"Worst Still Yet to Come..."

I love Russia Today, they let their guests speak.

Senior Research Scholar at Yale University Immanuel Wallerstein believes that the real economic crisis is still up ahead. According to Wallerstein, last years collapse was its minor version.

And the immortal Max Keizer on the "slippery slope" that America is on, basically saying that the crash cannot be stopped, only needing a "spark" for the final decent.

The U.S. dollar-based post WWII phantasmagorical world of never having to pay your debts is coming to a close, states financial journalist Max Kaizer to RT.

We are weeks away I believe. The G20 is just one last planning/prep type of situation before this magnum opus of a collapse goes live.

Wow, weeks away, now that's fresh doom!

If we can all agree we are in a Deflationary Depression, as I believe we are.. then we can assume that the true effects of the depression will not be felt for many more months. We have seen the economy slow its decline, and the markets 150+ days of rallying .. but once the next season of consumption fails us (christmas) we will see the next stage of the depression: deflationary collapse...

In Deflation based Depressions, the economy is entirely dependant on production. That being said, the only way to turn around a depression is a bottom out, which is usually 80%+ correction of the economy.. severe depression. The economy is dependant on consumption, production and employment.. these are leading indicators, this is one major reason the Gov is screaming for us to empty our accounts this Christmas, because if we don't spendearnings drop, people get laid off... the next stage of the depression, a spiral downward.

So in short, you are correct, the worst is yet to come..

reply to post by Rockpuck


I MUST PROTEST.

I want to be told that everything is alright. We've got it all under control. A few tweaks by some career banker somewhere will fix it all up. I need to be directed to 'be prepared to sacrifice' along with the rest of my 'work-to-survive' peers.

When someone whose opinion I value makes comments such as yours..., well..., to coin an oft-quoted phrase 'panic sex' actually takes on some real weight.

My deepest concern is for the continuity of community level government. The Federal Institutions are bankrupt (you can pick the context and be right even if we disagree). The state governments have been in decay since the two party monopoly was uplifted.

But at the level of communities, towns, and even some cities... we CAN survive even a total economic collapse if we PLAN for it. And I am not referring to "bug out bags" and "every man for himself" survival.

My question to someone of your understanding is this: Can local communities set up and rely on a rudimentary economic stop gap approach? If not, are there any possibility that local efforts can be set up to save whole communities? If there is no way... we MUST create it.

Or am I being childishly romantic?

I hope not.

reply to post by Maxmars


Eh, well I don't really know what you disagree with me about, I'll take a stab at your question:

No.

Local governments lack the ability to inflate currencies to provide services, thus the finite supplies of wealth, when they dry up via depression, reduce local governments to bare essentials..

In severe economic depressions as far back as organized markets have collapsed, the vast majority of organization and support comes from individuals and communities (churches, etc).. in more centralized smaller states (europe) the govs can take direct control of local civil affairs.. in the US this is far less effective, and thus responsibility falls to the People. Protect your neighbors, but I urge everyone that placing hope in Government at any level is naive and you set yourself up for dissapointment..

Originally posted by Rockpuck
reply to post by Maxmars

 

Eh, well I don't really know what you disagree with me about, I'll take a stab at your question:

Sorry, it was a lame attempt at being funny... epic fail

I agree with you. Too bad we don't have a civic plan to apply to a real civic crisis. All of the 'plans' of which I have been made aware of are intended to maintain the status quo.

reply to post by Maxmars


The only plans any Government makes has only to do with the contingency of said Government.. Any plan to protect the populace can be looked at as without a populace there is no need for government. That said, efforts to the general public are minimal, while the contingency of governing power takes priority.

Originally posted by Rockpuck
If we can all agree we are in a Deflationary Depression, as I believe we are.. then we can assume that the true effects of the depression will not be felt for many more months. We have seen the economy slow its decline, and the markets 150+ days of rallying .. but once the next season of consumption fails us (christmas) we will see the next stage of the depression: deflationary collapse...

In Deflation based Depressions, the economy is entirely dependant on production. That being said, the only way to turn around a depression is a bottom out, which is usually 80%+ correction of the economy.. severe depression. The economy is dependant on consumption, production and employment.. these are leading indicators, this is one major reason the Gov is screaming for us to empty our accounts this Christmas, because if we don't spendearnings drop, people get laid off... the next stage of the depression, a spiral downward.

So in short, you are correct, the worst is yet to come..

I don't think I can agree with you Rock. CNN told me today, you know that halfway hot chick, that it was just a recession. That kinda fat but still personable guy was pretty clear about that too. Everything is gonna be just fine. That bald headed guy really made me mad, but even HE says it's just a big tadoo about nothin'.

So plucky...how about some odds....do we get ruined financially first, or get vaporized by a nuke on the way to Denver?

[edit on 14-9-2009 by KSPigpen]

No kidding. I'm totally tapped out and barely making all my bills from my over indulgence during the boom. Most companies are also tapped out, and it will come to a head very soon.

Good informative post . I am in a catch 22 , truck is broke and no money to fix , so I can not do my normal work. I will get it squared away soon. But as least I am mentally perpared for whats comming thanks to ATS.

