If the "Nephilim" (Fallen ANGELS) are ET's, then how aren't Angels (and Jehova) ET'S?

reply to post by troubleshooter


Excellent post.

The ET (extraterrestial) label is an attempt to reinvent themselves... ...within our space age mindset...

How can we be sure they aren't labeled correctly now? A wheel of fire seems like a primitive way of describing an advanced technology. Not to mention the UFO like objects that appear in historical paintings. Why would a spirit need a ship?

I don't doubt the possibility of the Angel/Demon/ET connection, it seems plausible. But were we right then or are we right now?

Originally posted by troubleshooter

Originally posted by ArchaicLion

Originally posted by SharkBait
The Bible describes Lucifer as a snake

This is an interesting thread but to keep on point...

It only says a serpent tempted Eve. It does not say what type and it does not say who that serpent was. Anything else is conjecture.

The serpent who seduced Eve is clearly identified in several places...
...here is one...

Revelation 12:9 "...the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."

Best check you facts before you post.

Genesis was written in the 10th-5th century BC.

Revelation was written in 68-95 AD.

That's still conjecture. You assume the two authors are in reference to the same exact entity because they are in the same book and apparently bad.

I'm not trying to get into a flame war here. So let's move on.

Originally posted by ArchaicLion
reply to post by troubleshooter

 

Excellent post.

The ET (extraterrestial) label is an attempt to reinvent themselves... ...within our space age mindset...

How can we be sure they aren't labeled correctly now? A wheel of fire seems like a primitive way of describing an advanced technology. Not to mention the UFO like objects that appear in historical paintings. Why would a spirit need a ship?

I don't doubt the possibility of the Angel/Demon/ET connection, it seems plausible. But were we right then or are we right now?

I think this is what is happening...
...spirits don't need technology but their Nephilim creations do...
...they are biological creatures like us that have been bred up for the purpose...
...I think that the stories of creatures being bred up is probably true....
...where this is happening is uncertain but underground locations and even the Moon or Mars are suggested as locations.

I think the SciFi industries 'Alien Hypothesis' has made us open to the ET identity...
...but they are just the pre and post-flood Nephilim....
...spinning a story about being from Orion or somewhere else....
...and they have convinced heaps of people too.

Originally posted by troubleshooter
I think this is what is happening...
...spirits don't need technology but their Nephilim creations do...
...they are biological creatures like us that have been bred up for the purpose...
...I think that the stories of creatures being bred up is probably true....
...where this is happening is uncertain but underground locations and even the Moon or Mars are suggested as locations.

I think the SciFi industries 'Alien Hypothesis' has made us open to the ET identity...
...but they are just the pre and post-flood Nephilim....
...spinning a story about being from Orion or somewhere else....
...and they have convinced heaps of people too.

Makes sense and raises another question.

If the spirits/aliens/angels/demons/watchers (name depending on the source) were the ones that had technology then they could leave with that technology. If they were to have taken it back to where they are from they would leave no tangible evidence behind.

If the Nephilim were the ones with the technology, where did it go? Most accounts of the deluge state that the Nephilim were wiped out, only to appear again later and cause more chaos but to a lesser degree.

We don't have tangible evidence of this technology, at least not known to the public. Save for the aircraft artifacts and various types of imagery around the world. No ship parts though...

Genesis was written in the 10th-5th century BC.

Revelation was written in 68-95 AD.

That's still conjecture. You assume the two authors are in reference to the same exact entity because they are in the same book and apparently bad.

I'm not trying to get into a flame war here. So let's move on.

The Book of Job is arguably the oldest document in the western canon (older than Genesis)...
...and you are correct Revelation is one of the more recent.

The western canon contains approx 66 documents written by 44 different authors over more than 2000 years...
...and although idiom, language and cultures changed...
...they all essentially tell the same story.

The serpent is the same guy.

Another thing you should consider...
...John wrote Revelation while on the island of Patmos...
...he was a prisoner there...
...and he wrote the work using about 800 symbols from the Old Testament documents...
...as a way of getting the letter past the guards without them undrstanding it...
...so he was infact describing exactly the same guy...
...that's why he uses all his various names and titles.

reply to post by troubleshooter


Thank you, I see where you're coming from now.

I don't necessarily agree on the exact identity of the serpent.
For me, there isn't enough there to say with any certainty.

reply to post by impaired

..."The Heavens" translates to the sky, no? I think that's the smoking gun right there...

