Pilot walks off job after refusing to go through full body X-ray scanner at airport

ANYONE advocating more government access to private lives, my body, the cellular activity in my body, the introduction of fear and more fear into our lives, embracing the position that the government knows best, or defending further government insertion into our lives, is NOT a free minded human.
They have willingly gone over to the collared herd.
Defending submission, doesnt make it any less submissive.

reply to post by defcon5


quote by defcon5

I have news for you guys, pilots are exposed to a lot higher, and more dangerous levels of radiation in general, and accept that as a normal part of their jobs.

I know full well that every time I travel, I am exposed to higher levels of natural radiation.

It is something that we all have come to understand and accept because we are able to assess the risks, based on our experiences of over 60 yrs of high levels of international travel.

The full body scan is new technology that is being tested as we speak upon unsuspecting, and rather trusting travelers.

Everybody is aware of the need for security but it must come at an acceptable price. Our health should not come into that equation.

I'm not surprised he has had enough, he's a pilot for goodness sake, think about it!

Scan me day in day out looking for a knife or a gun or a bomb.... then send me on my way with an aircraft full of fuel and 250 helpless passengers strapped in behind me!

No wonder he just wants to be left alone to get on and do his job!

Good on the Pilot.

Before you could travel without full body scanners. Now you have them.

You can travel on foot, until one day you'll reach a scanner.

Same will go for trains, they wont stop at just airport scanners, lol.

This is the begining.

reply to post by defcon5


So pilots need to be body scanned or patted down? Why? Because we don't trust them?

I got news for you that pilot could kill every person on board with just his two hands! He doesn't need weapons to commandeer the airplane - he is already in control.

This is an absurdity of logic. He won't bring anything aboard that would endanger himself or the passengers. Trust me, you can trust them. If you can't trust the pilot I highly recommend you don't fly. If a pilot wants to commit suicide and take everyone down with him he can and no body scanner can prevent it.

The co-pilot? Yeah what's he gonna do when the pilot pushes the yoke full forward 800 ft off the ground on approach?

Do you usually tow the gov't line?

reply to post by MegaMind


Thats kinda what I said in my post above...

Seems crazy to me that airplane personnel should be forced to go through those scanners regularly. The health risk it poses is even worse than the invasiveness. And the invasiveness of it is pretty bad. This pilot snapped it seems, and I can´t say that I wouldn´t have in his position.

Don´t all pilots undergo extensive mental evaluations and stuff prior to getting their licence/certificate? Are they so inefficient that you have to assume that your pilots are just a "terrorist" attack waiting to happen? I realize asking for trust is a little on the naive side... But at some point the paranoia must stop. It becomes an infected and volatile environment. Perhaps even a breeding ground for what one seeks to prevent.

If I was a commercial airline pilot hellbent on killing a bunch of people, I wouldn´t bring a knife or gun onboard. I´d find a way to jam the cockpit door and then proceed to drive the plane into a mountain or something. Flying is quite scary, but isn´t it much safer than getting in a car, train, bus or carriage statistically?

Yes, I see the need for scanners. But not as a default option for everyone and their grandma.

reply to post by defcon5


It doesn't just seem silly - IT IS SILLY!

I think logic dictates that the "rules" don't need to be applied evenly to everyone. Pilots are an obvious exception to pat downs and body scans.

reply to post by MegaMind


You are correct and your signature is also spot on.

Mandatory, arbitrary 2nd line.

Originally posted by Cataka

Originally posted by Big Raging Loner

Pilot walks off job after refusing to go through full body X-ray scanner at airport

www.dailymail.co.uk

A Tennessee pilot is waiting to find out if he has lost his job because he refused to go through a full body scanner at a Memphis airport.
ExpressJet Airlines first officer Michael Roberts turned up for work on Monday but says he's tired of being manhandled by security agents and went home after deciding he didn't want to be patted down.
Roberts was chosen to go through the X-ray scanning machine at Memphis International airport before getting into the pilot seat to fly a commercial aircraft.

(visit the link for the full news article)

Good for him.

1. For refusing to be manhandled as it were and
2. Because being subjected to a full body X-Ray day after day just to get to work is NOT healthy. Just like that damn X-Ray scanner that the government is driving around beaming people with.

"It's completely safe to have full body X-Ray each time you go to the airport!" they say.

Sure...that's why when X-Ray Techs take ANY X-Ray *anywhere* on your body, they put a lead vest on your chest and walk 20 damn yards away behind a shielded door to push the button. Suuuuuure...totally safe.

edit on 21-10-2010 by Cataka because: Added that last bit about what X-Ray techs do - and Dentists.

edit on 21-10-2010 by Cataka because: Grammar

And again we hear about the dangers of, OMG, radiation. A full body scanner emission is awesomely weak, about 10 microrem. As opposed to the 1000 rem/hour you get at 38,000 feet on the flight you get on after going through the scanner. You would have to go through the scanner almost million times to equal the radiation, in Sieverts, of a redeye from JFK to LAX. The X-rays from a scanner are ionizing, but the power is very low since it only has to penetrate clothing. A diagnostic x-ray, on the other hand, must penetrate tissue and dense muscle, etc.
BTW, normal background radiation that you get just sitting around reading ATS averages about 1000 rem/day.

Originally posted by defcon5

The following is my opinion as a member participating in this discussion.

Originally posted by MegaMind
reply to post by defcon5

 

It doesn't just seem silly - IT IS SILLY!

