Evolution in the bible

Revelation 12:14

But the woman was
given the two wings of
the great eagle so that
she might fly from the
serpent into the
wilderness, to the place
where she is to be
nourished for a time,
and times, and half a
time.

Is this not evolution ? Gaining a skill or ability that your ancestor didn't have ? Please ats shed some light on this!

cock roaches become tolerant to pesticide,
at first most die
then some die then,
almost none die,
and then they can't live with out it
this is evil u tion

try explaining this to a literal bible type person
there is PROOF of evolution

no
the bible says there is no such a thing

on the other hand Darwin himself even said that
everthing about evolution seemed to fit
Except man
he happened too fast and Darwin wondered about that

that automatically means the bible is true.

[edit on 16-6-2010 by Danbones]

reply to post by Intuitiveaptitude2009

I posted a thread on this very passage about ten days ago.
I'll give you a link to it in a moment.

But, to be brief, my understanding is that the image is symbolic.
It deliberately refers back to a passage in the Exodus story in which God says to Moses; "I lifted you up on eagles' wings and brought you to myself"
The woman represents God's people, and the moral of the reference is that God has as much power to save his people as he had in the Exodus.

For further information please see;

On the wings of an eagle

How can the OP belive in human evolution, when the OP quoted from the bible?

reply to post by Danbones


It is true, that Darwin did NOT explain about human evolution. And besides, what makes Darwin the All-Knowing-God for evolution? He isn't... he is JUST_ONLY a human, just like the rest of us are.

reply to post by Intuitiveaptitude2009


No. People spontaneously sprouting Eagle wings is a fantasy, a supernatural happening, not evolution. Evolution is a gradual process, a wing wouldn't just develop in one or two generation's time, it would take a great many gradual changes over tens if not hundreds of thousands of years before a functional wing would start to emerge.

The Bible clearly doesn't teach evolution and that's the main issue with its creation account. Its fine if you take it with a grain of salt but some people believe God really did magically conjure animals and people as part of a week long supernatural creation - despite all the evidence to the contrary.

The only thing coming even close to evolution in the Bible is when God commands the Earth to bring forth life in genesis but even this is more incantation and divine magic than evolution or a gradual process.

Originally posted by Titen-Sxull
Its fine if you take it with a grain of salt but some people believe God really did magically conjure animals and people as part of a week long supernatural creation - despite all the evidence to the contrary.

There was no magic. He speaks and it happens. There is no evidence to the contrary. Something cannot come from nothing.

reply to post by texastig

He speaks and it happens

That's the definition of magical words. If you prefer I could call it "DIVINE SUPERNATURAL POWER" but that's just another definition of magic

There is no evidence to the contrary.

How about essentially everything we know about biology and the fossil record. We've even directly observed speciation, the change of one species into another. We've also identified evolution within our own species amongst isolated populations. Evolution has been proven to occur a myriad of different ways and science has found no evidence of magical creation or a creation of any kind. So its not just some evidence that's to the contrary - all the evidence is to the contrary.

Something cannot come from nothing.

You're going to run into the same conundrum no matter whether you take the science road or the religious road but at least scientists will admit that we just don't know where the energy to make the Universe came from while religion makes bold assertions of faith pretending they are absolute fact.

The issue for you is if something cannot come from nothing than where did your God come from. Hey wait, if God doesn't believe he was created by a God does that make God an atheist

Science cannot give up and say it happened because of God and slapping the God did it label on explains nothing and leaves us wallowing in ignorance.

Actually yes..the bible does show proof of evolution. This will be long and may need to be seperated into two parts.

Genesis

In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth.
Very first sentence, and we have to stop. Why? notice one thing, it never ever says when, nor how, nor how long it took him, just that in the beginning he did create them.

The earth was without form and void and darkness was over the face of the deep. And the spirit of God was hovering over the face of the waters.
We have to stop again. In the early days of the earth scientist have found evidence that it was once very much like Venus. We were much closer to the sun then. The earth was blocked by a thick canopy of clouds and gases with one body of water underneath. Actually it would be more correct to say that the whole atmosphere in reality was very liquid.

