The Ancients Series | Part II: Indians

The Ancients Series for AboveTopSecret.com
Authored by serbsta.

Part I: The Sumerians
Part II: The Indians

CONTINUED

The Astras: Hindu mythology makes use of these Astra’s which were said to be supernatural elements which only certain God’s could control. Significantly, Astra means ‘missile weapon’. Specific incantations and spells were required in order to be able to gain the Astra’s and to use them. Because of the power of these Astra’s, only those who were righteous and understood the conditions of use could be taught the power of being able to attain the use of one. Astra’s are used in both epics, the Mahabharata and the Ramayana. Let’s examine some of the Astra’s that were used:

Brahmastra:This was the weapon that was created by Brahma. Nothing could stop the Brahmastra once it was unleashed and it could never miss it’s intended target. This Astra causes massive environmental damage and no life could survive in the area once it was used, it cannot rain, and the ground grows dry.

Narayanastra: This Astra was the personal weapon of Vishnu. It released an outburst of thousands of missiles and the only way to stop it was for the target to bow down in complete submission.

Pashupatastra: This was the personal Astra of Siva. It could be controlled by the eyes and the mind. It was said to be capable of destroying life and all creation.

Vaishnavastra: Another Astra of the God Vishnu. Once released, this missile could not be stopped without Vishnu himself commanding it.

Varunastra: This Astra was said to be a water weapon, it could master the oceans and control them to be used as a weapon of war.

These Astra’s do sound a lot like modern day weaponry to some, with all the effects (destruction, impacts on the natural world, etc). Some have compared, specifically the Brahmastra to a modern day nuclear bomb.

The Destroyer of Worlds

Whether or not nuclear weapons have been used in the past, the influence of the Hindu Epics is prominent today, notably, in association with the first detonation of the atomic bomb. J. Robert Oppenheimer was a world famous physicist, and the head of Project Manhattan. Upon witnessing the nuclear test in 1945, Oppenheimer famously recalled verse 32 from chapter 11 of the Baghavad Gita:

“Now I am become death, destroyer of worlds”.

It is clear that Oppenheimer understands what he has done, and is feeling remorseful, he could be coming to an understanding of the cyclical nature of humanity, and how man destroys man with mans own creation. Oppenheimer is quoting Lord Krishna (avatar of Vishnu) once he has transformed into his celestial form in front of Arjuna. Remember, the Bhagavad Gita is the text inside the Mahabharata Epic which shows the conversation between Arjuna and Vishnu. As Vishnu transforms he becomes consumed with a bright light. Could this be Vishnu showing Arjuna the weapons they have available to use, in a way giving Arjuna the courage to continue fighting against his cousins. Oppenheimer considers the Bhagavad Gita as the most important literature that shaped his philosophy of life.

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Notably, Krishna (Vishnu) has transformed into a cosmic (celestial) form, emitting some form of radiance. One could describe the following (Arjuna speaking to Krishnu) as a description of a atomic bomb exploding, capturing everything in its path. The following are excerpts from the Bhagavad Gita:

These warriors of the mortal world are entering your blazing mouths as many torrents of the rivers enter into the ocean. (11.28)

All these people are rapidly rushing into your mouths for destruction as moths rush with great speed into the blazing flame for destruction. (11.29)

You are licking up all the worlds with your flaming mouths, swallowing them from all sides. Your powerful radiance is filling the entire universe with effulgence and burning it, O Krishna. (11.30)

Krishnu then explains that he has destroyed all the opposing armies without Arjuna having to fight:

Lord Krishna said: I am death, the destroyer of worlds. I have come here to destroy all these people. Even without your participation in the war, all the warriors standing arrayed in the opposing armies shall cease to exist. (11.32)

In quoting the Mahabharata itself, we witness a destructive incident, possibly the result of an Astra:

The splendour, equal to that of either the Sun or
the Moon, of bracelets and diadems of all the heroic kings, became
dimmed. And the dust that rose looked like a cloud, the flash of bright
weapons constituting its lightning. And the twang of bows, the whiz of
arrows, the blare of conchs, the loud beat of drums, and the rattle of
cars, of both the armies, constituted the fierce roar of those clouds.
Section CXVI

And more famously, consider the following passages:

...A single projectile,
charged with all the power of the Universe.
An incandescent column of smoke and flame
As bright as the thousand suns
Rose in all its splendour...
A perpendicular explosion
with its billowing smoke clouds...
...the cloud of smoke
rising after its first explosion,
formed into expanding round circles
like the opening of giant parasols...

...It was an unknown weapon,
An iron thunderbolt,
A gigantic messenger of death,
Which reduced to ashes,
The entire race of the Vrishnis and the Andhakas.
...The corpses were so burned
As to be unrecognisable.

The hair and nails fell out;
Pottery broke without apparent cause,
And the birds turned white.

After a few hours,
All foodstuffs were infected...
...to escape from this fire.
The soldiers threw themselves in streams,
To wash themselves and their equipment.

