Mexican UFOs Debunked

Originally posted by dirtjockey
The problem is that there is NO government individual or agency who is prepared to admit to the free world that there are beings from other planets who have the ability to enter our airspace, abduct our civilians, and pretty much do whatever the hell else they want to do. Why not? Because they will admit that they have absolutely NO CONTROL of the situation.


Not quite all goverments. Look into the Belgium UFO sightings of the late 80's/early 90's. They Belgium Govt admitted officially that something was in their airspace that they could not identify or intercept.

Originally posted by Facefirst
Not quite all goverments. Look into the Belgium UFO sightings of the late 80's/early 90's. They Belgium Govt admitted officially that something was in their airspace that they could not identify or intercept.

Have any good links on this?

Originally posted by cstopkiller
I think this things is unusual ! we need research it in long time, any quikly anwsers is not right !

Agreed, gonna take a long time to see what comes of this.

Just to add on letxa's comments, I am Mexican too, and I attended one of Maussan's "conferences" he gave in our city (Leon).

He was presenting the Jonathan Reed case (later proved a blatant fraud), telling people he posessed and alien bracelet he never dared to show.

The problem here is, Maussan's blind faith in paranormal matters has affected his credibility. A little research before telling people something is the ultimate truth would be nice from him...

Anyway, I had the opportunity to watch the video, and after reading about ball lightning and other weird phenomena, I can't assure that's what I saw.... maybe the radar data captured could add strength to this IR video.

[Edited on 20-5-2004 by cham00ko]

debunk schmebunk - those things are real craft. face the facts - this is only the beginning of what is going to happen all over the world in the lead up to Dec 21, 2012

[Edited on 20-5-2004 by braincell]

cham00ko: Just to add on letxa's comments, I am Mexican too...

Minor point of detail: I'm not Mexican. I'm American. But I've lived in Monterrey (Mexico) for the last 8+ years (algunos dicen que soy tan mexicano como el nopal)...

The problem here is, Maussan's blind faith in paranormal matters has affected his credibility. A little research before telling people something is the ultimate truth would be nice from him...

Definitely. That's the problem and I think that that's what people here are missing. The source of this video is indirectly the Mexican Air Force, but the direct source of this video is Maussan. And his track record just is very questionable and everything he presents needs to be double and triple checked. Unfortunately, this same video is actually less credible for the simple reason that Maussan is the one publicizing it. Had the Mexican Air Force taken this to a university or simply published it themselves (i.e. released it to the news media directly) this whole thing would actually be less questionable. But in this case the messenger (Maussan) truly poisons the credibility of the message.

Anyway, I had the opportunity to watch the video, and after reading about ball lightning and other weird phenomena, I can't assure that's what I saw.... maybe the radar data captured could add strength to this IR video.

Definitely. So far all we have is a video that is supposedly infrared. We're told that the objects appeared on radar but we haven't seen any tapes of the radar yet. We're told they weren't visible to the human eye, but we have no way to verify that and have to simply accept it on trust. We're told that they were exhibiting "intelligent" behavior based on their formation flying but with no radar data we have no way to confirm that. We're told they were in contact about the issue with their "base" but we have no audio recording to confirm the radio transmissions. We're told they were picked up by the plane's radar but we have no evidence that the objects were picked up by nearby ground-based radar at Ciudad del Carmen.

In short, we have a video in which we see some lights and then we have a bunch of unconfirmed and, so far, unverifiable claims. As it stands now there is simply no reason why this video is any more interesting than any other video that contains some unidentified lights in the sky. I'm not saying they aren't UFOs. Perhaps they are. But there is currently not enough evidence to support that conclusion and anyone that is jumping to the conclusion that these are alien craft is certainly as foolish as anyone that would jump to the conclusion that this is ball lightning. There is insufficient evidence to support either claim.

Hopefully Maussan (or the Mexican Air Force) will be so kind as to publically release the rest of the data and let it be reviewed by credible scientists.

