Admiral Hill-Norton "we have been visited for many years, page 4

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 04:01 PM

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double post sorry.

[edit on 22-9-2009 by manxman2]

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 04:15 PM

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Originally posted by Copernicus

Standing by for character assassination in 3, 2, 1....

The most likely reason for no disclosure is probably because the aliens dont want it. Otherwise they could easily make disclosure a reality themselfs. Humans are not the ones running the show here.

[edit on 21-9-2009 by Copernicus]

You have touched on the one aspect of Ufology that I can't get my head around. Why don't the aliens land somewhere bleeding obvious. In front of the whitehouse at midday, the mall in front of Buckingham palace etc etc They don't but they do manage to get themselves shot down in remote places and crash land here and there after travelling light years through space full of rocks and high energy particles?!?!?!?!?!? Sorry does not compute.

fls13

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 04:23 PM

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Originally posted by malcr
You have touched on the one aspect of Ufology that I can't get my head around. Why don't the aliens land somewhere bleeding obvious. In front of the whitehouse at midday, the mall in front of Buckingham palace etc etc They don't but they do manage to get themselves shot down in remote places and crash land here and there after travelling light years through space full of rocks and high energy particles?!?!?!?!?!? Sorry does not compute.

karl 12

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 04:28 PM

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Originally posted by fls13

"The movements were completely radical compared to those of ordinary aircraft..
For six hours there were at least ten unidentifiable objects moving above Washington. They were not ordinary aircraft...I can safely deduce that they performed gyrations which no known aircraft could perform".

Senior Air Traffic Controller Harry G. Barnes

fls13

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 05:29 PM

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Originally posted by karl 12

"The movements were completely radical compared to those of ordinary aircraft..
For six hours there were at least ten unidentifiable objects moving above Washington. They were not ordinary aircraft...I can safely deduce that they performed gyrations which no known aircraft could perform".

Senior Air Traffic Controller Harry G. Barnes

It's like Jimi Hendrix said, UFOs are a "dodgy subject." Information comes out years, even decades, after the fact and in drips and drops. Technology has improved, so what isn't extraordinary today certainly was 50+ years ago. They don't write about UFOs in the history books and people don't know what they don't know, but there is a gold mine of evidence out there waiting to be discovered.

Psychonaughty

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 05:55 PM

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Originally posted by itguysrule
reply to post by Copernicus

I think you are exactly right. If aliens wanted to land on the front lawn of the Whitehouse and say "Here we are!" there is probably nothing we could do to stop them. This means that either THEY don't want disclosure yet or WE (whoever they have chosen to talk to) asked them politely to wait a while and they agreed.

So why would this be the case?

- Maybe we are just REALLY lucky and the aliens are much more benevolent and patient than we are and they are letting us work out our own issues within some kind of agreed limits.

- Maybe we don't have anything the aliens are interested in and they watch us for fun like some kind of animal in a zoo.

- Maybe they think we have potential and they are trying to keep us from destroying ourselves.

In any case I would really like to know the actual story behind the story. I hope I live long enough to find out.

....Or maybe this planet is not what we think it is.

-Maybe they know why we're here and what the purpose of being a human is.

-Maybe they are governed by the higher forces that govern this material universe.

-Maybe humanity isn't understanding of what it is and that contact would mean straying away from the purpose/task at hand.

primetime2123

posted on Sep, 22 2009 @ 07:41 PM

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Originally posted by demongoat

Originally posted by primetime2123

sorry ...if this guy said aliens visit the planet I am inclined to believe him more than you just for the simple reason that he has seen alot of "stuff" in his lifetime and he has accomplished alot..that is the way the world works....this guy isn't some random wino on the street

seems to me that you are looking for anyone, anyone, who agrees with you.
even to the point of getting rid of any sort of discernment of truth
just because he's seen a lot of "stuff", doesn't make him an expert on aliens, it only means he knows "stuff"
still an appeal to authority.
i could care less if he was the queen of england or the POTUS, or even a wino, if the best they can do is give an opinion, they aren't anymore experts than anyone else.

true but he has a higher level of credibility than you or me......there are alot of people like him such as astronauts like Edgar Mitchell who have said the same thing....maybe you are one of those people who needs an alien to land on your lawn and smack you in the face to believe that they may exist

chunder

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 12:35 AM
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Armap and others

Firstly the argument over weighting of his opinion over others based purely on his credentials of position has to be a no brainer.