God said let there be light. Heres where it gets tricky. Because this is where alot of misconceptions begin to form. Lets look at the statement again and take it apart. God. Said. Let. There. Be. Light. ...again..Let..there is no part in that sentence where it states that God created the light. He let the light be. What was this light? The sun of course. Something to note here...this is the first "day" There is no indication on how much time passed between God creating heavens and earth, the earth being formless to the first day of light, those are all three distinct happenings with no mention of time frame between them. Also another thing that most people fail to take in is that Genesis is primarily creation on the Earth, not of the Earth. Everything we read in Genesis sits with things forming on Earth, not the universe as a whole. So, science tells us that the earth was covered in a cloud canopy and then the sunlight was able to break through, and here in the bible we are told that something was making the earth dark and then light was able to come through. Proof that this was the cloud canopy that science speaks of comes in my next paragraph.

Air is made
God said LET there be an expanse in the midst of the waters, and let the divide the waters above from the waters below. Again we have the whole Let thing, not created. And we have air developing. Which would have come after the sunlight was able to break through and begin the evaporation process. Which tells us per the bible that there was no expanse before, there was no seperation ..just as science states. and whats more to note? without the evaporation process? no dry land could come to be.

Which is what comes next Dry land appears
God said LET dry land appear
God Said LET the earth put forth grass, herbs yielding seed, and fruit-trees bearing fruit after their kind, wherein is the seed thereof, upon the earth: and it was so. And the earth brought forth grass, herbs yielding seed after their kind, and trees bearing fruit, wherein is the seed thereof, after their kind. Again huge huge huge misconception here. People read this and assume..that BOOM vegetation just appeared. Not at all, look at what it actually says: LET THE EARTH bring forth, meaning? the earth had within itself what it needed to bring forth vegetation, however, it couldn't happen until the cloud canopy was cleared up and the sun could break through. But God in no way just Boom and it appeared. In every step of the earth's creation God "LET" it happen, meaning? science was taking its natural course.

We will come back to Genesis 1:14 where it speaks of the sun and stars and moon, only because that takes alot to explain, and I won't have the room in this post.

God said "LET" the oceans bring forth living creatures after their kind

God said "LET" the EARTH bring forth living creatures after their kind

next post

reply to post by Nkinga


I have already made a post about this part.

What Genesis chapter 1, verse 1 is saying is that God is going to create the heaven and the earth. This is supported by verse 2, and Genesis chapter 2 verse 1.

There is no doubt that the Bible is saying that everything evolved over time. Except for what verse 2 in chapter 1 is saying. When Gods spirit moved upon the face of the waters. That movement is practically the only physical thing God did.

Texastig, HUH?

Titen-Sxull great response to that.

OP, this Babble verse, er I mean Bible verse can MEAN ANYTHING as USUAL!

To me I see a female eagle with its 2 wings flying away from a snake in the grass into a forest where she will remain for some period of time to give birth in a safe place.

If this is a book from God, and God is not about "confusion", than HOW COME A HUNDRED READERS WILL ASSUME A HUNDRED DIFFERENT STORIES??!!

The real meaning of this MAN-MADE story is whatever the original fictional fable, myth or legend was talking about, which was told MUCH EARLIER THAN CHRISTIANITY ANYWAYS.

COME ON! Lets be adults and evolve beyond the fairy tales of childhood some day, yes?



[edit on 16-6-2010 by Shine71]

reply to post by Nkinga


Now, something stands out to me here. I think we all know, or at least I hope we do, that evolution means the evolution of a species, and that it does occur. You only have to look at the flu bug to see the proof of it. Or else you would not have to get a flu shot every year. But its still the flu. Dogs may have had a single ancestor at some point in time, but it was still a dog a canine. Evolution does not mean a whale turning into a cow, that is something else entirely. So, when we look at the passages where the bible speaks about The earth bringing forth living creatures there is one thing the author constantly hones in on. "after their kind" when you look at it and read it, the author places it over everything...trees, herbs, grass, vegetation, sea creatures, earth creatures, constantly he states "after their kind" why would an author (thought to be Moses) even feel the need to say so? But in any case as I was saying, we see something quite clearly when we actually look at what it is we are reading. Let the Earth, Let the ocean, ...God never once takes credit for what the Earth is doing. Now yes, in a round about way he did create it..after all he states quite clearly "in the beginning God created the heavens and the Earth" which set everything into motion. But ultimately if we actually absorb just what it is we are reading we will see that primarily God allowed science to take its natural course. After all, he wants us to look around and see the proof of himself, himself created science, it would be very counterproductive to work outside the bounds of science for us to be able to see his proof. And just because we have discovered that science in no way means God is not there. At the same time we have proof that evolution exists. But to me, if in all avenues of creation on earth God allowed natural process to happen, I don't see why that would not include evolution itself? except in one area... onward:

Here is where we get tricky so far in every avenue of creation we have seen Let, let the earth, let the light, let the waters, let let let...but now we get to a very unique part...Humans. This is the only area of creation where God makes it very very clear "God created man in his own image" There is no questioning it here...in all the above passages, the bible states that Everthing was Let to happen, and then it comes to a dead and stop and states "God created humans" now..it states that he created us from the dirt of the earth, which science actually states we were formed from the dirt (Yes, they use much more difficult words, but imagine using those words for an ancient man, while we're on that subject, lets explain time to a man who doesnt know what it is yet, and therefore is my belief on why God used the word "Day" when explaining time ) anyway. It states that God created "them" male and female and told them to multiply and replenish the earth..screeching halt right here!!!!!!! WAIT...BACK UP...Say what? lets read that again shall we? in the exact biblical passage, and it states: Genesis 1:28 And God blessed them: and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and REPLENISH the earth.

Replenish? how can something be REplenished unless its been Plenished before?
People have many many interesting theories on this, I am abnormal, so my theory is that its exactly as it states, the world was plenished, something happened and now it would be replenished. However, it is in my belief that with the passages above this one that yes, the bibles does coincide with evolution and does hold at least some evidence to the side of evolution. That it wasn't all just God and hocus pocus I also believe that yes, there is a creator and in all areas he allowed science to take its natural place, except in one...Humans.

reply to post by Shine71


I guess you are right about everyone imagining and understanding different views from reading the bible. I think that applies to everything we read, even science and evolution.

Just about everyone can read. Only a fraction actually grasp the meaning of what they read. But everyone believes they understand everything. No one wants to claim that they are stupid and unknowing. That's why different people have different opinions about everything.

If one believes in God, then one does not have to defend God.

God is omnipotent, omnipresent, not "magical". God is God. He creates as is understood.

I am not here to press my views on any non- believers, however, I would like to point out why I cannot and do not believe in evolution, even if I was not devout in my faith.

If man is a spin-off from the monkey, which by progressive evolution has become man, how is it that over so many years in which "Modern Science" has maintained this theory NOT ONE SCIENTIST has ever succeeded, not even with the perfected instruments, science, laboratories, genetics, therapies, et. al. and methods at present, in making a man from a monkey? One could have taken the most intelligent offspring of a pair of intelligent moneys and then their intelligent offspring, and so on. One would now have many generations of selected, instructed monkeys cared for by the most patient, tenacious, and sagacious scientific method. But you still have monkeys. If there happened to be a mutation, it would be this: the beasts would be physically less strong than the former ones and morally more degenerate, for, with all your methods and instruments, you would have destroyed that perfection of the monkey which God the Father created for these quadrumans.

Another question. If man came from the monkey, how is it that man, even with grafts, fertilizations, bizarre matings that surely have gone on (and do not deny this, because they have) and repugnant forms of cross-fertilization, does not become a monkey again? Scientist and genetic therapists would be capable even of attempting these horrors if they knew that it could give approvative sanction to the theory, and prove once and for all Darwin's "Theory". But they do not do so because they know that they would not be able to turn a man into a monkey. They would turn him into an ugly son of man, a degenerate, perhaps a criminal. But never arealmonkey. They do not try because they know beforehand that they would get a poor result and their reputation would emerge in shambles.

For this reason, and this reason alone, modern science does not do so. For no other. For they feel no remorse or horror over degrading a man to the level of a beast to maintain a thesis of theirs (in theory).

Modern "science" degrade the intellect and like madmen do not even realize they are degrading it. In truth, many of the primitive people are more men than modern scientists because they realize the mystery.

And this is why I do not believe in "Evolution".

A virus can mutate in weeks.

A bacteria can mutate.

So therefore over a millenia... if "evolution" is at play here...

And with all our "intelligence"....
Hmmmm.

God is my answer.

Anyway, that is my position on the matter. I do not bash anyone for what they believe. Just giving some food for thought.

God Bless~

reply to post by thegoodearth


Your basic understanding of evolution is flawed.

Evolution = The change in the gene frequency in the gene pool of a population.

