Where did Cain's wife come from?

Originally posted by KOGDOG
The elements of my last post could never even remotely suggest what you believe were my intentions for quoting Eze 16:3.

Yes, I knew that you and I would not view it exactly the same way ... should I have clarified that those were my views because I just assumed that you would be already aware of it. *sorry*

Honesty really is the BEST policy when interpreting "Scripture". You might find that not everyone is "out to get you".

I absolutely agree that honesty is the best policy when it comes to deciphering the Scriptures. Given that the writers were Jewish, wouldn't a Jewess be more privy to the mindset of the Jews? Yes!

I'll let you in on the key to understanding our writings that really isn't so secret ... it is the Laws that were given to the Jewish People. This is the foundation for the whole of the Tanakh and the filter by which we are to understand the Wisdom within. Proverbs 2:1-11; Psalm 19:7-11; Isaiah 8:20 clearly show this (just to list a few). So, since I know and understand our Laws so well, you can be assured that I am deciphering them honestly and according the mindset they were written.

As for the "out to get you" comment, it is clear that you have issues with us. I have not been unkind to you at all and yet, you have shown much contempt for me and even you are disregarding the viewpoint of one of the People in whom these writings came from. Why is that?

I will agree with part of the above...

"Education" has little to do with "insight" and "love".

Cain found a wife from a different "bloodline".

It is "The Blood" that determines one's destiny.

Another fun dose of "metaphor/symbolism"........ right????
And I will feed them that oppress thee with their own flesh; and they shall be drunken with their own blood, as with sweet wine: and all flesh shall know that I the LORD am thy Saviour and thy Redeemer, the mighty One of Jacob.
(Isa 49:26)

Love is not the cornerstone of Judaism since it is an emotion that is both subjective and reliant upon present circumstances. Intellect is the cornerstone of Judaism. Education has EVERYTHING to do with the insight of our Scriptures.

And you are right .. I do not see mysticism in the Tanakh .. and thus read much of it metaphorically which is how it must be read to stay in line with the Law of God (as well as the Laws given to the Jewish).

Isa 49:26. The Jewish People are not Jewish because of our race, but rather because of our mindset .. and we call it Judaism. Abram became Abraham, the father of many nations : in other words, there are many who have joined to Israel whose bloodline is not Hebrew .. and it would even be difficult to say if anyone is of pure descent (though some seem to think it is possible .. that is a matter of speculation). This is talked about in Jeremiah (31:27 for one specific example), Hosea (8:8 as another specific) as well as other books of the Tanakh. This is the mindset in which much of Israel, including Isaiah 49 was written. Just read it in this light and if YOU are honest to read what is actually written, then this will become clear. As you read the chapter now, before you argue with the insight I gave you, notice verse 21 as it will not allow you to argue honestly against my Jewish perspective of Isaiah 49.

[edit on 14-10-2009 by justamomma]

[edit on 14-10-2009 by justamomma]

Some people believe that cain was actually the first vampire.

Thier proof was first him killing able. This was considered a lust for blood.

The part about god putting a mark on cain for anyone who harms him would be punished. This was supposed to mean the gift of immortality.


One thing that always bothered me about cain and able and i dont want to get off topic here but. How come god thought more of able then he did cain. Cain gave fruit and vegitation to god as a offer and able gave blood sacrifces.

Aint that a little twisted for a loving fair god who cherishes life?

Could this be part of the two god theory?

Also why didnt god just show cain a little more love? Thats the reason he killed able to begin with. Was because cain was jealous of the love god had for able. Or am i wrong?

reply to post by gerg357


enlil's temple city was in the foothills of the mountains, more conducive to raising live stock, cooler temps, better grazing.

enki's temple city was in the desert, that had to be physically altered with canals to irrigate it. the irrigated fields produced grains and palm trees for dates and coconuts.

Originally posted by gerg357
Some people believe that cain was actually the first vampire.

Thier proof was first him killing able. This was considered a lust for blood.

some people believe that President Bush really went to war for the good of our country .. their believing it doesn't make the fantasy truth.

Besides, "their" proof can hardly be considered proof given that Cain killed Abel because his pride was comprimised; not becaus he lusted blood. Then, if that were the case, we would have to call anyone who kills even once a vampire who is lusting for blood. Simple logic applied quickly makes this theory one to be dismissed.

reply to post by justamomma

I absolutely agree that honesty is the best policy when it comes to deciphering the Scriptures. Given that the writers were Jewish, wouldn't a Jewess be more privy to the mindset of the Jews? Yes!