BTW, does anyone have a link to a full uninterrupted video? I found a link in this thread that took me to two clips that were a few seconds long each but I'm looking for a full, continuous video of what we're discussing.

good work men. i knew ball lightning couldnt have been the answer! i knew it was a craft that had that new transparent panel technology. amazing stuff.

topsecretombomb: i knew it was a craft that had that new transparent panel technology. amazing stuff.

What evidence leads you to that conclusion?

i dont think there real but i dont think itis ball lightening

notice it takes scientists weeks to come up with an explanation. i could just imagine the government telling scientists to hurry up and find a plausible explanation as the scientists flip through encyclopedias of weather events that correspond best with the mexican ufo incident.

mauskov, you say that people jump to the conclusion that these are ET too quick. that statement just canceled out your knowledge in this subject. when someone reports a ufo because he claims he saw white lights in the sky two days ago, and then everyone has a firm stance it was a ufo, that's what you call jumping to conclusion too quick.

the mexican ufo incident was reported by a mexican police pilot, which already adds accountability to his testimonies. when the pilot explained what happened, experts for the most, could not find objectivity to his credibility. he has a video footage, clearly made during his shift or it would've been proven otherwise.

the objects in the sky weren't identified as planes and if you have half a brain, which i think a pilot who works for the mexican police would, he would be able to distinguish whether he's being surrounded and chased by intelligent life or experiencing a weather event that took scientists weeks to pull out of their ass.

whether it was really ET or some weather incident, this is anything but "coming to quick conclusions."

Here's some information on ball lightning.

Ball Lightning: A relatively rare form of lightning, consisting of a reddish, luminous ball, of the order of 1 foot in diameter, which may move rapidly along solid objects or remain floating in midair. Hissing noises emanate from such balls, and they sometimes explode nosily but may also disappear noiselessly. Also called globe lightning . It has been suggested that ball lightning is a temporarily stable plasma.
Reference: roland.lerc.nasa.gov...

Database of Ball Lightning Sightings: www.amasci.com...

Facts on Ball Lightning: www.tbns.net...

Average lifetime is about 5 to 10 seconds.
Average size is 1 foot in diameter.
Some of the balls are blindingly bright - others had almost no illumination and appeared grayish. Average brightness is about that of a typical 100W light bulb.

It was Jamie Maussan who years back also backed up this famous Mexican ufo video (Aug.6 1997 ufo over mexico city buildings):
www.jman5.com...

Consensus is that is a hoax (too bad, it was a great video...)

Still, this case looks better this time. I think it looks like triangular craft (some of those lights are flying in just such a formation - one light per angle...) This would explain why fewer objects were picked up on radar than were seen on the infrared cameras.
keyholepublishing.com...

No. The Philadephia Experiment was NOT originally about making a ship optically invisible. Because of the great loss of ships torpedoed by the Germans during WWII, the intention was to make Allied ships in Atlantic convoys invisible to RADAR. The USS Eldridge never became merely invisible. She physically vanished and was translated through a wormhole to a place hundreds of miles away. According to a source that I cannot name, the Mexicon Air Force was tipped off by USSTRATCOM operating out of Venezuela that objects appearing on their infra-red satellite photos and assumed to be planes smuggling drugs were moving over Mexico. The Mexicon Air Force radioed a plane that was on routine anti-drug patrol to move into the area and the rest is UFO history.

A little about Maussan: Here

And More (translated from Spanish for your convenience):

--[START TRANSLATION OF ARTICLE]--

On August 26th of this year (2003) a crazy Jaime Maussan appeared on the television program "Otro Rollo" [Otro Rollo is kind of like Saturday Night Live, but on Tuesdays in Mexico]. For a momento it seemed that on the screen was the Aregentine UFOlogists Pedro Romaniuk with his typical psuedo-scientific jargon, and that no-one tells him is complete nonsense out of respect for his age. Maussan, Romaniuk, JJ Benitez, and others constantly attack science, while at the same time robbing its terminology and using it without understanding it, to wrap themselves up in an air of "scientificness."

