Muslim mother hid bomb manual in her burka and 'considered turning her children into human bombs', page 3

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:06 PM

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Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by ModernAcademia

I usually agree with you, but I just can't on this one. Why would they bust her if she wasn't guilty. She is a woman with a bunch of kids, so now they had to pay out to try her and held her in prison. What would they gain from this if she wasn't guilty. It isn't like Britain isn't already chalk full of Muslims already. Now if she was the first one coming over to live there or visit then you might have a case, but truth is the Muslims are about to overrun all of Europe by reprouction and democracy.

A women with a bunch of kids makes it easier for the anti-terror squad to force her to confess. All they got to do is talk about her kids for couple of minutes and ask her if she confess she will only get two years but if she doesn't, not only her, but her kids will also be effected.

The case concerned the seizure of Osama Moustafa Hassan Nasr, also known as Abu Omar, and his transfer to Egypt, where he claims he was tortured.

All of the Americans were tried in absentia, with 22 sentenced to five years in jail and Robert Seldon Lady, the Milan CIA station chief, handed eight years in prison.

Two Italians were given three-year prison terms.

Citing diplomatic immunity, Judge Oscar Magi told the Milan courtroom on Wednesday that he was acquitting three other Americans.

Five Italians, including Nicolo Pollari, the former head of Italy's Sismi military intelligence service, and Marco Mancini, his ex-deputy, were acquitted, with Magi saying that the men were protected by state secrecy rules.

Lawyers for the 23 Americans said they would appeal against their convictions.

english.aljazeera.net...

"I was brutally tortured and I could hear the screams of others who were tortured too"

I don't trust them, and I don't trust the British since they have parallel policies. Forced confession through torture or through other means, the same thing.

HotSauce

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:17 PM

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reply to post by oozyism

The question is what would they gain for doing this. They have to pay to convict her, pay to incarcerate her, pay to take care of her kids while she is in jail if her family isn't in the country. What do they gain by convicting her, if she isn't guilty?

oozyism

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:21 PM

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Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by oozyism

The question is what would they gain for doing this. They have to pay to convict her, pay to incarcerate her, pay to take care of her kids while she is in jail if her family isn't in the country. What do they gain by convicting her, if she isn't guilty?

I said why in my first post in this thread:

Politically motivated, 2 years is nothing, they have killed thousands of innocent people, giving a lady 2 years in the anti-terror squad is doing a huge good, because it will bring about a law which will allow the authorities to search through your personal files. It is a means of justification.

They want to take away more of your freedom, it is already in America, Britain is next, slowly this fear will infect Europe then hello world war three (since everyone loves wwii I might as well come to that conclusion also).

ProtoplasmicTraveler

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:27 PM

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Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by oozyism

The question is what would they gain for doing this. They have to pay to convict her, pay to incarcerate her, pay to take care of her kids while she is in jail if her family isn't in the country. What do they gain by convicting her, if she isn't guilty?

Propaganda value friend. The whole War on Terrorism which is bankrupting the Western Economies and being used to impinge upon and take away civil liberties and rights and give the government excessive and added control over us all depends on the notion that there is a real threat we have to be protected from.

The reality is there is a very limited real terrorist threat, no where near the kind of threat that has warranted two wars in Iraq and Afghanistan at a cost of tens of trillions of dollars.

The reality is we could have bought every person in Afghanistan a Villa on Lake Geneva with the money we have spent fighting a small rag tag group of millitants over there.

So the Governments are always on the look out for a Headline to keep insecure people feeling insecure and grateful.

Wow I sure am going to sleep better a mother of five immigrating out of a war torn part of the world because it's war torn is behind bars!

I was so worried about her! Not!

Who knows who she is married too or related to and what angles they might be playing in selecting this woman.

In the mean time you have seen on this thread the people who can't wait to sieze on any news like this to say death to this, down with that, lets bomb this, lets nuke that.

We are being manipulated in the worst ways, being taught to give up all our notions of rights, due process, fairness, civil liberties, and to hate without question people who have never done a thing to anyone to warrant it.

The scary thing is a lot of people over react in large part because of the economy and the injustices they face in life. Give them something to vent and rail against that isn't the government.

Don't get mad at Congress, or Downing Street if you have no job, don't know how you are going to pay the mortgage or rent. Get mad at terrorists! Take out your frustrations on a mother of five!

Be a man, feel good! Pound your chest, curse a little.

It's all manipulation. It's all shameful. It's all very wrong.

HotSauce

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:28 PM

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reply to post by oozyism

So if what you are saying is correct, then why didnn't they just scream gun or bomb and plug her full of holes and been done with it?

oozyism

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:31 PM

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Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by oozyism

So if what you are saying is correct, then why didnn't they just scream gun or bomb and plug her full of holes and been done with it?

