North America. US scientists have recommended eradication programs for mild forms of H5 and H7 bird flu, but the experts have been ignored and their recommendations dismissed for "economic" reasons.

History has proven that prevention of HPAI is based on successful control of H5 or H7 LPAI.

Meat and eggs from poultry with "low path" bird flu are sold legally as food in the USA, Canada and other countries. The evidence suggests that humans infected with "low path" bird flu end up with chronic disease - and serve as "mixing vessels" to create more virulent and deadly mutations.

...H5N1 bird flu pathology is found in connective tissue of the blood vessels, lungs, gut, heart, brain and other organs, and is known to infect "apidose" or fat cells. The symptoms generally depend on the severity of the infection, its length, and the locations of infection in the body.

With LPAI outbreaks in poultry there is mild to moderate inflammation of the trachea, sinuses, air sacs and conjunctiva. In laying birds there often is ovarian atresia and involution of the oviduct. Various degrees of congestive, hemorrhagic, transudative, and necrotic lesions have been described.

Chronic infection with low path bird flu is not recognized in humans. However, the chronic disease pandemic sweeping the globe has the same pathology as H5N1 bird flu: the proliferation of abnormal myofibroblasts in connective tissue and smooth muscle cells throughout the body with aberrant wound healing and "tissue remodelling."

And the human chronic disease pandemic just keeps getting worse...
ATSNN. Bird Flu and Beyond: Chronic Disease to Kill 400 Million
ATSNN: Bird Flu, and the "Neglected Epidemic"

Wow, awesome job!!!!!!

It's gonna take me at least one more read through to process the info, a lot of it is new to me.

Just right off the bat, do you think that there is a connection between this info that Pravada brought forth, and the recent global bird and fish deaths?

I also read something a few days ago, I'll have to try and did it up. But from what I recall, there was a theory that if one had contracted the piggy flu (h1n1) and fought it off, that the person had almost a super ability to fight off other types of flu. I wonder if that would be beneficial here.

Ok, well I'm gonna reread and attempt to process and I'll be back.

Again great job.

So H5N1 is the penultimate virus?
I think tropospheric(ground level) O3 is the big stressor. witsendnj.blogspot.com...

I honestly think these fish died of a Sparolegnia I think it's called, white scale disease, which is a form of fungal infection on weakened fish, and am furthering believing (I think that is a word anyways) that this has spread into birds, and other wildlife and could very well be the cause of leprosy in the seal die offs. Now whatever has weakened these fish to the point of the mass attack that has happened I do not know, nor do I know if it is man made causes or natural causes due to overpopulation in certain locations. But, from all the research I have done on the subject and eliminating all other causes it is the one that makes sense. Whether or not this can and is being spread through human's in another debate. www.aquaticcommunity.com...

books.google.com... n&ei=Z4k7TbnAIsTYgAee1rGtCA&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CC8Q6AEwBA#v=onepage&q&f=false

reply to post by searching4truth


Thanks s4t.

do you think that there is a connection between this info that Pravada brought forth, and the recent global bird and fish deaths?

Absolutely. ...Birds and animals can fight off a lot in a healthy environment, but these days the assaults don't quit.

No doubt Bird Flu is back, and no doubt solar storms are wreaking havoc with our magnetosphere. These 2 fronts alone are deadly - and there's more (climate change, pollution, toxins).

I also read something a few days ago, I'll have to try and did it up. But from what I recall, there was a theory that if one had contracted the piggy flu (h1n1) and fought it off, that the person had almost a super ability to fight off other types of flu.

Supposedly, some people who had swine flu became immune - so the idea is to harvest their serum and create a universal vaccine. The other big marketing push is promoting flu-resistant chickens.

I think BOTH "solutions" are, ...erm, flawed.

reply to post by green-tree

So H5N1 is the penultimate virus?

Nope. Didn't say that, don't think it. ...We ain't seen nothin' yet. Wrote this in 2006, and it's still good: Beyond Bird Flu: The Perfect Microbial Storm.