Maussan spoke of Mars, at that time for its spectacular closeness to the earth. He said that some astronomers say that it had been 60,000 years since Mars was so close to ours. But Maussan, with his infinite wisdom, stated that he had a conflicting piece of data: That it had been 72,000 years or somthing like that. Ramones (the show's host) asked him when these same conditions would repeat themselves. Maussan said very confidently that it would be 700 years. I read on a page from NASA that very similar conditions would be present in about 200 years. Of course Jaime can state that the people at NASA are covering the truth from all humanity.

He later presented old pictures from the Viking, modifying the color, so that the region of Mars looks less red. Jaime believes that NASA has hidden from the whole world the fact that Mars isn't a red planet, but rather a color closer to that of the earth. En that moment I turned by head towads the window, located Mars between the clouds and noted a certain red tone. Undoubtedly NASA is doing their job very well, although I can't explain the technology they use so that the planet looks red, and what is worse, I don't know what the purporse of painting it red is.

Later, Jaime began defending Jonathan reed, that person who said he had killed an alien and that ended up, as expected, as a simple fraud. But not just him. He also defended the video of the UFO in New York, the one where the UFO flies around the now-gone Twin Towers. The grey crop circles with the mssage encrypted in a disc and the recent video of a UFO over Avebury.

To Maussan, everything is real. It is said that an English television station mentioned that they had made the video. But Muassan is skeptical. Instead of doubting all paranormal trash, he doubts that things are fruads. "Let them prove that Reed is a fraude! Let them prove hat the New York video is a fraude! Let them prove that the Avebury video is a fraud!" The world of Maussan is the world backwards. Later he presented a picture with supposed letters from the Jewish alphabet which, he says, appeared in the foothills of Popocatepetl [Volcano near Mexico City]. Maussan had them analyzed and found four interpretations.

In the recent UFO conference organized for Yohanan Diaz, Maussan explained his interpretations differently than he explained them on "Otro Rollo." At this time he has discarded the three first interpretations and has kept one that says something like "In the ninth month will be born the bad one." The ninth month could be our September, but Jaime talks about December, the ninth month of the Jews, according to him. Jaime has learned some things that he was criticized for. Now he announces his nonsense to the four winds via a medium that reaches all of the Americas (from Canada to the tip of South America) and parts of Europe, but he immediately makes the comment that he "is not claiming that the ninth month is the end of the world or that the volcanoe will errupt or that something bad will happen, just that they keep that data in mind."

The game is clear. If nothing happens, Maussan saves himself from critics. But if anything happens, regardless of how insignificant, Muassan will throw it in the face of his critics and say that he had predicted it. In this way he covers his flanks. No, he's not stupid, that's why he has the millions of dollars that he has. On the other hand, Jaime said he is already in contact with the young lady that appears in the video of the UFO with the Twin Towers, inside the helicopter. According to him, she doesn't want to talk. He also stated that the Sci Fi channel doesn't give much information, "for which the video still stands. In the future I will have news from the witness. Until that time it has not been demonstrated that it is false."

And despite his arrogance, Jaime doesn't seem to have been informed that the witness Barbara Sicuranza and her husband, the guitarist from The Blondie, Chris Stein, has accepted that they made the video as a promotional piece of the Sci Fi channel. In the end, that's Maussan for you...

--[END TRANSLATION OF ARTICLE]--

In short, Maussan is a dilusional fraud. His very association with this Mexico Air Force video diminishes its credibility.

Come on these things not only flew in a pattern but turn and started following them

AGENT 007: Come on these things not only flew in a pattern but turn and started following them

It's now been about three weeks since Maussan first announced this video. Questions:

1. In those three weeks, has radar data from the plane been made public?

2. Have radio communication between the plane and ground control been made public?

3. Has strictly visual video been made public that was filmed at the same time as the supposed IR image so we can confirm there was nothing visible to the naked eye?

4. Has there been any data made public from ground-based radar that would confirm the radar data from the plane?

5. Has anything significant been made public other than the supposed IR video?

Last I checked, the answer to all these questions is "no." And the person promoting the video is a well-documented hoax promoter. This does not bode well for the authenticity of the video regardless of what it appears the lights did in the video.