Ahh because then there would be an independent investigation.. To what really happened.. People are already suspecious of government lies, hey look at ATS.

HotSauce

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:34 PM

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reply to post by oozyism

So you are saying they can plant a usb drive on her and get fake letters where she says she is going to use her and her kids as suicide bombers, but they cannot plant a bomb or gun on her without getting busted?

Do you see how I have a hard time seeing your side of the story. This is like a black man screaming racism everytime he gets caught with a bunch of weed.

ModernAcademia

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:38 PM

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Mod Edit - Comment Removed. Please Review The Following:

2) Behavior: You will not behave in an abusive, hateful, intolerant, bigoted and/or racist manner, and will not harass, threaten, nor attack anyone.

Terms and Conditions

[edit on Wed, 04 Nov 2009 20:29:58 -0600 by MemoryShock]

I do apologize, but can a mod V2V me what I had previously posted?
I don't at all remember what I posted where the snip is.

If I said something derogatory than I do apologize
But I can't at all remember what I had posted

Please v2v me and accept my apologies in advance.

Thanks

TruthWithin

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:44 PM

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What I find amusing is when an AMERICAN mother locks her kids in a car and lets it roll off of a pier, it is just shameful. Yet, some crazy religious zealot does something and it is entitled "Muslim", as if to group all Muslims as a horrid people.

How bout the Christian mother that kept her adopted daughter in the basement and had her friends and siblings torture her for being a pregnant teen?

Her parents, carnival workers, had left Likens and her sister Jenny in the care of the Baniszewski family three months before her death in exchange for $20 a week. Baniszewski, two of her children, Paula and John, and two neighbor youths, Coy Hubbard and Richard Hobbs, were charged and convicted of the crime. Her torture and murder were described by the prosecutor in Baniszewski's trial as "the most terrible crime ever committed in the state of Indiana.

Source

Do Muslims have a sorted record of arcane tradition? Sure. But so do Christians.

What are you trying to prove?

tezzajw

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:44 PM

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Originally posted by InfaRedMan
Those types of thoughts represent a clear and present danger Tezz. There are some things that are simply 'wrong'. It's hardly the line of thinking we should be promoting.

Hey, IRM. Probably the first time on ATS that I disagree with you! It was bound to happen!!!

As far as I see it, it would be fairly easy to plant a few things on a person and then prosecute them for a thought crime. Every corner of society is not far away from being very oppressed with 'what if' crimes.

I really don't care what fantasies most people have, even if it is killing their children. I don't state that it is right, by my moral compass, but who am I to try and tell them what to think? When they act out, it's a different story altogether.

I think there's a dangerous precedent being set when it becomes easier for people to be arrested for what 'they were going to do'. A similar kind of case happened in Aussie recently, where those alleged 'terrorists' were 'planning' to shoot up the army barracks. Until they do it, what law have they broken, other than participating in a mass hallucination?

oozyism

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:45 PM

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Originally posted by HotSauce
reply to post by oozyism

So you are saying they can plant a usb drive on her and get fake letters where she says she is going to use her and her kids as suicide bombers, but they cannot plant a bomb or gun on her without getting busted?

Do you see how I have a hard time seeing your side of the story. This is like a black man screaming racism everytime he gets caught with a bunch of weed.

No why plant a bomb, that is much harder, they have to secretly bring the bomb to the airport, plant it, but when? Bypass security, and after security, bypass cameras.. Too much hustle, too much witnesses... etc

ModernAcademia

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:45 PM

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Originally posted by dooper
Well, Jesus Christ! Look at her photo!

who christ or the mother in the article?

well, whichever you meant, I can't tell anything by looking at a photo regardless of who you were referring to.

Originally posted by dooper
To make it worse, she was acting strange, nervous.

I posted a thread about scientists making a new device to detect fear
were you part of that project?

what is strange to you might not be to another.
And since when is being nervous a crime?

Originally posted by dooper
Let's see. She's dressed in a burkha, she's nervous, she's acting strange, she makes some furtive movements, and something falls out.

OHHHH THANKSSS

Case Closed!!!!!!!

You Sherlock Holmes you!!!!!

I always apreciate great insight!!!!!!
Thank you for showing me the light

HotSauce

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 10:54 PM

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reply to post by ModernAcademia

So really what this comes down to is do we trust your FEELING or do we trust the British government and the police, prosecutors, and judge that convicted her. I am sure she had an attorney, and she did confess. So I have to jump on the side that she is guilty, since all you have presented to back up your side is your feelings.

