Meditation, awarness and alcohol

I am not a big alcohol drinker. I do not drink in the week and will maybe have 2 or 3 drinks at the weekend, often with a meal.

I used to drink most nights but stopped as I found this was starting to not agree with me.

What I am starting to find now is that even the 2 or 3 drinks on a Friday and Saturday are really effecting my awarness. Has anyone else experienced this? It seems the more you meditate the less your body can accept alcohol, or this seems to be happening with me.

What I am sensing is a down turn in internal frequency, that I can really detect . Its difficult to describe, its not a hang over, headache or the other general down sides of drinking but an actual lowering of frequency and awarness. This will then take days to build up again through meditating.

Thing is Im not ready to give up drink, I think Id find that hard, I tryed once for 2 months and it wasnt easy! Thing is, is this something we must do if we wish to reach higher awarness? Maybe there comes a point when we just have to choose...increased awarness or alcohol?

There doesnt seem to be much on the net about this, but I found a few links

A psychologist who had been unsuccessful in earlier attempts to learn and practice meditation reports on the results of practicing Transcendental Meditation. Major changes included an increased ability to concentrate, spontaneous processing of unfinished psychological business, as well as miscellaneous ones like an increased tolerance of cold and a decreased tolerance for alcohol.

Another striking effect of TM on me has been a loss of enjoyment of and tolerance for alcohol. Before beginning Transcendental Meditation, I'd been in the habit, for several years, of drinking one to two wineglasses of sweet wine (Note 2) after coming home from work and before dinner. The usual effect of this was to relax me, cause a mild, warm glow, and to dull my intellectual processes very slightly. The effect was quite pleasant overall.

Shortly after being initiated, I found that if I tried to meditate within two to three hours of having drunk this amount of alcohol, that I could not meditate at all. As soon as I turned my attention inward to meditate, it was clear that my intellect was very dull, that my mind was wandering from subject to subject, like a man terribly drunk lurching down the street and hardly being aware of his environment. I do not know whether I was now more sensitive to alcohol than before, or whether I was simply much more aware of the effect of alcohol on me. My feelings and behavior when not meditating were not particularly changed, so I'm inclined to the latter hypothesis

www.paradigm-sys.com...

Then again this buddhist site says its OK as long as your not addicted. I always assumed buddhists didnt drink.

I do not see any harm in a certain amount of drinking for relaxation and enjoyment but it's important not to be attached to it.

I think it's important to not develop a culture around oneself where people feel uncomfortable to not drink - because some people really cannot go near the stuff - it's such an addiction - so it would be awful to have a sangha where people couldn't join in socially because they were not drinking.

They go on to say that in certain meditations its actually used

Lama Shenpen:

He has actually written an article about the Dharma way to drink alcohol. It is a traditional practice for siddhas and yogins and in a person of Trungpa Rinpoche's calibre there is no need to doubt his practice while drinking.

I have heard many first hand reports of quite astonishing facts about how he behaved when seemingly completely drunk . I heard from those close to him that he was always very strongly present and aware, whatever was happening.

www.buddhism-connect.org...









[edit on 27-2-2010 by Mr Green]

Mr Green, I think it's really cool that you are developing such a strong awareness of how your energy reacts to toxins, which is what alcohol really is. It's a poison, and as far as spiritual development is concerned, it acts only as a pollutant that will alter your discernment and awareness to a great degree. I've never heard of Buddhists using alcohol either, but I can bet that they use the purest most natural kind in a very controlled way, when they know precisely what they are doing with it....it won't be Jack Daniels and coke, that's for sure.

I don't drink at all, not from any puritanical stance, but from a place that required purity...I don't eat meat for the same reason, have never done drugs or cigarettes and try to keep dairy foods to a minimum. I just find that they all slow me down, and make me much less sharp and focused in my spiritual work. As well as awareness, we also need accuracy in this kind of work, and consistency, so that we know we can trust what we are feeling. This is just my opinion and experience tho....your observations will be interesting, and I hope you get many more replies about it.

reply to post by caitlinfae


As I read your reply I know it to be true, recently especially I know the two do not mix. Its yet another stage to work through/over come/progress through I guess. meditation and its resulting progression of awarness tells us what is right as we go along, and mine is telling me on a deep level alcohol is a limiting factor in spiritual growth...however its Saturday night as I type this and Im already thinking....oh a glass of wine time

Thank you for your excellent reply. You sum it up very well below in this quote

I just find that they all slow me down, and make me much less sharp and focused in my spiritual work. As well as awareness, we also need accuracy in this kind of work, and consistency, so that we know we can trust what we are feeling

Yes and I perceive this as a lowering of internal frequency, ability to connect to higher awarness, and your also right that consistency is altered.

[edit on 27-2-2010 by Mr Green]

as ATS's only celebrity bartender I feel I should chime in.