In my studies, i've found that there are 3 'Heavens'

#1...the atmosphere & sky
#2...the canopy of planets, stars...the visible universe
#3...the 3rd Heaven, where the Throne-of-God is, where Angels began


It's my conclusion, the 3rd Heaven is actually another dimension, outside this observable & made-of-matter Universe.

technically, the Heirarchy of the 3rd Heaven would be ETs, as they are ExtraTerrestial, they would also be Alien...
i.e, Not brought forth from Terra-Firma/Earth

but those terms do not properly indentify Angels as 'beings' or 'entities' from another dimension of the multi-verse
_______________________________________________

...I am afraid the universe is devoid of life. That's why I don't even bother with the UFO part of ATS. Because I know it's all figments of wild imaginations ...Blue_Jay33

FOOI = figments of our imagination (sounds like 'Phooy')

i agree that it is most likely that the 'spirit world' 'heaven' 'hell' and the specific 'Angels' are all internalized creations, shared among the believers of that kind of mental cosmology/virtual reality.

I was of that way of thinking for a long time, but i changed my model to seeing that 'spiritual realm' as actually being from an external, other Dimension... humanity can & does intersect with this parrallel dimension, and these events are thought of as
religious and/or spiritual encounters.



of further interest:
hplusmagazine.com...


thanks,




[edit on 23-11-2009 by St Udio]

Originally posted by St Udio
reply to post by impaired

 

#3...the 3rd Heaven, where the Throne-of-God is, where Angels began

It's my conclusion, the 3rd Heaven is actually another dimension, outside this observable & made-of-matter Universe.

I think I know where you are going here.

There is a sense in which heaven #3 is concurrent with earth...
...and available to faith.

I can supply scriptural support for this position if you are interested...
...but right now I am going to bed.

This was prefigured in Israel's Sanctuary where the Shekinah dwelt in the camp with them...
...the term 'heaven and earth' was used to describe this reality.

The Shekinah now indwells all who believe the Gospel...
...so that in the believer 'heaven and earth' have come together...
...and will become visible at the Parousia.

Originally posted by Agree2Disagree
reply to post by Ghost in the Machine

 

If you really examine it, you'll see that it's two-sided. One can argue that ETs are demons/angels or that demons/angels are ETs. It doesn't matter. We all agree that there are both gentle and vicious ET races. We can also agree that demons/angels fit that same bill. There's no evidence pointing to which one is more true than the other.

Indeed no evidence of anything, the topic just as well be fairies leprechauns as angels or gods, I am in agreement with you, one is no less or more likely than another.

What is absolutely pitiful is the mentality behind assuming a being of another world or universe is a demon.

One would expect this type of mentality from let's say an indigenous tribe that had never seen a white man let alone an aircraft, such as cargo cults.. But to have grownups in a pretty technologically advanced society worrying about demons and angels before even validating the existence of advanced life elsewhere is somewhat childish.


It would be rather ignorant in this day to reject such widespread ancient myths of entities coming from the sky and visiting humans as mere imaginary fabrication as we don't know it didn't happen.

That being said it seems also somewhat childish to claim that we all agree there are gentle and vicious et races.
How can you possibly "know this?" you can no more know this than you can know Buffys' dad was a gargoyle.

I can't see why not.

They are "from the heavens above"
We are "Made in their image" (they look similar to us, so we believe)
They have powers, healing etc. (Advanced technology)
They can posess you (Use your body as a host)
They are bright (UFO's are ussually bright)

Dont know, but I surely don't see why not??



cool post

reply to post by troubleshooter

Another thing you should consider... ...John wrote Revelation while on the island of Patmos... ...he was a prisoner there... ...and he wrote the work using about 800 symbols from the Old Testament documents...

I find it hard to imagine this John actually writing anything, he is alleged to have been a laborer and fishermen who spoke Galilean Aramaic. Upon his arrest with Peter, it was noted that John was an uncultured illiterate .
The likelihood of John composing the Apocalypse would imply that he had profound knowledge of of oriental myths and religions.
Coupled with numerous passages being originally written in Greek it would be rather stretching the imagination to the extreme to envisage john writing anything more than his name.

Father M E Boismard in 1966 demonstrated that John was killed along with his brother James of Zebedee in 44 AD.
Since the gospel was dated to 100 ad how is it possible that the illiterate Galilean fisherman wrote anything as he was dead 56 years earlier ?

reply to post by impaired


When people say that ETs are fallen angels, more times than not, they don't mean that they're literally beings from other planets. Rather, they are ETs in that they're pretending to be beings from other planets in order to deceive people.

reply to post by troubleshooter

The Book of Job is arguably the oldest document in the western canon (older than Genesis)

From what I've read, most scholars believe that the story contained in Job is older than parts of Genesis (Job cannot have come before creation); basically it's thought that Job was a contemporary with Abraham, due to some of the customs contained in it. But it is thought that the actually writing of Genesis is older than the writing of Job.

In the end, it's probably not a big deal though.

reply to post by moocowman

I find it hard to imagine this John actually writing anything, he is alleged to have been a laborer and fishermen who spoke Galilean Aramaic. Upon his arrest with Peter, it was noted that John was an uncultured illiterate.

That's not true. Here is the verse that you're referring to Acts 4.13:

Now when they saw the boldness of Peter and John, and perceived that they were uneducated, common men, they were astonished. ...