I think tropospheric(ground level) O3 is the big stressor. witsendnj.blogspot.com...

Ground level ozone is NOT good, and definitely wreaks havoc on plants and trees. Right now, the effects on animals are considered "secondary."

IMHO - ground level ozone may be a significant stressor in animals, but virulent microbial infections push them over.

reply to post by soficrow


I agree with you on this one, if I can get my camera to work I will take some pictures around a methane plant near where I live, all the tree's have turned brown and are dying around a 1/4 mile radius of the plant. And yet nothing has been said about it.

reply to post by Golithion

Originally posted by Golithion
I honestly think these fish died of a Sparolegnia...Now whatever has weakened these fish to the point of the mass attack that has happened I do not know, nor do I know if it is man made causes or natural causes due to overpopulation in certain locations. But, from all the research I have done on the subject and eliminating all other causes it is the one that makes sense. Whether or not this can and is being spread through human's in another debate. www.aquaticcommunity.com...

Saprolegnia fungus may be a factor in some of the die-offs, but as your source says, it "will only attack weakened fish that has already been infected by another disease." ...Bird flu is proved to infect fish, but I don't think Saprolegnia is proved to infect birds. Bats on the other hand, maybe.

...Still, it's a HUGE mistake to look for a "single cause" - all the new science shows that "everything is connected." For example, Complex systems biology.

Opportunistic infections like fungus take hold when the body is already really weakened - so it makes sense to look at the environmental factors that are creating stressors. The planet's new magnetic anomalies and H5N1 Bird Flu are good examples of major environmental stressors.

reply to post by soficrow


Oh I do not deny the fact that environmental causes do not help the situation. However this bird fungal infection is very similar to Sparelengia, www.multiscope.com... and it is still being debated that eating infected fish can be the cause of leprosy.www.petmd.com... another source for that. And who is to say that this did not spread from a captive bird to the population. However as stated I do not deny the fact environmental causes weakened these animals for this to happen. As for the fungal infection in bat's that has been noticed on news articles around the world so I do not feel the need to post one here, but I will anyways. www.livescience.com...


I am still doing research on this subject but it seems to correlate.

PS: I completely forgot the article about eating infected fish and leprosy: books.google.com... NnmVfVI&hl=en&ei=3Zg7TZiRA8WBlAfX-JXvBg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=5&ved=0CCwQ6AEwBA#v=onepage&q=Eating%20infected%20fish%20and%20leprosy&f= false

reply to post by Golithion

Oh I do not deny the fact that environmental causes do not help the situation.

And I want to emphasize that multiple stressors actually create the situation.

…a sea change in exposure science is required to incorporate consideration of lifestage, genetic susceptibility, and interaction of nonchemical stressors for holistic assessment of risk factors associated with complex environmental disease.

…Low-level and prevalent environmental exposures may contribute substantially to the burden of common complex disease (Gibson, 2008; Hemminki et al., 2006). Understanding the relationships between environmental exposures and health outcomes requires integration of a wide range of factors—extrinsic (e.g., environmental), intrinsic (e.g., genotypic), and mechanistic (e.g., toxicological)—to support health studies and characterize risk.

However this bird fungal infection is very similar to Sparelengia, www.multiscope.com...

Fungal infections appeared 'out of nowhere' to wipe out whole species of amphibians and bats (not birds). But while you are looking for a "single cause," researchers are looking for "new disease paradigms."

Fungi that appeared from nowhere are wiping out whole species of amphibians and more than a million bats just by attacking the skin.

And both plights may represent new disease paradigms for wildlife, according to researchers.

and it is still being debated that eating infected fish can be the cause of leprosy.www.petmd.com...

Erm. No. Mycobacterium leprae causes leprosy; and Mycobacterium chelonae is a bacterium related to leprosy that infects fish. That's the connection.