If in conversation at the dinner table you asked for opinions on a possible financial investment you were about to make would you give more weight to the 45 yr old doctors response or the 19 yr old lap dancers (and please invite me to your next dinner party as sounds interesting).

Bear in mind that query was not within the boundaries of professional expertise of either person, as is being suggested, which is not the case here anyway, because - see 2 and 3.

Secondly the weighting of his opinion can also be judged on the information he was known to have - which was direct contact with senior members of the forces who had personally investigated UFO cases, Lord Mountbatten for one.

Thirdly it can be safely assumed that because of his position he had certain information at his disposal, whether through contacts or status, as alluded to by information freely available on the Rendlesham Forest and Belgium Triangle cases.

What does it all mean - his opinion (as opposed to some others) adds more weight to the argument that a genuine phenomenon exists.

zorgon

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:57 AM
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Originally posted by ArMaP Or because it was a career somewhat connected with the government?

An Admiral you consider 'somewhat' connected with the government?

Sorry

zorgon

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:06 AM
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Originally posted by chunder
If in conversation at the dinner table you asked for opinions on a possible financial investment you were about to make would you give more weight to the 45 yr old doctors response or the 19 yr old lap dancers (and please invite me to your next dinner party as sounds interesting).

The 19 yr old lap dancer, because her father owns the company I am investing in
and yes my dinner parties ARE 'interesting'

Presenting me the Roast Beast

However in the case of an Admiral... he didn't get to that position by lying or being 'woo woo', especially in Britain. He would be privy to info others would not because as Admiral he would have high clearances... His military training would make him a better observer...

And he is NAVY after all

BUT I know what ArMaP means.... if Joe Petunia is walking down the street... sees a space craft land with two grays jumping out and abducting that 19 yr old lap dancer to serve on Orion... well we would just toss him to the wolves (ATS Skeptics) whereas if the Admiral told us this we would at least listen

[edit on 23-9-2009 by zorgon]

[edit on 23-9-2009 by zorgon]

Jim Scott

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 03:46 AM
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What continues to baffle me is why people still cling to the idea that the government is covering up the ufo phenomenon. An Admiral in charge of the Navy is a reliable source for government disclosure. If he says there are ufos, there are ufos.

To reach the pinnacle of your profession in the military means you have been experienced, used good judgment, been groomed by others to rise to the top because you exhibited great qualities of wisdom, leadership, etc.
To be in charge of your nation's naval forces for many years shows a level of responsibility, maturity, and intelligence.

I do not doubt the integrity of such a man. For me, men of this caliber are a reliable source.

Jimmy Carter said he saw a ufo.

How many people in high positions of government does it take for you to believe a government disclosure has occurred?

Does it have to be on official letterhead?

gortex

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 04:31 AM
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reply to post by Jim Scott

Some people cant see something until it slaps them in the face , while a lot of people who accept UFO reality are serious and rational , skeptics like to see us as flaky and easily fooled , as you say the evidence is there , if you choose to accept it there's testimony from military witnesses , the Foo fighters in WW2 , references to ET and UFOs in history and some of the NASA footage are all compelling reasons to believe that we have been and are still being observed by other races .

ArMaP

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 07:40 AM
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Originally posted by chunder
If in conversation at the dinner table you asked for opinions on a possible financial investment you were about to make would you give more weight to the 45 yr old doctors response or the 19 yr old lap dancers (and please invite me to your next dinner party as sounds interesting).
That would depend on what they would say as the reasons for their opinion, I do not accept any unsubstantiated opinion about anything, but if the doctor said one thing and the lap dancer another but the lap dancer's reasons made more sense to me I would give more weight to the lap dancer's opinion.

As I said before, what I think is important is in what data the person based his/her opinion, because that way I can understand (or at least try to understand) what was the reasoning behind the opinion.

