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Plan B

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posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 09:23 AM
In order for it to be the most effective, it needs to happen all at once.

There are two bills that now rest in the Senates' hands. Cap n trade and now health care. Plan B will go into effect the day the financial part of the Health Care bill goes thorough. This will be the day they start charging the tax. Providing the Senate passes this bill.

On that day, the small business in this country will fire their employees. Those employees will have everything in place and ready to go to be "contract" workers. Their former bosses will then contract work out to their former employees. Paying them the lump sum of what they would have paid them origionally. Leaving their new contract workers to decide what to do with their money at that point.

Every person needs to be able to decide for themselves what side they want to be on.

Each person decides if they are going to be for or against the new Health care. Those against will not pay the health care tax.

The jails are full, and broke. They will not be able to arrest us all.

I am sure there will be consequences. There always are. However, if done this way, then everyone knows where everyone stands. There is power in numbers. It helps to know you are not fighting alone.

After this becomes an issue, what happens next is up to the government. They can either fix it in a way that makes us all happy, or declare war on us.

You can not revolt against a government if you do not have something set up to replace it. You can not ask people to choose a side if you do not have a side set up for them to choose.

Therefore, another government needs to be set up and a new capital needs to established. As much as politics suck, they are important. Nothing will change unless there is another option for it to change into. This needs to happen old school public voting.

It has to be organized.

Just because it is set up does not mean that this second government has to take over. If nothing more, it can make certain the current government stays in line.

If you work for a small company, I suggest to talk this over with your employer. Chances are your employer has already decided on this "self contractor" idea. No body likes change, however small companies are being pushed into a corner with this. The taxes they are going to be charging your employer makes it impossible for most to stay open.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:07 AM
And later on at the Concentration camps we can all have a good laugh about it!

It's going to be a bumpy road! People will reach the tipping point...and we're getting closer by the day.

"Bye,Bye,Miss American Pie...."

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:19 AM
I think Plan B will prevent consentration camps. Actually it might be the only thing that prevents it if the Senate passes these bills and people decide they have had enough.

Our govenment needs competition to stay honest......well as honest as possible.

Having a second government set up, and allowing people to decide for themselves what to do with their money is the only thing that will allow us to keep our "Miss American".

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:25 AM
you are my new friend.

a rational voice, offering a rational way of going about things, within the system, to screw over said system.

i will spread this idea all over. i know several small business owners, and people that work in small businesses.

the problem still exists though on what to do about the whole getting fined or thrown in jail part...any ideas there? my only one is to clog up the system with our right to appeal. cost them more money.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:40 AM
Hello new friend

I know around here, the jails are struggling. They are letting people out early because they are over crouded and the states can not afford to keep them.

Do do not have the room, or the money to jail us. Who cares if they are going to fine you, if you are not planning on paying anyway? Think of how many people are not going to pay this when they have the choice.

The best defence is to knowledge.

How many ways do you think they can try and strong arm us?

[edit on 8-11-2009 by mrsdudara]

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:45 AM
A few other discussion boards are starting to talk about calling for a national strike should this bill (or a variation of it) actually get signed into law.

The government cannot tax people if they are not making an income

If Americans band together to shut down the .gov's income via a National Strike, they will have no choice but to listen to the people.

Still in talking stages, but I fully expect this form of a "Plan B" to be a possibility .

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:49 AM
I do not think the strike is a good idea.

Times are tough. People need their income. A strike is a very temporary thing. The government knows that. A strike would only make us weak. It would make people desperate, and able to be bought out.

Allowing people to continue to make an income and make them the bosses of their own money is empowering. It makes us stronger.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:55 AM
Here's what I see though...

once they realize this opposition is more than what they thought, they will jail us, it will just be in new jails, constructed on the outside of jails, with barbed wire fences, barracks for us to live in, we will essentially be able to move about as we like, because they don't have to resources to keep us in line like "real" criminals. That set up sounds familiar? Because it should.

And the reason I am worried about this is because I am a young adult looking at a future as a business owner. I do not wish to fly "under the radar" for the rest of my life. I want to prosper on the insurances our founding fathers made of life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.