ModernAcademia

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 11:04 PM

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reply to post by HotSauce

I have presented no feelings in my opinion

But this case screams false flag

It all seems planted, but maybe she's CIA too
who knows, maybe her family is getting money out of it

how and why, who knows
but false flag? Yes all the way!

Why would she have that pic of the terroist camp of people within a 1yard range jumping raised wooden logs with a man with a gun conveniently placed within the pic to make it all more poignant?

a yard of jumping hoops is sophisticated terroist training?
the alleged biggest threat to the american military super-power of the world?

Where did she get that pic from?
A terroist souvenir shop in afghanistan?

What purpose would such a pic serve other than to be planted evidence?

and a letter of her saying she would risk herself and her kids?
why carry that letter?
it's most efficient purpose would again be.... planted evidence.

and the phone bomb pic is amateur basement terroism on comedy central

I once read a USAtoday(I think) article in 2004 I think, it was about a man wanting to join al-qaeda or taliban.
They put him in a room for 7hours, within that 7hours he moved the curtains in that room a tad bit to see what was going on outside.

For that alone he was not recruited.

CNN said that taliban has infiltrated every facet of Pakistan law enforcement.

If they are that organized then does this story make any sense?

It makes as much sense as box cutters planning 911

or a passport being the only thing conveniently falling out of the plane lol

come on people
where are the deductive/inductive skills?

[edit on 4-11-2009 by ModernAcademia]

oozyism

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 11:17 PM

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reply to post by HotSauce

I am sure she had an attorney, and she did confess.

See you are also making assumptions to come to your own conclusion, under anti-terror law they are not allowed an attorny, they can be question without an attorny for 40 days.

Arsenis

posted on Nov, 4 2009 @ 11:46 PM

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Originally posted by oozyism
reply to
See you are also making assumptions to come to your own conclusion, under anti-terror law they are not allowed an attorny, they can be question without an attorny for 40 days.

I wonder if this is out of feelings or what, althoug I am not talking just about what I quoted but most of your post.

First off, the possibilities exist one way or another, it could be a plant, seems way too easy the collection of evidence they have collected.

But, we also got to look at the other side of the story, she is an older lady, apparantly oncesed with the jihad and most importanly apparantly mentaly ill do and I quote the source in the OP here...

The court heard that Chentouf, who has addresses in Manchester and The Hague, has a mental illness triggered by the death of a family member, and had previously tried to harm herself.

It seems to be due to this is why she got a reduced sentece, also what if that family member died by means of a suicide with a bomb attached.

But that is crazy isn't it so it must have been a plant. < / sarcasm >

It mostly seems that she could be mentally ill that is way more plausible but both options are open, and the reason is that we don't have enough proof of anything but a small summary of the whole situation from an article.

OFF TOPIC:

you were asking about Islamaphobia, which it was explained to you already but I will try myself and if you decide to respond do not derail into americas faults, we both know both sides do their crazy stuff but we are talking about Islamaphobia here.

People who are not muslim have almost no knowledge or even nothing at all, the first things that they hear as for that religion is the suicide bombers, stereotypes exist and although they are a generalization stereotypes are true for that small amount of people that they belong too.

let me give an analogy since I know your blood is already boiling as I saw from comments in the first 3 pages.

If a straight guy gets hit by a homosexual guy there is a possibility the straight guy becomes homophobic.
It doesn't mean that all gay guys will hit on him but that fear is there already and there is a chance that will happen again.so therefore homophob.

Lets go back to Islamaphobia, the ones you should be blaming should be the MSM since they are the ones putting the fear on other people about islamic suicidal bombers.

(and like I said some stereotypes are true about that small population, sadly they fall onto bigger groups of people)

EDIT: I am a little tired, if here are grammar errors or something doesn't make much sense it is because I am tired and will fix it tomorrow, or not...

[edit on 4-11-2009 by Arsenis]

Dark Ghost

posted on Nov, 5 2009 @ 12:07 AM
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Originally posted by oozyism

Is it wrong to hold your beliefs while you are fighting, it is called moral support(since we all know they don't have millitary support)? Yes no one agrees in the deaths of innocent people, but hey who isn't doing it these days for political means? Are you telling me America is not responsible for the deaths of thousands of Muslims? Innocent Muslims? Are you telling me Europe isn't responsible for the deaths of thousands of Muslims? Innocent Muslims? For political means?

The USA and allies illegally invaded a sovereign nation. Not the first time it has happened in history. They did not create a Islamic civil war as a result as you and many others would like to assume. Sunni v Shia violence has been a problem in the ME for a very long time. The invasion might have sparked a rise in the intensity of the battle, but most Muslims around the world die at the hands of other Muslims. You are aware of Saddam Hussein's murder of over 1 million other Muslims right?