Looking at it from a non bias side, this is a VERY accurate description of the after effects of a nuclear explosion.

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We should not however, forget Oppenheimer. At Rochester University a student asked Oppenheimer whether or not the bomb that was detonated at Alamogordo the first one to be detonated. To that, Oppenheimer replied:

Well – yes, in modern times, of course.

What Arjuna is describing when witnessing the transformation of Krishnu or what strange events that seem to be massive explosions are being described can be interpreted in many ways, but what leaves only two possible interpretations, fact or fiction, is the tale of the Vimanas.

CONTINUED BELOW

CONTINUED

Golden Birds and Flaming Chariots

Vimana’s have been heavily discussed on this website, some see them as the ET UFO’s of ancient times, others, just as with the rest of the issues discussed here, as pure myth. Vimana itself means ‘to traverse’, or ‘the traverser’, although modern usage means ‘aircraft’.

The Vedas (text’s which predate the ones we have discussed here) do not directly make reference to Vimana’s, but there is evidence of ‘flying machines’ in the Rig Veda itself.

"Dark the descent: the birds are golden-coloured; up to the heaven they fly robed in the waters. Again descend they from the seat of Order, and all the earth is moistened with their fatness." "Twelve are the fellies, and the wheel is single; three are the naves. What man hath understood it? Therein are set together spokes three hundred and sixty, which in nowise can be loosened."
RV 1.164.47-48

Vimana’s are mentioned in the Epics above as well. The Ramayana describes the use of a Vimana in the battle between Ravana and Rama.

"The Pushpaka chariot that resembles the Sun and belongs to my brother was brought by the powerful Ravana; that aerial and excellent chariot going everywhere at will .... that chariot resembling a bright cloud in the sky ... and the King [Rama] got in, and the excellent chariot at the command of the Raghira, rose up into the higher atmosphere.'"

They do indeed seem to be describing aircraft, but how? In ancient India? Surely it can’t be possible? The Mahabharata makes this even more inconceivable, as it depicts not only an aircraft, but a weapon of war.

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/0162e2302122.png[/atsimg]

In the Mahabharata the Asura (group of divine entities) have a Vimana which is described as having four strong wheels and measures twelve cubits in circumference. Spherical shape? Flying saucers anyone?

Further, it describes the Vimana of the Asura as having weapons such as ‘blazing missiles’ which caused massive destruction. But something more frightening, is Indra’s Dart which was a circular reflector, it produced a shaft of light and immediately destroyed it’s target.

The above extracts offer a very general overview of some of the Vimana’s used in Indian Epics. But below, I will highlight some extracts which may sound strange, but sound strangely similar to our modern day space travel. Keep an open mind while reading what is below.

EXTRACT 1: While Dhruva Maharaja was passing through space, he saw, in succession, all the planets of the solar system, and on the path he saw all the demigods in their vimanas showering flowers upon him like rain.
(Bhagavata Purana)

EXTRACT 2 : He traveled in that way through the various planets, as the air passes freely in every direction. Coursing through the air in that grand and splendid vimana, which could fly at will, he surpassed even the Devas.
(Bhagavata Purana)

EXTRACT 3 : Then the highly intelligent Asura Maya built the cities . . . There were many palaces with gems. Aerial cars shining like the sun, set with Padmaraga stones, moving in all directions and looking like moonbeams, illuminated the cities.
(Siva Purana)

EXTRACT 4 : The Puspaka Car, that resembles the sun and belongs to my brother, was brought by the powerful Ravan; that aerial and excellent car, going everywhere at will, is ready for thee. That car, resembling a bright cloud in the sky, is in the city of Lanka.
(Ramayana)

EXTRACT 5 : The vimana had all necessary equipment. It could not be conquered by the gods or demons. And it radiated light and reverberated with a deep rumbling sound. Its beauty captivated the minds of all who beheld it. Visvakarma, the lord of its design and construction, had created it by the power of his austerities, and its outline, like that of the sun, could not be easily delineated.
(Mahabharata)

EXTRACT 6 : And on this sunlike, divine, wonderful chariot the wise disciple of Kuru flew joyously upward. When becoming invisible to the mortals who walk the earth, he saw wondrous airborne chariots by the thousands.
(Mahabharata)

EXTRACT 7 : We beheld in the sky what appeared to us to be a mass of scarlet cloud resembling the fierce flames of a blazing fire. From that mass many blazing missiles flashed, and tremendous roars, like the noise of a thousand drums beaten at once. And from it fell many weapons winged with gold and thousands of thunderbolts, with loud explosions, and many hundreds of fiery wheels. Loud became the uproar of falling horses, slain by these missiles, and of mighty elephants struck by the explosions . . . Those terrible Rakshasas had the shape of large mounds stationed in the sky.
(Mahabharata)

I suppose you could take them with a grain of sand. It is still heavily debated what these ‘vimana’s’ were, for one who sees all of this as pure myth, they remain nothing more, but for one who searches for some trace of history in what has been recorded, what has been written, remains a possible reality.

