It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
Originally posted by masterp
My theory is that they draw energy from future time frames. This does not violate the laws of thermodynamics, if time is considered a dimension.
Originally posted by Astyanax
Unless you repeal the Second Law of Thermodynamics, future states of the system will have less, not more energy to draw upon.
Besides, time travel is widely held to be impossible.
Originally posted by Astyanax
future states of the system will have less, not more energy to draw upon.
Originally posted by masterp
Well, what happened? does anyone know? their site is not updated. Did it work?
Originally posted by masterp
If it was a failure, they wouldn't show it in the first place, nor would they upload the videos to youtube.
What really happened? It's really strange. A media blackout?
Originally posted by masterp
What really happened?
It's really strange. A media blackout?
Originally posted by StellarX
Originally posted by Astyanax
Unless you repeal the Second Law of Thermodynamics, future states of the system will have less, not more energy to draw upon.
Provided you are discussing a isolated system.
Originally posted by masterp
Originally posted by Astyanax
future states of the system will have less, not more energy to draw upon.
Why? please explain.
If you don't understand, I'm afraid you aren't qualified to discuss this topic.
Why should the media be interested in snake oil salesmen trying to sell snake oil?
If you don't understand, I'm afraid you aren't qualified to discuss this topic.
Originally posted by Astyanax
Yes, of course. And I understand the constraints that make a wholly closed (or isolated, if you prefer that term) system impossible in real life.
But if the system were not closed, at least theoretically, then it would be drawing energy from an outside source and would not be an over-unity device, but merely a transducer of some kind.
Originally posted by Astyanax
future states of the system will have less, not more energy to draw upon.
If the system truly is closed (or isolated, if you will), then this incremental energy is literally being created by it. This violates the First Law of Thermodynamics; masterp's contention was that his hypothesis did not contravene the laws of thermodynamics.
Besides (and this was my point when I so rudely suggested that masterp wasn't qualified to discuss the subject), the system being postulated would have, if closed, negative entropy, which violates the Second Law of Thermodynamics; one who cannot immediately see this is surely reaching beyond their grasp when they venture to propose a solution to the problem we are discussing.
Originally posted by Astyanax
Would I really make a comment like that if I didn't understand what I was saying?
If the system truly is closed (or isolated, if you will), then this incremental energy is literally being created by it. This violates the First Law of Thermodynamics; masterp's contention was that his hypothesis did not contravene the laws of thermodynamics.
Besides (and this was my point when I so rudely suggested that masterp wasn't qualified to discuss the subject), the system being postulated would have, if closed, negative entropy, which violates the Second Law of Thermodynamics; one who cannot immediately see this is surely reaching beyond their grasp when they venture to propose a solution to the problem we are discussing.
Well, never mind all that. Let's assume the system is not closed, but is, as StellarX proposes, actually transducing energy from elsewhere in the universe (never mind where).
In that case, equation (3) above gives us a very amusing result. The system can never be shut off; it must keep on running in order to have future states from which past states can draw their energy. If the universe is truly infinite, and contains an infinite amount of energy, then there's nothing, in theory, to stop the system running for ever. But it can never stop, not even after the universe has died around it.
Why? Because if it did, it would have a final state.
Would I really make a comment like that if I didn't understand what I was saying?
Besides (and this was my point when I so rudely suggested that masterp wasn't qualified to discuss the subject), the system being postulated would have, if closed, negative entropy, which violates the Second Law of Thermodynamics; one who cannot immediately see this is surely reaching beyond their grasp when they venture to propose a solution to the problem we are discussing.
Finding a source of " Unlimited free energy" would be the most unimaginably heinous crime possible against humanity. For it would inevitably turn the planet into a cinder. Hastening an isoentropic heat death. If you find a free energy source, you damn well better find a new free energy sink as well. Even then, the relative flux rates will still nail you.
Source: Guru's Lair: Blatant Optimist #49
Originally posted by masterp
You have a mistake in your calculations, and your conclusion is based on that mistake.