If you haven't been laid off or worrying about getting laid off, then you have a 1 in 2 chance of having had your pay cut even if those cuts only affected your retirement money instead of your take home pay. In my case, we first had no yearly pay increase then they cut out all the retirement matching money so that was a pay cut. They helped saved their bottom line at the expense of all the workers bottom lines. Then some of my investments have lost money while local city taxes went back up. You bet I'm cutting back my spending. Just multiply consumer spending cutbacks times 200 million and the only one spending more is Obama and the democrats. However with billions and billions spent, they are making up the difference. The only problem is that the interest payments alone on the national debt are amounting to hundreds of billions of dollars a year now and rapidly climbing with 1 to 2 trillion dollars of debt getting added this year.

reply to post by Rockpuck


Could not agree more brother.
The government needs to continue the need to survive and our well being comes second in there planning. I am sure they will leave the general populous to the military if it goes so far that they need to implement continuity plans. Not to say that is a bad thing I just wonder if they are prepared for this.

we are mearly in the lul in between waves of a dwindeling economy..Eventualy that lul gets closer to shore and hits the beach with a wave that breaks overhead..

I feal the only way the crash would be avoidable is if everyone out of work right now was able to obtain a job and steady income that leaves 500-1000 dollars excess after the monthly bills are paid out..

but we know thats not gonna happen..

The countrys running on life support..Pull the plug dammit..Have camper will travel when all else is lost,i say

Originally posted by brocket99
reply to post by Redpillblues

 

It's tough to believe anyone on here when their spelling is such junk.

Be nice. my spelling sucks, so what? www.dyslexia.com...

I'm actually not too much of a doom person but many people are predicting a financial collapse this Autumn and I think they're right, it'll be worse in the US. Start issuing a local currency now, follow the Ithaca model. Also check out how Argentina survived and start making friends in yr local community.
Learn to grow sprouts. Store a few kilos of oats. Im going to buy five kilos of oats and store them under my bed. Also twenty jars of spinach. Then Im going to chill.

Others have said something amazing will happen way before the end of the year. See D.Wilcock, who has been spot on before

I think this Autumn will be a pivotal period for mankind, I dont think there's much to fear though. That's my prediction.

When our government dismantled the 'Civil Defense' groups in our country, many said out loud that this was a very dumb idea. They should have instead changed their mandate to work towards this possibility of a basic collapse of the Federal Governments ability to be maintained. Having a committee that has spitballed a few plans before hand would have been much better than simply dumping the groups. If you've ever been to your local town meetings you know that the likelihood of getting anything done is in direct proportion to the special interests invested within that body! I don't see state or even local city governments being able to do anything for their citizenry. I base this on my own town but I imagine that your own is pretty much like my own!
Zindo

Well, when it comes to many of my fears about what is coming down the pike (war, economic collapse, swine flu), I find I can come to ATS and be so bombarded with fear laden propaganda that I'll start to feel that I'm paranoid and need to lighten up. That being said, I'm no prophet but, it doesn't take one to see things are bad and bound to get worse. They've been talking about "green shoots" for months but more and more I see the msm printing articles that are far more conservative - just shy of gloomy - about our economic future.

www.ft.com...

Originally posted by orionthehunter
If you haven't been laid off or worrying about getting laid off, then you have a 1 in 2 chance of having had your pay cut

Yup, I am at -30% of my 2008 salary. Fun times are just ahead!

maxmars
I want to be told that everything is alright. We've got it all under control. A few tweaks by some career banker somewhere will fix it all up. I need to be directed to 'be prepared to sacrifice' along with the rest of my 'work-to-survive' peers.

No problem!
Bernanke Says U.S. Recession ‘Very Likely’ Has Ended

See? It's all good. TIME TO BUY!

Originally posted by pluckynoonez
I love Russia Today, they let their guests speak.

Senior Research Scholar at Yale University Immanuel Wallerstein believes that the real economic crisis is still up ahead. According to Wallerstein, last years collapse was its minor version.

And the immortal Max Keizer on the "slippery slope" that America is on, basically saying that the crash cannot be stopped, only needing a "spark" for the final decent.

The U.S. dollar-based post WWII phantasmagorical world of never having to pay your debts is coming to a close, states financial journalist Max Kaizer to RT.

We are weeks away I believe. The G20 is just one last planning/prep type of situation before this magnum opus of a collapse goes live.

Wow, weeks away, now that's fresh doom!

How the **** did we get to the point where Russia has a more free press than we do?

Truly these are the end times spoken about in those old books.

Fresh is how I likes my doom, but really, I just think, even if none of these giant horrible doomgasms never come to pass, LOTS of tinier dooms are still all adding up every day. Water supplies dwindling, overpopulation, food scarcities, toxicity, and other concerns, all add up into the Fat Daddy of all Dooms.

So, is there even any concievable way that we AREN'T royally boned at this point?

Or are we just waiting, watching like at a horse race, to see which doom comes in first, second and third, who is dead last, and all that, and right now we're just at the point of debating the odds and placing our bets!?

[edit on 16-9-2009 by BaronVonGodzilla]

I think it s amazing how one poster can bring up an idea like "panic sex," and because it is a woman, all the guys on this site keep referring to it...even in other posts.

reply to post by BaronVonGodzilla


There are so many pointing to his Fall as being the time, which is weird because that one Bible parable that states "let no man know the time or hour..." never mentioned the month or season.