In this case we have only the opinion that "there is a serious possibility that we are being visited". As he didn't said why he had that opinion I cannot give that opinion more weight than I give to other people's opinion that is given without the reasons that made that person have that opinion.

Secondly the weighting of his opinion can also be judged on the information he was known to have - which was direct contact with senior members of the forces who had personally investigated UFO cases, Lord Mountbatten for one.
Did he himself investigated directly any UFO cases? If his opinion was based on what other people told him then he was in the same position as other people that had only "second hand" information about those cases.

Thirdly it can be safely assumed that because of his position he had certain information at his disposal, whether through contacts or status, as alluded to by information freely available on the Rendlesham Forest and Belgium Triangle cases.
Considering that he retired in 1977, he was in no official position at the time those cases occurred, so I don't think that we should assume anything about any possible special knowledge that he could have about those cases.

What does it all mean - his opinion (as opposed to some others) adds more weight to the argument that a genuine phenomenon exists.
Sure the phenomenon exists, what I would like to know is why he was convinced that the explanation for the phenomenon is extra-terrestrial visitation.

ArMaP

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 07:41 AM
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reply to post by zorgon

Yes, only somewhat connected because it's not a government position, they can keep that position regardless of government.

karl 12

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 08:20 AM
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Even if we ignore that Lord Hill Norton was Admiral of the Fleet (the equivalent to the U.S. Secretary of State) the actual content
of this quote makes some very good points.

"The evidence that there are objects which have been seen in our atmosphere, and even on terra firma, that cannot be accounted for either as man-made objects or as any physical force or effect known to our scientists seems to me to be overwhelming... A very large number of sightings have been vouched for by persons whose credentials seem to me unimpeachable. It is striking that so many have been trained observers, such as police officers and airline or military pilots. Their observations have in many instances... been supported either by technical means such as radar or, even more convincingly, by... interference with electrical apparatus of one sort or another..."

Admiral Lord Hill-Norton (GCB), Chief of Defense Staff, Ministry of Defense, Britain; Chairman, Military Committee of NATO; Admiral of the Fleet; Member of House of Lords.

tallcool1

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 12:02 PM
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Here's that same ol' "credible opinion" argument again. He never claimed to have witnessed anything, he is just a believer and stated so.

The opinion of a doctor is what the drug and cancer industries tell him it is - not what is actually true.

The politician's opinion is what the person giving him/her the most money tells them it is.

The high ranking military officer's opinion is what the politician tells him it is.

For crying out loud, at one time Richard Nixon was about the most powerful person on the planet - that didn't necessarily make him the most trustworthy, did it?

gortex

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 12:34 PM
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reply to post by tallcool1

Well the one thing Richard Nixon and Lord Hill-Norton had in common was a belief in UFOs

Richard Nixon, US President from 1969 to 1974: "I'm not at liberty to discuss the government's knowledge of extraterrestrial UFO's at this time. I am still personally being briefed on the subject

Disgraced President Confided UFO Secrets To Jackie Gleason
Richard Nixon UFO Pictorial

[edit on 23-9-2009 by gortex]

fls13

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 01:23 PM
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Originally posted by tallcool1
Here's that same ol' "credible opinion" argument again. He never claimed to have witnessed anything, he is just a believer and stated so.

The high ranking military officer's opinion is what the politician tells him it is.

Following that ill-logic, all high-ranking military officers would be speaking out on their believe in alien visitation and the public would know a lot more because no UFO documents would have ever been classified.

tallcool1

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:28 PM
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reply to post by gortex

So since the ever so trustworthy Richard Nixon said he believed in aliens visiting Earth, that makes it more believable?

And adding pictures of National Enquirer saying that Nixon let Jackie Gleason look at secret alien ships and bodies really isn't helping your case.

tallcool1

posted on Sep, 23 2009 @ 02:32 PM
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reply to post by fls13

Maybe they are "speaking out" about aliens because it is just a clever ruse to keep the focus off of what is really flying in the skies above us - and that is highly classified man made craft created out of our own intelligence and Earth based materials. Alien visitation is just a clever cover story to keep the sheep focused on something else.