Well I am going to leave it at this for today…
Sometimes there are things that on the surface appear silly, yet for good reason, which I am not going to get into here ATM, they are mandatory. All I am going to state is that it has less to do with being a pain to the employees and more to do with the employees exposure to the public.

As an ATS Staff Member, I will not moderate in threads such as this where I have participated as a member.

edit on 10/21/2010 by defcon5 because: tags

I know there are some "tensions" between pilots and airport staff. A lot of airport staff view pilots as arrogant and condescending in their attitude towards them, and perhaps many are. Could it be that as a airport ramp supervisor you feel this tension yourself? Maybe you just don't like pilots getting "special treatment" and want them to follow the same "rules" you do. If this is the case I would say your emotions not your logic are determining where you stand on this issue. Just a thought.

I personally dont have a problem with going through these all over x ray machines, at the end of the day i havent got anything on me that i could use a weapon i have no drugs i havent got anything to hide. Everytime ive been to an airport ive never been man handled, if im set of the x ray machine im searched but knowing i have nothing on me i let the people do their job.

What happens when something happens on an airline and people start going on about lack of secuirty and searches. I can see it now, an airline gets blown up or hi-jacked and the investigation turns out that if the full body scanners were used they could of prevented the terrorist or terrorists bringing on the bomb or weapon.

I can see both sides of this argument but my view is simple .. you got nothing to hide, walk through the scanner get checked, away you go .. off to someone hot if your lucky

It will always amaze me how easily people are led to less, and enjoy defending it.

For all those saying this was a good thing, what if everyone were to refuse scanners and pat downs?

Should we just do away with the security because it takes away our freedoms?

I'd have thought this pilot would have know more than anyone how important it is to check everyone prior to boarding a plane.

Like it or not, there are idiots out there that would quite happily take out a plane if they had the chance. Sorry but if you want to fly a plane, or fly on one, you should just accept that there will need to be at least some form of security in place.

Before i get the usual comments about this being the most scary post anyones read , no i don't agree with the level of security enforced upon us, but to flatly refuse to accept any of it is just dangerous and ignorant in my opinion.

As others have said, if you don't like it....walk or swim.

The day a plane gets hijacked or blown up, and they find that the suspect wasn't subjected to any security measures before hand, this place will be awash with threads shouting from the rooftops.

CX.

reply to post by CX


How does a pilot hijack his own plane? With box cutters?


Two hands is all it takes ....

Originally posted by MegaMind
reply to post by CX

 

How does a pilot hijack his own plane? With box cutters?

Of course you could hijack your own plane. Many people in the past have had a bad day and flipped thier lid without warning. Could a pilot not pull a weapon on his own crew and therefore instigate a hijack scenario?

A simple scan or pat down could have sorted that out.

I'm sure this particular pilot was just fed up that day, but i certainly wouldn't put security at risk just because he was throwing his teddy out of his pram.

Just out of interest, if you were stood waiting for your plane and your saw your pilot refuse to be patted down or go through a scanner....who would honestly be happy to get on that plane?

CX.

Originally posted by MegaMind

Two hands is all it takes ....

edit on 21-10-2010 by MegaMind because: (no reason given)

Fair enough, but you can eliminate a whole lot of other possible risks with a scanner or a pat down.

CX.

reply to post by MegaMind

I know there are some "tensions" between pilots and airport staff. A lot of airport staff view pilots as arrogant and condescending in their attitude towards them, and perhaps many are. Could it be that as a airport ramp supervisor you feel this tension yourself? Maybe you just don't like pilots getting "special treatment" and want them to follow the same "rules" you do.

I have to chime in.....I think your assessment, here MM is spot on (exception, I was a pilot at same airline where DefCon worked the "ramp"...and I will disagree with what you asked regarding HIS motives and attitude). However, the attitudes towards pilots by some of the TSA Screeners is as you mentioned. (It is not only limited to that segment of airport workers, or airline staff. Some pilots are swaggering arrogant pricks, and thus the stereotype is born).

The TSA workers often will display the "big fish in small pond" arrogance, wielding their assumed authority. I have seen it all too often ---- and each time (BECAUSE it usually isn't worth it) had to bite my tongue. (Many years ago the point about the fact, as you mentioned, every pilot already is carrying "weapons"....I say three, total; Two hands, and One brain, grated on me, and made me angry at the "eyewash" of a joke of security, when WE had to be subjected to it).

HOWEVER, I still rebelled. On rare occasions when was singled out (and WHY does that happen? It's stupid) and they insisted on a physical search, it is within OUR RIGHTS to request it be done in a private area. It was a minor victory, since the only other option is what this guy did ---- if he is represented by the Air Line Pilots Association (I hope, haven't looked it up yet----edit in, had not noticed his airline. YES, he is represented by ALPA) then that will be good....because such abuse of authority by TSA needs to be challenged, not meekly comlpied with.

I consider it humilating to be standing like a scarecrow, arms outstretched, in uniform in full view of everyone in the terminal. Passengers who are putting there lives in trust, by getting on a airplane operated by a total stranger --- and this highly trained professional is subjected to THAT sort of indignity????

I know too much about the behind-the-scenes to let those TSA agents believe that THEY are the "front-line" for security...I won't give details, but I can cite dozens of airports with complete gaps in the "security" that could be easily taken advantage of...and anyone else who has worked at an airport knows of them, too.

There are some stations where the flight crew is escorted to BY-PASS security, by their own airline staff. At just about every airport in the USA, there are ways to access the "secure" areas, without passing through the TSA magnetometers.

SO, for those reasons, I suggest the pilot in question decided to take a stand, and said "enough is enough!"