Mycobacterium leprae, also known as Hansen’s coccus spirilly, … is a bacterium that causes leprosy (Hansen's disease).[1] It is an intracellular, pleomorphic, acid-fast bacterium.[2] M. leprae is an aerobic rod-shaped (bacillus) surrounded by the characteristic waxy coating unique to mycobacteria. In size and shape, it closely resembles Mycobacterium tuberculosis.

**
Water is a well known medium for transfer of various diseases. …Mycobacterium chelonae, a bacterium related to fish TB, human TB, and leprosy, that can be isolated from water, soil and dust, and is also known to infect various fishes.

And who is to say that this did not spread from a captive bird to the population.

Several quotes in the OP say exactly that:

A German scientist said Tuesday the entry of faeces from infected poultry into the food chain via fish was a likely cause of the global spread of bird flu - and not migrating wild birds.

'We are moving away from the assumption that migrating birds are the cause,' said Josef H. Reichholf, a zoology professor at Munich's Technical University, in a comment published by the newspaper Die Welt.

… Reichholf suggested the more likely vector for the disease was the heavy use of poultry faeces as fertilizer on fields.

Poultry fecal matter was washed into lakes and rivers and ingested by fish or other aquatic animals, he said. The contaminated fish were then eaten by birds and animals. [Don't forget, the Mississippi carries agricultural run-off into the Gulf.]

Fish meal is also widely used as protein in animal feed, including poultry feed.

… He said bird flu developments in East Asia indicated that wild birds were being infected by poultry and their faeces - not the other way around.

I am still doing research on this subject but it seems to correlate.

Just remember: Correlation is not cause.

Again I agree with you this may have multiple causes, but the fact the blue beaks, disorientation, and unnatural behavior was seen in some bird cases the one in Italy in particular, I can't rule out that a new form of Infection is spreading, with all the previous documentation of illness, and spread, and other factors. Leads me to conclude and again in agreement a new disease maybe emerging, and combing as virus's and bacteria intend to do into multiple strains. It is scary www.accessexcellence.org...


And I must say I really really like you doing the research you have done. It show's great pushes in science are not just done in a lab.

Article on Turtle doves dying: www.dailymail.co.uk...


As to fish causing leprosy it still being debated as this provides. Just an FYI: www.whale.to...

reply to post by Golithion


Thanks Golithion.

All your links are interesting, and the information remains important. Your bird and fish death overview is from January 11, 2011. Your leprosy reference is from the 1800's, and your source regarding virus and bacteria's ability to mutate is from 1943. Good stuff.

Still, something happened around 1997, and the biological world got turned upside down. H5N1 "bird" flu first infected humans in Hong Kong in 1997; and the second new disease that appeared in 1997 was just as scary as H5N1:

"At a press conference on May 23rd in 1997 scientists finally acknowledged the arrival of the untreatable bacteria they'd feared for years. The scientists reports were grim:

...Today superbugs look triumphant. They are bacteria that resist our antibiotics. The drugs which have kept us safe for 50 years are beginning to fail. ...This is a serious situation. Over the last 5 years we've clearly seen a change in our ability to treat what should have been easily treatable infections because the bacteria have developed the ability of resisting the antibiotics. ...And the more antibiotics we use, the more resistant bacteria become. Every year more than 5 million people die from infections that don't respond to antibiotics."

So now we've got diseases that bypass the immune system, and medical technology too. I suspect Cold Spring Harbor's researchers had a hand in trying to duplicate nature's processes, once they "discovered" them...

Much has happened, biologically, in the 68 years since your Cold Spring Harbor paper was published, and in the 14 years since 1997. For example, Super Bugs are now an everyday reality. In March of 2005, the chief of infectious diseases at Montreal's Jewish General Hospital, Dr. Mark Miller, had this to say:

"Something happened 18 to 24 months ago, ...Now it seems any antibiotic can bring on the disease."

"Super Bugs" are highly contagious and lethal bacteria. They can't be treated with antibiotics.