Also, it does not matter how horrible and unjust a crime has been committed on you, targeting areas with large civilian populations is unacceptable. If another country came and invaded my country and committed the most horrific acts upon my people, I would definitely fight and resist them. What I would not do is try to blow up and cripple my fellow countrymen in the process. When I start to do that, I am just as bad as those who invaded.

Yes and those kinds of people exist in every society, including Democratic, should we demonize all Democracy sympathizers? Communists have already been demonized in the West, and thousands have died in response, thousands of innocent people, because of that Demonization. Should we continue an idiotic cultural behavior which has caused more harm than good? You can't blame Islam or the whole Muslim population for the actions of some bad seeds.

You need to re-read my post because that is the point I was trying to make. The problem is that you are trying to excuse the behaviour of a small group of bad seeds when they murder and cripple innocent civilians and try to place the blame on America. When it comes to demonising a whole country because of the actions of their army, you have no trouble lumping the "bad seeds" together with the general population now do you?

The difference between my view and yours is clear from what I can read, you believe Muslims are being demonized because of some in their population willing to kill innocent people to accomplish their goals, but don't care to mention that there is something more sinister at hand, for example the middle east situation, and the colonization of middle east by America.

The difference between you and I is that while we both have no trouble calling an orange an ORANGE, you have the inability to place the same standards on Muslims because you always want them to be the victims of American/Western oppression.

You can't expect to get away with colonization. People will fight, and people are fighting, with any means necessary, whether that be suicide bombing, or roadside bombings. They are fighting back, and they want to bring the fight to your land, as much as you want to take the fight to their land.

Ever heard the idea of the "Islamic caliphate"? Islam is certainly no stranger to the concept of colonisation. And I don't mean that as victims of colonisation, I mean that as advocates and promoters of Islamic colonisation. I know colonisation is a dirty word used to blacken the name of the West, but it is not a tactic exclusively used by the West either.

[edit on 5/11/2009 by Dark Ghost]

grimreaper797

posted on Nov, 5 2009 @ 12:39 AM
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Originally posted by Arbitrageur

If it was planted, why would she admit to it? She probably didn't have much choice because some of the documents she had were handwritten, and it probably wouldn't have been difficult to show they were in her handwriting.

There may be some false flags somewhere but this isn't one of them.

Normally I wouldn't respond, just lurk, and in fact I do believe she was probably in the wrong as there are definitely crazies out there.

But that aside, this is a very dumb statement to make. She got 2 years. With terror laws the way they are these days, she obviously got cut a deal, which is what happens most of the time, guilty or not.

Being that she is probably an immigrant, not very well off money wise, probably not very familiar with the law of the land, 6 kids, etc. etc. even if she was innocent, it wouldn't really matter.

Wouldn't be hard OR unimaginable for an ANTI-TERROR squad to make out a fake terrorist info guide on a USB drive. They know exactly what one should look like, and have the materials available to them to create it. They plant one, catch a bad person, cut a deal, and justify their jobs existence.

Just saying, 90% of cases in the US never go to trial, mostly because plea bargains.

chiron613

posted on Nov, 5 2009 @ 01:36 AM
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I don't see it as a plant. There is a large accumulation of information on how to make destructive devices (IED's, incendiary devices, poisonous gas, etc., etc.). Terrorists can get hold of this information just as easily as anyone else. As they learn, they can publish their own information.

Yes, terrorists could easily be running through obstacle courses, jumping over things, and doing what many military people do in basic training. Not all terrorists are kids with bombs strapped to them, who just blow themselves up. Many receive military training and fight like soldiers. In fact, you could consider them soldiers rather than "terrorists". So why not go through basic training, get fit, learn how to fight? Beats going into battle unprepared.

As for using kids for suicide murders, it's considered an honor, plus the kid goes directly to Paradise. Considering the quality of life in most of those countries, and the great honor of martyrdom, it's not at all unnatural or strange. We're used to viewing things from our Western perspective, where such behavior is strange. But when viewed from their culture, it makes a whole lot more sense. It's going to take a long time to work such cultural beliefs out, to get rid of the notion that blowing yourself up is a good idea.

ecoparity

posted on Nov, 5 2009 @ 03:24 AM
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I don't know why it would be so hard to believe. Even the bunny boiling complete nutcase model of the female comes fully equipped with Uterus and ovum. I can attest to this from first hand knowledge.

More often than not the religion of said female is of no consequence (unless that religion encourages Mothers to strap bombs on themselves and / or their children and go blow up a few infidels).

And to think people are afraid of right wing Christians......