Wait... OK... I remember you now.

Didn't you once comment on.... Mat 15:22-28
And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil. But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me. But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Didn't you interpret this "lesson" as degrading and insulting if not outright cruel on the part of Yeshua and how He spoke to this poor woman????

If I remember correctly I stated that this lesson was a statement of respect by Gentiles for the Hebrews who have suffered and worked in service to YAHWEH.

Didn't you then also claim your Jewish ethnicity with regard to interpreting "scripture" correctly???

I asked.... "How is it then that you a Hebrew did not understand the lesson?"

I might ask the same question now.

BTW... I a "Gentile" did not take offense at the above lesson...

That is why I took the name KOGDOG....

As for the "out to get you" comment, it is clear that you have issues with us. I have not been unkind to you at all and yet, you have shown much contempt for me and even you are disregarding the viewpoint of one of the People in whom these writings came from. Why is that?

Interesting that you capitalized "People".

That is what I meant with my hope for "honesty" from you. Finally!

My "issues" are centered on interpretation and implementation of scripture.

I have no "contempt" for you or any other "Child of God". Problems lie within how we determine who is "friend" and who is "foe".

Love is not the cornerstone of Judaism since it is an emotion that is both subjective and reliant upon present circumstances. Intellect is the cornerstone of Judaism. Education has EVERYTHING to do with the insight of our Scriptures.

I always... or usually write "Love/Logic". Love = Logic. Love is not an emotion. Love is what works. Examine all "Scripture" knowing that YAHWEH is "Holy/Logical" and there will be little to zero problems with such versus as Eze 16:3. Which BTW I believe you still do not understand... and assuming that I know... will not say.

Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught. And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned? Joh 7:14-15

Do you understand the above "teaching"???

I do not see mysticism in the Tanakh .. and thus read much of it metaphorically...

"Pillars of Fire", "Manna from Heaven", "Parting of the Red Sea", etc.... mumbo jumbo.... right???

Is the "Ark of the Covenant" also a "metaphor"????

You do not know what Eze 16:3 implies because you have not "asked" for what the Hebrews were chosen to bring back into the world.

But... that would be "mysticism" wouldn't it.

Eze 16:3 may just be the key to understanding what it is to be a "Hebrew"... and who and what Cain found to "marry".

I will now go read the "versus" that you cited in your post. I haven't yet done so... sorry. :-P.

reply to post by gerg357


i thought about this too, abel offers his fattest lamb, the first of his lambs as sacrifice

i believe, cain offers fruits and vegetables, but not the first of choice, so not the best he could

cain displays rage/jealousy over this, instead of humbleness or whatever.. and slays abel (like a child would react)

thats how i figured it to go, but yeah i always wondered.. what was wrong with cains offerings? and very good point.. abel offered blood..

[edit on 15-10-2009 by Naeem82]

Firstly I agree.... Alien is mentioned in the bible and the inter breeding with the descendants of A'Dam...

Cains Wife Not being of The Race of A'Dam. She can only be Alien!

You can Also find this more so in the Books of E'Noch.

There is another Enoch mentioned too in the bible...

The son of Cain built a CITY called Enoch....


A CITY for 3 to 5 People ????????? LOL

I don't think so do You ?????

So this CITY is Not a City people think of today!

Indeed it is Not so what is this CITY?

The CITY referres to Something else...
Perhaps an organised structure in the form of a "Map" within the Soul???

The main theme of the writings in the bible (The Roman collection of a few writings that have been miss Interpreted

and compiled) is Not the human Primate, in other words the descendants of A'Dam, but Rather about the Metamorphoses

of the Soul!

A'Dam is the Primate that Breaths Air!
Man is the Soul, whose Life is "LIGHT" Not Air, as in the case of A'Dam.

These writings are in parable form describing the Construct of the Soul, The History regarding the Metamorphoses of

the Soul and the Construct of the Manifestations (ie the Universe you experience) INSIDE the Soul Construct!

Here is a Map of the Soul referred to as "The Man Child", or "Son of Man".

A full description can be found in the Book of Ezekiel.

The writing has been corrupted but the design of this Construct or Matrix Map still remains in the Book.