END OF PART TWO: THE INDIANS

PART 3 WILL BE PUBLISHED AT A LATER DATE

=====================================================

SOURCES AND FURTHER READING

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu_mythology
www.pantheon.org/areas/mythology/asia/hindu/articles.html
www.probertencyclopaedia.com/browse/D7.HTM
www.themystica.com/mythical-folk/.../hindu_mythology.html
www.experiencefestival.com/hindu_mythology
www.sacred-texts.com/hin/
www.religion-cults.com/Eastern/Hinduism/hindu3.htm
www.religionfacts.com/hinduism/texts.htm
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahabharata
www.sacred-texts.com/hin/dutt/
www.crystalinks.com/vimanas.html
www.hinduwisdom.info/Vimanas.htm
www.ufoevidence.org/topics/vimanas.htm
ufo.whipnet.org/creation/ancient.aircraft/vimanas.html
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Robert_Oppenheimer
avalon.law.yale.edu/subject_menus/oppmenu.asp

Books:

Hindu mythology, Vedic and Purānic, Oxford, 1882

Handbook of Hindu mythology, ABC, 2003

The Ramayana and the Mahabharata, J.M. Dent, 2006

===================================================

Please feel free to discuss, debate, question anything written above!

Here's an interesting video which talks about nuclear radiation found in an ancient destroyed Indian city.



It touches on some interesting points.

8 flags and 0 replies?

Eeeek, that makes me uncomfortable.

Great OP Serbsta. Thanks for your effort, this was a very interesting read as was PART I.

IDK if I missed something, but you didn't mention any time periods in this part. Was it on purpose? Could you give an estimate on the time periods on this histories? Or are they just Indian mythology ?

Surelly these Astras sound a lot like nuke missiles. Very interesting.

Well a big thank you from me for all the work put into that. I'm sure I will enjoy sitting back with a coffee later today and reading through it all in more detail.

Cheers

Originally posted by MorfeuZ
Great OP Serbsta. Thanks for your effort, this was a very interesting read as was PART I.

IDK if I missed something, but you didn't mention any time periods in this part. Was it on purpose? Could you give an estimate on the time periods on this histories? Or are they just Indian mythology ?

Surelly these Astras sound a lot like nuke missiles. Very interesting.

I've read very differing accounts of the age periods, thats why i didn't put it in. I've read some estimates that the Mahabharata war took place between 6000-4000BC (which is closest to my opinion). But the text itself was composed between 400BC and 400AD. As for the Ramayana the average dating is around 5000BC, while some stretch back closer to 10000BC.

reply to post by TheBlackDog


Not a problem.

Enjoy.

Very nicely designed and written. I dont have anything to add because its all already been said in your OP. I´ll just add that The Epic of Gesar also tells of ancient wars and nuclear fallout.

I believe that previous civilizations have left remains that can be viewed with google earth and have posted coordinates accordingly in my updated OP which can be viewed toward the bottom of this page; www.abovetopsecret.com...

Let me add my voice to the chorus congratulating you on a job well done. The presentation is top notch.

While the information is outside of my field of expertise it is nonetheless fascinating and highly interesting and to me represents the very essence of ATS.


Again, excellent job.

Thanks for your great effort in putting together this great thread. I love these type of threads and subjects. I'm absorbing all this like a sponge! Love it, again thanks and S & F.

Also with the excellent discussion that followed part I (and still continues), I look forward the great discussions in this one too.

Thanks for the level of detail you have provided, I am at work so will be able to read all of the information when I get home. This is why I check this site daily as really makes you think about the civilisations that have came before us. S &F keep up the good work, there is also a crater lake in India that has different PH levels from one part to the other, I added it to one of sky floatings threads, will add about it here.

Interresting and well written!

Maybe someone from India can comment on this ?

Before we go any further: is the translation to English correct? thats a big issue, and I like to know if it is.

A lot of reading.. time to let it sink in and comment later. I have questions, but will read first a bit more.

Johan

[edit on 11-11-2009 by VonDutch]

pretty interesting, i've always considered the Mahabharata one of the best sources to prove we're not the first advanced civilization. the description of a nuclear blast is just too perfect.

s & f.....pretty good work

Wow. I'm a Hindu and I didn't know all of this to such a depth.
Very nice If there is any translation work I'd love to help

Great post, as was the post on the Sumerians. Waiting to see further elucidation of the Science and Maths of ancient India, including:

a) Discovery of zero

b) Advanced geometry, trigonometry, application of the pythogoras theorem beofre it was actually documented,

c) Brain and heart surgery, transplants,

etc etc.

I wonder if many know that long before the Wright brothers had their first maiden flight, a craft built on the concepts elucidated in the ancient indian texts actually made a passengerless short flight?

Cheers!