If my idea of happiness is not having insurance, if it is not having a vaccine, then gosh darnnit, let me have it. it is not hurting a single one of them..other than if enough of us go after this pursuit, then their wallet gets a bit thinner.

its time for this 20% to stand up. use this next election as a way to clear house. vote EVERYONE out. becaues EVERYONE in there is not protecting us, and if they vote like they are, they obviously are not standing up and saying it. they should be on tv RIGHT NOW. they should be organizing us. if they truly voted that way or just wanted to make certain people happy.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:57 AM
reply to post by redhatty

i do not see how a strike will help anything.

who strikes? those who can afford to live off their savings for an extended period? what about the majority who can't? those are the ones who need to be striking, but they have families, they have lives, they have bills that will still need to be paid. unless those who can afford to strike help us out, but i doubt that would happen.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 11:17 AM
reply to post by mrsdudara

If done correctly, it can work, no banks are following through on foreclosures right now, Credit cards are not being used at 30% interest.

With a few weeks to plan ahead, extra groceries can be stocked up, utilities can be payed up & the strike can happen.

But it will only be a success if we actually have a majority of the population involved in it.

We are still losing 500,000 jobs a week. More will be lost with the HC bill going into action. It will cause employers to drop 2 employees for every 1 they have to pay the insurance premiums for.

When there are no jobs left, it's too late to strike, then it's time to use more than pitchforks & torches.

Making employees a sub-contracted worker only leaves the responsibility for mandatory insurance on the worker, who can be charge $15,000 in fines and/or a year in jail for not complying.

This is nothing but a back door way for an employer to cover his arse, it is NOT a way to help the employees

[edit on 11/8/09 by redhatty]

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 11:28 AM
reply to post by redhatty

yes, the employers will be covering their ass, i think we are aware of that, but that is money that the gov is EXPECTING.

what would happen if you don't get your pay check? you'd be pretty mad and figure out why...they figure out contract laborers are the problem. then they try to make that illegal or something, and true colors begin to show even more.

its part of the process.

if a strike is planned, maybe 50% of those who try will be able to survive. lets face it, most of who will jump on board wont have any smart ways of going about saving like this. i've been trying for 3 months and its hard to have more than 10 spare bucks in my pocket at the end of the month, only getting what i need. and i don't think i am the only one in this predicament.

i really do not think a strike would work as you think. but i would be interested in a way that it would.

another problem, ok, strike works. we win. go back yea..gotta find a new job...because you can bet people have stepped into our old ones.

and they may not be able to go thru the formalities of foreclosure all at once..but i'm damn sure they can legally kick you out all at once then what?

[edit on 11/8/2009 by iamsupermanv2]

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 02:10 PM
reply to post by redhatty

We only hurt ourselves with a strike though. We hurt our local small businesses, and we are done for. People are living paycheck to paycheck right now. Stocking up is not going to an easy task. The other problem is it is not a perminant fix.

We need a fix. No more threats. We need action.

You say if it is done the right way? What way is that exactly? Businesses need to be able to continue to run. People need to be able to eat. At a time when jobs are becoming scarce they need the assurance that they will have a job to come back to. How is a strike going to do all that. All while chastising the government.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 07:00 PM
The right way? Well, my idea is not perfect, but imagine this, we have 50 states. Each state has 1 day of national strike, but they all run consecutively, so the .gov sees 50 continuous days of protest & reduced .gov revenue.

One day should not hurt any small business, if one day will hurt them, they are already in trouble & there's little that can be done to help them anyway.

No going to work, try to get the super-majority of the state to participate, no shopping, no buying ANYTHING for one day in each state for 50 days in a row in the end.

If the .gov doesn't wake up & pay attention, we start all over again and run it another 50 days, 1 day per state, until these pigmen in CONgress wake their arses up & realize exactly who they work for.

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 07:27 PM
Oh I just love this plan. LOVE IT!

Y'all didn't get your way on this issue, so your solution is to completely destroy the economy. BRILLIANT!

This right here is the reason you lost the last election. People are sick of this kind of attitude in this country.

But hey, please go for it, cause it will blow up in the GOP's face so badly that no one in their right mind will ever vote another republican in office again.