The Book of Ezekiel also gives details of the Labyrinths of the Construct.

Here is a drawing of the Construct Partition Map of the Soul...
Also found in The Book of Ezekiel and The Revelation of J.C.
This Partition Map is referred to as "The Man Child" or "Son of Man"...



[edit on 15-10-2009 by The Matrix Traveller]

They say incest is the best, so I guess Cain put it to the test, honestly, thats the only explanation if you hold the creation story true......

reply to post by clever024


All is all based on how you interpret the writings....

Check out

on ATS. Read the Thread very very carfully.

reply to post by ButterCookie


Cain's wife was one of his cousins. This was not forbidden by God until Exodus and the Law given to Moses. And was necessary to fill the Earth from creation.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


We can't assume this about Cain's Wife... It simply does Not tell us Cain's wife was his cousen...

Nor is it written in any other writings that Cain married his Cousin!

Why???

The fact still remains; who did Enoch the Son of Cain, build that City for.

This City was called Enoch according to the writings.

How many people were to live in this City?

And where was the City of Enoch Built.

We must Not confuse Cain’s Son. "Enoch" with the E'Noch who was the 7th from A'Dam...

Note this 2nd E'Noch was the 7th and still no cousins have been mentioned!

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller


???? Why should I have to be 'told'??? Adam was the first man, Eve was the first woman, therefore Cain would have married one of his cousins, second cousins, heck even third cousins. Who knows, perhaps it was his sister even. Do you realize how many generations of cousins could be made when the people before the flood were living to nearly 1,000 years old??

Hundreds if not thousands of people. And God didn't command not to do this until Moses was given the Law in Exodus. It makes no matter to me, I suppose I could ask him in heaven someday if I really wanted to know.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Hey steady on if you have the evidence I would love to see it...

When reading anything on this subject you can't assume anything at all or you may as well not read this material at all but instead dream up your own writing..

But if you can present the evidence I would be very interested as I have not come across such evidence within the writings....

I am always willing to be taught by them that have knowledge.

Wait... OK... I remember you now.

Didn't you once comment on.... Mat 15:22-28
And, behold, a woman of Canaan came out of the same coasts, and cried unto him, saying, Have mercy on me, O Lord, thou Son of David; my daughter is grievously vexed with a devil. But he answered her not a word. And his disciples came and besought him, saying, Send her away; for she crieth after us. But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Then came she and worshipped him, saying, Lord, help me. But he answered and said, It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs. And she said, Truth, Lord: yet the dogs eat of the crumbs which fall from their masters' table. Then Jesus answered and said unto her, O woman, great is thy faith: be it unto thee even as thou wilt. And her daughter was made whole from that very hour.

Didn't you interpret this "lesson" as degrading and insulting if not outright cruel on the part of Yeshua and how He spoke to this poor woman????

If I remember correctly I stated that this lesson was a statement of respect by Gentiles for the Hebrews who have suffered and worked in service to YAHWEH.

Didn't you then also claim your Jewish ethnicity with regard to interpreting "scripture" correctly???

I asked.... "How is it then that you a Hebrew did not understand the lesson?"

I might ask the same question now.

BTW... I a "Gentile" did not take offense at the above lesson...

That is why I took the name KOGDOG....

First of all, I have no evidence to say I am Hebrew. Definitely Scotts/Irish.... but Hebrew? not that I am aware of. I am a Jewess though. You mistake this to be about race. The Jewish People are no longer in a tribal system in the way we were prior to now. Our bloodline has been scattered into the genepools of the nations and thus.. for all you know, you have the blood of the People in you... just not the underrstanding of the Mind of the People.

That you don't get offended is great. But we can all read what happened there. Jesus was ready to dismiss her despite her desperate sobs except that the disciples were becoming annoyed.

That you might not feel offended is most likely do to your own pride because if you were being honest, you would not attempt to imply excuses on his behalf and rather go by what is written there. Jesus had issues with those who were not of his own ppl, clearly .. unless of course they were in power (of course, in that case, by what it is written, it does appear that he a good back up plan going for his escape from the cross ... referring to the Roman guard he befriended so quickly, of course).

Interesting that you capitalized "People".

That is what I meant with my hope for "honesty" from you. Finally!

My "issues" are centered on interpretation and implementation of scripture.