In fact, antibiotics now cause previously benign bacteria to mutate into lethal forms. Most "Super Bugs" mutate into highly contagious and lethal forms on exposure to antibiotics inside the host's body.

In 1998, a triple assortment swine flu appeared, containing human, swine and bird flu genetic material. Animal diseases started infecting plants, plant diseases started infecting animals. Bacteria started eating antibiotics, and thriving on them like they were super-foods - unrelated microbes started cross-breeding - species and kingdom barriers suddenly meant nothing.

…and it's not over yet, by a long shot.


Here's a museum exhibition you may find interesting: Epidemic! The World of Infectious Disease.

Indeed super bugs are nasty critters, but it has taken years to evolve like you have shown here. www.usatoday.com...

But, and this is a big but we are not sure if both are related as of yet. A lot of research still has to be done And thankfully there are many people trying to find a cure for drug resistant bugs like this. www.scientificamerican.com...

Precedent says though that we may be unleashing something worse in the environment by doing so however. www.glfc.org...

Example of fish for instance:
dels-old.nas.edu...

Such treatments can lead to depletion in population which we as stewards have to be mindful of. Such as releasing something into the environment to stop a deterioration, while creating one instead. Example for you: www.suite101.com...


Better source regarding Malaria: www.i-sis.org.uk...

reply to post by Golithion

Originally posted by Golithion
Indeed super bugs are nasty critters, but it has taken years to evolve like you have shown here. www.usatoday.com...

Thanks Golithion.

...The evolution accelerated pretty much over night - the spread is a bit slower for the less contagious bugs like those talked about in your link.

But, and this is a big but we are not sure if both are related as of yet.

The "relationship" has to do with the accelerated evolution, across the board.

A lot of research still has to be done And thankfully there are many people trying to find a cure for drug resistant bugs like this. www.scientificamerican.com...

These super bugs are feeding on antibiotics. New research shows that resistance is transmitted horizontally!!! Meaning something that was always understood to be 'genetic' is actually passed on like an infection...

...So-called "cures" actually push bugs to mutate, and speed up their evolution even faster.

Precedent says though that we may be unleashing something worse in the environment by doing so however.

No kidding.

Such treatments can lead to depletion in population which we as stewards have to be mindful of. Such as releasing something into the environment to stop a deterioration, while creating one instead. Example for you: www.suite101.com...

Clever - bringing in a natural predator - that just happens to be a fungus.

Better source regarding Malaria: www.i-sis.org.uk...

And creating transgenic malaria resistant mosquitoes. GREAT idea. (Not.)

.......Just a reminder Golithion -

this thread is about epidemic, possibly pandemic Bird Flu and the fact that it infects fish. AND the idea that the disease works in concert with recent geomagnetic anomalies to cause mass die-offs...

Any chance you could address the topic?

Thanks, sofi

Hey there friend, another great job of connecting dots and providing support! Jeeze, as if things couldn't get any worse! I was reluctant to accept the WHO information because I believe there is conflicts of interest going on with them and big pharma, but everything else you brought together paints a pretty dire picture. I had never considered the immune system of the birds/animals playing a part in all of this, but it makes sense. And fish? Well that's a new one on me. You almost have me convinced I might need a shot, but that would be the last thing I would do, don't know who to trust anymore besides my own mind, after it process as much info available pertaining to the subject.

Like the native americans web of life analogy, everything is connected and what happens to our co-inhabiters will likely have an affect on us too. It's a shame people don't usually respond until a crisis is upon them, but I also understand how people are too distracted, or disenchanted to find out the truth. Guess it's up to us, the ats canaries to continue investigating and reporting, and you soficrow are one of the best.

Peace,
spec

reply to post by soficrow


Great thread. This crossover mutating virus,if it gets more out of hand will effect us in many bad ways. You figure it will drive the price of all meats,poultry and fish through the roof! Things are already getting bad enough as it is!

This may be the one they actually force people to get a vaccine for. We may end up with no choice in the matter,who knows?