Lexta,
In case you have not found a link for the full video yet:
Mexican Ufo Video Link

I agree with your position. Am missing the next actions also. I have seen Stanton Friedman (on the UFO Update Mailing List - a good site where the big guns post - Randle, Friedman, etc.) making some pompous and smug statements on the "debunkers" not coming up with any hard facts but then neither is he.

Apparently the National Autonomous University Of Mexico has requested "copies of the video from the Secretariat of National Defense along with technical data on the sighting in order to carry out deeper studies and come up with a definite scientific answer." I know they initially called it ball lightning, but I hope that they will seriously look into it. Otherwise if it is left up to Maussan, then it will remain tainted as you say...



[Edited on 31-5-2004 by gzhpcu]

The story is not quite dead yet...
Las Vegas Mercury Article on Mexican UFOs


Unfortunately, it seems that the fringe element is also getting involved in "clarifying" the incident. Billy Meier apparently has asked his ET contacts ("not one of ours..." they apparently replied) to look into it. Good grief... All we needed...

ball lighting does not retain patterns, match speeds with and surround aircraft.

Originally posted by letxa2000
AGENT 007: Come on these things not only flew in a pattern but turn and started following them

Hello letxa2000 and all members,

I know it is too late for this post but not to late to let you know the truth
about this infamous story promoted by a well known hoaxer named Jaime Maussán.

It's now been about three weeks since Maussan first announced this video. Questions:

Maussán was hired by the MOD -Mexican Secretary of Defense- to distract the people's attention from severe problems related to security and political matters.

See: 2004 Videoscandals
en.wikipedia.org...

1. In those three weeks, has radar data from the plane been made public?

No way, the Radar data (video) never existed, just words of ONE crew member who was operating the AN/APS143(V)B Radar on board the C26A airplane dedicated to Maritime target detection.
Mexico has NO RADAR on the ground ANYWHERE. WE HAVE NO MILITARY RADAR'S IN MEXICO. PERIOD.

Here you can see the Mexican Air Force UFO investigation results:

Mexican Air Force FLIR's video lights are not UFO's
www.alcione.org...

Also the radar targets where vehicles in the Yucatan Peninsula Highways:

See: Radar Targets May be Trucks On Yucatan Highway
www.virtuallystrange.net...

2. Have radio communication between the plane and ground control been made public?

I was the only one who did a FULL transcription and translation of the
whole 32 minutes on board communications:

March 05, 2004 Mexican Air Force C26A FLIR's video on
board C26A communications transcription and translation
www.alcione.org...

You can watch and hear the FULL VIDEO (58MB) while you read the transcript:
www.alcione.org...

3. Has strictly visual video been made public that was filmed at the same time as the supposed IR image so we can confirm there was nothing visible to the naked eye?

There was the MOON recorded, and worst, it shows how the FLIR equipment was not calibrated and had -4° to +2° ELEVATION ERRORS

Here you can read Tim Printy's complete story:

UFOs appear in Mexico (again)!
by Tim Printy
home.comcast.net...

4. Has there been any data made public from ground-based radar that would confirm the radar data from the plane?

Mexico has NO RADAR on the ground ANYWHERE. WE HAVE NO MILITARY RADAR'S IN MEXICO. PERIOD.

5. Has anything significant been made public other than the supposed IR video?

Yes, the public interview with three crew members that answered in a very non-professional way. They where NOT scared at the moment of the sighting, by the contrary, they where joking and laughing and they
NEVER chased any airplane.

Last I checked, the answer to all these questions is "no." And the person promoting the video is a well-documented hoax promoter. This does not bode well for the authenticity of the video regardless of what it appears the lights did in the video.

I have published since 1998 more than 45 hoaxes of Maussán.
Visit and translate some cases that are not written in english.

ALCIONE www.alcione.org...

Best UFO solved cases:

Mexican Air Force march 05-2004 FLIR's video lights or UFO's?
www.alcione.org...

AEROMEXICO'S AIRPLANE COLLIDED WITH A UFO BEFORE
LANDING IN 1994?
www.alcione.org...

NEW YORK UFO VIDEO JULY 24th 2000. Real or fake?
www.alcione.org...

Regards to all.

Capt. Alejandro Franz