I have no "contempt" for you or any other "Child of God". Problems lie within how we determine who is "friend" and who is "foe".

I am having a difficult time understanding you considering the spectacles you are reading through are jealousy. I can't for the life of me figure out why you are attempting a character assination because I capitalized the "P" in People. I capitalize the "N" in Nature; the "R" in Reason; and the "G" in God... does that give you more ammunition to use against me?

Just curious so as not to repeat the offenses. Go... oops! sorry.. **g**od forbid I hurt your feelings by capitalizing another letter.

Seriously ... you are becoming ridiculous now for a reason I can not find.

I always... or usually write "Love/Logic". Love = Logic. Love is not an emotion. Love is what works. Examine all "Scripture" knowing that YAHWEH is "Holy/Logical" and there will be little to zero problems with such versus as Eze 16:3. Which BTW I believe you still do not understand... and assuming that I know... will not say.

Love is an emotion and has nothing to do with logic. Sorry .. that is one of the biggest misconceptions the Gentile writers of the NT made when trying to mooch off of the Tanakh...

it is little wonder that a Jew would not fall for such emotional manipulation given that the Tanakh is concerned with the Mind! then, the seat of emotions (the heart) is merely a tool to know oneself and ultimately each other.



[edit on 17-10-2009 by justamomma]

reply to post by The Matrix Traveller


I appreciate your integrity and decorum, The Word states Adam was the first man, and Eve the first woman, and Cain and Able their first sons, (Seth was third). But Adam lived to be 930 years old, Genesis 5:3. And he and Eve had many more sons and daughters, Genesis 5:4.

So if one thinks logically, with hundreds of years of childbearing capabilities they could have had hundreds of children, those children could have had hundreds of children, and so forth and so forth. But we do know two facts from scripture that leads us to the answer, 1. Adam lived to be 930, and he and Eve had many more sons and daughters, therefore Cain would have married either his sister, but more than likely married one of his brothers daughters. The day Adam died he most likely had thousands of grandsons, great grandsons, great great grandsons, etc. thousands.

And remember, it was not a sin and commanded by God not to be done till Moses was given the Law in Exodus. Some 2,000 years later.

reply to post by justamomma

First of all, I have no evidence to say I am Hebrew. Definitely Scotts/Irish.... but Hebrew? not that I am aware of. I am a Jewess though. You mistake this to be about race. The Jewish People are no longer in a tribal system in the way we were prior to now. Our bloodline has been scattered into the genepools of the nations and thus.. for all you know, you have the blood of the People in you... just not the underrstanding of the Mind of the People.

That you don't get offended is great. But we can all read what happened there. Jesus was ready to dismiss her despite her desperate sobs except that the disciples were becoming annoyed.

That you might not feel offended is most likely do to your own pride because if you were being honest, you would not attempt to imply excuses on his behalf and rather go by what is written there. Jesus had issues with those who were not of his own ppl, clearly .. unless of course they were in power (of course, in that case, by what it is written, it does appear that he a good back up plan going for his escape from the cross ... referring to the Roman guard he befriended so quickly, of course).

I am "Scottish/Irish"...

Without the "Spirit" what good is your "mind/intellect"?

As for the "Canaanite woman/dog".... always remember that you.... are nothing but a Canaanite! Your father was an Amorite and your mother a Hittite! Ezek 16:3

That also would make you a "dog"......... He was speaking to "all" of "us".

You need to "humble" yourself before "YHWH". You cannot "work" your way into "Heaven".

Here is how to know thyself....... A "Child of God" will act and speak as "One".

Why would Yeshua want to "escape the cross"? Oh... wait.... you won't have anything to do with "mysticism".

I got cha'....

I am having a difficult time understanding you considering the spectacles you are reading through are jealousy. I can't for the life of me figure out why you are attempting a character assassination because I capitalized the "P" in People. I capitalize the "N" in Nature; the "R" in Reason; and the "G" in God... does that give you more ammunition to use against me?

Just curious so as not to repeat the offenses. Go... oops! sorry.. **g**od forbid I hurt your feelings by capitalizing another letter.

Seriously ... you are becoming ridiculous now for a reason I can not find.

"Character assassination"??? I intended exactly the opposite. The OT/Tanakh needs to be examined with a less "educated" spirit. Your proof is all around you... right now. But... you don't believe in all that "mysticism".