I think you're over thinking this, altering your state of mind is generally eye opening, no matter what your drug of choice is. Obviously you can take it too far, but if you ever meet someone who has been clean and sober their entire life, then 9 times out of ten they are socially unacceptable in multiple ways. They can't relate to most other people, who don't mind Imbibing on some great cocktails from time to time, and they have a holier than thou, or even paranoid response to people enjoying a good stress reliever.

now...try this recipe...created by none other than yours truly.

Old Uncle Peach(named after a certain lurker on this site)
1.75 oz. of Whiskey or Bourbon
.75 oz. of dry vermouth
.5 oz. of St. Germain elderflower liqueur
a dash of peach bitters

Stir all the ingredients in a glass of ice and strain into a chilled cocktail glass. Drink, then meditate.


Enjoy!!!

-Liquid

"Alcohol" and "awareness" are mutually exclusive.

Booze is a weapon, people use it to blast their brains out — a few hundred million brain cells at a time. Alcohol sedates, destroys neural and other bodily tissues, and is quite literally lethal to any organism.

Might as well sit back and relax with a snifter of anitfreeze. I mean, if you're really serious about going comatose, might as well go with the good stuff. Booze will do the same thing to the human brain, it just takes a little longer.

Yes, I speak from experience. I gave up alcohol ten years ago in April. Have never missed it, nor longed for it, nor craved it. It's gone from my system and good riddance.

Besides, I found something even better than booze for getting high. It's called senility. Potent stuff, and it's free.

— Doc Velocity

reply to post by Doc Velocity


Actually drinking small doses is not only fun but has some benefits to health. Don't drink antifreeze, or jager bombs, or any of that other crap. Learn to enjoy real cocktails, micro brewed beer, and wine has been a staple of many cultures since as long as anyone can remember. As always, if you have any questions talk to me, ATS's only celebrity bartender.
benefits to drinkin

And as long as we're sharing cocktail recipes, try this. Me and a bartender in Sarasota, Florida cooked this up one night around Thanksgiving back in 1992:

One shot of Red Hot Schnapps
One shot of Wild Turkey 101
A short glass with 2 ice cubes
...Do not stir or mix. Gently pour the poisons down the glass, like in chemistry class, allowing them to blend as they will.

We called it a Roast Turkey... and, man, it'll deep-fry your ass.

Tastes like candy, home for the holidays, all cheerful. Then it stomps a mudhole in your butt and leaves your body in an alley.

bon apetite
and good night!

— Doc Velocity

To be honest with you I feel that your OP is heartfelt but shows the weakness of the "chop suey" approach. Why not find a meditation school (buddhist, Xtian, Pagan or whatever) that resonates with your deepest feelings and follow that one. The point is that these schools have their own checks and balances.

Just a thought.


Rgds

T

[edit on 27-2-2010 by Tiger5]

reply to post by Doc Velocity


good try Doc, but nowadays the candy flavored cocktails are starting to go the way of the buffalo, thank god. Those are for club kids who just wanna get plastered. Very anti awareness, the type of stuff that we try and do nowadays generally has more subtlety and complexity then the crap that has been served in excess since the 50's or earlier really. We're using new flavor ideas, and experimenting with molecular mixology as well. It's shame you've been out of the scene for 10 years, cuz for about the past 8 a revolution seems to have occurred. We've gotten back to preprohibition style drinks, and come up with some amazing new concoctions as well. As you can see an open/aware mind is needed to come up with this stuff. In fact meditation, of sorts, helped me come up with a recipe that won me Seattle's most inspired bartender 2009. I ended up in GQ magazine, and i think my picture and recipe are still on Bombay Saphires' website if you wanna have a look.

Originally posted by liquidsmoke206
as ATS's only celebrity bartender I feel I should chime in.

I think you're over thinking this, altering your state of mind is generally eye opening, no matter what your drug of choice is. Obviously you can take it too far, but if you ever meet someone who has been clean and sober their entire life, then 9 times out of ten they are socially unacceptable in multiple ways. They can't relate to most other people, who don't mind Imbibing on some great cocktails from time to time, and they have a holier than thou, or even paranoid response to people enjoying a good stress reliever.

-Liquid

Actually, this is not about thought processes, and "over-thinking" the experience, it's about what we have experienced and learned from that....observation, if you like. I don't know what kind of people you spend your time with, but to dismiss 90% of all non-boozers and smokers as socially unacceptable bores who can't relate is a little immature in my opinion. I certainly have never been accused of that...I have no such problems, and I'm pretty sure Mr Green doesn't either.

If you enjoy the artificial shift in state that alcohol and drugs produce, then that's fine...it's your choice totally, and I won't preach to you about it, but you have to recognise that it's nothing close to a truly spiritual shift in state that is reached through spiritual practise...that's any spiritual practise, and not just mine. Anyone who tells you differently, and says that dope/booze/chemicals/whatever will put you on the correct path to intense enlightenment is seriously seriously deluded.

