Judas.. Pure Evil or A friend of Jesus...

reply to post by realshanti

As to the idea that the Hebrews were never in Egypt - I researched that a number of years ago and it is quite interesting - I wouldn't dismiss it out of hand but the jury is still out on that ...whether their captivity was in Egypt or Babylon does not affect my faith in Christ -

The jury is still out ? Whose jury exactly the roman catholic jury ?

Dude, the were never 2 million Hebrews enslaved in Egypt as according to the claims made in your bible which you accept as truth, so obviously as this event did not occur your bibles are erroneous.

The exodus is probably one of the most important events in your bibles, this is where your god Yahweh presents to you the way you should live your life, if you choose not to live as he/it commanded the you will suffer the penalty that he/it deems fitting the crime.

We no know some thousands of years later, that this event did not actually occur, but you counter with yes it did but it must have occurred elsewhere so it is still true !

This is preposterous logic grasping at straws to convince yourself that your many years of "study" of what you wanted to believe ie the bibles is not in error.

Your awkward statement -"whether their captivity was in Egypt or Babylon does not affect my faith in Christ" implies that regardless of factual error whether in whole or partially, within the bibles. You will accept what they have to say as fact and ignore lack of evidence unless it presents itself in a manner that would fit in with what you wish to believe,

This kind of mental gymnastics is quite typical of the christian delusion, and no doubt the more biblical problems one presents to you the more you will bury your head in the sand and pretend it will all go away.

Quite honestly I pity you in that you are far too brainwashed or egocentric to ever consider that you could in any way be in error.

Fortunately for the rest of the reasoning world, your superstitious religion is imploding and peoples are being freed from the shackles of this wicked nonsense which has no basis in reality.

You've come to the table claiming "Proof" -

my proof for the existence of Jesus Christ is Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John, and the letters of Paul [Saul of Tarsus]

Not only have you failed to provide proof you have failed to provide any evidence. What you have presented is hearsay and hearsay is only evidence of itself and not "proof" of anything.

You openly admit that regardless of lack of evidence you will accept hearsay as proof of what you want to believe. If that is what you choose to believe the fine kick on and I would be the first to defend your right to believe what you wish.

However, please please don't continue to present your "faith" as proof as we know that your faith is based on hearsay unless proven otherwise, which you claim you have no need to do probably because you are unable to do so.

Moocowman . . .

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Just because no proof exists does not mean that those things did not happen.

Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
Moocowman . . .

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.

Just because no proof exists does not mean that those things did not happen.

To what unrecorded non event in particular are you referring, the exodus ?
Agreed, absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, but when there is evidence of the space, where what is alleged to absent is supposed to reside, is evidently filled by something else which is evident then things change. QED

reply to post by moocowman


Most scholars -even non Christian scholars at that - accept the account of the Gospels as at least a reasonable if sometimes metaphorical account of the life of of Jesus, as an historical figure....more information exists about him from near the time of his walk on the planet than any other person of his era or indeed any other ancient time...The sources you site about the Exodous are a minority opinion which does not make them wrong - therefore worth studying as I said - but at this point yes - the majority of scholarly work on the subject are not in your camp...that's a fact..the jury is still out...
but that said your interpretation of who God is and what he will do is dead wrong....and my experience with Jesus Christ is just that - mine - I don't expect you to believe simply based on what I say - you have to ask him into your life and develop your own relationship with him...And the fact that the accounts of believers through the centuries resonates with unmistakable similarities is something I take seriously - and rely on -
be that as it may, I still have to develop my own relationship with God the Father, Son and Holy spirit - nothing can replace that necessity - so it may be that we never agree on the actual events of history - but the teachings of Christ, his life, death and resurrection are eternal and a treasure beyond counting - thats my take - take it or leave it - over and out and all the best to you, really..

Well if Judas did commit suicide, according to the Bible, he is in hell as suicide is a unforgivable sin. How can you ask for forgiveness of a sin, when your dead? kinda sucks dont it. Saying he had to turn in Jesus is also false, do you think this was the only time Jesus could have been caught? i don't think so. Society back then was very closed, it wasn't like Jesus could take a jet to another country and escape quickly. The donkey express wasn't the fastest get away vehicle at the time. Jesus would eventually of been caught, especially since he knew he had to be caught and crucified, it was his job. another big bummer. Oh well, i guess we will all find out one day, when worms are going through our skulls.

Originally posted by Neo Christian Mystic
Pilate: Who should I set free? Jesjuah Son of the Father? Or Jesjuah Son of Joseph?.||||||||||||||||||||||||||||

Josjeh by JesJu by HoSe by JesSe by JosJef by Juskan through KE'ansBiEr *spit* hew these stones.... these damn stone$....$\endnip.col

I haven't read every post , but the movie The last Temptation of Christ goes into this. It follows the gospel of Thomas and Judas more than the other more well known gospels. Very good movie. Directed by Scorcese.

reply to post by gerg357


You fail to understand the importance.

It IS NOT GOOD that Jesus had to be sacrificed.

Why is it that people still fail to understand what a sacrifice is?

How many parents here would sacrifice their son/daughter to save the human race? Don't allow the small number of words in the previous sentence to be a downplay on the importance of this subject. REALLY. Your son - Your daughter - could you?

People do realize God is a person, too, you know? Forgive the tasteless humor, but He has feelings. And, the all-powerful was so weakened by the sacrifice of His son that He had to TURN AWAY FROM JESUS. He could not watch it happen. READ what Jesus says to God while He is dying.

Maybe you don't get how wrong it is that God knew that Judas could be used in the way that he was used. Yes, it is true that Judas did NOT know what effect he was having even after Jesus had already said that it would happen. That is true for ALL of us. How many of us realize the reality of a situation totally before it happens? I know I'm gonna be a dad. But, I am certain that the realization will not hit until after the baby is here. In my arms. For two weeks. Yeah, I'm certain a lot of people here know what I'm talking about.

Judas made choices in his life that proved to God what kind of choices he would make later in life. No, that did not guarantee Judas' involvement, but it was pretty much a statistical fact. Judas was the person he chose to be for himself. Just like, if you were someone who had trained to use a rifle for your entire life and you could pick a grain of salt off of a fire ant from 100 yards, you would be someone that would be more suited to be a sniper than say, someone who wasn't. Does that mean you want to be a sniper? No. Would you snipe if you had to? Yes. When a given situation is provided, therefore, you will act accordingly. You will still make a choice.

The saving of our sins by Jesus' sacrifice was not inevitable in the fact that God and Jesus didn't constantly try to think of a way out of it -- because they did. It was inevitable because of the choices that we make. The kind of people that we are made us predictable. God understood what had to be done based on the information we provided. Don't you get it? So many things work this way.

I am trying to understand the mentality of a person who decides that because someone does something, they were forced to do it just because it was "supposed" to happen. What? Everything that has happened was "supposed" to happen. It didn't happen any other way. So, does that mean that you are forced in everything you do? Perception is a wily concept, I know, but then what's the point of doing anything if you don't have choice?

reply to post by gerg357


I believe that Judas still acted on his own will.........If he had refused and fought Satan's putting the idea in his head. Satan would have kept searching until he found someone to do the dirty deed. Satan wanted Jesus dead.

I do believe Judas repented for what he did and will be in heaven with the other disciples.

Peace,
Grandma

reply to post by Grandma


I don't think you know how these things work. People smack their grandmothers dead with a frying pan to their fore heads thinking that's a good idea. Sure Satan had nothing to do with that - or what if? Get real. If the damn bastard wants something to happen, he'll damn well make it happen. No questions asked, he'll use you like a finger puppet.