As for the caps thingy.... capitalizing "God" I understand...

As for the "P" in People...I think maybe you just had a "Freudian Slip"....

There is hope for you!

Love is an emotion and has nothing to do with logic. Sorry .. that is one of the biggest misconceptions the Gentile writers of the NT made when trying to mooch off of the Tanakh... it is little wonder that a Jew would not fall for such emotional manipulation given that the Tanakh is concerned with the Mind! then, the seat of emotions (the heart) is merely a tool to know oneself and ultimately each other.

I dunno about this "Mind/Intellect" nonsense.... if I remember correctly... the Jews were chosen because....

G-d held a mountain over their heads! Or my personal fav.... The Jews were so screwed up that G-d chose them because there could be no other explanation for their success other than G-d's might.

Oh yes... the heart....
The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it? Jer 17:9

The only "Way"(note the capitalization of Way/TheWay) to know "YHWH" is too purify yourself... not with works/education.... but as Able did... a "Blood" sacrifice... MUMBO JUMBO/MYSTICISM ALERT!!!!... Take the branch of a hyssop plant, dip it in the blood which is in a bowl, and put some of the blood on the top and sides of the doorframes of your House/Temple(Ummm... note caps again).

There really are monsters all around us. You need help. I have done my part.

Now we shall just have to wait...

Shalom... momma

reply to post by NOTurTypical


Thank you for your response. I am interested in these ancient writings and would be very interested, if there are other ancient writings that may add other record to that of Genesis. I have read many others to date but haven’t come across any yet, that suggest that any others were born to A’Dam & Eve before Seth, other than Cain and Able. So I would indeed like to discover other writings that may provide evidence.


It is not my intention to argue against your understanding, but rather discover any writings, referring to the Fact that A’Dam and Eve had daughters before Cain took a wife, and begat a son called Enoch.

Especially to inhabit a City built by Cain’s first born, Enoch.


In Genesis it is interesting to note in Chapter 5 v. 3 and 4

Quote;

3.
And A’Dam lived an hundred and thirty years, (130 years old)
and begat a son in his own likeness after his image;
and called his name Seth:

4.
And the days of A’Dam after he begat Seth
were eight hundred years: (800 years)
and he begat sons and daughters.

It is interesting to note that there is No mention of daughters before Seth
and only two other sons, beside Cain.

When Able was murdered, I was lead to believe, that Seth was born to replace Able???

So what was Cain’s age when he took a wife?

He was younger than 130 years as A’Dam was 130 years old when he had Seth???

(It took Seth 105 years before having his 1st child, Enos!)

And how many other children did A’Dam have between Cain and Seth?

Well it only mentions one other and that was Able ???

As it says in Verse 4….

It was after (reflected in the Word “and”) he begat Seth he lived eight hundred years.
Also during that time After (reflected in the Word “and”) he begat Seth be Also begat Daughters.

But do the words in verse 4…

Quote;

and he begat sons and daughters.

Refer to A’Dam or Seth.

I think you will find these words relate to Seth and Not Adam!

But I could be wrong???

In no way does it say anywhere in Genesis he begat any daughters before he begat Seth.

And remember A’dam was only 130 years old when he begat Seth!

The argument is based on the writings, not what might have happened.

Chapter 5. gives you the family tree…

Are you suggesting that the family tree is incomplete or incorrect???

If so can you quote from other writings, such as the A’Dam books, little Genesis, or the Books of E’Noch that may give other information regarding A’Dam and Eve having any other children before Seth other than Cain and Able?

If you can I would be very interested in the books you can quote from.

As far as I understand if the writings are accurate, then these daughters would have been mentioned.

It seems to indicating that A’Dam begat daughters during the last 800 years of his life and not mentioning having daughters or any other sons before Seth.

Again.. depending on whether the words

and he begat sons and daughters.

Refers to A’Dam or Seth.

The writings only mention as I said, 2 other children before Seth.

When Seth was 105 years old, when he begat his first child, Enos.

Not a very high rate of producing offspring???

This is in keeping with A’Dam and Eve, having Seth, when A’Dam was 130 years old,
in fact A’Dam was a little more productive than Seth, but not by much … LOL

I was married very young, and I am now 60 but only have 3 grandchildren the oldest is 14 years old.

[edit on 17-10-2009 by The Matrix Traveller]