Nowhere in that verse does it say that John (and Peter) was uncultured and illiterate. Rather, it says that he was a common man. Common in so far as that, he hadn't gone through the advanced training that rabbis did. This is why the leaders were astounded by Peter and John's use of Scripture; they shouldn't have really been able to use it as well as they did.

The likelihood of John composing the Apocalypse would imply that he had profound knowledge of of oriental myths and religions.

Or he could've been familiar with the eschatology of his religion and had a vision from Christ, like he said. I'm just sayin'.

Coupled with numerous passages being originally written in Greek it would be rather stretching the imagination to the extreme to envisage john writing anything more than his name.

The whole book was written in Greek, not just a few passages. Not classical Greek either, but rather Koine, or common, Greek. Since John was a fisherman, is it out of the question that he would've learned to write some due to his father's business? I don't think it's out of the question. A thing about John's Greek too, it's not perfect. It's very rough compared to the polished Greek of say, Luke or the scribe that Peter used.

Father M E Boismard in 1966 demonstrated that John was killed along with his brother James of Zebedee in 44 AD.
Since the gospel was dated to 100 ad how is it possible that the illiterate Galilean fisherman wrote anything as he was dead 56 years earlier ?

And? Is this guy infallible? His is just one thought among many about the book of Revelation. Not everyone dates Revelation to AD95. Not everyone believes John the Apostle wrote it either. They're just opinions. That's why one needs to go and take in all the evidence they can themselves and then make a decision on their own.

reply to post by impaired


No, impaired, you are not crazy. This is basically the same conclusion I myself have come to after years of study on the subject matter. Think about it from the perspective of the ETs. On their world, they are Royalty, and that, coupled with greed, jealously, sloth, and narcissisms, made themselves out to be Gods to primitive mankind. It is clear to me that they, (Annunaki) were the ones who created religions, and you can tell the Annunaki were infighting, because the different religions are different from place to place, and they fight all the time over whose is the right religion. S&F for your post.

angels and Demons are no different than believing in the 'Lesser gods' of Mt Olympus and the Underworld.
True Montheists do not believe in these entities because they are irrelevant and powerless to the will of God. The One and Only One Almighty.
Same goes for any 'idols' worshipped in unison, or instead of The One.
If Jesus was the 'Son of God' , he is not God.
If Jesus was the Embodiment of God, then he was merely the fleshy vessel used by God to commune more effectively with Man. Thus worshipping the bottle, instead of the 'Genie' contained within.
I have no problem with those of Duelism or Polytheism, as long as they don't try to pawn it off as a form of Monotheism, It's not.

Here is my view on the whole thing:

Larger Human type beings live, they lived here before the dinos, they live else where in the universe. We were created by them, then over took them and destroyed their presences here on earth.

All the Angles and Demons and crap and God(s) are all just misinformation.

[edit on 23-11-2009 by theuhstuf]

You have to remember that ET means life not of this earth. Mankind has assumed that the earth is ours, yet we did not create it. That makes it a gift if indeed it is ours. Some people think that ETs where here before modern man. If that is true, then that would make it their planet also. How about we just say unkown life form. That would clarify that we do not know what it is or where it came from.

Actually, angels are ETs. Angel is a job description, not a category of life. In other words, those cosmic citizens who serve love and light selfishly, can be Blessed. Archangels serve Divine Mother and meet with the high councils of planets. They are freedom fighters. For example, Michael led J'ean D'Arc, and won battles against elite bloodline forces with a small group of men. Another incarnated here that I know of is a lawyer who defended natives rights for years, pro bono, and won. They incarnate as well, and are here for what may be coming up, depending on the timeline possibilty brought in. Even when incarnate, they are their higher selves, can do things multidimensionally and with many aspects of self at the same time, they are omnipresent, you have only to call out for them, Michael/Miczael, Uriel, Raphael, Gabriel, Metraton. They do rescue people from abduction if they have faith, and this isn't about having the Jewish, Christian, or Muslim Faith. All prayers are light and love.

In ple'o'sha'n, Micahel is Miczael. In ple'o'sha'n, God is Divine Mother, who is First Cause, on a journey of self discovery. The Creator also discovers that She Herself is a Child of yet another Creation, for the omniverse is incredible, and God is an aspect of Self that goes on, as we are all aspects of our higher selves, in turn aspects of the Creator.

When I experienced Miczael's presence, unlike a normal postcard contact from an ET with a siting of a craft, his presence was like a field, a plane of consciousness, that extended for miles. Super consciousness. And, my friend who was writing to me was healed instantly.

Our religons were made by the annanuki and come out of Sumeria to control us.




[edit on 23-11-2009 by Unity_99]

reply to post by impaired


Star and Flag!!!

You already know from my past posts and threads that I believe in this theory and NO ONE can change my mind about it...the divine beings in the bible were aliens ( the Anunnaki to exact) and they are our creators, miracle bringers and astonomy teachers..They were the GODS.

HIGH FIVE!!!!