Have fun with the cocktails if you like, but it's not the fabulous answer you think it is.

Originally posted by Mr Green
Thing is, is this something we must do if we wish to reach higher awarness? Maybe there comes a point when we just have to choose...increased awarness or alcohol?

Lol. Im sorry but this is funny. "Hmmm.... should we give up drugs that diminish our awareness in order to increase our awareness?"

reply to post by caitlinfae

If you enjoy the artificial shift in state that alcohol and drugs produce, then that's fine...it's your choice totally, and I won't preach to you about it, but you have to recognise that it's nothing close to a truly spiritual shift in state that is reached through spiritual practise...that's any spiritual practise, and not just mine.

maybe you should meditate a little more, or perhaps swing by my bar and have a few because this statement is completely wrong. Shamans around the world past and present have been using various ways to alter their minds, these are the guys who wrote the book on meditation....

ever heard of Soma?
ayahuasca? I may have spelled that wrong...
Fly Agaric shrooms?

Experience opens and expands the mind, obviously.

reply to post by caitlinfae

If you enjoy the artificial shift in state that alcohol and drugs produce, then that's fine...it's your choice totally, and I won't preach to you about it, but you have to recognise that it's nothing close to a truly spiritual shift in state that is reached through spiritual practise...that's any spiritual practise, and not just mine.

maybe you should meditate a little more, or perhaps swing by my bar and have a few because this statement is completely wrong. Shamans around the world past and present have been using various ways to alter their minds, these are the guys who wrote the book on meditation....

ever heard of Soma?
ayahuasca? I may have spelled that wrong...
Fly Agaric shrooms?

Experience opens and expands the mind, obviously.

Most of the things I have read on achieving transcendence have never come outright and preached abstinence of any kind. What is important though is moderation. Not just with things like alcohol, but everything.

reply to post by liquidsmoke206


This thread is not about the evils or the moralities of alcohol...what you do is up to you, and no-one here will lecture you, but you must realise that my experience is not the same as yours, my abilities are not the same as yours, and yes, of course I know what ayahuasca and all the others are....it's also not about chilling out, or relaxing, or being sociable. Mr Green posted with a very valid observation about the effects of alcohol on her spiritual awareness, not asking for more cocktail recipes.

Please don't presume to tell me to meditate a little more, drink a little more, or however you think I should behave a little more....there is no one correct spiritual practise...only what is correct for ourselves.

reply to post by Xcalibur254


everything in moderation is actually impossible, because that would be an excess of moderation itself. BAM!! you just got caught in a catch 22, sucka!!!

everything in moderation, especially moderation!!!

I'm not sure what you mean by "frequency," but it sounds like meditation is making you more aware of your body/mind state as it reacts to what is fundamentally a depressant. Meditation and drug use (this includes not only alcohol but such substances as caffeine, nicotine and even processed sugar) can provide eye-opening challenges. Your heightened awareness of your physical/mental state may lead you to make certain choices. You'll know what they are as you observe them. For the record, certain Buddhist sects are known for very high levels of alcoholism. The mental strain of certain exercises seems to take its toll.

I can agree that alcohol is mostly detrimental in trying to gain any form of enlightenment. I mean you can get buzzed and it won't really effect you, in fact it may help, but when you become drunk and I mean DRUNK, mindfulness is replaced with mindfulnessless.

I don't drink anymore, and it's only really helped me. If you want to try substances to try to gain some insight, alcohol is honestly the worst you could choose from. Marijuana or psychedelics are easily more applicable.

Good Topic...

I'm 26 and i drink maybe 3 times a year! If i dint have an occasion to go to such as birthdays etc then i probably wouldnt drink at all. I have no desire what-so-ever to get drunk!

Whats strange though is that from 17-22 all i did was go out every second or third night and get drunk, spending most of my money on drinking.

1 day i just stopped, the hardest part was saying no to my friends, and yes i have lost some of them as friends, but all that did was highlight to me the importance of the friends who were still with me. Once i said no, i just kind of ignored wanting to go out with my friends.

No, however, when i have a drink, and it can be just 1 drink, i will wake u the next day feeling like i had 30 drinks. I also find myself gettin very woozy after just 1-2 drinks, no matter what the alcohol content.

I have never looked back at giving up "mainstream weekend alcohol" and i urge everyone else out there to realize the same as there are NO benefits to it at all

reply to post by jrmcleod


what matter is the persons each one as a living true reality source of its own positive drives justifications of being true

but you focus a lot on having a grisp of spiritual matters to justify yourselves as being of that source and not you

i dont see a big difference between someone who meditate to feel being light with someone that drink to have fun, they are of the same materialistic means, to profit from what it is living definitions realities already and never mean to be the source of itself reality existance then lighter as living true