Evolution is not something you "believe" or "disbelieve", it's a fact of denying it or accepting it as fact.

reply to post by thegoodearth


I assume you mean that man is evolved from apes, though technically apes are still a subset of monkeys.

If man is a spin-off from the monkey, which by progressive evolution has become man, how is it that over so many years in which "Modern Science" has maintained this theory NOT ONE SCIENTIST has ever succeeded, not even with the perfected instruments, science, laboratories, genetics, therapies, et. al. and methods at present, in making a man from a monkey?

WHAT? Pardon my french but what the hell are you talking about? What kind of pseudoscientific sci-fi nonsense have they been feeding you in Creationist boot camp? Why on Earth would scientists need to make a man from a monkey in order to prove evolution? How would blending the DNA of two different species prove evolution? WHAT? Man is an ape, still, we don't need to make a man from an ape to prove we came from apes, our DNA, our behavior, our bones and brains, our physiology, everything about our biology AND the fossil evidence ALL points to us being apes that have evolved and are still evolving.

Proof of the still evolving part: Genes Explain why Tibetans Thrive

If man came from the monkey, how is it that man, even with grafts, fertilizations, bizarre matings that surely have gone on (and do not deny this, because they have) and repugnant forms of cross-fertilization, does not become a monkey again?

We're still apes. And what do you mean cross-fertilization? YOU THINK HUMANS HAVE HAD BABIES WITH MONKEYS? Allow me to bash my head into the wall while attempting to reconcile your [dripping sarcasm] brilliant argument [/sarcasm]. Technically we might still be considered monkeys today:

And this is why I do not believe in "Evolution".

Because your head is filled with nonsense that doesn't make a lick of sense.

Please, spend some time on wikipedia educating yourself because your post has reduced my hope for the human race to less than zero.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/b3b3705652fd.jpg[/atsimg]

[edit on 16-6-2010 by Titen-Sxull]

[edit on 16-6-2010 by Titen-Sxull]

reply to post by Titen-Sxull


Its probably better to just say that we are a part of A ape family. We just look a little different then the once in the zoo.

Not everyone is capable of imagining that a tree can grow different types of branches with different types of Apes.


Its the gene pool within the tree stem that created the different branches of Ape families over time. Every time we reproduce we also contribute to the growth of the original tree stem, but only within our own branch.

[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]

By far my favourite book on the subject of our anthropoid origins:

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/316d9690a918.jpg[/atsimg]

The conga lines of gangbanging gay chimps in Hyde Park are particularly memorable.

I aplaude some of the post I've read

I think a divine creator will create something that is so perfect it can keep developing on its own. Evolution.

The bible says we are made in God's image can someone please shed a light on it ? Was this a physical or mental image ?
To believe God is all omnipotent that is really something... With it one accepts God to know all which makes our lives a joke. IMO

We are gifted with a brain that is intelligent and if we accept it to be a part of creation...
shame on those who do not use it. Science is a part of us using that brain, what we learn is supposed to be learned and we can accept fact for truth. It makes us aware of a part of life which is still hidden from plain sight.

Really for those who put their believe above science are in a way admirable for their strong faith. However what they fail to use is the gift which is given to them which is a resemblance of God even. How can you deny what it made us learn and understand. Why keep the eyelids on ?

I believe in creation. Life is amazing and complex. So complex that it looks like it is created. Little signs like golden fractal thingy are amazing.
We must accept we don't know and people should realize to question their faith and accept the Lord works in mysterious ways. This mytery includes those who believe even more IMO. Science is here to make the mystery a little better understand

Originally posted by Sinter Klaas
I aplaude some of the post I've read

I think a divine creator will create something that is so perfect it can keep developing on its own. Evolution.

The bible says we are made in God's image can someone please shed a light on it ? Was this a physical or mental image ?
To believe God is all omnipotent that is really something... With it one accepts God to know all which makes our lives a joke. IMO

If you read Genesis Chapter one verse 2. You will read that God is a spirit.

2.

And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

In Genesis God is only mentioned as a spirit. So if God created Man in his image, it must have been in spirit.


When it comes to intelligence. We humans can have something that does not already exist within the infinite. The difference between our intelligence and the infinite is that ours is limited to our finite existence.

Our finite existence limits us to learning from scratch from birth.



[edit on 27.06.08 by spy66]