Originally posted by soficrow

Still, something happened around 1997, and the biological world got turned upside down. H5N1 "bird" flu first infected humans in Hong Kong in 1997; and the second new disease that appeared in 1997 was just as scary as H5N1:

"At a press conference on May 23rd in 1997 scientists finally acknowledged the arrival of the untreatable bacteria they'd feared for years.

Coincidentally, 1997 was also the year the pandemic influenza virus of 1918-1919 was retrieved by scientists who located the frozen corpses of victims who had died of it in Alaska, and dug them up to gain access to this virus to play with.

reply to post by speculativeoptimist

Originally posted by speculativeoptimist
…I was reluctant to accept the WHO information because I believe there is conflicts of interest going on with them and big pharma,

There are! …and with agri-biz and the food industry, and travel indutry and …..

…but everything else you brought together paints a pretty dire picture. I had never considered the immune system of the birds/animals playing a part in all of this, but it makes sense. And fish? Well that's a new one on me.

In some ways no, it's not a pretty picture. In other ways, it's seriously cool in that it shows how everything is connected, interracts and is inter-dependent.

You almost have me convinced I might need a shot,

NOOOOOO! …it's the compromise solution between the WHO, agri-biz, Big Pharma and all the money makers but it's NOT the right one!

….what happens to our co-inhabiters will likely have an affect on us too.

The same things that affect them impact us too.

It's a shame people don't usually respond until a crisis is upon them, but I also understand how people are too distracted, or disenchanted to find out the truth.

Best thing that happened to me was getting sick. First time in decades I had time to read, learn, catch up. …Too bad that's what it took.

Guess it's up to us, the ats canaries to continue investigating and reporting, and you soficrow are one of the best.

You too spec. …and thanks.


reply to post by CASH69

Originally posted by CASH69
reply to post by soficrow

 

Great thread. This crossover mutating virus,if it gets more out of hand will effect us in many bad ways. You figure it will drive the price of all meats,poultry and fish through the roof! Things are already getting bad enough as it is!

Thanks CASH. …Looks like the plan is to getting mucking with the environment, then force people into raising and eating GM food to avoid the predictable, natural effects. Oh yeah, and get vaccinated.

This may be the one they actually force people to get a vaccine for. We may end up with no choice in the matter,who knows?

…I won't do it.


reply to post by Kailassa

Originally posted by Kailassa

Originally posted by soficrow

Still, something happened around 1997, and the biological world got turned upside down. H5N1 "bird" flu first infected humans in Hong Kong in 1997; and the second new disease that appeared in 1997 was just as scary as H5N1:

"At a press conference on May 23rd in 1997 scientists finally acknowledged the arrival of the untreatable bacteria they'd feared for years.

Coincidentally, 1997 was also the year the pandemic influenza virus of 1918-1919 was retrieved by scientists who located the frozen corpses of victims who had died of it in Alaska, and dug them up to gain access to this virus to play with.

Interesting coincidence, isn't it?

…I think it's another factor and stressor, but a lot happened before then to set the stage - including GM and GE tinkering, and bioweapons development. Not sure what the tipping factor was, could have been naturally environmental.

…It's the cumulative and coinciding stressors that are driving evolution's acceleration at this point though. …It's out of control for sure, and it's gonna be a wild ride.

reply to post by soficrow


Dang it I was agreeing with you and we both got on a tangent. Don't have to get freaking snippy about it, and yes bottom feeders can transmit the disease as the US Fish and Game has found, as well as Pigs, and Cats.

It's the feces of infected animals in fish farming that could cause the infection in fish. But a lot of research is being done, since bottom feeders like Carp, Catfish and the like eat these kind of things, it is a likely scenario to say, that a single bird infected, could have caused the spread to these fish farms. Here: www.birdlife.org...

Great study about this particular subject. And again I was not advocating tempering by using those means those were examples of what I mean't to say shouldn't be done. Perhaps a miscommunication or not. But there hope that helps you a bit.