BTW, you do know that if you somehow manage to do this, any employee would just have the right to collect unemployment, sue the employer for wrongful termination, and then won't have to be a 10-99 contractor.

[edit on 11/8/2009 by whatukno]

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 08:58 PM
Ok plan B supporters listen up ! Can you entertain a new view ? The health care reform bill is this nations chance to save itself ! Put aside for the moment the constitutional issues and grasp the bigger picture. This is just a trogan horse to Hide the Billions of dollars which will be pumped into this economy as fast as they can print it ! Ever look into the corporate America derivative scam ? Ever watch a corporate takeover ? Redistribution of assets and allocation of
new programs ! All in the name of Health care ! Clever way to try and keep the public's eye's off the real issue's ! No vested money left ! anywhere !
I don't like what's happening but we have got to look forward by looking forward not by looking in the rear view !

posted on Nov, 8 2009 @ 10:23 PM
As a 1099 employee you typically get a higher hourly rate than is normal for a salaried employee in your same position in order to cover the taxes that your employer doesn't pay.

Also, the government doesn't just allow companies to function solely on a 1099 workforce. Contract labor is just that, a contracted temporary position. The IRS has the legal ability to come in to your business and require you to make your employees actual employees of the company if they determine that the positions aren't temporary/freelance.

That being said, I highly doubt you'll get many people to get on board with this plan because of the relative instability that comes with being a contracted employee. There may be many people who like the idea on the surface, but the reality is quite a bit more complicated. Do you believe that with the economy in its current shape, people would be willing to take that risk? Do you think small business owners would be willing to take that risk? I'm just not so sure about that.

Plus, organizing even 1% of small businesses to do this plan would probably be a near impossible task.

posted on Nov, 9 2009 @ 10:17 AM

Originally posted by Avenginggecko
Do you believe that with the economy in its current shape, people would be willing to take that risk? Do you think small business owners would be willing to take that risk? I'm just not so sure about that.

Plus, organizing even 1% of small businesses to do this plan would probably be a near impossible task.

Unfortunatly, Plan B is already out there on the table for many. This is not just an idea I came up with while staring at my computer.

My husband is a business owner in the commercial, and housing industry. We are one of the lucky few. For the past couple of years I have sat here and watched many good men and women have to close their doors. The ones who are left are struggling. The tax they are talking about will do these companies in. Most are already operating on the absolute minimum number of workers they can. So, laying off a few to cover the expences is out of the question. These business owners know that if they have to close their doors there will not be anywhere for their employees to go. There are no job openings. Granted this might not work for a waitress, or reatail clerk. That is not to say it wont eventually though.

You can judge how the rest of the economy will be by watching this industry. It is the foundation of our country. It employs not only the engineers, and architects, but steel workers, lumber, construction, builders, roofers, plumbers, electritians, painters, the list goes on.

The commercial and housing industry has changed a lot during these hard times. Now, you have to fight for the job. You have to be willing to give 110%. They no longer bid on jobs individually, but they put teams together and bid that way so everyone knows who will be working on what job.

Granted being a self contractor means you have to be on top of your game at all times, because if you slack off, they might not choose you for the next job.

Those unemployment checks do not come forever.

The housing industry accounts for more than 1%.

The part of Plan B where I talk about the contract workers is something that is already in the works.

I figured that since people are all talking about revolution, striking, and such....this might be another option. A peacefull least at first. It is something that is very likely to happen anyway. When these men and women have to cut those checks themselves, do you realy think they are going to? NO. It is hard enough to pay the taxes they owe now. They never had to physically deal with taxes before. Their employers did it for them. Our of sight out of mind. You put all that money in a persons hand they are going to see that and immediatly their brains are going to think WOW I could pay off my debt, my bills and have steak for dinner tonight. The moment they have to cut that check ....... they will see things in a whole new way. That is going to open a big can of worms. AND THAT ANGER and RESENTMENT is going to spread like wildfire.

Im just offering a way for it to be more controlled and organized. Wildfires can be very benificial if controlled properly.

[edit on 9-11-2009 by mrsdudara]

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